Agency Management System

[fchelf]

I have been a Partner user for 10 years, and Partner XE for almost a year. No problems, well satisfile.

[Threxx]

As a current TAM agency admin, I'm curious as to what's going on with Epic?

I believe it has been 2.5 years now since I was at TenCon watching some flashy video about how Epic was the future of insurance systems, but so far it has been very quiet from my perspective.

In early 2010 I spoke with an Applied rep who more or less told me they aren't really promoting migrations to existing TAM agencies because there are still some bugs to work out that will be fixed in the next version. I haven't heard a peep since then. I really don't know if the 'next version will be what everyone is waiting for' line was true or if it should have been translated to "it's a sinking ship but we're not going to tell you that".

Since then I've found it incredibly difficult to get anyone at Applied to talk to me about Epic. To be honest our users are clamoring for something more up to date. I don't want to tell Applied that because then I fear they will try to sell us on Epic even though it may not be ready for prime time. If they aren't willing to sell me on it when they don't think they're going to lose me as a customer, then maybe it's really still got too many issues?

Several of our users came from a larger agency in town that used Sagitta and many of them say it's better in many ways. However as I understand it, Sagitta is meant for large agencies. We're in the ~50 user range, the other agency is in the ~80 user range. I don't think either of us are really large enough to be Sagitta's intended audience. So instead maybe I should be looking at AMS360?

More importantly for now though... I just want to figure out what the heck is happening with Epic. Searching this entire internet message board it seems like it hasn't even been mentioned in any discussion in calendar year 2011!?

[gforaker]

No, far more Sagitta owners are migrating over to Applied. Several of the largest agency groups in the country have purchased Epic and are converting over.

Epic is doing just fine and is a fully functioning product. You really need to contact your area representative to take a new look. There will be no "sales job" because there will be no software cost for you to upgrade. I really can't believe you are having trouble finding people at Applied to talk to you about it. Are you really a TAM user? You sound like an AMS newsgroup troll.

As for TAM, Applied has said that there will be no phase out of that line. They will continue to develop and improve TAM for any foreseeable future. There will be no push to encourage TAM agents to convert over, so you will not receive lots of marketing info on Epic unless you ask for it.

There is also plenty of discussion about Epic on the Users Group forums. You do belong to the Users Group, don't you?

[JasonBHBCo]

Applied Epic is up through its 4th major release/update. I believe that 5.0 is due out at any time...
Disclaimer: I do not work for Applied, I am an independent consultant.
In my role as a technology and workflow consultant, I have implemented workflows at some agencies that are using Epic over the past 24 months. I'd be more than happy to chat with you about what I have seen, some strengths and weaknesses, etc.
I understand that Applied is using a fairly rigorous roll out process, perhaps due to the sheer number of users of TAM that could potentially be brought over to Epic, and perhaps due to the gaps - and potential issues that some agencies may have - with where the platform is now.
Feel free to email me back at jason@bhbco.com if you'd like to talk in more depth about Epic.

[Threxx]

No, far more Sagitta owners are migrating over to Applied. Several of the largest agency groups in the country have purchased Epic and are converting over.

That is an interesting fact if more Sagitta owners are moving to Epic than to AMS360. Where did you get that info? Then again I was under the impression that AMS360 wasn't really 'scaled' for larger agencies, so it would seem their choices would be to either stick with Sagitta or move to Epic? I'm honestly asking... I don't know for sure. In either case, we're not a 'large' agency.

Epic is doing just fine and is a fully functioning product. You really need to contact your area representative to take a new look.

As mentioned, I have, in 2009 (I didn't mention that), early 2010 and now in March-April 2011. So far it has been a very slow process requiring multiple attempts on my part to reach out to get anyone to call back with any real information.

There will be no "sales job" because there will be no software cost for you to upgrade.

I'm guessing that's probably why nobody seems eager to talk to me. But hoping it's not because of issues with Epic. Those are the only two explanations I can think of.

I really can't believe you are having trouble finding people at Applied to talk to you about it. Are you really a TAM user? You sound like an AMS newsgroup troll.

I've been an IT guy at my agency and TAM admin for over 10 years now. I'm not trolling. I can see how it would appear that way since I'm coming here and complaining but I guess I've just gotten frustrated at how Applied basically got us all excited about Epic 2.5 years ago and here I am today having a difficult time getting any information on it.

