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What to Expect If Supreme Court Strikes Down Obamacare

By Ricardo Alonso-Zaldivar | April 25, 2012

United States flag medical

April 25, 2012 at 1:35 pm

Sarah says:

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“If the Supreme Court strikes down President Barack Obama’s health care law, employers and insurance companies — not the government — will be the main drivers of change over the next decade and maybe even longer.–”AND THERE WILL NOT BE A GOVERNMENT RUN ENTITLEMENT PROGRAM TO CONSUME OUR BUDGET AND PUSH US TOWARD DEBT LEVELS LIKE GREECE!

Government will tell you what services you can get and when you can not get them.
Your employer can keep their coverage at a loss to them, instead of being able to just pay a fine and cancelling your coverage.
Your tax dollars will not subsidize coverage for people who pay nothing for the same health coverage for which you dearly.

WE WILL MAINTAIN OUR FREE MARKET CAPITALISTIC SOCIETY AND TELL SOCIALIST TO MOVE TO FRANCE.

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- April 25, 2012 at 1:39 pm
  
  Baxtor says:
  
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  The only problem I have with your comment is “Your tax dollars will not subsidize coverage for people who pay nothing for the same health coverage for which you dearly.” Unfortunately we do pay for those people. They cannot get turned down in an emergency room so they do get treated and hospitalized. We in turn DO pay for them because someone has to pay the bill. If they are a US citizen they just won’t pay it, if they are an illegal, they won’t give truthful addresses or social security numbers so you’ll never find them to pay.
  
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- April 25, 2012 at 1:42 pm
  
  Jill says:
  
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  And this is to you personally, what will you do when you, yes you, are not employed, and you are very sick and need care. What then – and I’m not speaking in macro terms – just you. We just let you go, right?
  
  Reply
  - April 25, 2012 at 2:43 pm
    
    Rutro says:
    
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    No, we do not just let her go. We treat her because she has PAID INTO THE SYSTEM AND IS ENTITLED TO COVERAGE!!
    
    Reply
  - April 25, 2012 at 2:59 pm
    
    John says:
    
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    I can tell you what I already do because I’m not employed. I pay for my own health insurance out of pocket. Should the government provide your car & home & life insurance? All of those things can financailly hurt someone if they don’t have it, just like health care.
    
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  - April 25, 2012 at 3:20 pm
    
    Sarah says:
    
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    There would still be Medicaid! (what an idiot) and with regards to all of your other beloved entitlements like wellfare and unemployment,If I am capable of working then, I would be capable of going out and performing a service for a fee. I would wash your car, clean your house, walk your dog. I would buy and sell whatever I could find at a reduced cost. I would start a business or get a job I really didnt think I wanted but would do anyway. I would use my brain instead of your wallet!
    
    Reply
    - April 25, 2012 at 5:05 pm
      
      Sarah-ahahaha says:
      
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      Good luck paying for cancer or anything more serious than a sprained finger by washing cars, cleaning houses, walking dogs, buying and selling garage junk, or whatever else you’re Faux-News-biased brain tells you is possible. Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in this country. That’s a fact. Also, I don’t hear any other first world countries asking to go to a system like ours. The only time we have the best healthcare in the world is when you can afford it. Cleaning dogs and houses and dog houses may put “food on your family”, but that’s about it. But, believe what you will, Sean Hannity.
      
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      - April 26, 2012 at 12:16 pm
        
        Rutro says:
        
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        So, Sarah-ahahaha, you’re telling us that paying for cancer treatments is going to be easier if this bill goes into effect? I’ve got news for you…MORE people are going to die from their cancer BECAUSE of this bill…some of those people don’t have
        6-8 months to wait to be treated…you’ve been watching way too much Rachel Madcow and MSNBC..now let’s see how many of you liberals give me the thumbs down for speaking the truth…something that you all seem to skirt around…
    - May 10, 2012 at 10:45 am
      
      DS says:
      
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      “There would still be Medicaid! (what an idiot)”
      
      Medicaid does not exist for everyone, dear Sarah. I know people who have lost there jobs and are trying very hard to find employment – easily applying to 100 jobs a week, and still unemployed. And they do not have Medicaid. Why? Because here in Oregon Medicaid is a lottery – once you qualify, you are on a waiting list, and it is luck of the draw if you are offered a spot in 1 month, 5 months, 1 year, 5 years.
      
      And heaven forbid those people have a pre-existing condition, then they currently can’t even get private health insurance, so would have to go to a high-risk pool. And that is not affordable if it costs 3/4 of your monthly unemployment.
      
      Unfortunately even our social safety nets for those people who have worked their whole lives and “paid into the system” are not able to accomodate everyone.
      
      So quit calling people idiots and get informed on how it actually works for people.
      
      Reply
      - May 10, 2012 at 11:33 am
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Robo Saraahahahahah has left the building. Evidence – see post that states 40% of Votes in WV voted for someone in jail in Texas in their primary. If she was still here, there is no way she wold have let that stand.
        Just goes to show, you cant argue with common sense. President Job Killer needs to go! Vote for OBama, you vote for your job to get exported.
    - May 11, 2012 at 4:59 pm
      
      Marina says:
      
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      I agree with all of this except for Medicaid – not everyone qualifies. I own my own agency but got ill a year into it. I have $13,000 in medical bills and more coming. No health insurance. I’m having to pay what I can and work out payment plan on the rest ti keep it out of litigation. I do not qualify for Medicaid because I own a business (not quite in the black yet) and I own a vehicle. With all that, I am against federally run health insurance but am all for getting health care costs down so we can all afford to buy insurance.
      
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  - April 26, 2012 at 1:54 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    ICHIP. Yes, Ill does have an assigned risk pool for the UnHealthy / Uninsured that will cover Pre X after 12 months. That needs to be tweaked to remove the Pre X.
    
    Reply
- April 25, 2012 at 1:49 pm
  
  youngin' says:
  
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  We don’t have a free market capitalistic health care system in this country now, how can we “maintain” it?
  
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  - April 25, 2012 at 3:21 pm
    
    Sarah says:
    
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    Stop it with the robo like (thumbs up) Its obvious.
    
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    - April 26, 2012 at 8:39 am
      
      youngin' says:
      
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      I don’t know what you’re talking about, my browser only lets me rate each comment once. Maybe try putting less of your comments in ALL CAPS.
      
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      - April 26, 2012 at 10:17 pm
        
        Sarah says:
        
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        Robo Dislike is obvious just look at the post hidden! I can do it myself but choose not to.
  - May 10, 2012 at 11:35 am
    
    FFA says:
    
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    By Kicking OBama out of office and getting someone with common sense in there.
    
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- April 30, 2012 at 9:10 pm
  
  Sarah says:
  
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  Obbviviously Robo Voting by paid Obama campaign workers going on in this blog! Look at the amount of dislikes, why would IJ Allow this if they were not in the tank for Obama.
  
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- May 7, 2012 at 10:02 am
  
  Greg says:
  
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  When will people learn that for the “Government to subsidize” means that the tax payers pay!
  It is obvious only liberal comments are liked, all else are hidden.
  
  Reply
April 25, 2012 at 1:35 pm

Baxtor says:

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The only issue I have with this story is where one representative wants to go after medicare again by making them chose different coverage levels. I have an idea, why don’t we go after every government worker that pays less than $100 a month for their whole family plan and then only has a $250 deductible. Of course go after our senators and house of reps policy as well. Why always the retired? In my opinion, people working for us should NOT have a better plan than we have. That again means all government employees from the Federal down to local.

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April 25, 2012 at 1:35 pm

Jack Straw says:

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I want the same insurance Plan we taxpayers give our Scumbag legislators-

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April 25, 2012 at 1:45 pm

Jill says:

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Having been a healthcare compliance officer for many years, it is a fact, that Insurance Companies and employers have been the drivers of health care delivery systems for the past half century. Nothing is new here …workers and family members will be steered to hospitals and doctors that can prove to insurers and employers that they deliver quality care and cost is a factor. You and your doctor will not decide what is appropriate and medically necessary.

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- April 25, 2012 at 1:54 pm
  
  DW says:
  
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  My doctor and I decide what is necessary and appropriate care right now. No matter which facility I go to, I still have a say in my care. Jill, I’m not sure where you get the idea that doctors don’t have a say.
  
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  - April 25, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    
    Jill says:
    
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    I meant in the new scenario described in the article after the Supreme Court Decision …
    
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- April 25, 2012 at 2:42 pm
  
  Jon says:
  
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  Funny,
  
  My wife’s former plan (PPO) says otherwise.
  
  In fact, the family current “high deductible” plan also says otherwise–and it’s a lot less expensive overall than the PPO.
  
  Number-crunching nitwits do not get to say what kind of care you are entitled to, unless you get stuck with an HMO. And even then, the doctors can appeal the HMO decision, and an HMO does have to worry about bad faith.
  
  And this “workers and family members will be steered to hospitals and doctors that can prove to insurers and employers that they deliver quality care and cost is a factor” is a load of bunk. You want to know why the current system (not obamacare) doesn’t work? The head of the Mayo Clinic wrote a very illuminating editorial that ran in most, if not all the major newspapers a few years ago about this very subject. The current system pays based on the frequency of care, not the quality.
  
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- April 25, 2012 at 2:54 pm
  
  Rutro says:
  
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  Jill…do you really want to wait up to 6 months (or more??) to have a procedure done, only AFTER the government tells you that it’s OK for you to even HAVE it done? What’s the matter with you people are your way of thinking?!?!! Oh…that’s right…that’s the liberal-progressive way of thinking. My bad.
  
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  - April 25, 2012 at 3:34 pm
    
    Jill says:
    
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    No one is waiting 6 months to have procedures done now, unless it is not a medical emergency and they don’t have the means to pay. That is why we need to find health care avenues for those who don’t have an employer plan or an association to buy it through. The cost of uninsured medical services is shifted back into the system of payors. The use of healthcare services without paying is an unregulated commerce. People on Medicare don’t wait 6 months to have a procedure done. People with employer sponsored health care don’t have a six month wait. Where do you come up with 6 months? HIPAA laws and regulations (also adopted by State insurance departments) define the term medically necessary and yes, you and your doctor (or provider) get to decide that together. I hope that doesn’t change. I’m not a liberal-progressive so don’t label me. I have worked in the health insurance company business for over 25 years and have a long perspective on it.
    
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    - April 25, 2012 at 3:41 pm
      
      Rutro says:
      
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      Yes, but your perspective is obviously tilted to the extreme left. There is no waiting period right now, because the monstrosity healthcare reform act doesn’t go into effect until 2014–unless of course, people wake up and take care of business in November…
      
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    - April 25, 2012 at 3:45 pm
      
      Rutro says:
      
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      One more thing…you’re right about the 6 month wait–I don’t know where I got that from. It’ll most likely be MORE than 6 months once our current doctors either retire or find another field before this health care bill puts them out of business.
      
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    - April 25, 2012 at 5:42 pm
      
      Always Amazed says:
      
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      They will though… they will!
      
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April 25, 2012 at 3:06 pm

Lucky says:

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I, for one will be overjoyed if this monstrocity is shot down. It was bad news when conceived, bad news when it was passed and bad news if it is implemented. The Progressives will deny that there are “Death Panels” in this bill, but it clearly states there will be committees to determine whether care is provided. For the elderly, it is a death sentence when a bureaucrat tells the doctor and patient that care cannot be provided. My wife just had a blood clot lodged near her lungs and it had to be removed or she would die. We were lucky the surgeon got to it in time and got it removed. I shudder to think what would have happened if the case had been submitted to an Obamacare bureaucrat and he only authorized a pain pill. I would have been a widower a week later. This is only one reason out of the dozens of other objections I have to this bill. It didn’t have to be this way. They should have done some common sense things, but chose the Progressive way which is disastrous and will lead to poor outcomes and tremendous expense.

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- April 25, 2012 at 4:15 pm
  
  J.S. says:
  
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  I’m happy your wife is OK. However, I shudder to think what would have happened if you didn’t have health insurance and she would have needed to go to an overcrowded emergency room as the only possibility. You would have been a widower a week later.
  
  This is why the pre-Obamacare system doesn’t work. It clearly has death panels. If you don’t have the money to pay or insurance, you will die when things like this happen.
  
  The Republicans had numerous opportunities to help change this over the past 30 years but chose not to. Don’t expect that to change in the future.
  
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  - April 25, 2012 at 4:27 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    Actually, she is on Medicare and a good Supplemental. She was treated very well in the Emergency Room, they ran the proper tests, diagnosed the problem and she went into surgery in the afternoon. Do you think that would happen in Canada or Great Britain or the coming Obamacare? Not hardly. Please don’t blame just the Republicans for no action for the past 30 years. Democrats have been in charge for just as many years. This is a problem that both parties did nothing about. By the way, Republicans did offer alternatives and they were laughed out of the room in favor of shoving a very terrible bill down our throat.
    
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    - April 25, 2012 at 9:00 pm
      
      OmniSure says:
      
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      Medicare IS SOCIALIZED HEALTH CARE. You just have to SURVIVE somehow to age 65 to get it… MEDICARE FOR ALL! Where was the FREE MARKET when hard working, WWII Veterans started to get old (age 65) and started to get sick? NOWHERE! That’s why Medicare became! If the FREE MARKET weren’t shunning itslef from the current UNINSURED/UNAFFORDABLE PROBLEM problem we have in the USA for UNDER AGE 65 CITIZENS, we wouldn’t need OBAMA CARE or anything like it. SOMEBODY SOLVE THE PROBLEM… Ok, here I go… Expand MEDICARE to ALL with HIGH DEDUCTIBLES & TAX SAVINGS ACCOUNT for self funding of all SMALL health maintenance procedures and allow the MEDICARE coverage for the LIFE SAVING BIG STUFF. AND EVERYBODY PAYS, even those on WELFARE they just get LESS in Food Stamps or whatever… a PROGRESSIVE PREMIUM based upon income as this coverage would be MOST IMPORTANT for those with THINGS/CAPITAL to PROTECT from a Doctor’s HUGE MEDICAL BILLS. Poor peaple have nothing to loose but thier lives. Rich folks loos their MONEY then their lives…
      MEDICARE FOR ALL, with prudent management for the “youngsters” of course. THAT SOLVES THE PROBLEM and the DELIVERY SYSTEM is ALREADY IN PLACE (all docotors LOVE to work with Medicare)… Some, too well! Rick Scott…
      I’m OmniSure MEDICARE FOR ALL WOULD SOLVE OUR HEALTH CARE PROBLEM…
      
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      - April 26, 2012 at 2:02 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Why is it unaffordable???? Defensive nedcine being preacticed out of fear of malpractice?
        Once again – Tort Reform.
  - April 26, 2012 at 3:12 pm
    
    Bob says:
    
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    J.S:
    
    Hospitals in the event of an emergency treat first and look for payment later. The wife would be treated exactly the same in an emergency in comparison to someone with insurance. When I tell walk in clinics or emergency rooms I have been to what I’m there for they ask if I have insurance, when I said in the past I did not, they said ok and I was seen just like everyone else. I did not receive a bill until I left. Try again. Your scare tactics are B.S. and don’t happen that way. Ever.
    
    Our current system has very few people who die from not receiving treatment. If they were you would see it on the media every day. Trust me. They would kill for that kind of report.
    
    Republicans are against someone trying to take control of the commerce of health care. Giving free care to people who need it was put in place by Reagan. He was keeping the government from being able to get in bed with private insurers. Treatement would be mandated to be given and whoever gave it would cover the costs. That is different than requiring everyone to have coverage and streamlining that money into the hands of insurers. Insurers have costs and profit margins. Hospitals who take people into the emergency room do as well. It’s better streamlined as it is now, and then dealing with the few circumstances when someone can’t get care, then focusing on health insurance. That’s just ignorant and is about controlling a commerce.
    
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    - April 27, 2012 at 11:30 am
      
      Ins Guy says:
      
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      bob,
      your right and i’ve liked your post. But- you shouldn’t have mentioned Reagan. all the lefties will now automatically dislike your post until your fact is hidden and discount everything else you said. Let the T/D’s come!
      
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April 25, 2012 at 3:07 pm

Ben says:

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Just like Canada and other place where this is already in effect, people will be waiting 6-8 months to get treated, which forces many people to fly here to get quality care. So they end up paying a huge tax for the service that they can’t receive and then have to pay out of pocket to fly out somewhere to be taken care of.

Here’s the real solution. Let the free market reign in health care. Just like supply and demand determines an equilibrium and fair price for electronics and any other goods/services, let it fix the health system too. This, in turn, will also drive competition among doctors and hospitals, which increases the quality of the care consumers receive.

What we have been doing obviously doesn’t work, and adding more mandates and taxes will not fix the problem, it will only worsen it

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- April 25, 2012 at 5:29 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  Canada and Europe as well. Wake up people. Are you not aware of what is going on in Greece, Italy and Spain? They have socialized health care. There are riots and their unemployment rates are astronomically higher then our rate is. Geeze, how’d that happen? I, Me, Mine! Gimme, gimme, gimme! Guess what? If it didn’t work there how do expect it to work here?
  
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- April 26, 2012 at 8:37 am
  
  youngin' says:
  
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  I agree with your sentiments, Ben, but I don’t see an actual solution in your post, just freshman-level economic analysis. The real world is much more complicated. There are legitimate reasons why the healthcare delivery system cannot function within a (fictional and only theoretical) perfect free market system, but I agree that it has gotten much further away than it should be.
  
  If more people had high-deductible plans, and the tax treatment was equalized between individually purchased vs employer purchased, and medical service providers were required to disclose their prices ahead of time and make the patient sign a good-faith estimate of charges BEFORE services are rendered, we would have a much leaner and efficient healthcare delivery system IMO.
  
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- April 26, 2012 at 12:05 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  If my wife had been told to wait 6 months to have surgery for her blood clot by some bureaucrat, I would be planning her funeral right now. She was examined, had tests and operated on the same day because the decision was between us and the doctor as it should be. In a free society, we should have that ability for treatment to save lives. It does not exist with Obamacare. Wake up people.
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 3:25 pm
    
    ComradeAnon says:
    
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    Do you have an example of a bureaucrat saying someone (who is insured) with a blood clot will have to wait 6 months for treatment?
    
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    - April 26, 2012 at 4:47 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
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      Hey Comrade, have you heard of “rationed care”? It is all over this bill. They are cutting Medicare by $500 Billion over 10 years. That means that seniors will be told to take a pain pill and die. No hip replacements, no life saving operations. Anyone who has stayed up with the news on what goes on with Canada and Great Britain’s health system would assume that Obamacare is going to be any different based on everything that has come out on it. You may not like to hear it, but the so called committees run by bureaucrats are nothing more than “Death Panels”. Read the bill dummy. It is in there.
      
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April 25, 2012 at 3:25 pm

Sarah says:

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When was the last time anyone ever recieved a service from the government at a (real unsubsidized) lower cost than they could recieve from the private sector?

Never! Under Obama we have “Government Gone Wild” GSA! and prostitutes in Columbia for the Secret Service. Comon man! Is this the “Change” all of you voted for?

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- April 25, 2012 at 5:17 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  Bravo Sarah! You hit the nail right on its head.
  
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  - April 27, 2012 at 11:34 am
    
    Ins Guy says:
    
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    Always Amazed,
    Interesting how your comment is liked raving about Sarahs comment which is hidden. Guess the lefties can’t read!
    
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    - April 27, 2012 at 12:09 pm
      
      Always Amazed says:
      
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      They one read what they want to read and only hear what they want to hear.
      
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April 25, 2012 at 4:49 pm

DG says:

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More employees will become part time workers if health care is required to be funded by employers. Part time workers do not receive benefits.

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- April 26, 2012 at 2:05 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  I wont hire any one full time any more!
  
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  - April 27, 2012 at 11:36 am
    
    Ins Guy says:
    
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    I hope you spend all of your time & extra money on HR and training.
    
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- April 26, 2012 at 3:01 pm
  
  hmmmmmmm says:
  
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  I am not certain that part time employee will necessarily be exempt. Are you certain?
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 3:10 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Its way too much for me to stay on top of. I have always had success with the COllege Kids. They come in for two years, produce and then they leave after they graduate. Just three years ago, I went o hiring Full Time people. I will be revisiitng the colleges as they dont need it.
    
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April 25, 2012 at 8:17 pm

Rebecca says:

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The solution is simple but due to the corrupt and inept legislatures and judges they will not disclose the real solution. NON PROFIT INSURANCE COMPANY ONLY! AND ONE POOL!!!!!! In each state or as a whole. AS a whole it would be even cheaper and
coverage the best.

Why is it ok with insurance companies to force people to by liability insurance?

If the supreme court throws it out then your employer and insurers control your health and daily lives. Where’s our freedom in this. Do you like giving urine samples. It won’t be your choice if you want to keep your job. do you want your employer telling you that you have to loose weight or get lost? How are you going to feel free with this?

Take my word for it. They don’t care about your health they only care about the dollars.

OBAMA CARE IS THE LESSER OF THE TWO EVILS. It opens the door for much better and bigger reform of the industry as a whole.

This is what the insurance companies really don’t want. It would mean your auto insurance and home insurance could cost you less and they could make less.

People who can’t understand this are in for a rude awakening if the Supreme Court strikes this down. Why aren’t they spending our money abolishing the estate tax, which is immoral (taxing someone even when they’re dead)and putting a hardship on the family.

We lost a family farm, because the gov’t took all the money and the farm had to be mortgaged then sold. WHERE IS OUR GOV’t when this happened.

They’ve been perfecting the art of stealing peoples property, income the day after the revolutionary war.

Remember the Louisiana Purchase? Our Gov’t took land away from citizens who fought, lost blood, limbs and loved ones, so they could sell it for a profit.

They haven’t changed.

