Obamacare Day 3: High Demand, Enrollment Glitches Persist

By and Curtis Skinner | October 4, 2013

  • October 4, 2013 at 11:00 am
    wvagt says:
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    Americans won’t find out how much Obamacare REALLY costs until they start filing claims and run into the deductibles and copays.

    • October 4, 2013 at 1:41 pm
      jack says:
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      I think the customer service number to get help said it all 1-800-F1UCK-YO. Ain’t the funniest thing ever! LMAO

    • October 4, 2013 at 2:21 pm
      Agent says:
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      I don’t think the low information voters will have a clue what they are buying and the first claim will tell the story. I saw a clip on Jimmy Kimmel where they were interviewing people on the street. They liked the Affordable Care Act, but hated Obamacare. They are the reason he was elected and re-elected.

      • October 4, 2013 at 2:57 pm
        mikey says:
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        I saw that clip too agent, but it made Republicans look bad as they were the one’s who didn’t know the difference. They hated Obamacare and loved ACA. So they were hating just because of the term Obamacare.

        • October 4, 2013 at 3:09 pm
          Always Amazed says:
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          Where did you see that these folks were affiliated with any party? I saw the same exact clip and there was no mention of any party affiliation.

          • October 4, 2013 at 4:27 pm
            Agent says:
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            Right Always! I don’t remember the interviewer asking a one of them if they were Republican or Democrat before posing the question. I have a sneaking suspicion that most were liberal Democrats there in Hollywood. Most of them looked like their IQ was between 50 & 60. Not much going on between their ears.

          • October 7, 2013 at 7:50 am
            Ron says:
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            Always Amazed,

            Please tell me where mikey said the people were Republicans. He only ponted out that those people were against the law when referred to as Obamacare, but were for the law when referred to as the Affordable Care Act.

            Agent,

            How do you know for whom those people voted? My experience is that both sides have their fair share of uninformed voters. Just reread some of your posts.

          • October 7, 2013 at 9:27 am
            txmouthbreatherboogereatertx says:
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            Any time you see a knuckle dragger, they are considered Republican – rural ‘merica

          • October 7, 2013 at 9:51 am
            Agent says:
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            Hey Ron, your liberal brain can’t assimilate a post so you put your own slant on it which is incorrect. Mikey actually said “but it made Republicans look bad as they were the ones who didn’t know the difference”. It kind of looked like he singled out Republicans to me.

            You can slam me all you want, but at least I don’t need a website to know how to think critically. Gee, I wonder why the government will not say how many enrolled in the first week. They keep stammering around and saying citizens have until March to enroll. I don’t think they are proud of the first week since the website is down more than it is up. I think a lot of people were window shopping and when they saw the price for what they were getting, they said to themselves – No, I don’t thinks so.

          • October 7, 2013 at 10:08 am
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            You are correct, I misread mikey’s post the 1st time. See, it is OK to admit when you misinterpret someone’s post. You should try it sometime.

            How do you go from stating, “They liked the Affordable Care Act, but hated Obamacare. They are the reason he was elected and re-elected.” where you made the assumption that these people voted for President Obama; to, ” I don’t remember the interviewer asking a one of them if they were Republican or Democrat before posing the question.”?

            First you make an assumption regarding who these people voted for, then complained that mikey made an assumption without evidence. What changed?

            Unfortunately the rest of us are not omniscient like you and cannot see all. I only ask you to provide a source when you make a statement that should be based on some data and/or statistics. I enjoy doing research and can be swayed to your point of view if I can see it for myself. Being a fellow Economics degree holder, you really should understand that concept.

    • October 4, 2013 at 4:35 pm
      FFA says:
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      Or the increase on the tax bill.

      • October 5, 2013 at 9:17 am
        Former Status Quo says:
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        The majority don’t pay taxes.

      • October 7, 2013 at 12:01 pm
        Agent says:
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        Gee, Ron finally misinterpreted a post. Did you actually see the Kimmel clip? It reminded me a lot of some of Jesse Waters interviews with people on the street. These are all low information voters who voted for Hope & Change. It was real easy to distinguish them from informed voters. I wonder how many of them were the sit on the fence undecided Independents you are so proud of.

        • October 7, 2013 at 1:51 pm
          Ron says:
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          Agent,

          At least I am man enough to admit when I make a mistake, unlike you.

          Once again, how do you know for whom they voted?

          When did I state that I am proud of undecided Independents? I am very proud of anyone who votes based on who they believe will best represent them, regardless of party affiliation. That takes real courage and intelligence. How smart do you have to be to say, “I am a Conservative and will vote for anyone who has a ‘C’ after their name”?

          I did not see the Kmmel clip, but did hear about it. That is an example of my biggest criticism of our citizens. Too many rely on what they hear or see without doing the homework to become educated and get the correct information. Sound familiar?

          • October 7, 2013 at 3:22 pm
            Agent says:
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            Ron, I can’t believe you didn’t do your research and find the Kimmel clip, but weren’t afraid to launch into an attack without seeing it. You keep touting the Independents, the majority of which are the “undecideds” in all elections. Do you not know the difference between big government Leftists or RINO’s and Conservatives by now? Where is your brain hiding out? Perhaps I should give you some key words they say so you can sift through the muck and see where they are coming from. I can spot a Leftist and a Conservative a mile off just by how they talk and what they propose. It is a shame you don’t know how to think critically to tell the difference.