As for TAM, Applied has said that there will be no phase out of that line. They will continue to develop and improve TAM for any foreseeable future. There will be no push to encourage TAM agents to convert over, so you will not receive lots of marketing info on Epic unless you ask for it.

If Epic is clearly superior (as they seemed to be saying when they introduced it) then I'd think there would be a push. If you're a company like applied and you're trying to retain your existing customer base, wouldn't you rather have them using your best product? I understand they don't want to alienate people that love TAM... but that's not at all the same thing as promoting a superior product.

There is also plenty of discussion about Epic on the Users Group forums. You do belong to the Users Group, don't you?

Which forum is that? I read the ASCnet forums occasionally. I wanted to talk about this here since this appears to be a management system neutral forum, whereas ASCnet is by nature all Applied users. Even still I do see Epic talk on those forums, but not really high level talk about where Epic stands in terms of viability compared to TAM as well as Vertafore and other management system offerings.

If there is another forum I should be aware of please let me know.

Applied Epic is up through its 4th major release/update. I believe that 5.0 is due out at any time...
Disclaimer: I do not work for Applied, I am an independent consultant.
In my role as a technology and workflow consultant, I have implemented workflows at some agencies that are using Epic over the past 24 months. I'd be more than happy to chat with you about what I have seen, some strengths and weaknesses, etc.
I understand that Applied is using a fairly rigorous roll out process, perhaps due to the sheer number of users of TAM that could potentially be brought over to Epic, and perhaps due to the gaps - and potential issues that some agencies may have - with where the platform is now.
Feel free to email me back at jason@bhbco.com if you'd like to talk in more depth about Epic.

How long have they been on 4.0? I want to say that's the version I was told they were on in January of 2010? Or maybe that's what they were about to be on. Thanks for your contact information. I may shoot you an email in a bit once I've learned enough to form some decent questions.

[Brenda H]

I don't know anything about Epic, but I have been a Tam user for some years. I have also been expose to AMS 360 and I would not migrate to that from Applied, unless you are prepared for a lot of preparatory work to get your system migrated from one to the other. Having used several Applied systems, (even back to the DOS applied) and AMS (not 360) I am way more satisfied with Applied and their products.

[Rhonda233]

We've been using Epic now for around 2 years and are very happy with it. We're currently on version 4.1, but the next big version 5.0 should be out soon. Sure there's been some hiccups along the way, but nothing that would make us ever want to go back to any other system. We used TAM for about 12 years before converting to Epic and I haven't had one user ask to go back yet.

Our main goal in converting was to get on something more up to date and functional and I believe Epic has done that for us. Even though we're a small agency, we can look and act just like our bigger competitors using Epic's efficiencies and functionality. We service everything from the $500 BOP to larger accounts - the local school district, hospital, and government entities - using this system and it functions well in every instance.

Can't say the conversion was easy, but can say it was well worth it. I'm glad to be sitting back enjoying Epic's efficiencies while my competitor's struggle to keep up using out dated software!

[tomwarren]

I would also like it to be able to work Ebix. Available for agents, brokers and MGAs in the United States, EbixASP is an Internet-based management system specifically designed to handle ASP sizes of agencies, brokers, and is suitable for all business P & C. Management System offers a full range of insurance needs, modular automation solutions for the claims and the general Ledger Accounting System.

[saabins]

I have just opened my own P&C insurance agency and I am shopping for an agency management system. I have seen your opinions on many systems, but not on AgencyPro and InsurancePro. Insurancepro is a part of ITC. These are 2 systems that I came across and have been doing my research on. I have found Agencypro to be very user friendy and also inexpensive. I am wondering if anyone has heard of these 2 agency management systems?? I need feedback as I need to put a system in place asap.
Thanks.

[Agent79]

I don't have any experience working with ITC on their agency management products, but I have worked with ITC on e-mail, web sites, etc.... and they have been super good. Based on my experience I would have confidence in them. (I'm small mostly P&C agency in KY.)

[landersinsurance]

Does anyone know how much it is to setup Hawksoft? Or a range of how much it would cost to have a tech setup your client managment system with a server?

[scotp]

This is a great thread to read, particularly when you've been demoed numerous systems and been inundated with integration specialists and months of sales spiel!

I asked a question a few months ago on MGAs (a separate thread) and got great answers (and some blatant sales pitches) but thought I'd try again as I'm doing a project for a medium sized agency (over 50 people). I'm doing research type projects for the owner (as I was before on MGAs).