And now we citizens have a chance at affordable health care, and we are being fooled again by our corrupt GOP and some Democrats. They are not our representatives, they are being paid with Foreign Corporate dollars. Most, whom don’t even live here and don’t care about anything but $$$$$$.

Wake up!!!!!! If you are against the health care reform as it is then you are either a multi millionaire or gullable and uninformed.

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- April 27, 2012 at 11:40 am
  
  Ins Guy says:
  
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  All this, and now you want them to run your health care choices! Who are you telling to wake up here? Do you have a mirror on your computer?
  
  Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 2:50 pm
  
  InsuranceforLife says:
  
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  Thank you Rebecca.
  
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- May 7, 2012 at 1:51 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Well Sarahahahah or what ever you called you self, I have never had a problem with a private health ins company until O’fn’bama stuck his nose into it. My rpoblem still is not with the carrier, its the premium they are being forced to charge.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 8:19 am

Sarah says:

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Stop it with the Robo dislikes, its obvious Jill and friends of Obama. I guess this proves again that we have to look forward to undocumented imigrants and dead people voting for Obama again in 2012. Remember Acorn, oh thats right liberals do not really care about voter fraud.

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- April 26, 2012 at 10:52 am
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  Yes, I sure do remember ACORN. There was a man in Ohio who said he voted for Obama 56 TIMES!! And the media just ignored it. If someone said they had voted for McCain 56 times there would have been a blood bath. The media and the fools who voted for Obama put an inexperienced man in office, because the wanted to make history, and now we have the mess we’re in today because of it from our healthcare on down. This country as NO leadership! Los Vegas, Columbia & Fast & Furious should have been an eye opener for you people. Wake the blazes up! Greece here we come!
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 2:07 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Dont forget – He cut his political teeth in the mosr corrupt county in the most corrupt state. He grew up under Blago.
    
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    - April 26, 2012 at 2:15 pm
      
      Always Amazed says:
      
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      FAA – That true. Gee I see so many gave me the tumbs down. THE TRUTH HURTS NOW DOESN’T IT! And I did speak the truth! 56 times a man in Ohio voted for Owebaman and NOTHING was done about it! Nothing! That’s politics for you. And I live in Chicago so I know first had how currupt our polticians are.
      
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      - April 26, 2012 at 2:40 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        He should have been made to testify in the Blago trial. Would hav ebeen very interesting to see what he would have said. Same with Rahm. Just makes me wonder what they are hiding? Maybe they could have said something that got him off. Is there an innocent man – even if he is a loud mouth jack ass that put our state in shambles -in jail cuz them two had something to hide?
    - April 26, 2012 at 3:14 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      No One likes the fact there is an Ill Politician in the White House.
      
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  - April 27, 2012 at 11:44 am
    
    Ins Guy says:
    
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    AA: Yes, they remember too, its just that they’re so far “all-in” with Barach Hussein Obama that they don’t want to recant now and look like fools.
    
    Or… maybe their just sheep following the goat up the ramp and are too stupid to know any better.
    
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April 26, 2012 at 8:26 am

Sarah says:

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GSA fiasco, – Secret service with prostitutes, – Fast and furious, – Unconstitutional legislation being shoved down our throat. Voter protection for undocumented imigrants. Unprosecuted black panther voter intimidation.

GOVERMENT GONE WILD!

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- April 26, 2012 at 11:52 am
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Sarah, Judging from several of the posts in this story, it looks like there is a Progressive virus with some of these people. They keep arguing the merits of Obamacare when every fact and statistic says it will bankrupt the country. Everytime it is scored, it double in cost. Hello Progressives! Wake up and smell the coffee. This approach has already failed miserably in Europe. The Euro is toast, Greece is rioting. Britain has cut their program in half, Canada’s doesn’t work and these people still think that Obamacare is the best option. Excuse me folks. It is a disaster on the horizen.
  
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- April 26, 2012 at 3:34 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Secrret Service with Prostitutes? #1 selling service of all time is was always will be sex. Not saying I like that fact, just saying that it is a fact. The knucklehead should have just paid her. Now, cause he is a cheap a@#, its turned into an international incident.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 10:43 am

Bob says:

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Again, Arguing with a Democrat is like playing chess with a pigeon. Even if you know the game of chess inside and out. The pigeon is still going to knock over all the pieces and crap on the table, and strut around victorious.

Go ahead Jill, Youngin and your Libtard Friends, Strut….. But your arguments holds no water.

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- April 26, 2012 at 11:14 am
  
  youngin' says:
  
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  What did I do?
  
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- April 26, 2012 at 4:14 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  *Sigh*…I hate that the other Bob with the same handle as me tends to be a lot more brutal right than common sense right like myself.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 10:46 am

Sam says:

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So I guess this article proves that the Socialist Liberal Democrats knew all along that they were pushing for an unconstitional law! SHAME ON THEM…. They took an oathe to protect this document and then went right ahead and pushed for a law they knew was unconstitutional.

CHANGE AGAIN! TO SOMETHING ELSE. ANYBODY BUT OBAMA 2012!

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- April 26, 2012 at 12:33 pm
  
  Rutro says:
  
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  Ted Nugent was right..Obama IS wiping his a** with our Constitution..go ahead and ‘thumbs down’ me all you libs…er, pigeons…(Bob–hope you don’t mind that I borrowed that!!)
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 2:12 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Long live the NUGE!!! Love his music. Love his way of life. Love his political views.
    
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April 26, 2012 at 12:44 pm

Agent says:

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Mitt Romney made a good speech the other day. I have to agree with what he said. He said that if Obamacare is allowed to stand, the government will control one half of the entire economy. That is a scary thought in a free society. What freedoms will be left if this all powerful government controls every aspect of our lives? That is why we have such a strong opposition to the Progressives in office currently. They need to all be sent packing in November. Romney has the message now and we need to keep the pressure on him and the new Republcans taking office in January to reverse the nasty trend to Progressive Socialism.

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April 26, 2012 at 2:12 pm

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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What part of our government runs healthcare with the mandate? Outside of Faux News, government run healthcare doesn’t exist in the US. The health insurance companies still call all the shots – ha, no pun intended. Right now, there are bureaucrats making your wellness decisions…while sipping on extra dirties atop their yachts you bought them with inflated premiums that continue to hike and denials of coverage for unrelated pre-existing conditions. Take profit out of our healthcare system. Your life shouldn’t be left for stockholders to decide how valuable it is. Oh, and Sarah, your beloved Heritage Foundation came up with “Obamacare”. Blame them. Don’t be so Hannitized. He’s a liar. “Faux News – ‘Fare’ and Manufactured”.

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- April 26, 2012 at 4:23 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  You’re more ignorant on the left if you’re disregarding an entire news station due to a perceived bias. I find pieces on MSNBC all the time and NY Times which work to my benefit. When you take their facts you can often use it against their opinion pieces.
  
  But moving forward, as I have explained this before: Government pays in 1:1, assuming it doesn’t put itself in debt which it usually does. Then there is an operational cost making it under 1:1 for each dollar paid in to healthcare. The 4% overhead cost in Canada is NOT the total cost. Now to move further forward, here is why for profit health insurance companies are better than government:
  
  The health insurance company invests your premiums, and on a large scale controls fraud. Premiums not paid out on a large scale are reinvested to be shared among profit, as well as premiums paid out. Many insurance companies pay out more than they receive on several years. But as they had a surplus, they are fine. They are able to adjust down their rates depending on that surplus. As things are now, only 20% of premiums can be invested. That limits their ability to grow your funds.
  
  The example I give: A good invester can double their money in 15 years. The best can do that in 5. Let’s say they do it in 10. They take your 10 billion dollars, and increase it to 20 billion. Their operational costs including overhead and pay of employees (which are not included in Canada’s overhead numbers of 4%)are 30% of the 10 billion on average. 30% of 10 billion is 3.3 billion. Of the new 10 billion 3.3 billion will go to the insurance company 6.7 BILLION WOULD GO TO INSUREDS. Your stupidity on the left is astounding though. You limit their investment of your premiums (by stating that 80% must go directly to care rather than reinvestment) which limits the growth of funds to YOU then you complain that they aren’t lowering your premiums.
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 5:10 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    Bob, as usual, your posts are far over the head of these Progressive bloggers. They post on emotion and you are on an intellectual, common sense approach. They don’t care about cost and profit is a dirty word to them. It is all about them being entitled and having the all powerful government take care of them. Spread the wealth around and everyone can be equally poor. I hope they all get a one way ticket to Cuba and get some of that free Healthcare Fidel has waiting for them.
    
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- April 27, 2012 at 3:09 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  I also feel the need to point out: The mandate was SUGGESTED by republicans, it didn’t go through so they dropped it. You’re all for a democrat going back to a failed idea from 30 years ago?
  
  That’s not progress. By the way: Stop disliking the posts again and again that you don’t agree with. I know it’s you and Jill. That is dishonest to try and cover up everyone’s arguments but yours. I have not disliked your posts to hide them. My post below about the average expense ratio of 30% is not a fact you can debate, nor is the 20% of premiums can be invested, nor is the doubling your money in 15 years in the stock market. Bureaucrats are not making decisions in the healthcare industry, insureds are. The more these industries grow the more options and capital there will be for all insureds. The government could never tax enough money to even come close to the amount a private company can pay out. I also feel the need to remind you government officials are just as apt to corruption as corporations. You are willing to make the government (which has no checks and balance system, as you would never vote republican, so any democrat would have ultimate say) and are not ok with a set up which would have to have HUNDREDS of insurance companies be corrupt? Which do you think has the higher chance of corruption systematically? Here’s a hint: It isn’t the free market or health insurance companies. People could just choose another insurer. If one is cheaper people will move. They have the goal to be profitable but they CANNOT screw people. Another insurer would eat them up. Grow up kid. If you’re disliking my posts so much you already lost :)
  
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April 26, 2012 at 2:22 pm

Water Bug says:

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Woe! The socialists are out in force today disliking any moderate or conservative comments.

Barry Obama said many times that he wanted a single payer system like Europe. He even said it after he was elected yet he claims to be a capitalist.

BTW I first became interested in politics in the 70′s when Ted Kennedy pushed for the formation of HM”s on the grounds that they wouldn’t work and we would be forced into a European style system.

Let’s do away with socialism once and for all and let’s do it quickly.

OK all you jolly Marxists. Gimme a big red dislike vote.

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April 26, 2012 at 2:32 pm

Rutro says:

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Geez!!! What flavor Kool-Aid are all you libbies drinking today?! I love getting your ire up…it’s so much fun to see you all scramble to post the most recent libbie-progressive babble that they are spewing on MSNBC!!

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April 26, 2012 at 3:02 pm

Chuck in Evergreen says:

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People, everyone. You cannot spend more than you take in. You can’t borrow from programs funded by employees (social security)with no plan to pay it back. You cannot raise taxes on anyone and expect them to buy more and spend more in a free economy. You cannot expect the government to bail you out of your bad decision, over and over again. The politicians cannot expect all of us to continue remain uneducated about the facts and dependant on media’s biased, dishonest, bribed opinion.

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- April 26, 2012 at 3:45 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  HMMM. Old Math. The kind the nuns would smack your knuckles with a ruler for not using. You must be as old as me to be able to remember that basic concept.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 3:05 pm

Always Amazed says:

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It’s amazing how blind the socialist left is. I wish I could find the guy in Ohio on YouTube who said on TV to the whole country that he voted for Barry 56 times! I’ll keep looking….

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- April 26, 2012 at 3:29 pm
  
  ComradeAnon says:
  
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  If you’re not being sarcastic, you just entered the most ironic comment of all time.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 3:11 pm

Water Bug says:

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Hurray! I irritated enough leftist rabble that they felt compelled to shout me down so my comments were hidden.

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- April 26, 2012 at 10:23 pm
  
  Sarah says:
  
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  Robo dislikes, flooding all pro-Obama articles on I.J.
  
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April 26, 2012 at 3:18 pm

Always Amazed says:

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiX2vdbYrio

I am getting closer..

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April 26, 2012 at 3:24 pm

Always Amazed says:

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBrVUrv31is&feature=related

And another one…

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April 26, 2012 at 3:27 pm

Always Amazed says:

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgYdOf-jkno&NR=1&feature=endscr

Geeze – I could do the ALL DAY!

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April 26, 2012 at 3:29 pm

Always Amazed says:

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Hey not the same guy but I’m close. I guess I’ll stop at 18 times. I believe I have made my point.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=x0hUI33MVaQ&NR=1

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April 26, 2012 at 3:30 pm

ComradeAnon says:

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Will RomneyCare be next? If ACA, or parts of it, are found to be unconstitutional, will the lawsuits start against what MA has?

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- April 26, 2012 at 3:33 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  You never know. It will be intereting to see where all the chips will fall.
  
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  - April 26, 2012 at 3:50 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    My guess is he will stay away from the topic all togeather. too much of a hot buttin topic. He will at least be smart enough to wait for his second term.
    
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    - April 27, 2012 at 12:10 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Question for all the dis likes – If you watched someone smash themselves with a hammer, would you then around and do the same thing? Would you evaluate what went wrong and then make sure you did not make the same mistake?
      
      Reply
- April 26, 2012 at 3:52 pm
  
  Ratemaker says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
  12
  12
  They may have started already. However, there is a fundamental difference between a state law and a federal law. I don’t know what powers the Mass. Constitution gives the Mass. government. The case against PPACA is that it overstepped what the federal government can do.
  
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- April 26, 2012 at 5:45 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  I have to ask: Do you just blindly assume that just because a state had reform it logically must be similar to another type of reform? Have you ever reviewed the difference between insurance code in the 50 states or code in general?
  
  The reason I’m curious is: You seem to believe that any reform (Romney Care) is equal or similar to another reform (Obama Care) and I would like specifics rather than vague ridiculous concepts thank you very much. Is there a particular similar section? Could you site the section of the bill please?
  
  *rolls eyes*
  
  Grow up ComradeAnon. Concepts don’t win arguments and don’t make changes. Reality does.
  
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  - April 27, 2012 at 9:36 am
    
    ComradeAnon says:
    
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    Since I have no idea, I asked a question. Nothing more.
    
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    - April 27, 2012 at 12:16 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      It was everything more you smart @$$.
      
      It had implications. When you get backed into a corner you pretend nothing was implied?
      
      Maybe you should get your @#%! straight before you make a comment. Pardon the anger, but I’ve seen your posts and right now you are full of #!@#%@. Be a man.
      
      Reply
      - April 28, 2012 at 1:30 am
        
        ComradeBnon says:
        
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        Hey Bob, with your palindrome @$$, I bet I know what your name stands for. ‘B’arack ‘O’ ‘B’ama. Went from a palindrome to an acronym, didn’t you? Huh? Oh yeah! Gobama 2012! Gobama, Gobama, Go Go Gobama…to the White House again. Oh yeah. Fox and Friends may bring the dividends while drawing cries with their lies. I’ll choose what’s true, the red white and blue, and that’s Barack in two, zero, one, two. Better be coming hard at us with some single payer, though. Nixon was right, yo’. Funny looking at all these posts from the people who think they are or someday will be a 1%er. Good luck…from an Irishman. Or, perhaps you immigrant haters would rather me say buena suerte.
    - April 27, 2012 at 3:13 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      Let’s play comrade. I know how to like and dislike multiple times. You want to try and hide comments to make sure your ugly side isn’t seen? I will outperform you in making sure these comments are not hidden. We can go all day. Do you have the time?
      
      :)
      
      Reply
April 26, 2012 at 3:32 pm

Always Amazed says:

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Sorry – I just HAD TOO!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZwng4omanI&feature=related

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April 26, 2012 at 3:41 pm

Always Amazed says:

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This is the last one I promise..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LG0FRX4plz4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xd72fYWY3I8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTXZN97F1Tw

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- April 27, 2012 at 2:15 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  Anita Mon Crief is an amazing woman. She is well educated, well spoken and she also helped bring Acorn down along with prostitution scandal, the name of the two who posed as a pimp and prostitute evades me now. I’m sure we could them as well on YouTube. A wonderful website to use for information. Obama should have NEVER been allowed to even run for president. 7 million in unmatched voters, if McCain was linked to something as horrible as this it would have been all over the news. That’s the liberal media for you. The truth hurts now doesn’t it?
  
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April 26, 2012 at 4:56 pm

Agent says:

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I like the one Fox did when they interviewed the guys in front of the unemployment office in NY. One guy was doing push ups on the sidewalk and obviously was able bodied. He said he wasn’t interested in finding a job and was just there to get his check. He also admitted to having a number of children by different women and not supporting any of them. He and some of his other buddies said they would vote for Obama because they could get the free stuff. What has happened to this country?

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- April 27, 2012 at 12:17 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  What has happened to this country indeed? Obama and his free stuff not only for his public, but also for his family. Nice vacation they had in Spain on the taxpayers wallet.
  
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April 27, 2012 at 12:25 am

R says:

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A couple of thoughts

We have an estimated 45 – 50 million uninsured in this country. We have an estimated 10 – 15 million illegal immigrants. A little math = 30 million uninsured for health care that are citizens. Many work at jobs with small businesses, not even Main Street, just side-street businesses. I see many comments about the illegal immigrants running up the medical costs when the majority of uninsured are citizens. I am not in favor of anyone breaking the law. Just remember, most of the uninsured are citizens.

As for medical costs, a couple of posts have discussed personal medical cases. Many hospitals now do not allow your network primary care physician, the medical professional you have spent years building a relationship with and who knows your medical history the best – the hospital will not allow that doctor to treat you. They contract with a group of “Hospitalists” who only see patients in the hospital. Why? – because the hospital rules have become so complex that the active PCP cannot keep up with the rules so they must turn to this other group.
What does this get the average patient when they go into the hospital for more than overnight out-patient status? The possibility of more errors, longer stays because the treatments are not effective, more defensive testing, poor communication between the patient and the doctor. Face it, this person stops by for a 5 minute chat once a day and everyone says “you are getting such good care!”

Apart from the politics – does the ACA do anything to control the underlying cost drivers of medical care? The defensive testing, medicine errors, poor care because the doctor does not know the patient, the patient demanding the latest and greatest drug they saw advertised on TV, or the latest test because their relative/friend had one and it was the ‘answer’ to figuring out that case (totally different)? We all have had a part in driving up costs. The only piece of the ACA that may address costs is the Accountable Health Organization which will try rewards for keeping people out of the hospital.

I work at a Community College managing P & C insurance, Student Accident Insurance, and other specialty policies. A student went to the ER for an injury, told them they did not have insurance. The bill – $420. The next week the student went back to get an itemized bill for the Student Accident Insurance claim. The new bill – $1750. Cost shifting impacts all of us. We cannot sustain the current system. It is broken. Stop yelling about politics. Start talking about fixing the system.

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- April 27, 2012 at 12:21 pm
  
  Ins Guy says:
  
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  Good stuff, but I think there’s 1 point missed. “Network PCP”.
  
  These PCPs shop/choose the right networks, or contracts, to be enrolled in based on their client base, business models, etc. As do Hospitals. they especially have to be careful because they more than any other entity in the country, pass uninsured costs off to the insured. If they sign a contract that says they can must charge $1 for an aspirin instead of $5 to cover the cost of all the free ones given out, they quickly start losing money, and I mean quickly.
  
  Reply
April 27, 2012 at 8:11 am

Mary says:

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The federal healthcare law is a convenient whipping boy. Most of the complaints have nothing to do with this law. People who have had healthcare coverage for most of their lives take it for granted and have no idea what it’s like to be without, how one illness can put you in the poor house for the rest of your life. Too many espouse the free market philosophy without consideration of whether it works in the field of healthcare and where it may fall short and need some support. We can choose to have a government keep open options for us or we can choose to have private insurers, which make money by restricting coverage and denying claims, make those decisions. Either way we are not in control of our decisions. Neither is the employer for the most part. I’ll take some government involvement over a profit-driven care system thanks. It’s not socialism or a government takeover as critics like to hype. I guess they just prefer having a private insurer tell them they aren’t covered or that they have to pay more than they do a government getting involved to expand coverage, choice and limit what we have to pay out of pocket. This ought to get some screams.

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- April 27, 2012 at 12:30 pm
  
  Ins Guy says:
  
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  Mary, you are right. People taking things for granted is one of the primary problems in this country. However, forget the socialism, right, left or whatever label for a minute.
  
  My biggest problem is the “some control”. The fact is that the elitist, ego-maniacal politicians don’t know how to do the “some” thing. Great example: why do they spend so much time on MLB Steroid-use? Because they are fans with power and HUGE egos. And, most are lawyers who’s warped sense of perspective tells them they have a duty to because they’re the only ones who can/should.
  
  Reply
April 27, 2012 at 9:22 am

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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Absolutely hilarious, here. Showing a professional director edited footage. Hahahahahahaha:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=61e_1255415784

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April 27, 2012 at 9:38 am

ComradeAnon says:

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It will be interesting to see if the Commerce clause is cited in an overturning, if their will be challenges to other areas established by it. Civil Rights, environmental laws.

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- April 27, 2012 at 4:12 pm
  
  JB says:
  
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  No: the Commerce clause had little (if anything)to do do with Civil Rights – that was a Constitutional Amendments issue (particularly the 1st; 4th; 5th; 6th; 7th; 8th; 9th; 13th; 14th and 19th Amendments)
  No: environmental laws don’t make you do anything, they simply say what you can’t do.
  So, the Commerce Clause appears to be a legitimate basis for overturning PPACA, but not for the others cited.
  
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  - April 27, 2012 at 7:10 pm
    
    ComradeAnon says:
    
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    Gonna have to disagree JB. Ever hear of Heart of Atlanta Motel v United States? And the EPA has frequently cited the Commerce Clause in regulation. I’ve never heard of the Clause as a reason to overturn the ACA. It’s what’s cited as the power FOR it.
    