We are looking at a fully integrated software solution.

My strong opinion is that the solution needs to be a cloud based system (we have great, fast T1 lines, and its mainly one office - some remote workers, but we get by on a bespoke type system and some use of other systems (Imageright and an accounting system) and they login in without much keystroke delay. We are looking to go fully integrated. I understand most of the providers host for you as SAAS, but I think it would be ideal to have it hosted by a third party (eg Amazon) with their almost 100% uptime and then their isnt too much reliance on the provider (though most are owned by someone big or listed (Applied by Bain Capital, EBIX is listed, AMS is by Vertafore etc).

The voting on this forum seemed to suggest that AMS360 was popular, but it seems a lot of the users are small (I know this thread originally was for 1-5 user agencies) and clearly 'it depends' is the key for this whole process. EBIX didnt get any votes but Applied TAM did and more than Applied EPIC (suggesting voting skewed to what people knew and had got comfortable with)

The options for bigger agencies seem to be Applied Systems EPIC, AMS 360, EBIX and some others. I read a Novarica report from 2010 that compared lots of systems (and had lots of bubble charts and such) and also suggested CSC PointIn was popular (or at least had a lot of users, and that company is huge).

So I would love to see if anyone has some overall opinions (based on use) or comparison of the options for a medium sized agency. The pricing is obviously whatever you negotiate so we're kind of viewing that as irrelevant at this stage and they are all roughly the same ballpark.

Are there any good free reports out there (this forum is like a report in itself!)?

Scott

[gforaker]

Scott, I'll go out on a limb here and give you a straight opinion. After all, what else is this forum for?

Since you will have 50 users, you will probably need a full time IT person anyway. Paying the extra money for a hosted ASP just doesn't make economic sense for you. Your in house IT person can set up a 100% reliable server and have it guaranteed backed up offsite with all of the attention the on-line providers can offer. Your in house version will be cheaper, faster, more reliable and more flexible. As an added benefit, you will retain control and ownership of the data, not the provider.

There are only 2 providers you should look at for 50+ employees. Applied or AMS. The others are either not fully mature products (in spite of their claims) or don't have the economic stability to be sure of survival.

[glennetheridge]

Hello Scott,

We have an MGA that uses our system for over 200 branches across the country with around a thousand users. Maybe you have heard of them, TWFG in Texas. They also have hundreds of General Agents that can track their policies with them. They house our system on their servers. They had Applied at one time but didn't want to break the bank with their huge business. So they found a system that works great for them, not called Applied or AMS. It's called eVo. Evolution Agency Management. www.my-evo.com, contact us and we would be glad to show you what we have. We can also host your users on our servers if you want as well, the choice is yours. If our system can work for TWFG, I am sure it can work for your smaller agency.

Glenne@my-evo.com

[mjcoop]

Scott,
You seem to be heading down the right track. I would agree with the other poster that your two main options are Applied and Vertafore. There are some other "ankle biters" out there that as an advisor to my clients I would never suggest. Who knows what the run rate is on one of these small companies. Unfortunatly Applied and Vertafore are the 10,000 lb gorillas in this market. If these small players have a decent product chances are pretty good that Vertafore will buy them eventually. I have had some experience with a company called Epic-One (not to be confused with Applied's Epic). They have a MGA/Wholesale product that seems to be getting some traction with some decent accounts in the US. If you are looking at Vertafore, you may want to consider Sagitta instead of 360. Not sure of all the business requirements your client has, but using Sagitta and WorkSmart is a great combination. Also, word is they will be doing a lot of front end and back end work to Sagitta in the next few years. Including moving the database to SQL (not confirmed...could just be a rumor). I think you would like Applied System's Epic for a MGA as they have a really good custom forms builder that allows you to capture data that may not be on an ACORD form. Biggest issue I found with Epic is from an accounting and billing staindpoint it really does not give an MGA what they need for a broker view. Epic is really geared for a retail agency, but it is a great product. Only other comment I would make is to agree with the other poster that with 50+ employees you should not have any vendors host this for you. They are going to put the full court press on you to host and give you all these reasons like you don't need servers anymore. It's just not true, with 50 employees you know you still need some type of file&print or exchange servers and will still have that cost. If anything I would say look to a 3rd party hosting company and not the vendor. Good luck to you!