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    - May 1, 2012 at 9:37 am
      
      JB says:
      
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      Gonna have to disagree, ComradeAnon. The case cited did reference certain constitutional rights. The Commerce Clause in that case had to do with federal regulation of public accommodations. I assume that if the motel owner disagreed with the (proper) finding he would have been free to get out of the motel business.
      As for the Commerce Clause being cited as a reason FOR the PPACA, it is also cited as reason to strike it down. Some believe that there is a distinction between “regulating” commerce and forcing “participation” in that commerce. So, a part of the argument both for and against the PPACA hinges on the interpretation of “regulation”.
      
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    - May 1, 2012 at 2:12 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
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      It is interesting that you cited EPA in your argument. They are doing unconstitutional things every day. Have you heard about the guy at EPA bragging that he just goes in and “crucifies” companies so that the others in the industry will be easier to manage. Of course, he has had to resign in disgrace now, but I am sure he will find a new job on the campaign. I cannot believe you are so naive to not see the light about what this administration is doing on a daily basis. The idea of a government forcing a free people to buy a product on pain of a fine or tax is abominable. These free people are going to do something about that in November.
      
      Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 11:01 am
  
  Sarah says:
  
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  Huh! What! Commerce Clause/ Civil Rights, Environmental laws?
  
  Get a grip Comrade Anon! You really are stretching the limits of reasonable thinking here.
  
  Reply
April 27, 2012 at 10:56 am

Water Bug says:

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I don’t think anyone is opposed to reforms in our healthcare industry. Many if not most of us look at the USPS, Social Security, Medicare, and other mega agencies that are wasteful and inefficient and dislike the idea of more parts of our lives ruined by governmental interference.

There are plenty of free market solutions. Single payer health insurance is not the answer.

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- April 27, 2012 at 12:44 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  I think one thing most of us agree on is this is the most divisive issue of our times. Any legislation which divides the country this badly cannot be good for the country. If more than half the states have sued to have it overturned, there are big time issues with it and it is blatantly unconstitutional. We are talking about giving the already too powerful government control over our lives and our freedoms will be stripped away by the bureaucracy. Our economy will continue to slide with overburdening taxation and regulation. Big Brother here we come if we don’t stop it now.
  
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April 27, 2012 at 12:19 pm

JB says:

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All the sniping and vitriol is astounding (and very amusing) but understandable considering the flawed philosophy that things will be better when some group/faction can control events and micro-manage things because they know better. A goodly number think it’s okay for the government (the entity with the power to coerce, punish and reward, they hope) to force anyone/everyone to play in their game, due primarily to their own greed, envy and desire for power. Claiming altruistic motives is an elixir for the gullible masses, designed to hide the BS behind a thin veil of “compassion”. Deny the motives if you will, but you’d be wrong. I just wish some of these dimwits would stop trying to love me so much.
But the hard truth is that anyone who believes that anyone or anything can truly be controlled is delusional. So the control crowd can do what they will, they’re grasping at smoke-rings.
In the long run there is one inevitable, inescapable truth: no matter how rich or poor, healthy or sick, joy or sorrow any of us experience, we will all return to dust. No system of health care or doctor’s skill can change that. And 100 years from now very few human beings walking this earth will remember or much care how brilliant you or I thought we were. I ask you, does anyone remember what the Roman Emperor Latinforanus Gladurgongovinicus said in the year 120 A.D.? I didn’t think so.
All of this everyone getting their noses up in everyone else’s business may be annoying, but in the grand scheme of things is trivial. In the meantime: Children behave! Stop lying, and stop taking things that don’t belong to you!

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- April 27, 2012 at 5:01 pm
  
  OmniSure says:
  
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  JB said:In the long run there is one inevitable, inescapable truth: no matter how rich or poor, healthy or sick, joy or sorrow any of us experience, we will all return to dust. No system of health care or doctor’s skill can change that.
  
  JB,
  Now you’ve got me wondering, will Obama Care cover THE BULLET?
  
  Thanks for BRIGHTENING UP MY DAY!
  Omni Out
  
  Reply
April 27, 2012 at 2:46 pm

Bill says:

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Stop it with the ROBO dislike! If you want to really read the posts click on the responses that are hidden.

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April 27, 2012 at 2:52 pm

Bill says:

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Stop ROBO dislikes, it is certainly obvious on the above posts. Could even be IJ due to their obvious liberal bias in their reporting.

NOBAMA 2012!

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April 27, 2012 at 3:47 pm

JB says:

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Maybe a lot of the dislikes are coming from people who are disliking themselves after reading what they just posted?

Or, maybe more likely, it’s a devious plan to get more people to read them, knowing that human psychology will lead many to want to find out – oh, just gotta know – what’s being hidden?

Or, most likely, a lot of people just tap around liking and disliking, and then pat themselves on the back as if they accomplished something? As if disliking will somehow magically render the commentator’s opinion unworthy of consideration?

(Thinking to myself: these likes and dislikes are all over the map…I hope I don’t get too many dislikes, my self-esteem will surely plummet…so many questions, so few answers…hope I can sleep tonight…)

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- April 27, 2012 at 4:53 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  JB, It is obvious to me that Progressives are an unhappy lot and have apparently victims of a mental disease, apparently incurable in a lot of cases. They have also been taught by union teachers that Capitalism is bad and Socialism is good and it is fine to redistribute the wealth of the country since they have bought into this farce. Obamacare will be the biggest redistribution of wealth in the history of the country. It will also be a big job killer as employers cut back on employees because they won’t be able to afford it. Tell me Progressive bloggers, how will this country restore the economy with a rising unemployment rate and many employers going out of business? How will this bill lower costs when they are already skyrocketing due to what is on the horizen. The bill has already doubled in cost from the first scoring. How is this affordable? If you want free Healthcare, move to Cuba. Perhaps Fidel can get you fixed up as long as you agree to work in the sugar cane fields. Enjoy your rice and beans because that is the staple diet in that country.
  
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  - April 27, 2012 at 5:13 pm
    
    Sarah-ahahaha says:
    
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    Sean Hannity has lots of friends on the rice and beans diet:
    http://www.newshounds.us/sean_hannity_let_them_eat_rice_and_beans_04242012
    
    Reply
April 27, 2012 at 5:39 pm

TxLady says:

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In reading through all these, including the hidden ones, it is odd how comments that would normally be well liked are being disliked. In all the years I have been following IJ, I’ve never seen this many posts from so many new names, nor this many likes and dislikes. IJ readers are usually fairly conservative, and have in the past been pretty one sided on the health care, and these likes, dislikes and posts just don’t seem to tie out. Something sure is up. I expect this to get heartily disliked, then hidden.

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- April 27, 2012 at 5:59 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  The dis likes have to be from Non Commission Insurance Sales people. How can anyone sell group insurance with the crappy commission scale the carriers put out now? A Tremendous disinsentive for any one to even attempt to market this stuff any more.
  
  Reply
April 28, 2012 at 1:15 am

Glenn Beck 2016 says:

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13
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I know what it is. I bet the government has ACORN and Black Panther recruits checking all websites that have hot political debate with forums. Have them swing the votes. Make it seem like socialism is alive and well in this country. The people here are too smart for that. I don’t know how to robo-vote, as some of you have put it here. Maybe I don’t have the magic button. But, if I could, I’d be voting for myself a lot right now. The only real place to get news is Fox. Smart like a Fox! Though, I really wish we could have someone to vote for in 2012 rather than someone to vote against. I’m not sure Romney is all that much better. I’ve seen multiplechoicemitt.com. It’s upsetting we don’t have someone better to run against the current administration. To be honest, with Mitt, I’m not all that enthused to even show up. Seems like much more of the same no matter who wins the office. All of the candidates we had going were more interested in social ideology than fixing the country and healthcare. I hope for someone and something better in 2016.

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April 28, 2012 at 2:00 am

Moving Forward says:

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I once knew a man who won DC. Flawless was his philosophy. He sat with Joe B, fixing things for you and me, and did indeed improve this country. 4 more years, Barack O’-B (1 Kenobi). That’s a Star Wars reference for all you Reagan fans. How’s that 30+ years of the horse and sparrow, err, trickle down working out for us? Do we even have a middle class anymore?

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- May 1, 2012 at 11:40 am
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Hey Moving! The reason why the middle class is shrinking is because of big government, excessive taxation, excessive regulation and their attempts to micro manage our economy. The EPA is the biggest job killer in the country. As the now disgraced and resigned EPA guy said, they would just come in and crucify companies and that makes the rest of them easier to manage. They should be the first to be defunded and disbanded. We are now in the midst of “Trickle up Poverty” as practiced by Obama and his minions. Spread that wealth around and everyone gets poorer. What an insane policy to do in the greatest country on planet earth. This is why I state that Progressivism is a mental disease and is a completely opposite philosophy from what made the country great.
  
  Reply
  - May 1, 2012 at 2:00 pm
    
    Sarah-ahahaha says:
    
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    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/aug/12/mitt-romney/mitt-romney-gets-another-pants-fire-saying-were-in/
    
    Reply
    - May 1, 2012 at 3:30 pm
      
      Sarah-ahahaha says:
      
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      http://www.politifact.com/ohio/statements/2012/jan/19/dennis-kucinich/dennis-kucinich-says-combined-top-ceo-pay-topped-7/
      
      Reply
      - May 1, 2012 at 3:31 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2011/nov/16/rick-scott/rick-scott-us-regulations-are-most-difficult-world/
- May 3, 2012 at 10:09 am
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Cant understand why Defecit spending was such a good idea.
  
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April 28, 2012 at 11:32 am

Bob says:

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Whoever is doing the dislikes to hide comments: you are a weak controlling fool. The whole world does not have to believe what you believe. And you call yourself a democrat. Pathetic.

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- April 28, 2012 at 12:09 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Bob, Sarah, Always,FFA, JB! These robo dislikes are a sign that Progressives have infected this site. They sure hate hearing the truth. Everytime I see a debate on TV between a Conservative and a Progressive, the Progressive tries to bully and shout down the opponent because they don’t have a leg to stand on with their position. As I stated in a prior post, Progressivism is a mental disease. I wonder if Obamacare will cover it. Perhaps not if they are on Medicare.
  
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April 28, 2012 at 11:47 am

bob says:

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Forget it, I’m not balancing out your dislikes, everyone just so you know: Turn off cookie storing and it allows you to vote multiple times. The person who feels the need to hide every comment that they don’t like is doing that. I tested by going against certain names to find out who was most likely.

Comrade Anon is the only one who appeared to defend his posts. It’s likely him.

The Sarah-hahahaha of course is the person doing it and defended the posts as well. But I’m thinking that title name is also ComradeAnon.

This is basically the most absurd thing I’ve seen a democrat do. Such indoctrination.

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- April 28, 2012 at 12:23 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Maybe they want to hit the unemployment line and grab some give a ways. Ride the unemployment system – grab some free medical care -be part of the problem.
  Bob obviously does not live in Illinois if this is the most absurd thing you have seen a dumacrat do.
  I’ve been advised to close up my Ill Corp and move out of state. Which state I asked. Answer – any state.
  
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  - April 30, 2012 at 12:16 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    FFA, if you reside and work in almost any of the blue states, you have a problem. They are all for government solutions to everything and the union influence in education and industry is oppressive. I don’t know how many businesses make it in those states. We will welcome you in Texas. No State Income Tax, Right to Work, no oppressive regulations and we believe in Individual Responsibility and Freedom to live our lives as we see fit. Obama’s favorability is about 15% and dropping.
    
    Reply
April 28, 2012 at 1:02 pm

Sarah says:

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Obamas campaign pays people are paid to post and the ROBO DISLIKES! Are proof are hiiting all sights to limit desenting opinion. SHAME ON OBAMA AND HIS CAMPAIGN! Childish unethical behavior is nothing new for them.

IF YOU WANT TO READ OPINIONS READ HIDDEN POSTS. WHO VOTES AGAINT A HIDDEN POST? 120 dislikes Comon man! SHAME ON YOU MOOCHING LIBTARDS!

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April 28, 2012 at 1:07 pm

Sarah says:

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Libtards cannot argue on factual information so they revert to childish behavior like voting dislikes to hide the truth!

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April 28, 2012 at 3:04 pm

FFA says:

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Simple Pole. ObAma Care. Like or dislike?
No beefing, no explanation necessary. Like or dislike.
For you Robo guys & gals please resist the temptation and let the masses be heard.

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- April 30, 2012 at 11:14 am
  
  Bill says:
  
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  Really FFA! What do you think is going to happen, Do you think that the Obama Campaign is not in full swing?
  
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  - April 30, 2012 at 1:53 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    I am thnking that this will be skewed on the dis like side by about 60%. So, 23 likes and 14 dislikes so far with the Likes being 23 and Dislaike being 37. I can use new math too.
    
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    - April 30, 2012 at 4:44 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Had my numbers back wards. Only 14 likes when I apply the 60% Robo guys to slant things Pres Give A Ways way. 39 Dislikes. So 53 Legit Non Robo Votes total 39 Dis Likes vs 14 likes. 14 people out here like increased rates, increased govt interferance, free give a ways.
      
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      - April 30, 2012 at 5:07 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Funny you Robo this post.
  - May 1, 2012 at 11:00 am
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Well Bill, even the Paid Robo Obama campaign cant hide the truth. Disregard the 60% Robo guys. As of 09:47 May 1, 64 Dis Likes vs 24 Likes. 72% of people in this Forum are against O Bama Care.
    Yes, this is what I expected. People feeling the impact speaking out. If the Robo guys are colleges kids paid by the OBAma Campaign, that speaks volumes. They know under this guy their future is not looking good. They are bitting the hand that feeds them today so they dont get kicked in the crotch down the road.
    
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    - May 1, 2012 at 3:41 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Nobody likes the ugly truth. As of 02:30 May 1, more votes in and still holding firm 72% of people including the robos dont like OBama Care. But yet, Obama is ramming it down our throats.
      In November, lets make sure the door dont hit him in the a#@ on the way out. He would probably try and get one of his give a ways to line his pockets.
      
      Reply
- May 1, 2012 at 4:59 pm
  
  Sarah-ahahaha says:
  
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  Most people don’t like it because it doesn’t go far enough. It’s a step in the right direction, but a strong majority wanted the public option. This is why your poll is deceiving you in your comments below.
  
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  - May 1, 2012 at 5:19 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Be that as it may Sara, 72% of the people dis like it. Their reason are their own. Its obvious the Robo folks resisted the temptation no matter who pays them. When you cut through all the debate 72% dislike it.
    
    Tell that to the two people I let to go be able to afford my health insurance. Dont think it will be of any help to them. All they know is my bill sky rocketed and I had to fire them to be able to pay it. All my family knows is I am now working 6 & 7 days a week because the work has not stopped.
    
    It boiled down to a simple business decision – old math. I sit wondering how they are going to feed their family, pay their mortgage, provide for their own Health Care.
    
    Just wondering, what do you base your conclusion on? Have you done a poll? Survey something? Is there something out there I have yet to see? All I see / hear is people complaining about their rates. They are begining to learn the New Definition of affordable.
    
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  - May 1, 2012 at 6:13 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    What did you do? Threaten the Robos that you were going to fire them? No comment on why you think you know what the majority of people think?
    
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  - May 1, 2012 at 6:20 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    So, between 04:50 and 05:15 Chicago time, 271 people “liked” your assumption not backed up by any fact that you have presented.
    
    Of course, no one liked what happened here – more people hitting the umemployment for the simple fact that I had to pay my health care bills.
    
    How about we all write in Scott Walker for Pres. 52 states and the Fed Government – how many balanced budgets within first term in office? One that I know of.
    
    Reply
  - May 2, 2012 at 3:24 am
    
    Bob says:
    
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    And the public option could never pay out as much as private. See my other comment. Those are facts. Including bonuses and corporate executive for profit pay the average expense ratio is 30%. Companies reinvest and build the money invested. If that money went to the government, the double earnings on it in 10 years would not happen. With a 2 billion dollar company (as many large insurance companies are in size) investing 30% (the amount allowed) and paying out to claims as they happen allows growth on 30% of 2 billion, being doubled in 10 years. That’s 30% of 2 billion (600 million) they invest, which becomes 1.2 billion with a B. They take 30 percent of the built up amount, AKA what you call greed (which is 360 million) and then pay 70 percent as per usual which is 840 million. The government would have no such build up. But because you don’t want “corporations” (and by default the jobs and people they employ) getting 360 million on the return you’d rather get rid of the 840 million which the government for a fact would not have if they received 2 billion. They would have 2 billion. End of story. No capital built. The public option is less efficient. Like it or not. If I’m wrong then prove me wrong rather than disliking. Do it. Use some numbers.
    
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    - May 2, 2012 at 3:26 am
      
      bob says:
      
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      That should read 740 million.
      
      Those numbers are not debatable. And that doesn’t run up any debt. None. No red ink. No debt for our children. All of it goes to jobs, and people employed. Insurance people are paid pretty well. You’d rather turn them into 30,000 a year government employees running us into debt. Shame.
      
      Reply
    - May 2, 2012 at 3:30 am
      
      bob says:
      
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      And to reiterate: This means with 2 billion in dollars, they can pay out 2.74 billion in claims over a ten year window in green ink. That isn’t even including the reinvesting of their premiums each year. It’s laughable that you think the government can come close to competing with those ratios. The government would have invested 2 billion dollars, had an expense ratio of 10% at the lowest, and 1.9 billion would go to insureds. Get the math now moron?
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 8:57 am
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        How would the Public Insurance Option Work?
        Under this plan, the government would establish a new public insurance option that would be made available to folks through a national insurance exchange.
        The insurance exchange would offer a range of regulated private plans and the public insurance plan to the uninsured.
        The public insurance option would:
        1. Offer “comprehensive” benefits with incentives for disease prevention and payment methods that reward results;
        2. Build on Medicare’s claims administrative structure and national provider networks;
        3. Be open to individuals and to large employers;
        4. Provide income-related premium assistance to help low-income folks afford coverage;
        5. Set a minimum benefit standard to ensure access and adequate financial protection in the case of an emergency.
        Plan advocates stress that insurance obtained through the exchange could go with the insurance holder, thus helping folks to retain their coverage upon moving or losing their jobs.
        Upon the creation of the public insurance option,
        • Folks would be required to obtain coverage,
        • Employers would be mandated to offer insurance, or pay into a trust fund that assists low-income people in affording their premiums.
        The hope is that the public insurance option would help to reduce the price of private insurance through increased competition: The public plan will spend just 5% on overhead costs, compared to the nearly 15% currently spent by private insurers.
        The Commonwealth Fund predicts that private insurers will be forced to cut administrative costs and waste to offer comparable premiums and retain customers.
        In this extensive report, the Commonwealth Fund argues that health expenditures could be reduced by $3.3 trillion by 2020 by implementing a number of healthcare reform initiatives. The recommendations include the creation of the public insurance plan, and assert that the maximum savings cannot be achieved without such a program in place.
    - May 3, 2012 at 1:25 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Well Bob, He is not just the give a way pres, he is also the take away pres. Reach right into you & my pockets just to give some one another give a way.
      
      Reply
  - May 2, 2012 at 12:19 pm
    
    Bob says:
    
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    Sarah-hahaha:
    
    My numbers were concrete, everything you just wrote was conceptual except for overhead. The Expense ratio includes overhead. 30% is pay including overhead and all costs. 70% goes to claims.
    
    Keep with me now: Up to 30% of premiums can be invested, as they are not paid out consistently. This sounds like it’s 130% but it’s not as claims take time to happen and happen at certain ratios. This is why the government had limited it to 30% can go to investments, Obama changed it to 20%.
    
    The overhead number being lower for the Government doesn’t matter, it could be half, and it wouldn’t matter and here’s why:
    
    2 billion dollars: 15% overhead cost: $300 million cannot go to insureds, so 1.7 billion can. That’s the numbers the government can pay out.
    
    2 billion dollars: 30% expense ratio (including overhead costs) makes $600 million cannot go to insureds, 1.4 billion can. HOWEVER 30% of the premiums are invested, and increase in size, consistently. I will just go on a 1 year basis, in reality they reinvest constantly, which means you would add each year, and add the annual return rate, and the number would be larger than 10 times my final number. 2 billion multiplied by 30% investments, $600 million is going out to investments. That $600 million becomes 1.2 billion in ten years. They take 30% which is 360 million and give 740 million to insureds. They received 2 billion dollars and paid out 1.4 billion initially, and another 740 million after 1 year’s premiums 10 year return. 10 year’s premiums returns would not necessarilly be 10 times 740, as each year’s surplus (have you looked at insurance companies profit charts and surpluses you moron?) would also receive an annual return as they invested. THESE are numbers. Comparing overhead does not compare the capital that for profit companies create which can then be used to pay claims. They invest their premiums and grow funds, many of them operating as banks as well to get huge returns to be used for premiums. That is what you neglect to account for, while the government collects taxes, (premiums) which don’t grow, the private companies grow the funds. You also neglect to see that tort reform, or reform to control costs would do the same thing as a public option. The public option would only lower costs, IF they also controlled costs by changing coverage parameters and streamlining it. Why not stream line it for the private insurance companies? With the numbers I put above, they for a fact can pay out more than they receive due to investment growth on premiums. The government cannot pay out more than they receive. It’s a fact. Not debatable.
    
    Reply
    - May 2, 2012 at 12:36 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Bob, She is a paid Robo worker. Before she got on the robo squad, 72% of all responding did not like OBama Care.
      She does not consider the effect at the street level- Unemployment, Increase in overall cost, Increase in Taxxes necessary to fund this thing, burrying my Great GrandChildren and their Children in debt, people losing their houses just to name a few.
      Disregard anything she has to say because she is paid to say it.
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 3:48 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        I’m not sure she’s paid but I’m sure she doesn’t know how to do math for herself. CBO study quoting is like applying math that doesn’t work, and then modifying the numbers to explain the math didn’t work with math that doesn’t work again, and then recyling that again and again. There’s only so many times you can state the study changed, before you have to acknowledge that the first study was wrong to begin with, and discredits all the studies.
        
        This girl will realize it eventually. When presented with loss ratios, expense ratios, and surplus charts from insurance companies I am amazed she hasn’t already.
  - May 2, 2012 at 4:49 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    587 likes????? Is this your day job? Spread the new OBAma Math?
    
    Reply
  - May 7, 2012 at 1:59 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Really Robo Sarahahaha? 700 to 3? A Public option that will only increase taxes and federal expenditures to people that cant find a job due to this laws trickle down effect of a dis incentive to hire full time people?
    
    Reply
- May 2, 2012 at 2:32 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Too bad Robo Sara got on her emplyees and skewed this to what she thinks. Whats next – secret service kicking down my door? Due to the increase of unemployment in my home town, there has been a surge in Hookers hanging around because thats all they can get for work. I am in the state of pay to play, soo… Wonder how much a hooker is these days?
  
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- May 3, 2012 at 4:57 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Back off the 60% Robo Sara ahahaha factor 103 total votes – 68.93%
  Dislike Obama Care.
  
  Reply
April 28, 2012 at 8:40 pm

Bob says:

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ComradeBnon:

In my entire life I’ve never heard such a fool. So my comment about how to build up capital, and the expense ratio (which includes corporate bonuses and incomes) how do you explain off that one buddy? Those are numbers, and they easily explain to you why a for profit company would outperform a non profit/government entity. Did you even take out a F#@ing calculator? That’s under an 8% annual rate doubling your money in 15 years you @#$%!ing retard! At which rate if they double the earnings, took 30% which for a FACT IS THE EXPENSE RATIO FOR FIRMS CURRENTLY INCLUDING MILLIONAIRE PAY RATES, they would have 70% of the double earnings to give to you OF WHICH THE GOVERNMENT WOULD HAVE NONE, and more importantly that they ARE giving to you. It can’t be going anywhere else, the GOVERNMENT tracks expense ratios as part of a combined ratio. Did you study this at all? I’ve been in this field for nearly a decade how long have you? It’s @#%!ing numbers, and us here in the insurance field know it. We don’t aim to be 1%’ers, we aim to have everyone have a fair chance, and not screw people for the sake of screwing them, regardless of wealth or status. Your side hates the wealthy, and last I checked, it’s not ok to hate someone just because it’s popular to do so. Bill Gates created over 100,000 jobs, a non profit charity, and before he ends a single day helps millions. What the #%!@ have you done lately? Every single 1%er gives more than you to society. And quit bragging about being an Irishman. I don’t know about you, but no one but a prejudiced person says that one type of person can outperform another. Am I sensing some racism there? Also: You don’t know my ideals on immigration, you @%@ing tool. You can speak English and you work? Fine by me if you live in this country. I have no problems with immigrants. My family happens to be Mexican on my mother’s side. I’m a quarter, you freaking fool. Marie is my mother’s middle name you retarded libtard. If you know hispanic naming schemes you know what that means.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 10:28 am

TxLady says:

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I was right, my comment was rated extremely low, all for simply saying something seemed to be up with the comment rating and that it did not tie out with the usual IJ readers. The comment was made late friday afternoon, and very few people read or make comments on the weekends, yet it has 103 dislikes. Funny, funny. Go figure.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 10:32 am

Sarah says:

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See the ROBO dislikes? Get ready for the Obama Campaign, They have paid bloggers from colleges campus’s across the US in their get out to vote campaign.

The problem is, The kid’s that are being paid bloggers by the Obama campaign, can not find a job! They can not find employment doing anything they are majoring in. They are supporting the one guy who has killed their ability to work! LOL… It is very ironic!

Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 10:55 am
  
  TxLady says:
  
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  Ironic, yes, but also incredibly sad. With two kids in college, they tell me what their fellow students think. Not a one they know supports Obama.
  
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  - April 30, 2012 at 12:51 pm
    
    TxAgent says:
    
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    I think he has lost support with the young iphone crowd. They graduate and then can’t launch a career because there are no jobs for them. Those who have Bachelor of Arts degrees are really in a pickle because they are not trained to do anything. Many of them joined the OWS crowd and have retreated to the basement to blog kind of like the ones who are doing all the dislikes on this site. To say they are disenchanted with the country is putting it mildly.
    
    Reply
April 30, 2012 at 10:47 am

Ins Guy says:

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Sounds like an terrorist plan to me. They tried 11 years ago, failed and come with something new. I’m still not convinced of the citizenship of our president (not the paper / id, etc).

No president should be allowed to retain his seat who wont salute his troops, hand his heart or even speak the pledge of allegiance.

does anyone have video of the innaugaration? Was it even a bible?

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 10:56 am

Al says:

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ComradeAnon says: “Do you have an example of a bureaucrat saying someone (who is insured) with a blood clot will have to wait 6 months for treatment?”

Yes. Daily in Canada and UK. Oh, and Cuba.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 11:04 am

Al says:

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Wow, not only are the auto-hide posts mostly conservative, you can”t vote to “like” them once they’re hidden.

Huh.

I hear the wife of the publisher is a big lefty. She probably has nothing else to do.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 11:40 am

GETREAL says:

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Like or Dislike appears to have been compromised. Impossible that there are so many Dislikes responding to support Obamacare. IJ has never had that many Obamacare supporters chiming in. Of did the reviewer for IJ click away on the Dislikes?

I’m getting strange vibes of some parallels to stuffing the ballot box (like the pro-no-ID crowd) type voting folks. Hmmm….

Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 11:48 am
  
  Jim says:
  
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  Getreal, I think there are dead people posting here too…LOL… Funny how almost all unethical illegal voting is done for democrats. Huh?
  
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  - April 30, 2012 at 12:54 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    HMMMM. Must be an Il Based Company. Most Likely – Chicago.
    
    Reply
April 30, 2012 at 11:58 am

Sam says:

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Funny how the Obama supporters revert to Acorn tactics when it comes to voting. LOL…

If I was a Democrat, I would be ashamed of stuff like this, but wait, then again, I wouldnt be a democrat if I was capable of shame. LMAO….

Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 2:35 pm
  
  Always Amazed says:
  
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  Exactly, Sam! Acorn and the Black Panthers, both.
  
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April 30, 2012 at 12:04 pm

bob says:

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Hilarious. I agree Sam, Sarah, and Texas Lady. It is shameful. They seem to want to help the little guy, even if he doesn’t want it. They seem to want to win to help everyone, even if it means making up votes to account for the people who don’t want a part of it. Whether we like it or not, Democrat is the way to go, it should be forced on us.

That kind of mentality is sickening.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 12:11 pm

Al says:

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Yeah, I refreshed and clicked “like” for one of my own posts about ten times, and couldn’t keep up with whoever is disliking it.

And the conservative posts are being hidden as fast as you can say “Liberals have severe emotional and cognitive disabilities.”

This site is a joke.

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April 30, 2012 at 1:02 pm

FFA says:

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84 of 138 (60.86%) hidden and more to follow. Not sure what bench mark they use to hide posts. All of mine speak agains O Bum huh and his give a way style. As of 12:02 Chicago time, almost every one is hidden. HMMMMMM.

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 1:34 pm

Bob says:

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Arguing with a liberal is like playing chess with a pigeon, No matter how much you know about the game, inside and out. He is going to jump up on the table, knock over all the pieces and crap in the middle of the board and for some strange reason then strut around victorious.

Just saying,

Reply
April 30, 2012 at 1:47 pm

youngin' says:

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Wow. I didn’t realize how many crackheads work in the insurance industry.

Reply
- May 1, 2012 at 8:09 am
  
  JB says:
  
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  Yeah, with all this bizarre disliking, you might be onto something.
  
  Reply
  - May 3, 2012 at 8:54 am
    
    JB says:
    
    Like or Dislike:
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    12
    Oh, and even more bizarre liking.
    
    Reply
April 30, 2012 at 3:07 pm

FFA says:

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Well, 1st Q taxxes due today. Obvious I need to let another full timer go. Thats means two Full time people in my small business since the Impact of OBamaCare March 1, 2012. Wonder how many other small business in the same shoes.
Thanks Mr President. Guess I did not need one day off a week. Guess my quality of life with my familiy didnt need to improve. Some bumb grabbing your give a ways deserves it more3 then do I.

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- April 30, 2012 at 3:46 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  FFA, I am sure you will be thrilled with the $127 rebate you will be getting on the MLR. You may be able to fill up twice on that money. Isn’t Obamacare wonderful? I am sure all the Progressive bloggers on the dislikes are jumping up and down for joy.
  
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  - April 30, 2012 at 4:38 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    No one likes the fact that I have to fire two people to pay for the increase in OBama Care. Guess we can take them 61 votes and translate them to the Dis Like of Obama Care.
    
    Reply
April 30, 2012 at 4:01 pm

Bob says:

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The Obama campaign is up and running arent they? Known for their efforts to squelch any information that is not supportive of a socialist take over of healthcare.

Shame on thier paid bloggers!

Reply
- April 30, 2012 at 4:11 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  I would say at hyper speed. They must really be worried about their guy staying in. Now, they are publishing names of Romney supporters and intimating they are crooks etc. There is literally nothing they won’t stoop to doing to further their agenda. It seems to me these Progressive bloggers would be ashamed of what Obama and his minions are pulling, but I am sure they will be given a pass just like the lame stream media does on a daily basis.
  
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- May 1, 2012 at 2:05 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Yes, but they resisted the temptation to “like” on my poll about OBama Care. Overwhelming majority has hit dislike.
  
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May 1, 2012 at 2:09 pm

Bob says:

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Wow. I can only imagine how much time and effort it took to do that many dislikes. We must really have ruffled that person’s feathers.

Kid who is doing the dislikes: Hiding comments through dislikes isn’t the way to fight ethically. If democrats aren’t about fairness and ethics to do with politics, then what are they about? If you believe in your party you are doing it a dishonor.

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- May 1, 2012 at 3:50 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Bob, Perhaps they hired the OWS kids hiding out in Mom’s basement to infect this site with all these dislikes. I don’t know what they are unhappy about. They get 3 squares, mom does their laundry, doesn’t charge rent and they can blog all day spewing their venom against us.
  
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  - May 1, 2012 at 4:04 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    I have two grown children living back home because no one will hire them full time (including me). No one wants to pay the health insurance. They are just as disgruntled as I am. The more student loans they have to pay while unemployed, the wider their eyes open.
    
    Reply
    - May 1, 2012 at 4:22 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
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      I was fortunate that one of my daughters is a Physician’s Assistant and the other one is a Pharmacist. They are good to go on their careers. I just wonder how the healthcare system will degenerate in the coming years if this dastardly bill is allowed to stand. They may be working twice the hours at half the pay in a few years if this bill is not overturned. Currently, they have a good life and are successful. I am worried about them and my grandchildren because of what they will face in the future.
      
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      - May 1, 2012 at 6:08 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        WOW. 31 people dont like the fact that your daughters can take care of them selves.
      - May 1, 2012 at 8:51 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
        Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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        I personally don’t like the rhetoric about “dastardly bill”. But, I’m just one of thirty-one.
      - May 2, 2012 at 3:37 am
        
        bob says:
        
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        Rhetoric? I’m sorry do you know what that word means? You mean to state: You just don’t like “anyone’s opinions that don’t match yours” and you’re just one of “you” who voted 31 times in a hyper frenzy because you’re a fool.
        
        There. Corrected. Continue. I mean please do prove me wrong and quit feeling the need to dislike everyone’s posts multiple times. Feel free to be honest. I wouldn’t expect it from someone who talks about “rhetoric” to “dastardly bill” (matter of opinion) while they go down grading every post they don’t agree with it. I don’t like that “dastardly rhetoric!”. Insert sarcasm here. The mis-used word was intentional. Grow up Sarah-hahaha
May 1, 2012 at 9:14 pm

Sarah says:

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Youngin, sarahahaha, jill, you guys vote just like all democrats. Unfairly and illegally. You should be ashamed of this display of your political party’s ethics. Pittiful! Plain and simple.

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- May 2, 2012 at 4:03 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  FFA, isn’t it a travesty that these people can’t stand the thought of me raising two wonderful daughters who had the desire to be educated and succeed in a profession? We taught them personal responsibility and the value of work and they abhor people who just want to be on the government dole for the freebies. That is the height of laziness and stupidity.
  
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  - May 2, 2012 at 7:33 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Very upsetting. Taught my kids the same. They were not as fortunate as your daughters. All they can find now is part time jobs 10-12 hours a week. I can see the employers side as the cost of health care makes it impossible for me to hire any more full time people. And, If infact I do have to sopply part timers with health insurance, I am off tot he local college and will not hire someone that tells me they need health insurance. Just furthers the problem.
    Am here I am at 06:30 at night work again probably till about 08:00 further diminishing my quality of life.
    Then you get idiots like Robo Sara ahahahah with her robo squad hiding everthing she does not agree with. Its seemlingly just a matter of time before I become part of the problem too.
    Hopefully, the folks on the Supreme Ct are paying attention. I also hope that you dont live in IL. We get the 2x whammy here. Quinn and Obama are two peas in a pod. Watch the new every night. More murdes in Chicago – murder rate up. Got an OBama Stooge running Chicago too. So, I guess thats the 3x whammy in this god foresaken state. Yes, I said GOD. Guess I am going to get Sara AHAHAHAH Robo blasted again. Of course, you will two.
    
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    - May 2, 2012 at 7:36 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Pardon the typos. dont get enough sleep any more. Thanks again, Pres & Gove.
      
      Reply
May 2, 2012 at 8:59 am

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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Good article from “The Healthcare Blog” site:
http://thehealthcareblog.com/blog/2012/01/13/bring-back-the-public-option/

Unbiased CBO info:
Another significant feature of the insurance exchanges is that they would include a public plan that largely pays Medicare-based rates for medical goods and services. CBO estimates that the premiums for that plan would generally be lower than the premiums of the private plans against which it would be competing. Because all plans offered in the exchanges would vary their premiums to reflect the costs incurred in each area, the difference in premiums between private plans and the public plan would vary geographically—but on average the public plan would be about 10 percent cheaper than a typical private plan offered in the exchanges. That difference in premiums is itself the net effect of differences in the major factors that affect all insurance plans’ premiums, including their payment rates to providers, their administrative costs, the degree of benefit management they apply to control spending, and the pool of enrollees they attract (the effects of which would be partly offset by the risk-adjustment provisions described above).

Enrollment in the public plan would also depend on the number of providers who chose to participate in it. Providers would not be required to participate in the public plan in order to participate in Medicare, and CBO assumed that some providers would elect not to participate in the public plan because its payment rates would be lower, on average, than private rates. Even so, CBO’s judgment is that a substantial number of providers would elect to participate in the public plan, in part because they would expect a plan run by HHS to attract substantial enrollment. Taking into account both the access to providers in the public plan and the relative premiums its enrollees would pay, CBO estimates that roughly one-third of the people obtaining subsidized coverage through the insurance exchanges would be enrolled in the public plan—so enrollment in that plan would be about 9 million or 10 million once the proposal was fully implemented. Given all of the factors in play, however, that estimate is subject to an unusually high degree of uncertainty.

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- May 2, 2012 at 9:59 am
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Sarah Ha Ha, I guess you haven’t listened or read the story about the Fortune 500 companies contemplating dropping their Group Insurance for their employees, paying the fines and throwing their employees into the exchanges which will be offering Medicaid type plans. I am sure the employees who currently have good plans will just love that. The companies would increase their pay to pay the premiums, but they will be taxed at a higher rate and I am sure they will like that as well. This President said over and over that if you like your plan, you can keep it. Hello! Not if your company decides to drop out due to all the bad stuff coming down. There is nothing affordable about the Affordable Care Act. The facts are that we will have rationed care and poor coverage through these exchanges and the current Health Markets will be shills for the government in return for subsidies. It can’t be much worse than this.
  
  Reply
  - May 2, 2012 at 10:15 am
    
    Sarah-ahahaha says:
    
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    It already is worse. Time to try something new. What we’ve been doing isn’t working, people are being denied coverage, millions are uninsured entirely, and corporate bureaucrats are lapping it up. The system has been broken for decades. One of the main reasons why Obama was put into office was to reform the dysfunctional healthcare we have had in this country. He ran on it. It’s just a shame Barack decided to sign into law Bob Dole’s and the Heritage Foundation’s plan. It simply doesn’t go far enough. Non-profit single payer is a matter of time. Whether you like it or not, that’s the direction the US is headed and most welcome it. By the way, I’m a registered Independent, always have been. Skipped out on Clinton’s terms (hated politics back then) voted Bush, Brett Favre write-in (couldn’t go fo another Bush term and #4 beat the alternative), Obama. Given the jack-wagon going up against Obama (again, I’m done with Bush), I’ll have to go Barack again in 2012. I’ll personally take higher taxes. I’m a Christian and I am my brother’s keeper.
    
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    - May 2, 2012 at 11:37 am
      
      Agent says:
      
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      Actually Sarah Ha Ha, it is a shame this bill was passed at all. It ranks as the worst bill every passed and signed into law. It is totally corrupt, will bankrupt the country since it doubles in cost every time it is scored. I have a hard time believing you think the government can do a better job than private enterprise to reform the system. All one has to do is look at the myriad of government programs that are abject failures and wasters of our tax dollars and yet you willingly want to hand them control of our healthcare and let bureaucrats make life and death decisions instead of our doctors. How naive and Progressive of you!
      
      Reply
    - May 2, 2012 at 2:39 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      The uninsured is worse in light of the recession. People still receive emergency treatment. Areas which people are denied coverage people are just as likely to die regarding in Canada and the other countries (cancer). Medicare takes care of people who have need as well. There are VERY few people dying in this country due to the system who would live in another country. If so, for every person you list here who died, I’ll list another in Canada. If there were so many, the news stations would be reporting on it.
      
      Try again. What we have actually does work. Is it perfect? No. But throwing a crowbar into something just to take AN action is not the correct action. A man learns that sometimes it’s better not to act than to make an action that ruins the whole system.
      
      Reply
    - May 2, 2012 at 7:46 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      And why do you think its worse? Its become unaffordable? Address the underlying problem. Mal Practice & Fraud.
      Mal Practice – if you sue me and lose, then you pay every nickle to me that you wanted from me.
      There are already laws in place to deal with Fraud. Enforce them.
      One good thing in IL is the I Chip Program so people that you describe can have coverage.
      Why not let me keep my COBRA which was much less expensive? Remove the 18 Month Limit. That I could afford.
      So, Sara HAHAHAHAH, go ahead and robo me off the forum. Go report to whom ever your boss is and brag about how many opinions you blanked off. Fact remains before you got the robo squaD on my little pole, 72% did not like OBama Care. Your in the 28%. Good luck finding a job after the election.
      
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    - May 3, 2012 at 6:42 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Was watching some history channel program recently. It stated that every 250 years on average, democracies fail. We are there (250 years) and Barak is not doing anything to stop the trend that was cited. Seems like he is just pushing it along.
      
      Reply
- May 2, 2012 at 12:00 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  Parameters please. I would like to see how they determined that it would be 10% cheaper.
  
  Also: These same people said that revenues would decline by 800 billion after George W’s tax cuts, and there was a net increase of revenues. Their predictions are not accurate to any degree. That means they were off by over 800 billion dollars. They tried to backstep and say that the economy expanded at a rate which allowed revenues to increase despite the tax cut. Then on the alternate side they stated that GDP growth was slower than during Clinton years. See the incosistency there? If it was GDP growth, then Bush’s economy was better (doubtful, even as a republican no one can say the economy in the late 90′s was better than Bush’s) if it wasn’t the economy that was the factor, then their estimate on taxes was completely off, by over 800 billion dollars, plus the amount additional that came in each year.
  
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  - May 2, 2012 at 12:37 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    Bob, Perhaps some of these Progressive bloggers who like to mass dislike our comments haven’t been around long enough to remember what went down with the Clinton regime. He was on a similar path as Obama and tried to run Hilarycare on us and back then, it couldn’t gain traction because it was equally bad. Clinton also had to deal with a Congress who actually wanted to balance the budget and back when Congress had a spine, they ended up winning. Clinton came out and said the end of welfare as we knew it was at hand. He clearly capitulated since he wasn’t going to get his Progressive agenda passed and get re-elected. By the end of his second term, the economy was in the doldrums and Bush inherited a recession. The Bush Tax cuts clearly worked to bring additional revenue in as you pointed out. Progressives have a limited mental capacity and think a country can spend their way to prosperity. Debt doesn’t mean anything to them. To us, a trillion here and a trillion there and pretty soon you are talking about serious money which has to be paid back at ever increasing interest. We know that debtor nations never climb out of the hole they are in. Progressives, please point out successful countries who have adopted your theories and are doing well. Europe is a huge mess and is melting down as we speak. How is that Socialism working out for them?
    
    Reply
    - May 2, 2012 at 2:01 pm
      
      Sarah-ahahaha says:
      
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      What do you want to talk, GDP? What is/are your metric(s)? You count how many “socialist” countries supersede us below. We already have successful social programs in this country, doesn’t mean this country is socialist. I don’t want communism here, I just want a more even playing field. The way things are set up now, all we do is trickle the dollars up and if we had some actual reform, healthcare included, we can start to improve conditions for every American here and that’s what the founding fathers were hoping to afford us. I’m an underwriter, not a robo.
      
      Per capita figures and in US dollars as noted by:
      International Monetary Fund (2011)[4] World Bank (1990–2010)[5] CIA World Factbook (2000–2011)[6]
      Rank Country US$ Year
      
      International Monetary Fund (2011)
      1 Luxembourg 113,533 2011
      2 Qatar 98,329 2011
      3 Norway 97,255 2011
      4 Switzerland 81,161 2011
      5 United Arab Emirates 67,008 2011
      6 Australia 65,477 2011
      7 Denmark 59,928 2011
      8 Sweden 56,956 2011
      9 Canada 50,436 2011
      10 Netherlands 50,355 2011
      11 Austria 49,809 2011
      12 Finland 49,350 2011
      13 Singapore 49,271 2011
      14 United States 48,387 2011
      
      World Bank (1990 – 2010)
      International Monetary Fund (2011)[4] World Bank (1990–2010)[5] CIA World Factbook (2000–2011)[6]
      Rank Country US$ Year
      1 Luxembourg 113,533 2011
      2 Qatar 98,329 2011
      3 Norway 97,255 2011
      4 Switzerland 81,161 2011
      5 United Arab Emirates 67,008 2011
      6 Australia 65,477 2011
      7 Denmark 59,928 2011
      8 Sweden 56,956 2011
      9 Canada 50,436 2011
      10 Netherlands 50,355 2011
      11 Austria 49,809 2011
      12 Finland 49,350 2011
      13 Singapore 49,271 2011
      14 United States 48,387 2011
      
      CIA World Factbook (200 – 2011)
      Rank Country US$ Year
      1 Monaco 178,800 2010 est.
      2 Liechtenstein 125,600 2009
      3 Luxembourg 125,000 2011 est.
      4 Norway 102,200 2011 est.
      5 Qatar 93,700 2011 est.
      6 Switzerland 87,200 2011 est.
      7 United Arab Emirates 69,600 2011 est.
      8 Australia 69,200 2011 est.
      9 Kuwait 65,900 2011 est.
      10 Sweden 62,900 2011 est.
      11 Denmark 59,800 2011 est.
      — Jersey 57,600 2005 est.
      — Falkland Islands[10] 53,000 2007 est.
      12 Canada 51,700 2011 est.
      13 Austria 51,700 2011 est.
      14 Netherlands 51,500 2011 est.
      15 Finland 51,500 2011 est.
      16 Singapore 50,800 2011 est.
      17 Belgium 50,700 2011 est.
      18 San Marino 50,600 2011
      19 United States 48,400 2011 est
      
      Dick Cheney said, “Defictis don’t matter.” I think what he meant to say was, “until a Democrat gets in the White House and then that’s all that matters.”
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 2:06 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        What I want to talk is common sense.
        
        If you’re going to compare GDP, and revenues, it has to be in OUR country. They didn’t weigh Canada, I didn’t weigh Canada, and you’re a fool.
        
        As an example: Most Euro nations do NOT have a capital gains tax. They aren’t verbatum to our nation.
        
        So again: The CBO estimated George W’s tax plan would decrease revenues by 800 billion. The revenues didn’t go down by 800 billion, they went up. They then tried to argue that the revenues only went up due to gdp growth. The GDP didn’t grow fast than Clinton, so it can’t be GDP growth that caused revenues to rise. It means their estimate of 800 billion dollars being lost in taxes was wrong. It was my way of showing you: A CBO study does not prove a point. My numbers though, I noticed you have not debated the loss ratio to expense ratio, and the 30% investments, and the returns. Nor have you debated that the government can only pay out 85% of the premiums they receive will the private insurance companies CAN FOR A FACT pay out over 100% due to investments. It’s math. Try it sometime.
      - May 2, 2012 at 2:09 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        Keep up with me Sarah-hahaha.
        
        The only reason I brought up GDP growth was not to state per capita in comparison to another country.
        
        It was to prove the CBO study couldn’t have been accurate. They said revenues would drop 800 billion. Yet they increased. GDP didn’t increase faster during Bush’s term. I SAID THAT. You don’t have to prove to me that our GDP growth then was bad. You actually argued MY POINT.
        
        IF GDP GROWTH IS DOWN, AND REVENUES ARE UP, AND TAX CUTS WERE PUT IN PLACE, AND THE CBO ESTIMATED A 800 BILLION DOLLAR DECREASE, AND THERE WAS A NET INCREASE THEN THEY WERE WRONG. IF THEY TRY TO BACK TRACK AND SAY GDP GROWTH WAS WHY THE REVENUES INCREASED THEY ARE WRONG. GDP GROWTH DIDN’T INCREASE. GET THE PICTURE?
      - May 2, 2012 at 7:48 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Further evidence your paid to do this. Robo away!
      - May 3, 2012 at 11:56 am
        
        JB says:
        
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        Sarah-ahahahaha,
        Nice data, but incomplete. You should use some of your basic underwriting training to arrive at something more meaningful: 1)Identify 2)Analyze 3)Implement 4)Monitor(repeat 1-4 necessary)
        It seems that too many solutions to problems skip step two or use incomplete data in the analysis, and too many programs are never subjected to step four.
        
        So, the above figures are meaningless unless we know more: Might we want to know the GNP, as well? What is the tax rate? (50K/year taxed at 20% is the sames net as 100K/year taxed at 60%)What is the cost of housing? the cost of utilities? food & clothing? health care? (be careful-some of these might be hidden in the tax rates)And finally, that intangible all-important “quality of life”?
        
        I’d rather be poor in a free country than wealthy in a repressive one…
        Money and material goods: $$$$
        Freedom from repressive government: Priceless
        I think THAT’S what the founders had in mind.
        
        Lastly, not that Dick Cheney has anything to do with anything nowadays,I hope you don’t agree with him that deficits don’t matter!
      - May 3, 2012 at 12:25 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        Sarah-hahaha-
        
        Wrong. Investment is not only limited to stock market performance. It is also reliant on investments as in capital invesmtents, and many insurance companies hold ownership in a bank which grows funds as well. Their investments, including financial, capital, and potential bank ownership, being at an average of 10% growth is a conservative number. There is a reason why Lloyd’s has several different markets. Try again.
        
        Also: In the grand scheme of things, over the last 40 years the stock market has annualized a return rate of 9%. That is not including dividends. The stock right now including dividend pay outs is equal to what it was in the 2007 peak. That was a fact I took from a liberal source MSNBC. “Recent times” How long have you been an underwriter? Yes, during the recession companies failed. But during that whole time before then they built up capital, more capital and payed out more claims, than the government could have. End of story. The government would not have paid out more then, and would not now. And again: The average return, has been about 9%. I have to assume that Insurance companies are not dumb, and invest capital in many different ways than a consumer (AKA investing into ownership of a firm that they jointly have a say in, investing in a start up company, investing into ownership into a banks profits provided they provide capital themselves, it is different for a company than a person).
        
        Pay inequality has not been narrowed down to a matter of fact as to the reason. People having more wealth does not prove that wealth causes lower living standards. Just because the amount of wealth the top has is getting higher, does not show that the cost of living for the middle class is getting worse. In fact, people these days own far more than they did in the past. Medical costs are manageable if you have a policy, and it is affordable to the middle class and provides excellent care. Now for people working at McDonalds and other bad jobs, yeah, things are pretty bad. That’s their choice, and they receive assistance.
        
        Raising taxes in order to distribute more entitlements would not bridge the wealth gap. Our current entitlements are survival based, and less than half of the population uses them. You cannot tax the middle class into wealth.
        
        Recently one of the Obama admin stated that in consideration of the price per barrel, and costs to drill, the cost of gas should be 2.59, and including TAXES which adds .60 cents that we were on track to being at the normal. That is admission that taxes raise costs, and they wanted to raise taxes on oil companies (which are already double that of green energy companies, and at the highest tax rate of all company types). Then that raises needs. Than that raises costs. Higher taxes does not fix pay inequality. Paul Ryan’s study already proved that, his CBO study I might add.
      - May 3, 2012 at 12:29 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        JB – that’s why I asked about metrics. I agree this is the greatest country and again, I don’t want Communism. I’m just saying there are social programs that work. We have many in this country but that doesn’t make us a socialist nation. I am not sure that the founding fathers ever made comment on being materialistic. And, I know for certain where Jesus stands on that. Unless you subscribe to the Gospel of Supply Side Jesus. Google that sometime, that’s flippin’ hilarious. I don’t care what side of the spectrum you’re on, pure comedy gold.
    - May 2, 2012 at 2:14 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      Agent,
      
      I could take up that argument with them but I prefer not to touch Clinton. It’s a harder argument to make. I let them have Clinton.
      
      I don’t let them use CBO studies as a source when they have been so blatantly wrong.
      
      Sarah-hahahaha:
      
      How about that CBO study regarding unemployment not going above 10%? How about the CBO study republicans brought forth showing that social security taxes cause pay inequality to increase presented by Paul Ryan? How about the CBO study regarding insurance premiums following the passage of the health care plan which has since been modified up several times?
      
      How about the republican backed CBO studies? You haven’t cited them. The CBO receives parameters and is asked to do a study with those parameters. They are unbiased in the conclusion but not the parameters. If Paul Ryan as an example gives them fudgy numbers to get the numbers to show pay ineqaulity, and they calculate on those numbers, he has the power to fudge the CBO. And considering how often CBO has been wrong I’d say this happens with both democrat submitted and republican submitted studies to the CBO.
      
      Moron.
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 3:34 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Bob, You can let them skate on Clinton if you like. Sorry, but I am happy to take them on. Clinton was not Mr. Wonderful as many of the media are overjoyed to say. He was every bit as rotten as the current regime. His only saving grace was that he was more of a pragmatist than the current President who is nothing more than a Progressive Socialist ideologue. When Clinton saw the handwriting on the wall, he had the sense to back off. He was then free to chase the skirts which got him impeached for lying to a Federal Grand Jury. Congress did not remove him, but he should have been.
      - May 3, 2012 at 12:52 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Really Sarah Ha Ha? I agree with you on two points. We have the greatest country on earth and I don’t want Communism. I also don’t want Progressive Socialism as well. Do you know the difference? Basically, Communism owns and controls all means of production in a country. There is no freedom of choice and there is no incentives to get ahead because everyone is in the same boat except the leadership who lives in splendor. 99% of the folks live in terrible poverty. Progressive Socialism is just a step on the road to Communism. They seek to control every aspect of a citizens lives. More and more industry is nationalized and Obamacares goal is to control the Healthcare Industry by imposing its mandates and forcing people to buy something they may not want in a one size fits all plan. More and more freedoms will be stripped away until we are basically serfs to the State. By the way, this Presidents plan is called trickle up poverty. The Middle Class will go away and only the elitist leaders will do well. I would hope you don’t want this for your family, but I could be wrong.
    - May 2, 2012 at 3:40 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      Agent:
      
      Haha, I agree with your Clinton sentiments. I’d go into it but I don’t want to risk the “independant” getting off topic on the issues that me and “her” are debating on.
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 3:57 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Ha Ha Ha Ha. If Sarah Ha Ha is an Independent I will eat my hat. She is so far in the tank for Socialist Liberal Progressivism she will never see the light of day again. Do you really think you can sway her thinking? She may be TOPOV in disguise. One thing you have to admit, they are committed to the agenda. We have to be equally committed to the truth about what has gone on and what will go on if it is not stopped.
      - May 3, 2012 at 9:01 am
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        Hey, I agree with you on Clinton. He’s a cheating SOB. Nice role model for the Presidency, huh? The only good thing he did is leave office with a surplus. He repealed Glass-Stegall, lied constantly, and just seemed downright ill-principled and dirty. But, at least Obama is trying to do something to improve the country. You may not agree, and I don’t expect you to because you want things to remain as they have. But, the last 30+ years has widened the gap between the lower and middle class and those up top. This is due to the wealth distribution up (that’s a fact) and the rising costs of healthcare bankrupting Americans. And, that’s just the Americans who can get covered. So, say what you will, be at least the man is trying to do something rather than sit on the sidelines and continue to watch the deterioration. And, he tried with a Republican-founded strategy. Status quo isn’t going to work anymore. Neither is turning back the clock on so many reforms and improvements we’ve made in this country. We can stop the war on women, no one should be allowed to tell me what I can and cannot do with my uterus. We can stop the war on students, my daughter pays enough on student loans. We can stop the war on gays, because, does it really matter what someone else does in their bedroom? Besides, heterosexuals partake in the same activities on a regular basis. We can stop the partisan crap and start working together otherwise we are in for some big trouble. Oh, and we can stop the war on drugs evidently because it’s pretty clear we lost. Sin tax that stuff and there is your investment income for healthcare. Anyone signed up to participate in purchasing of federal drugs gets another excise on their healthcare, or forfeits it completely into a high risk pool or something. Oh, and Bob, your numbers depend on investment income which hasn’t been so solid as of late. I’m not your robo, I have an underwriting job which is why I get the Insurance Journal emails daily. I don’t doubt there is someone out there who likes what I say and votes for me and those like-minded and against you. All I’m trying to say is we need to do something. If the Private Sector can find a way to insure all Americans and reduce costs with no pre-existing conditions, then they should get after it. That’s what every American deserves. The founding fathers expected us to figure that out by now. Good day gentlemen. I’ll let someone else go from here. This posting is about dead anyhow. Everyone is hidden.
    - May 2, 2012 at 4:20 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      589 likes on one of these comments?? I’m not the paranoid type, but I know how to do this liking disliking, and how long it takes. You would have to either not have a job and dedicate a full couple days to that, or it would have to be multiple people. I’m beginning to think you guys are right on the paid dislikes. At which point you’re absolutely right: We do have to fight just as hard with truth.
      
      Reply
      - May 2, 2012 at 7:51 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Yep. Robo Sara hahaha and her cronies. She is probably in Mexico or China paying her robo squad fifty cents a week.
      - May 3, 2012 at 10:02 am
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Bob, It is interesting Sarah Ha Ha stated the postings were dead now and everyone hidden. I don’t see any of her rantings hidden. What does that tell us? I had to laugh when she said at least Obama was trying to do something to improve the country. Wow, what a statement. He has done nothing but assure the ruination of the country for almost 4 years. This is certainly the most corrupt administration in the history of the country. $5Trillion in new debt with nothing to show for it. A massive Healtcare Bill which is sure to bankrupt the country, 30+ Czars running the country from the White House basement, scandal after scandal and Sarah Ha Ha thinks this guy is wonderful for what he is doing. Unbelievable.
- May 2, 2012 at 12:41 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Estimates using Old School Math or “New OBama Math”? Seeing you have been identified as the leader of the Robo Squad, nothing you say or post means s$#@. Your paid to do that. Wish we could meet after you are off the clock so you can say what you really feel.
  Enjoy your Robo job, it will be ending soon. Then what for you? Stick you hand out for the OBama Give A Way life style?
  
  Reply
May 3, 2012 at 11:10 am

FFA says:

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Agent, What did people expect with a Politician from Illinois? Again, he cut his political teeth in the most corrupt county in the most corrupt state in the country. He grew up under Blago – another Ill gov in prison.

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- May 3, 2012 at 11:38 am
  
  Agent says:
  
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  The great State of Illinois has produced one of the greatest Presidents in US History and the worst one in US History. How is that for irony? Before Blago came along, I believe several governors have gotten into huge trouble with their shenanigans. Chicago has gone from Capone and the mob running the city to the Daley machine. Now, Rahm Dead Fish Emanuel is in charge. How is that working out for them? Chicago is known as the armpit of America. I feel sorry for you living in that environment. I hope you can escape to friendlier climes.
  
  Reply
  - May 3, 2012 at 12:52 pm
    
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    Times do change. Once was a great state. I have to believe that we lead the nation by a land slide in Corrupt Elected officials. Goung back to the 80′ Grey Lord Judges – Silver Scoop, Rostenkowski, Walker, Ryan, Blago. Jesse White (Our Sect of St) holds a fund raiser for a Chicago Politician – touting how great this man is. The very next morning – arrested for Bribery Charges. Nothing like putting some egg on Jesse face. Jesse Jackson Jr still in office? He is the one accused of offering $1M for the senate seat. General overall acceptance of bad behaviour seems to be the norm. Dont live in Chicago – Far West Burbs. Even my city hall is getting infected with bad decisions probably driven by personal greed.
    
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May 3, 2012 at 2:16 pm

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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CEOs at Fortune 500 companies made on average $12 million each in 2011. They’re now getting paid 380-times more than their average worker. That’s a slight increase since 2010 – and a massive increase since 1980 – when, before Reaganomics, CEOs were paid only 42-times more than their average worker.

On top of that – CEO pay increased nearly 14% in 2011 – compared to a meager 2.8% increase in worker pay that same year. The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer – creating the largest wealth inequality gap in America since right before the Stock Market crash of 1929. And rather than doing something about it – multi-millionaire Congressman Paul Ryan and the Republicans want to make wealth inequality even worse with a $3 trillion tax cut for the nation’s Romney-rich. We can’t afford to do that – in fact, we need to be doing just the opposite.

We need to roll back the Reagan tax cuts – and make the Romney-super rich pay their fair share in taxes again.

Bob, FFA, and Agent, I know you will disagree. You can have your own opinion, just not your own facts.

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- May 3, 2012 at 2:17 pm
  
  Sarah-ahahaha says:
  
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  Dr. Robert Hartwig gave this presentation recently in Chicago. It paints a different picture than Faux News and pundits in general. It also paints a different picture than you are trying to develop in your commentary. I encourage you to take a look at what he sees in the economy. Not everything is great, but he seems to think this current administration has things going in the right direction:
  http://www.iii.org/assets/docs/ppt/PublicRisk-042612.ppt#2909,4,Economic Outlook for 2012
  
  Reply
  - May 3, 2012 at 2:41 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    Really Ha Ha Sarah! Do we trust anyone from Chicago to paint a different picture? I will put my Conservative pundits up against your MSNBC pundits any day of the week. Bob has repeatedly given you the facts and you still go back to your Progressive talking points. Your emails parrot the administration we dislike so much. This administration is practicing trickle up poverty. The middle class is shrinking as we speak and may not exist in a few years. The crony capitalists on the inside may do very well because they are close to the center of power and get favors in exchange for their contributions to the Democratic Progressive party. Why not ask Warren Buffet to pay taxes on Berkshire Hathaway or Jeffrey Immelt to pay taxes on GE earnings? The so called rich making over $250,000 salary already pay 70% of the taxes. By the way, Romney did pay $14 million in taxes last year and gave several million more in charitable donations. John Kerry couldn’t bring himself to pay taxes on his yacht and moved it to Rhode Island to avoid them. Rich Democrats don’t believe in paying taxes and have a small legion of tax attorneys to help them.
    
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- May 3, 2012 at 2:54 pm
  
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  Well Sara ahahahahaha, I am not a Fortune 500 guy. I am just one man trying to pay his bills. To have a $1300 increase in Medical Premiums is killing me. It has diminished my quality of life as I had to let someone go – pick up their work load – and sitting on the fence about letting another go. OBama Care has forced carriers to reduce commissions pulling money right off the top. Then the increase with the highest deductible. I spent out of pocket last year $17000 + on Health Insurance & Co Pays and Deductibles. Thats when my Cobra Premium was only $722 @ month. Factor in the $1300 @ Month INCREAS and 2x the deductible which my wife will hit – no doubt about it. That is an additional $15,600 in cost. Those are MY FACTS. Not fortune 500. Could care less. I care about Joe small business. 5 -10 man shops. OBama is killing us small business men forcing small business to drop medical plans & forget about hiring Full Time People furthering the problem! Quinn is killing small business. Cat & Sears thresten to leave – Sweet Heart Deal at small business expense.
  And you begrudge Fortune 500 people for being all they can be. Its the American Dream – make as much as you can. And you bash them for living it.
  Mean while, OBama steps on the Keystone pipeline – not creating jobs. Sending our jobs over seas. Manufacturing is dead in this country. I know he did not start the mass exedous of jobs, but he is in a position to bring them back and he has not.
  So, worship the Pres of Destruction of the American Dream if you want. Your right to do that is protected by the Constitution. Its a right I respect unlike you and your robo squade trying to hide all comments critical of your personal belief.
  NO BAMA 2012! Write in Scott Walker! He can not just talk about balancing a budget, he can actually do it! ANOTHER FACT. Something Pres Give A Way has missed the mark on.
  
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- May 3, 2012 at 3:11 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  Those are facts that are irrelevant. One person having money does not take money from another. Tax rates have always stayed close to 20% of GDP regardless of 35% as a max, or 95% in the 60′s. Taxing the rich just to take their money, which does not add to entitlements, is not a method to bridge the gap. Again: entitlements are a safety net. They do not push anyone into a higher class. The middle class does not use them. All you would do is take money from the rich, with no additional revenues, and risk circumstance like gas here 2.59 is costs, and 60 cents is due to taxes. That’s almost a fourth of the total cost. Raising taxes is not productive. It does not increase revenues and it increases costs. Two simple facts. Again: wealthy people receiving money does not forewarn a tax policy flaw. So taxes would not fix the problem.
  
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May 3, 2012 at 2:47 pm

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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Be careful on placing blame solely on Obama for food assistance:

Clearly, the rise in food stamps is a direct consequence of the most recent recession, which began more than a year before Obama took office. It’s impossible to know how high SNAP usage would have gone had the Republicans, rather than Obama, shaped policy in 2009 and 2010.

On the one hand, SNAP usage has continued to climb almost every month of the Obama presidency despite some signs of an economic recovery. So Gingrich’s charge cannot simply be dismissed out of hand.

On the other hand, there is typically a lag time before an upturn in the broader economy begins to show up in decreased SNAP usage. The previous high from 1994, for instance, came following a recession that officially ended in mid 1991 — and that recession was much milder than the most recent one. This makes it harder to divvy up the blame.

One last point: The number of food stamp beneficiaries had started to head upward under President George W. Bush, partly because of more aggressive efforts to get eligible Americans to apply for benefits, and partly because of changes in the rules that had the effect of broadening eligibility. The experts we spoke to agreed that both policies began under Bush but were retained by Obama.

The changes produced consistent increases in the number of average monthly beneficiaries. The number rose in seven out of the eight years of Bush’s presidency — most of which were years not considered recessionary. All told, the number of recipients rose by a cumulative 63 percent during Bush’s eight-year presidency.

Our ruling

The number of SNAP beneficiaries is at a record level, and it has risen in most months of the Obama presidency. But Gingrich oversimplifies when he suggests that Obama is the root cause. Much of the reason for the increase was a combination of the economic problems Obama inherited combined with a longstanding upward trend from policy changes. But Obama has supported those policies. On balance, we rate Gingrich’s statement Half True.

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- May 3, 2012 at 3:43 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  Did you just quote fact check? Wow. On the food stamps: the recession is not on the rise to where it should be. We are still about 7 million jobs under what we were when the recession peaked. After a severe recession stastically through history it bounces up quick. This recession is dragging on, as is clear by housing prices, home sales etc. I work with architects and engineers. That market has not picked up. Worse, one of Obama’s first actions was to artificially inflate the housing costs by having banks buy up properties and sell them at higher values. The middle class if the recession had bottomed out could have bought the lower cost homes, and then had money left over for the economy. Instead he favored the selling market which is not a good idea. We want to help people to get homes and still give to the economy, not give people who have homes more housing equity at the expense of those who need a home. You talk about republicans being against the middle class, they aren’t.
  
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- May 3, 2012 at 3:53 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Get your facts straight before mouthing off Sarah Ha Ha. Food Stamps have doubled under Obama and they actively recruit people to go on them. There is no accountability to this program and it was recently brought to light about the guy that won the lottery and he was still on food stamp assistance. Many of these people have flat screen TV’s, new cars and other amenities and they are defrauding the American People. We also have a government who wants to expand all entitlements to make the population more and more dependent on government. The problem with Socialism is pretty soon you run out of other peoples money. This country is broke and getting worse, not better. Too bad you can’t see the forest for the trees.
  
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May 3, 2012 at 2:49 pm

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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I think you guys are Repulic-onfused. The economy is getting stronger. Dr. Bob Hartwig doesn’t have a horse in the race. He’s an expert in the insurance arena. His numbers also don’t lie. He leaves that up to Faux News.

Reply
- May 3, 2012 at 3:27 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Not fast enough.
  
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- May 3, 2012 at 4:08 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  Again: disregarding an entire news station’s facts shows you are narrow minded. Fox says thing that are wrong. That’s why you take the numbers, and not only compare them to Another station but also the parameters. Many times when you find different numbers in opinion pieces that clash it is different parameters in the study. And you should then research a news piece on the other side with the same parameters which does not had N opinion (which is why it is important to know which articles are opinion pieces). When doing so, I find that msnbc matches fox news opinion pieces on their fact pieces web parameters are equal. I could give many examples but they would fly over your head. I fact check msnbc against fox news and fact check fox news with msnbc, and then include Forbes, politifact, New York times, and huffigton post to see the same numbers interpreted differently from each. None of them are good at conclusions. That’s why you collect facts, make a parameter, and create your own study from mutually agreed on facts. You disregarding fox news disallows you from doing this. Ever dating “faux news” means you are indoctrinated with no form of fact checking your own sources
  
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May 3, 2012 at 2:58 pm

FFA says:

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I blame O Bama for not bringing our jobs back home.

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- May 3, 2012 at 3:56 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
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  FFA, I blame Obama for a lot more than not bringing jobs home. Everything this Administration does hurts small business and the American People. Between the EPA and Obamacare, they are the biggest job killers in America right now.
  
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  - May 3, 2012 at 4:53 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    So do I. Increasing job opportunity would go a long way to resolving a bunch of other things.
    
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    - May 4, 2012 at 4:07 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Robo Sara dont agree with me on job creation.
      
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May 4, 2012 at 9:10 am

Sarah-ahahaha says:

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Obama is a socialist? The guy is to the right of Teddy Roosevelt. You gentlemen really should fact check yourself more often:

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2012/jan/08/rick-perry/rick-perry-says-barack-obama-socialist/

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- May 4, 2012 at 11:07 am
  
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  Sarah Ha Ha, I have seen all I need to see of this President and what he stands for. He makes Teddy Roosevelt look like Rush Limbaugh. Had you been paying attention at the time, you should have been listening to him carefully. The first give a way was when he told Joe the Plumber we had to spread the wealth around. He was an avid student and true believer of Saul Alinsky which had the most radical beliefs of Socialism/Communism on record. His whole upbringing was hanging around with Socialists/Communists and domestic terrorists and you have the nerve to say he was to the right of Teddy Roosevelt. All of his appointments to government including the Czars hiding in the basement of the White House are all equally radical. You are terribly misguided if you think this is the guy we should trust with the countries future.
  
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  - May 4, 2012 at 11:54 am
    
    Sarah-ahahaha says:
    
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    The facts don’t fit your narrative. But, there is no hope for your close-mindedness. You choose to believe this fantasy made-up by Fox News and Glenn Beck. You really should do more fact checking and you will find the most uninformed people are those who depend on any of the major cable news networks. Politifact is a great resource and your local news is probably about as good as it gets as far as the truth and limited bias. I choose to look at the facts and make up my own mind. I think that’s what America will do as well. Like it or not, 4 more years. The majority doesn’t want to go backward. Though, who knows, Mitt flip-flops on literally everything, so maybe he’d command just the same. At some point in time in his political career, he’s agreed with Obama on almost everything…including healthcare. I’ll continue to fact check your commentary. Not that it will matter to you, but just so those who are still reading this can see the truth if they care to do so.
    
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    - May 4, 2012 at 12:08 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
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      You are right about one thing Sarah. The majority does not want to go backwards and adopt the failed policies of Progressive Socialism. We have seen for the past 40 years how the Soviet Union collapsed, Europe is in full meltdown due to Progressive policies by misguided politicians. Your President wants the same thing for America. Excuse us for wanting what made this country the greatest on earth.
      
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      - May 7, 2012 at 12:26 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Many of you know by now that France got rid of Sarkozi and installed a committed leftist who intends to tax the rich to the tune of 75% of income. I’m sure that is going to jump start their economy which is poor to say the least. France will be Greece in less than a year. Following closely is Italy, Spain, Portugal in total disarray.
    - May 4, 2012 at 12:34 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      Not surprising you keep assuming on how we are drawing conclusions when I don’t watch Glen Beck or fix news. My fact checks weigh methodology and parameters as said below and are made as simple as possible. Your source is not unbiased. I have checked fact check and it’s funny how over half the articles weigh republicans as in the wrong or half true, and for democrats over half are weighed as half true or correct. Hmm…Bias?
      
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      - May 4, 2012 at 3:48 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        No, no bias at all. That should tell you something about the Republican Party. It’s time people like you take the Republican Party back. You are misguided and a fairly emotionally-driven (former part of sentence my opinion, latter supported by your repeated use of “moron” and “idiot” in your arguments), but seem fairly intelligent or at least passionate. The Republican Party is nothing more than an arm of corporate America. It’s fascism at its finest. No thanks. I like my water and air poison-free.
    - May 4, 2012 at 4:14 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
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      Sarah-haha:
      
      When a source has specifically chosen pieces pointing to Obama not being a socialist, and does not include that his agenda matches the socialist party’s agenda as Paul did, and the same site favors democrats more than republicans, the source is biased.
      
      It does not have the details Paul did, and unlike Paul’s article it doesn’t declare itself the source to fact check all other sources, so it’s cherry picking information is intentional to paint a picture on the left and is leaving out information which would damage that picture.
      
      The fact that you as an adult are attempting to argue they are unbiased, and it just works that way, while the argument made by Paul clearly shows it does not work that way, and you STILL have not debated Paul’s facts, shows you are not just indoctrinated, you are also still bullying.
      
      I call you a moron, an idiot, outside of my facts. The fact that I call you a moron, and an idiot (which is true) does not disprove my comments.
      
      We aren’t taking the ethical he said she said who do you know argument. Again I will say the following: Disprove Paul’s comments one by one if you’re going to disregard his information. If you cannot, and then claim that “republicans are just always wrong because one of my sources points to that evidence, I might add this source doesn’t have Paul’s information” then you’ve lost already, and are an idiot, a moron, and indoctrinated.
      
      :)
      
      Try again.
      
      Reply
      - May 4, 2012 at 4:22 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        That should read more to the extent of: Unlike Paul who is not claiming to be the end all source of pertinent information on a topic, meaning it should be weighing both sides, and if it doesn’t have Paul’s information which shows Obama is a socialist it is by default not weighing both sides, your source is claiming to be the source of all, and is missing information from the other side.
        
        Bias. No other argument, you have no recourse, that is bias.
      - May 4, 2012 at 4:40 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Bob, Sarah Ha Ha cannot stand up to your logic and offers nothing but emotional outbursts against Republicans. Many Republicans are also a part of the problem. Remember when McCain said his biggest hero was Teddy Roosevelt? He has been busy reaching across the aisle for many years to accomodate the left, he forgot what made America great. He should retire to the ranch. It is time the Conservative wing of the party take control. I don’t much like the leadership which mainly goes along to get along. We very much need young leaders like Rubio and Ryan to take charge and purge the Progressive agenda from the government. We will be much better off in the long run.
      - May 4, 2012 at 4:43 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
        Hot debate. What do you think?
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        “Oh yeah? Well the jerk store called and they said they ran out of you.”
        
        (have to finish a quote before the weekend starts, will get back to you on your PRG article)
- May 4, 2012 at 11:53 am
  
  Bob says:
  
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  Fact checking with a source like fact check is not fact checking. Fact checking with facts is fact checking. There is a difference between taking another’s conclusion composed of their facts, and drawing up a conclusion, with research, composed of many facts. The fact that you Sara-haha have denied my facts, due to being lead by sources rather than your own research is insane. You aren’t researching. Bob hartwigs study for an example did not show the method of weight for his study. He used words like “cumalitive job loss”. So then does he mean accounting for a projected job participation rate in light of expected people who he believes should be leaving the job field (baby boomers?). If so he’s a fool. He expects that 3 million people left the work force and did not get replaced because people retired? Let me tell you, more than 3 million people are looking for jobs. We are for a fact 7 million jobs down. You should fact check yourself. Seasonally adjusted, cumalitve, net job gains, watch for the parameters you moron.
  
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- May 4, 2012 at 12:02 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
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  According to politifact. Now drawing on real facts no, he is a socialist. You quote sources, and your sources Re suddenly the source eh? And then any source who isn’t your source you bash. That’s why I refuse to give sources, because it always comes down to a “you can’t rely on that source” battle with morons like you. But to show you, for every source you have saying he’s not a socialist I have ten saying he is. http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2012/01/22/is-president-obama-truly-a-socialist/. So we aren’t getting into a source battle we are getting in to a fact battle. Ya got that Sarah-haha? You follow your sources like sheep and that’s why you lack substance. Make parameters, do a study that multiple sources agree on with concrete numbers weighed with the same methodology. Key word in there parameters, methodology. You keep quoting numbers that many sources disagree with, and then attack the people who disagree but a simple review of the parameters and the methodology will show they took different methods to come up with the numbers. From there you have to weigh which method is best, not one source against another again and again without reviewing the parameters and methodology. That’s insane and does not show you have any reliable facts.
  
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  - May 4, 2012 at 12:29 pm
    
    Sarah-ahahaha says:
    
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    Bob, not sure why I’m giving you time of the day since you cannot refrain from your condescending remarks (shows how smart you are and better yet, you lead with your emotions…not rational). I bet in your mind, you’ve never lost an argument. But, really, Paul R. Gregory? Yeah, no opinion there. Politifact is an unbiased resource, friend (that word stings, doesn’t it?) Have a good Friday, Bob.
    
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    - May 4, 2012 at 12:39 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      Sarah-hahaha- Agent (who you are debating with) disagrees, JB disagrees, FFA disagrees, And my facts have not been disproved. These people have referneced my numbers as accurate. Youre the one who keeps saying “the facts” and mock as well as assume sources. I have no obligation to talk to you who repeatedly assumes incorrectly I am quoting fox news, who then makes a smart ass comment in any way “friend”. And my facts have not been affected by my emotions. They are stand alone.
      
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    - May 4, 2012 at 12:48 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      Also: whenever someone has a fact you do not like you label them “Paul r Gregory?”. I don’t. I looks at their facts. That stock market quote I mentioned? Guess which administration said it? Please? Pretty please guess? Obama’s. Obama backed it up. I researched it, found it to be true. Do I think Obama is honest? No. Do I think I can discriminate on all his info and disregard his research? No. You democrats believe in “bi partisan” efforts but seem to be ok with attacking sources, and disregarding their information in all cases if you don’t like them. What in Paul R Gregory’s study do you take issue with other than Paul R Gregory? Did you take the time to disprove his comments? Did politifact directly disprove his comments? No. The Article in argument of Obama as a socialist used a different measure than did Paul. Which is why you compare the measure, not the source. Believing someone because they are someone is dumb as hell, and shows why you cannot form an opinion free of an article or politifact. Done with the insults? I could throw you into next week child
      
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      - May 4, 2012 at 1:58 pm
        
        Sarah-ahahaha says:
        
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        Bob, it sounds like you need a hug. Throw me into next week? Do you like to slap girls around, Bob? Just asking. Sounds like you have an anger issue. Not good for the blood pressure, buddy. Oh, and Dr. Hartwig knows a few things, too:
        
        Dr. Hartwig previously served as director of economic research and senior economist with the National Council on Compensation Insurance (NCCI) in Boca Raton, Florida, where he performed rate of return and cost of capital modeling and testified at workers’ compensation rate hearings in many states. He has also worked as senior economist for the Swiss Reinsurance Group in New York and as senior statistician for the United States Consumer Product Safety Commission in Washington, D.C. He is a member of the American Economic Association, the American Risk and Insurance Association, the National Association of Business Economics and the CPCU Society. In 2005 and 2006 Dr. Hartwig served on the state of Florida’s Task Force for Long-Term Homeowners Insurance Solutions. From May 2005 to May 2008 he served on the board of directors of the Independent Insurance Agents and Brokers Association of New York. Currently, Dr. Hartwig serves on the board of directors of the American Risk and Insurance Association and the Griffith Foundation for Insurance Education.
        
        Dr. Hartwig received his Ph.D. and Master of Science degrees in economics from the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. He also received a Bachelor of Arts degree in economics cum laude from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst. He has served as an instructor at the University of Illinois and at Florida Atlantic University. Dr. Hartwig also holds the Chartered Property Casualty Underwriter (CPCU) credential.
        
        Dr. Hartwig has authored and co-authored papers that have appeared in numerous publications, including the Journal of Health Economics, the Proceedings of the Casualty Actuarial Society, the John Liner Review (where he also serves on the editorial board), Dossiers et Etudes (Geneva Association), the Journal of Workers’ Compensation, the Journal of Insurance Operations, Global Reinsurance, Risk & Insurance, Insurance Day, Compensation and Benefits Review. He is also a regular contributor to National Underwriter and many other industry trade publications.
        
        Dr. Hartwig makes frequent presentations to industry associations, company management, industry executives, analysts and clients and speaks internationally on a wide range of insurance issues. He has testified before numerous state and federal regulatory and legislative bodies, including the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee, the Senate Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Committee, the House Financial Services Subcommittee on Capital Markets, Insurance and Government Sponsored Enterprises and the House Financial Services Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations and the House Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure.
        
        Don’t hit girls, Bob. Shouldn’t hit anyone, really. Peace, and have a good weekend. Maybe have a drink and tell yourself you won again. You’re a big winner, Bob. Always have been, always will be. Except for in November. Make sure there aren’t any girls around you in November.
      - May 4, 2012 at 2:19 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
        Hot debate. What do you think?
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        And further: his qualifcitions are irrelavent. What I don’t like about you is people like you set up bullying. You say oh here is is qualifications I won’t even debate his facts, (a one percenter I’m sure) and then you insult other people’s credentials and not their facts. Don’t hold your breath going on qualifications. So I should ignore parameters and methodology so long as someone has credentials? How about no. Weigh the facts not the person. That’s adult. I don’t care about the he said she said who you know who you listen to whiny youngin crap of your age group and that’s all you have given me. I care about methodology and parameters. That’s why you ate irrational and are actually bullying. “faux news” is a method of bullying. Now looking at fox news’s fact and realizing there are different parameters, that is actually debating without bullying. So when you referenced politifact, I referenced a parallel, then you bullied the source as I predicted (as old people sometimes bait trap like that Sarah ha ha). You didn’t debate his argument. You labeled him. Debate item by item piece by piece, parameter against equal parameter. That is debating. You have not gone item by item parameter by parameter. You have quoted many different articles with many different parameters which do not tie in to each others parameters even. That’s childish. They don’t even collectively prove each other. Old math as FFA keeps saying kiddo.
      - May 4, 2012 at 2:46 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
        Hot debate. What do you think?
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        FFA: Best be careful. Somehow we must all be in “faux news” power. I knew none of us here was quoting fox news. But we are being labeled as such. That’s sad to hear with crime. I’ve been ok in Washington, it’s clearly not as bad as some of the other blue states.
    - May 4, 2012 at 2:11 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      Sarah-haha: now I’m a woman abuser? You best talk to the mother of my child. I do not believe I habe told her what she has done wrong in the entire time we have been together, and when she asks me what I would do I generally tell her that if I told her what to do it would be me doing it. Try again. I don’t like people who come in and bully people, label sources, quote “faux news” claim they are a victim, an then talk conferencing to me and try to turn it around. What I mean throw you into next week is you don’t have a leg to stand on and you are mocking people here with crap for information. How old are you? No older than 38 is my guess given the argument tactics.
      
      Reply
    - May 4, 2012 at 4:01 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      You need to spend more time roboing away. You falling behind. Let me guess, your on your 8 hour lunch break?
      
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    - May 4, 2012 at 4:17 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      At least he is not Roboing you off the forum.
      
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    - May 7, 2012 at 12:42 pm
      
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      HMMM Sarahahahah. You forgot to blank out the response tab.
      Fact – My Health Insurance Premium went up $1300. Fact – I laid off someone to be able to pay for it. Fact – Work Load did not go away because a worker did so I have to pick up slack. Fact – my quality of life has deterioriated.
      End result – Higher Unemployment. More Stress. No fun for me!
      Fact!
      That is what is going on in America today. So climb out of your little cubby that Obama has you working in and open your eyes. Talk to your family. Talk to your friends. Not fortune 500 people. Joe Average Small Business man. See if their story matches mine.
      Robo away!
      
      Reply
  - May 4, 2012 at 12:59 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
    Hot debate. What do you think?
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    Hey Bob, You cited the Paul Gregory article to battle with Sarah. Paul Gregory and I went to school together at Oklahoma. We were on the tennis team together. He was a very brilliant guy who sailed through with a perfect 4.0 with multiple degrees. If someone wants to talk Economics, he is the guy. You couldn’t have picked a better source of information. It is too bad that poor misguided Sarah Ha Ha keeps sticking to her Progressive guns which keep firing blanks.
    
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    - May 4, 2012 at 1:17 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      That’s very interesting agent. Apparently you and I are fox news people and that’s why it’s ok to disregard our facts though, from this liberal person who says she’s against a war on women, discrimination, and oppression. Irony much? Those who listen to fox news are republic-uninformed. And she talks about childish insults and wars on women. As long as she thinks someone is wrong disregard the whole news station, anyone who listens to it, and their mothers, hell start a war.
      
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      - May 4, 2012 at 2:34 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        I just watch the local ABC news myself. Ever get to Chicago, Channel 7 at 10pm. Mark Giangreco is the best local sports guy in the entire country. Jim Rose and Wafer Weigle are very competent fillins. Rest of the news? Too depressing. More shootings in Chicago. Obamas stooge running Chicago has lost what grip Daley had on it. How many more people must die before Quinn steps in with the Nat Guard? I hate that thought, but something needs to be done. One thing for sure, what Obamas stooge is doing is not working here too.
      - May 4, 2012 at 2:57 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        I do watch Fox some, but not as much as I used to. O’Reilly has given more than a pass to Obama in his quest to be fair and balanced. They give far too much time to the Progressives than deserved and Alan Colmbs makes me ill. He is the best example of idiotic Progressive drivel I have heard. I get most of my news from the internet on sites I trust will speak the truth. Sarah Ha Ha must be a fan of MSNBC, NBC, CBS or ABC who are open cheerleaders of the agenda.
May 4, 2012 at 12:23 pm

JB says:

Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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My Dear Sarah-ahahaha, et al,
Here’s some data (all percentages rounded):
total posts to date: 237 (100%)
total posts hidden: 184 (78%)
total posts not hidden: 53 (22%)
total posts by Sarah-ahahaha: 20 (8% of total posts; 38% of not hidden posts!?!)

Here’s my analysis, admittedly based on my opinion of what’s considered left or right leaning, but I know I’m close:
Left leaning posts not hidden: 31 (only 13% of total posts, but 58% of not hidden posts)
Middle of the road/innocuous posts not hidden: 20 (8% of total posts; 37% of not hidden posts)
Right leaning posts not hidden: 2 (2% of total posts; 4% of not hidden posts)
I’ve read every post, and know that most of those hidden (78%) are espousing a more conservative viewpoint, but not many could be considered offensive in any way….so, close to 78% of the total espouse a more conservative political approach, and yet is only 2% of the unhidden?!?!

Here’s my conclusion: the unhidden posts are a total farce. Someone’s intent on forcing their/your views on others and appear quite happy to censor and squelch any opposing opinions. Absolutely disgusting. Un-American. Not good. I admit it’s only my OPINION, but I just go where the FACTS lead me…
P.S.: if this doesn’t get at least 952 dislikes I’ll be disappointed

Reply
- May 4, 2012 at 12:47 pm
  
  Agent says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
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  Hey JB & Bob, It is pretty hard reasoning with a true believer like Sarah Ha Ha. She has swallowed the Progressive bait hook, line and sinker. No common sense, no room for dissenting opinion and runs the dislike machine to try to squelch our replies. It is kind of like the EPA which goes into the first 5 businesses in an industry and crucifies them so the rest will be more manageable. Oops! The guy had to resign for his “unfortunate” choice of words. In reality, the EPA is a very nasty organization which kills jobs every day of the week. Romney should disband them the first day in office.
  
  Reply
  - May 4, 2012 at 2:01 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
    Hot debate. What do you think?
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    JB, please clarify – Did you use Old Math or New Math?
    
    Robo away Sara hahahahrobosquad. Last I checked my poll results, using new robosarahahahah math, 69% of people dont like Obama care.
    
    Hard to understand why she backs an Ill Policitcian that seems his main purpose is job killing in these United States.
    
    Reply
    - May 4, 2012 at 2:49 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      FFA, I wish I could agree that his main purpose is killing jobs, but his agenda is to create a Progressive Socialist society and control every aspect of our lives from cradle to grave. When the Constiution is ignored in favor of ideology, we cease to have a free society. A by product of this policy is killing jobs by his environmental wackos in the EPA who enjoys “crucifying” companies by making examples out of them. I wonder how Joe Manchin (D-WV) likes him now that the war on coal is in full swing and West Virginia depends on that industry for survival.
      
      Reply
      - May 4, 2012 at 3:53 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Well agent, we found something to dis agree on.
        Was at one of my clients this morning and that bitter taste of what he told is still in my mouth. If they are in fact going to have to plug in group health, he would close his door killing another 142 jobs not including him. He is not fortune 500. An honest hard working Joe that can not handle that hugh increase in expense Ofnbama says he has to.
        Supreme Ct Judges – Are you listening to what is going on in America???
        Maybe killing jobs is the means to his end? Maybe I’ll have to reorganize my thought on the bad this guy has done.
        Robo away Sara ahahahaha. Cant hide the truth for long!
      - May 4, 2012 at 4:15 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        FFA, As an Independent Agent, I insure a number of small businesses here in Texas. They are disgusted by the government in every way, including Healthcare. Many are contemplating cutting back on employees below 50 to keep from having to comply with this onerous bill. If a guy has 60 employees currently, he will have to go down in the mid 40 range and lay off almost third of his workforce. They work hard for years to build a business and now must scale back or go out of business. Is this the American Free Enterprise system or has it morphed into something else? Progressive love to say that this bill will not cause unemployment. I beg to differ with them. I wonder how many millions of workers have dropped out of the workforce because the jobs aren’t there. Sarah Ha Ha believes the economy is getting better and believes the Labor Dept figures. If the truth be known by reliable statistics, I think it is closer to 20% unemployed than it is to the manufactured 8.3%.
May 4, 2012 at 4:21 pm

FFA says:

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Its the Sararoboama way. eliminate jobs – silence the masses. Reach into my pocket untill I cant afford food/clothing/shelter. The generation of entitlement still does not out number the baby boomers with the values we were taught and tried to teach our kids.

Reply
May 4, 2012 at 11:24 pm

Bob&Sarahahahah make me ha says:

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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
You 2 should get a room. Friend of mine told me to check this rampage out. Hilarious! So far, Sarahahahaha has best comment with the Seinfeld reference. Bob and Sarah both have some points. Will be interesting to see what happens in June. My money is on judge activism. Sarah, you are not addressing Bob’s remarks. Curious to see if you can. Bob, try not to be such a Johnny Knoxville, a little harsh for my liking. Sounds,like you both need some action at home. Keeps me sane. What happens with all this happens. Still won’t matter much, because we have the best nation in the world. USA all the way!

Reply
May 5, 2012 at 2:24 pm

Mr Dobalina Mr Bob Dobalina says:

Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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Bob and Sarahahaha or whatever, you 2 should get a room. It doesn’t matter what either of you think. What’s going to happen is what’s going to happen and your lives with both go on. You both have good points. Though, Sarah quoted Seinfeld, so she takes the cake on entertainment value. Bob, you just seem pent up, relax man. Sarah – get to Bob’s points on the PRG article. Stay on topic, too. This is about healthcare. And yes, it needs fixing. Right now, we have sickcare in this country. Seriously, I don’t remember the last time I went to the doctor for preventative measures. Only go when I need to because of the copay and out of pocket expense. Can we do something about those? Not sure this bill addresses those items. But, seriously, you 2 argue like and old married couple. Quit the PDA.

Reply
- May 7, 2012 at 9:47 am
  
  Agent says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
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  Interesting post name Dobalina. You won’t need to worry about co-pays, but you will need to worry about out of pocket expense when you have to get Medicaid type coverage through the government exchange if this bill stands. You will also need to worry about getting a doctor’s appointment and if you develop a serious condition, getting treatment for it. People in Britain and Canada wait up to a year right now for some conditions. Many of them die before getting treatment or they come to the US for operations. That will be unavailable to them in the near future if the bill stands. This bill does not fix Healthcare. It only makes it worse and the quality of medical care were surely decline.
  
  Reply
  - May 7, 2012 at 10:10 am
    
    FFA says:
    
    Hot debate. What do you think?
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    And more expensive. Dont let the name fool you. Its the new definition of affordable which actually means unaffordable if your old school. Mr Obama seems to be rewriting the dictionary as well as math text books.
    
    Reply
    - May 7, 2012 at 10:31 am
      
      Agent says:
      
      Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike:
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      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      It is the new Governmentspeak. Anything they say actually means the opposite just like Big Brother in Orwell’s 1984. Every government entity throws out their numbers and expects the public to believe it. As an example, they trumpet that the economy is getting better and the unemployment rate going down when we know that there are 7 million fewer jobs in the market than 4 years ago and millions have dropped out of the workforce and stopped looking for jobs. They have spent $5 Trillion and have nothing to show for it except the debt and somehow that has made the country better. They passed this bill on the guise of making Healthcare more affordable and it has been shown that Healthcare premiums have skyrocketed.
      
      Reply
      - May 9, 2012 at 6:07 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
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        Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
        Agent –
        
        I’ll take that as a compliment. Thank you.
        
        My father taught me a great deal in dealing with the more liberal crowd. I was raised in Washington, so had to deal with many of the psuedo intellectuals in the Seattle area growing up.
        
        What gives me more of an edge is my father’s switch to conservative wasn’t until after Carter. I still remember thinking worker’s comp was good. Now having worked in the field so long, and seeing our monopolistic worker’s compensation get dominated by the insurance companies on a regular basis in every way, it changed me. I remember my father talking about FDR doing prison camps in California for the Japense etc. When I started looking back on FDR’s presidency, worker’s comp, insurance, the healthcare law, witnessed the Clinton Era try so hard to appeal to the same personality type I was growing up I realized these people needed to be combated and I’ve been active ever since. I’ve lived the lie. I am done with it, and I owe it to others to be informed enough to help. I’m one of the few to make the switch, and not to be a zealot on the right either. I’m also a businessman so I have experience there as well. I constantly provide examples to the people I hire so they can learn. I gave numbers that showed how much Obama’s tax plan would charge me, if I had 4 agents making as much as I expected. I set up the costs, and showed that a CSR would cost me about $30,000 on a low end, and the amount extra Obama would charge me would be just under that number. With 4 agents I could either hire that CSR, or try to make do with the 4 agents handling certificates and maintanance. That’s not including the health care costs. It’s math to me. Either we give wealth to an employee who can spend it for anything they want (housing, living a life free of the need of entitlements) or we tax enough to get rid of that job, in order to give a form of an entitlement to someone who will then not have the ability to get off of that need.
        
        It really is a huge problem that not many people are aware of, as very few republicans understand how to spell it out in a way that doesn’t sound extreme. But it’s simple to me: An employee making $30,000 a year, or the government giving out $30,000 in entitlements, and now that 1 person is also not employed and needs entitlements so it’s twice as bad for each job you eliminate.
        
        It’s horrible.
- May 8, 2012 at 1:59 pm
  
  Bob says:
  
  Like or Dislike:
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  Someone should smack you upside the head. I dot tolerate a person coming in with the name “Sarah-haha” dominating a post. I made actions to smack her upside the head and she needed it. Do you commonly stand by and watch bullying? You aren’t the higher person by stating two people are bickering and it doesn’t make your opinion mean more. Don’t mean to be a jerk but you brought a knife into a gun fight., which really didn’t need a blow out to begin with. This girl has been out of line to the whole forum.
  
  Reply
  - May 9, 2012 at 5:16 pm
    
    Mr Dobalina Mr Bob Dobalina says:
    
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    Bob,
    Man, go back and take a look at my comments. I said you had some good points. Someone should kick your _ _ _! Talk about bullying, take a look in the mirror. I see your comments (yes, I read the hidden ones) calling people names, telling them you’re going to cause physical harm (I get you aren’t being literal), and trying to act mightier than everyone else. All I was doing was making a funny joke and saying it doesn’t really matter what any of us think. I’m not trying to be higher than anyone. I was just saying, I stumble across this forum and there you 2 are going at it so I said get a room. Take a joke and understand this message clearly, “See Dick take this forum too seriously. See Dick scream and yell and jump up and down a lot like a jack _ _ _. Sick Dick die of a heart attack. Bob, don’t be a Dick!”
    
    Especially next time someone is in at least some part agreeing with you. Sarahahahahahaha may not use your tone, but I’m not afraid to. Did you get beat up a lot when you were a kid? Again, relax, it’s an Insurance Journal forum for crying out loud. Knife to a gun fight – who are you, Indiana Jones? Talk about dumb. You 2 can have your little lover’s quarrel. Morons, idiots, Johnny Knoxvilles, dumbflips. The both of you.
    
    Reply
    - May 9, 2012 at 5:26 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Like or Dislike:
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      Hilarious as you are, you neglect to mention the woman came in with a name “Sarah-hahaha” and clearly has been voting to hide comments.
      
      I don’t threaten those who don’t agree with me.
      
      You’re condescending crap is what angered me, bringing a knife to a gun fight was my way of saying you came in guns blazing when you had no reason. You weren’t joking. You insulted me for taking care of her, the bully.
      
      I was not beaten up as a child, and your insult style is pathetic. You sound a great deal more defensive than I.
      
      My argument style was not Mightier than thou. Grow up. I don’t have time to direct your other BS. Someone should kick my ass, what a nice comment. I don’t mean to sound arrogant, however: No one will. The reason: I don’t come in with the intention of being a dick like you. Don’t be a Dick Mr. Dobalina. Follow your own rules.
      
      My mentor always said: You win some, you lose some, as long as your goal isn’t @%@ people and you win more than you lose you’re set.
      
      I don’t feel the need to battle unnecessary battles. This woman’s ignorance has tangible effects on our environment, and my bickering with her like it or not allows me to learn her crap and learn how to deal with the crap and arguments. Ever wondered why some people make better points than others? It’s the fight, the drive that you clearly lack and have in place arrogance.
      
      You could talk all you want about “oh boo hooo they are fighting” or grow a pair yourself and see the only reason I have pionts is because I debate with people like her. And I make a point of being active and on my toes. Sometimes I debate them just to educate myself. Do you think good points comeo out of a lack of people arguing? You’ve got another thing coming. You’re either a pansy or not. And you, your reasoning and bull crap comments in how you dealt with me is why I took to you with hostility. I will continue to do so if you don’t back off bud. Learn some old school respect. It wasn’t your argument to come in and start sqwaking at both sides Big Man who wants to “Kick my ass” for telling you to keep your ass respectful if you’re going to get in between. Learn old school manners son.
      
      Reply
      - May 9, 2012 at 5:37 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        It was probably sarahahahah changing her name again. She has been identified as having about 4 names in the forum. Obama probably fired her as today anti obama comments have yet to be hidden. He probably sent her job to China.
      - May 9, 2012 at 5:39 pm
        
        Mr Dobalina Mr Bob Dobalina says:
        
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        Hey Bob, simply – phuck you! Arrogance? Live in a glass house much? I feel sorry for your friends and family, assuming you have any. I was trying to say you had good points but now, I think you are just looking to pick fights with others. You’re the bully. I’m done with this forum. My boss just thought I’d get a kick out of what’s going on out here. I did and obviously bent your pecker sideways. In no way at all did I start off making anything else but a joke about her and the Seinfeld comment. And, regardless of what you think, your opinion isn’t going to swing the Supreme Court. But, you will live with their decision no matter what it is. I’m actually with you on this one and hope it gets shot down. But, since you want to go, I’ll meet you at the bike racks anytime you’re ready, punk!
      - May 9, 2012 at 5:42 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Bob, I would hate to see you if you get really mad. Thanks for putting Dobalina in his place along with all his/her Progressive buddies. Now they can dislike to their hearts content.
    - May 9, 2012 at 5:43 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Like or Dislike:
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      I saw one comment, and the one comment was that we were arguing like we were married.
      
      If your form is coming in and “joking” and attacking someone, and then you go off saying “oh hey buddy I didn’t do anything!” then you state I’m a bully you have a problem already.
      
      You don’t come in swinging with someone you agree with. I figure you’re full of it. You did insult me when entering. It was not the Seinfeld comment I’m referring to. Perhaps you should read your entrance phrase outloud, say it in public and enter into a random debate with someone you don’t know, and see how quickly you get kicked to the curb.
      
      Just saying.
      
      Reply
      - May 9, 2012 at 7:12 pm
        
        Mr Dobalina Mr Bob Dobalina says:
        
        Like or Dislike:
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        Learn to read, dipstick. I’m actually on your side in this debate. Though, each of you have some valid points, that’s all. I’m a registered Republican for Pete’s sake, not a Progressive. Have been registered since early 80′s. I don’t want Obamacare much like I don’t want to continue this discussion with your dumbazz anymore. You’re stupid and paranoid. So is this post, forget what my boss says. Peace and see you later. I could still kick your arse, though. Your ego is writing checks your body can’t cash. Which is odd, you seem like a smart fellow. Enjoy being whatever you think you are and have fun with Sarahahahaha, if she ever gets back to you. I’m outta here so I will never know.
    - May 10, 2012 at 12:57 pm
      
      Bob says:
      
      Like or Dislike:
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      I’ll keep it short for you: You came in arrogant and I have kept this as logics. See my other post: If you came in as you did to a debate in Seattle you would get beaten up. Myself, for taking issue with you is not arrogance and is not cashing checks I can’t pay as your expression states. I didn’t write the damn check to begin with, you came in swinging hard and I had to knock you in line. Not for me. For humanity. Again: If you came in as you did in Seattle you would be beaten (verbally) to a pulp. You need to learn social etiquette which means no. You could never kick my ass. The 5 people watching the debate would instantly acknowledge you were out of line entering as you did, which would make 6 in favor of you butting out and one (you) coming in believing he alone is gods gift to the world. I follow social etiquette which you didn’t I’m your intro. It’s clear I would own you before you even acted, as I act for the people you act AS the person. You get those concepts or are you too grown up to think outside yourself?
      
      Reply
      - May 10, 2012 at 1:10 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Do you think this is part of Robo Sararahahaha strategy – Divide & Conquer? Its a valid war strategy from the dawn of time on.
        We need to fight the common enemy (Obama) and defeat him. Then we can put the gloves on and meet at the jym, settle this thing.
        But for now, focus on firing OBama and his cronie commies including his stooge in Chicago.
      - May 10, 2012 at 3:05 pm
        
        Bob says:
        
        Like or Dislike:
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        FFA: Agreed. Thanks for the advice.
May 7, 2012 at 10:45 am

Bill says:

Hot debate. What do you think?
19
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Lets see 699 likes to 2 dislikes? Way to go Obama supporters. I guess we get to look forward to dead people voting in Chicago again?

Obama campaign should be ashamed of paying bloggers again!

Reply
- May 7, 2012 at 5:32 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
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  Dead people voting in Chicago again? You mean still, dont you? OBAma Stooge running Chicago. Nothing changed. Looks like robo saraahahahhhha got fired. Just could not keep common sense from coming out.
  Nicely Done Americans!
  
  Reply
May 7, 2012 at 10:59 am

FFA says:

Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike:
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Bill, It looks like there are only anout 5 people left in the forum. Robo Sarahahahaha vs 4. We all know whats going on. We disagree with her so she uses her robo squad to silence the people at the street level feeling the pain. She probably has one of them Fortune 500 jobs. Obviously a West coaster as it is 09:54 Chicago time and she has not robo’ed our opinions into hidden status yet Or MAybe she is one of them people that cant find full time work because no one can afford the affordable health insurance and dont start work yet. None the less, Obama is most likely going to kick her to the curb after the election and then she will feel the pain just like us average Joe’s.

Reply
May 7, 2012 at 11:02 am

Sarah says:

Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike:
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Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Just like a socialist, to silence dissenting opinion by fraudulent voting and pushing legislation in the dark of the night by corrupt politicians.

Sound familiar, Well look no further than Obamacare!

Reply
- May 7, 2012 at 11:18 am
  
  FFA says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
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  Welcome back non robo sara. Figured you gave up arguing with Robo Saraagahahaghag. Not sure why I continue to do so. I’ll be bit$#@% every time I have to pay my Affordable as defined by Obama health insurance bill instead of affordable as defined by Webster. Oh well, Soon Robo Sara will be working and she wont let anyone speak their mind.
  
  Reply
  - May 7, 2012 at 11:58 am
    
    Sarah says:
    
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    Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
    FFA, Why do I refuse to argue with Sarhahaha, first she gave herself the handle because of me. and she is the same person as Jill, Youngin, and the appropriate name of Comradeanon. One and the same person I guarantee you! This is obviously a paid blogger by the Obama campaign! Yes The Obama campaign uses paid bloggers and did so in a big way in the first election. They pay young college kids to attack right wing blogs and other so called non partisan blogs online. Not really a secret.
    
    We all know the truth here, Obamacare is unconstitutional whether the Court says so or not! It is obvious to me that the document does not give the power of the Federal government the right to dictate to me what products I must purchase as was evident in the court proceedings so far. Lets see if the left wing on the court is really there to uphold the constitution or make a left wing power grab.
    
    Anyway, As Bill stated below and I happen to agree with him. I will not argue with faceless, multiple named ROBO voting paid blogger from the Obama campaign.
    
    Reply
    - May 7, 2012 at 12:07 pm
      
      FFA says:
      
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      Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
      11:02 am Chicago time and she is still not at work.
      Good observation on the names. Expose her for what she is.
      She probably wont go tell her boss she has been exposed as she dont want to lose her job. Of course, Obama will kick her to the curb after the election. He is not loyal to the American People, why would he be loyal to her?
      
      Reply
      - May 8, 2012 at 9:50 am
        
        Agent says:
        
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        The Robo dislikers are back. Maybe they took a few days hiatus to attend the local OWS rally.
    - May 7, 2012 at 12:45 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
      Hot debate. What do you think?
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      Sarah, I have to admire your titanium spine. You have no problem seeing these Progressive bloggers for who they are. We have lost a lot of freedoms in the past 3+ years. It is up to the American People to reject everything Progressive. They are like a disease on this society and we have the cure by voting this President and all his minions out in November.
      
      Reply
May 7, 2012 at 11:05 am

Bill says:

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The Obama campaign has paid bloggers. I guess it is one way to lower the unemployment rate. Just hire ex Acorn workers to blog on insurance websites that they know nothing about!

I would put nothing past this president and his campaign workers that stuff ballot boxes and pay illegal aliens to vote for him.

Reply
May 7, 2012 at 11:45 am

Bill says:

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Sarahahaha you are a communist! obvious in your Robo voting and push for a public option instead of the free market capitalist system.

Plain and simple – You and your friends would be better served living in Cuba!

Reply
May 8, 2012 at 1:51 pm

pogiine says:

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This is all about being “Politically Correct”. Politicians will say anything to be elected. Where do you think their loyalty belongs? To their political parties and of course their own interest. Result, a bottomed out economy, millions out of work, crime rate is up etc. etc. etc.

Reply
- May 8, 2012 at 1:55 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  So is the suicide rate.
  
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  - May 8, 2012 at 4:14 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
    Hot debate. What do you think?
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    The suicide rate in France will be going up dramatically when all those rich Frenchmen realize they will be taxed at 75% by the new leftist regime. The Eiffel Tower may be a popular spot to jump from. The others will just move their money to Switzerland where the Swiss can watch over it. I predict France will be Greece within the year.
    
    Reply
May 8, 2012 at 1:53 pm

FFA says:

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Well, the robo Squade finally got out of bed and got to work. Work one hour and feel like your entitled to 8 hours pay?

Reply
May 8, 2012 at 3:41 pm

JB says:

Hot debate. What do you think?
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Hey, I heard of a wonderful solution that doesn’t involve a large bureaucracy, extensive government intrusion and control, at least 75% would favor, and would make quality care available to all: hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden
hidden hidden hidden hidden hidden

Reply
May 8, 2012 at 3:50 pm

FFA says:

Hot debate. What do you think?
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JB, thats good. We could probably read it for the rest of the day. Appears that ROBO Sarahahahah or Jill or youngin or commi was outsourced to China.

Reply
May 9, 2012 at 11:03 am

FFA says:

Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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From AOL News:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/08/keith-judd-texas-inmate-g_n_1501761.html?ref=elections-2012&icid=maing-grid7%7Cmain5%7Cdl2%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D159060

Reply
- May 9, 2012 at 11:24 am
  
  Agent says:
  
  Hot debate. What do you think?
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  Good one FFA. I would think that West Virginia would overwhelmingly reject Obama since he and the EPA are virtually shutting down the coal industry in that state. West Virginia depends heavily on coal. Is Joe Manchin hiding out in the woods? If he doesn’t come out against Obama, the people will promptly dismiss him when he is up for re-election. You just can’t have a Federal Government destroying the economy of a state and expect the citizens to say “Oh Well”.
  
  Reply
  - May 9, 2012 at 3:16 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Did you see that Rep Senator from Indiana, the logest standing senator got voted off the primary yesterday? He was long though to be the #1 republican supporter of Obama.
    
    Reply
    - May 9, 2012 at 3:36 pm
      
      Agent says:
      
      Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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      Yes, Lugar was one of the longstanding RINO’s who have gone along to get along. He, McCain & joined at the hip buddy Lindsey Graham have all participated in “reaching across the aisle” politics for many years. The problem with that approach is that Progressives always give up nothing and get their huge spending programs which are responsible for our $15 Trillion debt accumulated. Lugar needed to go and Indiana is showing they like the Conservative approach now and are rejecting the politics as usual bunch. Sarah Ha Ha will not like this so I expect an avalanche of dislikes.
      
      Reply
      - May 9, 2012 at 4:35 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
        Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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        What was OBamas campaign slogan – Time for a change?. Guess he is right.
      - May 9, 2012 at 5:42 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Not a problem for us any more. It appears to me change is inevitible this November. Seems there have been a few old politicians kick to the curb recently. Down side is that they will still be a burdon on the tax payers with their cushy pension and their 100% medical coverage on our dime.
May 9, 2012 at 5:15 pm

Agent says:

Hot debate. What do you think?
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Since that Hopey Changey slogan didn’t work out so well for them, the new one is “FORWARD”. By the way, that word has been used by Marxists for 50 years as their slogan. It is appropriate for Obama since he subscribes to their theories.

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May 10, 2012 at 11:48 pm

23ccoleman says:

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I am new on this board. I am a CPCU in Des Moines. I think there are good and bad in our industry. I also think there has been a wealth distribution towards the top since Reaganomics took a stronghold. I am not afraid to say that nor back it up. What I am going to say is the bill that has passed is not the right one. There are better ways to fix our problem here in the United States. But, I am going to take this opportunity to say what a great statement from The President recently. It has nothing to do with healthcare but everything to do with the vision of our future. What B.O.B. came out and finally said about same sex couples is nothing short of a civil right’s statement. One short statement from a man, one enormous and historic statement FOR mankind. Don’t be a bigot to society while drinking your blindness instead of good. You screwed up on healthcare, Barack. But, you’ve certainly paved the rainbow road I personally choose to follow. I am married with a daughter and couldn’t be more proud of what you chose to do, no matter the incentive. I think you lose the election now but you go down as one of the advocates of civil rights in this nation. I know there are those out there that will say they don’t disregard gay individuals. But, what about gay couples? Should they have their own drinking fountains? Their own designated restaurant areas? Should they sit in the back of the bus in order to hold hands? I say no. And, go RAINBOW! I expect to be shot down, which is okay. I know who loses in the end. The haters and those who think religion reigns in this country. Matter of time. I am not some Sarahahhaha or some Youngin or Move Forward or whatever you want to coin me. Go ahead and coin me. I won’t be voting at all. Unless someone harbors this post, you watch. Again, I don’t believe in this healthcare bill. It’s crap. I am not trying to conquer and divide. I certainly don’t care what you think if you don’t agree with me. I’m happy to debate anyone who cares. I’m also happy for my sister and do think this is a move in the right and forward direction. If that makes me a Progressive, so be it. Amen! Come after me, I am ready. Oh, and by the way, Romney wins and I really don’t care. I hope he does something to restore this country which is slipping. But, let’s not slip on this issue. Now, disagree. It’s the American way and I love to have the discussion.

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May 11, 2012 at 9:18 am

Captain Planet says:

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Nice commentary, 23 – but you’re wrong on healthcare. This is a move in the right direction. Oh, and as stories like Romney’s assault back in high school continue to leak, I disagree. Obama wins a second term. Looks like Mitt started cutting hair before he started trimming out American jobs via Bain Capital. My dad was a victim of Bain. Lord help us all should he win office. We might all be walking the streets waiting to see what firm oats come out of the horses rears in hopes of picking out a nutritious meal. If Romeny wins, America loses. This could be the tragic end to a wonderful country. GOBama 2012. No vote on Mitt Wrongly. Conservative masses, and I know you are out there, you can say what you will and try to tear me down. I stand strong and proud of our President.

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- May 11, 2012 at 10:10 am
  
  FFA says:
  
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  I honestly dont care what the republicans put up against OBama. Nor do I care about Gay Rights. Two people want to commit thier lives to each other, GOD bless them.
  I care about keeping a roof over my familys head. OBama the job killer has got to go. Obama the Socialist and his health care bill has got to go. OBama giving away American money to any one who sticks their hand out except employed Americans has got to go. Before robo Sarahahahah got her squad on my little pole, 70% responding did not like. He lost 40% of the Primary in W V. to someone that is in federal prison in TX. Old Math – 4 out of 10 people in WV would rather have a convicted felon that is still in prison be president then OBama. Dont Forget – OBama cut his political teeth in the most corupt county in the most corupt state.
  What was he hiding in the whole Blago thing??? What was Rahm Hiding??? What was Jesse Jackson JR hiding??? Did Blago fall on the knife for these three? Guess we will never know. After all, OBama and his cronies are above the law.
  
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- May 11, 2012 at 12:11 pm
  
  Captain Planet says:
  
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  7 offshore bank accounts. How American is that? Dog on top of the car and then it “ran away”. Who puts a dog on top of a car even just to go down the block, let alone go on a vacation? Flip-flop on EVERY issue. Etch-a-sketch? Really? Maybe he’s a fan of LOST and thinks he can just re-set the island with a turn of the donkey wheel. “I don’t care about the very poor.” No kidding, Mitt. No kidding. Go buy your wife another $900 T-shirt. Buy yourself a personality while you’re at it and maybe some decency, too. GOBama!
  
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  - May 11, 2012 at 1:13 pm
    
    FFA says:
    
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    So you begrudge the guy for living the American Dream? Being all he can be – better at what he does then almost everyone? Suppose you feel the same way about the Kennedys? Rockafellers? You going to hold being filthy rich against him, stay consistant. Begrudge OBama too. Or is it ok for Dumacrats to be filthy rich coming from the most corupt county in the most corrupt state?
    
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    - May 11, 2012 at 1:31 pm
      
      Captain Planet says:
      
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      The difference is Obama didn’t inherit his, he actually worked for it. No, I don’t begrudge him for his money. I begrudge him for how he made it, where he hides it, the amount of taxes he pays on it, and then his political flip-flopping, lack of character, and lack of personality. He raped countless Americans of their jobs with Bain Capital take-overs. He’s a phony (all the trees are the right height, I’m going to need to learn to say ya’ll, I’ve had pink slips, hired an illegal immigrant and then fired him because “I’m running for office for Pete’s sake” – the list is endless, really. Check out multiplechoicemitt.com. If you care to see the other side of the debate, I encourage you to check out Thomm Hartmann’s website as well.
      
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      - May 11, 2012 at 1:42 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        So, If Obama would have inherited his $$$, you would carry the same grudge?
        Is what Mit is doing Illegal?
        Is Mit an ILl Policitian? Obama is. We all know what has gone on in the god foresaken state.
      - May 11, 2012 at 1:45 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Obama is from Illinois. He needs to go. Just a matter of time before his Illinois ways infect the Fed Govt.
- May 11, 2012 at 1:36 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  How is handing me – Joe Small Business a 2x cost increase on my medical premiums good for America? I need another full time. Instead, I had to send one to the unemployment line to handle not only the OBama Care Increase, but Quinns 65% jump in taxxes.
  I will never hire another Full time person because I do not want to pay for their Health Isnurance. So, right here, right now – I am down 1.5 full time people and will NVER HIRE a full time worker.Does that not just further the problem of UnEmployment?
  I am not the only small business using the same line of thinking. All over America. No, he did not start the mas exporting of jobs. He is in a position to stop it and he has not. Instead, he steps on the Keystone Pipe Line not creating them job. His definition of Affordable is in direct conflict from the definition I was taught as a child. How are we supposed to know when to apply the OBAma Factor or just use Webster?
  
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May 11, 2012 at 10:46 am

Agent says:

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And what planet are you from Captain? I guess you like that wealth redistribution stuff and trickle up poverty this current President is putting out. Here we have a guy who is tearing this economy up piece by piece, presides over the most corrupt and radical administration in this nation’s history. Obama’s background is to hang around with unrepentant Terrorists, Marxists and other radicals and you seem to think he is a good guy and is deserving of another term to finish the country off for good. You should move to Venezuela or Cuba so you can enjoy the benefits of their society.

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- May 11, 2012 at 12:21 pm
  
  Captain Planet says:
  
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  We’ve been giving too much corporate welfare for the past 30+ years and distributing the wealth up. It’s not trickling down. The working man is getting hosed. Time to try something new. Reaganomics have failed. The experiment is over! Most prosperous times in America is when the top tax bracket was paying double or more than what they are now. I’d like to see just a slight increase, invest that in infrastructure and educating our youth, and return this country to greatness.
  
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  - May 11, 2012 at 12:49 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    Hey Planet, did you not study any history in school or did the union teachers teach you a different version of what happened. Reagan inherited an economy just as bad as Obama and turned it around in 3 years and created 21 million new jobs. If you had studied recent history on Socialism, you may have learned that it has been an abysmal failure everywhere it was tried. The Soviet Union collapsed because of it. Most all of Europe is on the brink of collapse due to these failed Socialist policies. By the way, Reagan lowered the top tax bracket from 70% to 28% and the revenues coming in to the Treasury doubled due to creating more taxpayers. All your guy is creating is huge debt with all his schemes and job creation in the private sector is a joke. We have 7 million fewer jobs in this country now and runaway welfare. Millions have given up looking for work and have dropped out. Is this what you want for America? Trickle up Poverty, the middle class going bye bye? Under this current scheme, everyone will be equally poor when all the wealth is re-distributed. Perhaps Media Matters is where you are hanging your hat these days.
    
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    - May 11, 2012 at 1:07 pm
      
      Captain Planet says:
      
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      Nope, never gone to Media Matters, actually. I do enjoy Thom Hartmann and Chris Bradshaw, though. What we are seeing has really nothing to do with Obama and everything to do with what he has inherited. We put 2 wars on the credit card back when “deficits didn’t matter”. That took our surplus we could have used to start paying down our debt and turned our economy into a debacle. Trickle down is the reason why we are here in this suffering economy. The economy is getting stronger under Obama. Granted, not where we want it to be, but it’s definitely improved. I think the real unemployment (if you include those who have given up and those underemployed) is somewhere around 15%. It was 17% and almost hit 18%. I’m personally sick of buying yachts I don’t get to ride in and personal golf courses in backyards I don’t get to play on. Corporate welfare is killing America. They are the ones shipping the jobs off to foreign countries because they don’t want to pay decent wages here. Corporations don’t care about the US. They only care about making money and the more, the merrier. A great writer once wrote, “Avarice is the root of all evil.” The Gordon Gekko menatlity needs to Gek-GO! I don’t remember Jesus saying, “Buy and collect as many nice things as you can and follow me.” Time to do the human thing. Love people not money. I am my brother’s keeper. Want to spend less? Let’s look at the Pentagon, then. Welfare in this country amounts to a sliver of the deficit pie. Even if we cut that off completely, we don’t gain much ground.
      
      Check this, the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities decided to add up the numbers and figure out how much money the federal government spends on the nonworking poor. The answer: about 10 percent of all federal welfare spending. How did they come up with that? CBPP’s methodology uses census data to figure out exactly where program dollars are going, but you can get pretty much the same answer using a simpler, easier-to-understand technique. Step One is to list every federal welfare program. Step Two is to deduct spending on the elderly, blind, and seriously disabled. That’s Social Security, Medicare, SSI, and about two-thirds of Medicaid. Step Three is to deduct spending that goes to the working poor. That’s unemployment compensation, EITC, and child tax credits. Step Four is to add up the rest. This overstates how much goes to the nonworking poor, since these programs are open to both working and nonworking families, but it gives you a rough idea.
      
      It comes to about $235 billion, the bulk of which is SNAP (formerly food stamps) and about one-third of Medicaid. That’s 12 percent of all federal welfare spending and about 6 percent of the whole federal budget. Once you account for the fact that some of these program dollars go to the working poor, you end up with CBPP’s estimate of 10 percent, or about 5 percent of the whole federal budget.
      
      Oh, and remember – Obama got Osama!
      
      Reply
      - May 11, 2012 at 5:56 pm
        
        Agent says:
        
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        Planet, I haven’t seen this much Progressive gibberish on a post since the old TOPOV days. Perhaps you are TOPOV and changed your post name. Since you are a true believer of “The One”, I will not try to change your mind further. I will leave that up to Bob if he wants to try.
      - May 11, 2012 at 6:25 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Yes he did. Or should I say, the Seals got him. He just said Go get him.
May 11, 2012 at 10:58 am

FFA says:

Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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That opinion dont matter. He/She dont vote.

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- May 12, 2012 at 12:41 am
  
  Captain Planet says:
  
  Well-loved. Like or Dislike:
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  Agent and FFA, I don’t know who TOPOV is. What is that, the other point of view? I’m assuming. I’m not trying to change your mind, either. Just speaking my own. I don’t think he is “The One”. That’s Jesus. Barack is just a man I personally believe in because we have similar opinions. I completely respect your opinions as well. I like to have the conversation, the discourse. I love this country and think we both want it to be the best. We may have different ways of getting there, though. From reading Bob, he’s right, this Sarahahaha person seems to be bullying but in all due respect, Bob is somewhat bullying, too. Can’t we just have a nice conversation and cordially disagree on occasion? Can’t it be like some of the dinner clubs I enjoy? A whiskey and water, a good political conversation, and at the end of the day, realize we aren’t the ones solving world problems. FFA, the Seals did get him and excellent job on their part. I want to give them all a hug. But, many advisors were telling Obama no and he still pulled the trigger. If the US Forces are giving Obama credit for his decisiveness, should’t we at least give him a nod, too. I dislike Tiger Woods because of his awful display of etiquette on the golf course. Throwing clubs, cussing, being disrespectful. But I give him the nod on being one of the greatest golfers ever. I’m not asking you to say Obama is one of the greatest Presidents. I know where you stand on that. But, as far as Osama is concerned, kudos to Barack. Can we agree just on that one issue? Yes, I obviously lean left and I don’t care what you call me. I bet if we were to sit down and have a beverage of your choice, maybe throw the stick at the golf ball for a bit, we’d actually enjoy each other’s company. I have plenty of conservative friends. And, they still think I’m a pretty darn good person. Opinionated, but good. I love my wife, I love my daughter, I love my dog, I take care of my lawn, I save money, I go to church, I try to obey the law, I graduated college, I voted for Barack in the last election, I read books, my favorite comedy is Caddyshack, I think the first installments of Star Wars were excellent (the most recent being rubbish), I’m checking out Insurance Journal late on a Friday night with a beer, and I just don’t agree with the conservative side of social issues. I also don’t think the trickle down has really worked in our favor. If that makes me a bad guy, then call me Al Capone. Generally speaking, I am a living dichotomy of man. Good qualities and bad. I’m not perfect nor do I pretend to be. One thing is for sure, we shouldn’t have Americans believing other Americans are enemies. George Washington said a 2 party system was going to ruin this country and I think we are seeing that come to fruition now. We all need to work together again. Put our differences aside and love one another. No more hate. If we’ve tried something and it doesn’t work, try something else. The key component being “try”. We don’t want to end up like the other great empires that crashed and burned. And, we are reaching that decade number when things start to go amiss. The sooner we start joining hands rather than throwing them, the better. Thank you both for being the Americans you are. Isn’t freedom great? Oh, and I still hold myself as a liberal. I don’t need to change that word to progressive. I listen to Glenn Beck daily and I certainly do not personify a progressive. I’m not trying to control population with deathly tactics. I’m not trying to cause ill will. I just lean left. And, you just lean right. So what? And, so be it. It’s all good…at least in this country. USA!!!!
  
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May 12, 2012 at 11:03 am

FFA says:

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Well, CP, I will give him the nod for pulling the trigger on Bin Ladden. Been sleeping a little better at night knowing #1 Enemy of the State is gone. On to the next.
My biggest beef with OBama is the health care bill. First, Carriers pounded down commissions to a leve where it is no Profitable for me to service. I have all but forgot about even talking to my commercial customers about that. What groups I did have cancelled because of the hugh spike in rates.
More income gone.
I wont go into the way the govt has effected me in Jan & Feb. March rolls around and I have to go off Cobra and install a Group Health Plan that has sky rocketted cost. The increase was more then my mortgage is. I had to let a full timer go. She is collecting UnEmployment and the increase in my Unemployment rate is coming. More Cost out of pocket. Just cause the worker is no longer here does not mean the work load has decreased. It has actually increased as I am busting my butt to cover the OBAma factor (not to mention the Quinn Factor) in my bills. I am stressed and having issues at home as all I do is work 6 + days a week on average trying to get back to even. A beer? wish I could afford it. Even if I did start to have a few beers after work, I would most likely end up in AA. The more I think about what he (and Quinn/Blago) has done to me, the worse it gets. He gets his sttoge in the Mayors office in Chicago – the murder rate spikes.
December 2011 rolls around, I am thinking its time to start kicking back. Instead, Jan rolls around and I have to pick up the already accelorated pace.
I suppose if you lived in IL, you would get my point on an Ill Politician in the White House. From the days of Al Capone all the way through Blago and now another State Senator being brought up on Bribary Charges. According to the local ABC Nightly News, they have him red handed. So, yet another Ill Politician heading to the fed pen. Oh, lets not forget Todd Stroger too. Never got caught doing any thing wrong. His biggest claim to shame is that he pushed the highest tax rate in the nation on the people in Cook County. Then he gets FEMA money to help resotre people after massive rains and he throws a party at the zoo with it.
Now, he is bringing the NATO Summit to Chicago. The inconvience for the people who live and work there were not a factor in that decision. Should have put it in the middle of the desert so as to not keep people out of their houses and out of work. No Consideration for them folks. Barak wants – Barak gets.
In my opinion and my opinion only, Ill has lost the right to have any representation in DC. From the Senate to the House to the West Wing. We need our house in order before we infect the rest of the country.
So, to sum it up, I dont really care who wins so long as this health care bill gets kicked. I would preferr it not be someone from IL, but I would gladly comprimise that off the table. If you dont know the state of Il Politics, crawl out of the cave your in. Grey Lord, Silver Scoop, Walker, Ryan, Family Secrets, Blago and now this new guy. Look em up. Maybe you will see my point. If you dont, we can agree that this health bill has to go. Then we can agree to disagree on the other points. GOD Bless America!
BTW, do you actually think there is such a thing as Free Birth Controll???

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- May 14, 2012 at 9:27 am
  
  Agent says:
  
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  Oops! The honorable Governor Jerry Brown (D-Ca)had to admit his states deficit was double what was forecast in January. They have been running taxpayers off in that state for several years due to heavy taxation and regulation and environmental idiocy. Businesses have moved out to friendlier states. Perhaps Hollywood should cut him a big check to make up for the deficit. Then they will be paying their “fair share”.
  
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  - May 14, 2012 at 11:16 am
    
    FFA says:
    
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    Hollywood has their house in order, maybe these big time movie makers should take over the mansion.
    Tax business to cover govt mistakes.HMMMM. The OBAma way.
    just curious, how did Arnold do a gov? Did he create this mess? Make it worse? Were things better under him?
    
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    - May 14, 2012 at 11:50 am
      
      Agent says:
      
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      Actually FFA, in the early years of the Governator, he tried to do some things to get the budget under control, but his budgets were soundly defeated by the Progressive establishment in Sacramento. He basically had to give up and go along to get along. The environmental wackos are so strong in this state that they prevent drilling to get more revenue, think the Smelt fish is more important than the Agriculture Industry so they prevent water to be released to irrigate farms. They wouldn’t let Arnold build more windmill farms because it would hurt the natural beauty of the state even if they were out in the desert.
      
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      - May 14, 2012 at 12:03 pm
        
        FFA says:
        
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        Thanks. I know things are in dis array in Ca. Wondering is it better or worse then in IL. Sounds like it about the same. At least your not paying as much for policitianc in jail (I think).
        One good thing from Cal was the Cal Cobra provisions. You can carry your Cobra an additional 18 months. In my opinion, I should be able to carry my cobra as long as I can afford to pay the premium.
May 14, 2012 at 12:44 pm

Agent says:

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Arnold should have stuck with movies where he was one of the highest paid actors in history. He was pretty much a disaster as a politician and then he got into trouble with fathering children with his housekeeper. It is a toss up between which state is the biggst loser. I would have to give California the nod since they have a bigger economy and have more wackos there. Illinois is more corrupt and have many former politicians in jail. Many of the current ones should be there as well.

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- May 14, 2012 at 1:13 pm
  
  FFA says:
  
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  Guess I could argue that, but whats the point. Sad commentary when the argument is who is worse off. I would argue IL is for the simple fact of the Cal Cobra provisions. Someone out there had some common sense when they passed that. Let me keep what I have as long as I could afford to pay it up to an additional 18 months past the Fed Cobra Provisions. Could have let me keep the affordal health care I had. But now, I get to pay the Obama version of affordable. No one at the Fed Level has even put a single thought into that.
  BTY, as long as Arnold is taking care of his obligation and not a burdon to the tax payors – No I dont like what he did. Maria is hot. What the heck is he thinking? My Daughter has kids with two dead beats. My wifes X is the biggest Dead Beat in the State and in the top 10% of the entire country over $500,000 back and counting. No body does anything about it. Even when he was working at the tune of $35.00 an hour. Nothing. So, from my point of view, Arnie is not so bad.
  
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  - May 14, 2012 at 2:28 pm
    
    Agent says:
    
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    The maid he got preganant wasn’t even hot. With all of the hot Hollywood starlets out there that he could pick from, he picked the maid. Hmmm! She was available and willing and now his marriage is in shambles. I wonder if he is paying his fair share from the millions of residuals from his movies.
    
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