          • October 7, 2013 at 4:03 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            Why would I research a clip from a comedy show? You do realize that Jimmy Kimmel is a comedian, right? So you will tout a comedian for your take on the country, but cannot provide an actual credible source of data. And you wonder why I don’t buy what you’re selling.

            Maybe people are undecided because they want to gather enough information to make an informed choice. At least they are not sheep who vote for a letter (D, R, L, C) instead of a candidate. I respect those people far more than anyone who votes any party line.

            You will vote for a letter, then complain about the division/polarization of the country. True Independents are the least polarizing because they actually see and respect both sides of an issue and do not have any opposition to criticize. I know you call that “sitting on the fence” or ” the inability to make up their minds”, but it only means that we like to gather as much infomation as possible, process it, then make a decision. That is critical thinking.

            Critical Thinking defined: disciplined thinking that is clear, rational, open-minded, and informed by evidence.

            http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/critical+thinking

            How could you possibly believe that you, or any other person who votes strictly by party line, use critical thinking when voting. By definition, Independents, especially the undecideds, are the most likely to use critical thinking.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:03 pm
            bob says:
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            Bob,

            Registered independents have a history of voting contradictory to their beliefs and being highly volatile. A registered republican or democrat will on occasion vote against party line. Though republicans do it more often than democrats. As I recall a few years back it was roughly 90% of democrats voted per party line whereas it was roughly 60% of republicans. I’m not sure if that has changed. Yes, independents switch more, but they switch too preemptively and against their own beliefs which is not clear thinking or rational behavior.

            An example: You want a smaller government, you’ve stated it. The republicans try to get it smaller, a government shut down happens, and you state the republicans are bad for trying to get a smaller government.

            Republicans vote to get the government smaller (remove ACA) and the independents who do control the flow of congress then vote against the republicans, who they voted in in the first place to fight against the ACA and due to discontent with the ACA. You don’t want the ACA but you sure as heck don’t want republicans to remove it, or are unwilling to give them enough of a majority for a chance to remove it. As you said, how do they have the ability to remove the ACA right now? You actually want them to leave it there even though you don’t approve of it just so Obama can pass more big government things that you are against. In reality, Obama pushes through big government items you don’t like, and ties it together with what he says are republican ideals like tax cuts, and calls it a compromise, but to who? The independent? No. The independent wanted tax cuts and spending cuts, and they were against the stimulus. So when the republicans didn’t back the stimulus, and backed spending cuts and tax cuts, you wanted them to compromise against what you wanted? Passing tax increases with spending cuts for example was not what independents wanted. So in reality Obama keeps passing things you don’t want with things you don’t want, to pass things full out liberals want who are in the minority of the population.

            That is not thinking clearly, or rationally.

            I’m not an independent because they really are a lot of the problem. They did well with Clinton and Reagan, but they also voted for Obama and Bush W, just because you know it was time to “vote out all incumbents!” as you often say.

            Is “voting out all incumbents” a clear and rational goal? Is it based on policies?

            Really Ron. Pot Meet Kettle. Agent is quite passionate, as are you. But don’t try to pretend you have some sort of special status from being independent, or that you are “man enough” to admit you’re wrong unlike agent, or that agent reminds you of them fatherly types! Always forcing their way!

            Just buck up and start realizing men like agent are a part of society you should probably listen to, rather than using them as an excuse to vote democrat because they are just so stubborn. You’re stubborn as well, in your own way.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:13 pm
            bob says:
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            I’ll shorten it up:

            If independents were truly independent, right now they would vote in a right party government to remove what they don’t like about Obama (the ACA, spending, stimulus, and have the tax system they want put in place)

            And then they would vote the democrats the next cycle on whatever programs they wanted to gain from the left.

            I see a lot more of the “vote out the incumbents”.

            You may see me as a right voter, but honestly, as I said there is one take away I want to see happen from the and current democrats: The government gets their hands off private markets, and then just offers a public option (key word option). I probably wouldn’t mind the subsidy staying for private plans either, if it were similar to the amount applied to the public option. I probably won’t honestly. It’s something I actually am upset with the republicans about, but I know that voting left right now won’t change that aspect. I know that voting right right now will get rid of quite a bit though, the ACA included, and would force republicans to pass their alternative plans offered in the past.

          • October 9, 2013 at 4:07 pm
            Ron says:
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            Bob,

            My point about the shut down is that it is not President Obama’s shut dowm. Both sides are My problem with tying the PPACA repeal to the funding of the government is that it is a non-starter from the Senate and President’s perspective. I like Representative Ryan’s approach. Let’s try to get some entitlement and tax reform, and remove delaying, defunding, or repealing the PPACA from the negotiation.

            Voting out all incumbents would send a clear message that we the people are fed up with how Washington is currently running the country. Please provide a rational approach to sending a similar message to our representatives.

            What does it tell you that 90% of incumbents up for re-election in 2012 won? It tells me that the people gave their representatives a green light to keep up the status quo which is not working.

            How can you say that Independents have a history of voting against their own beliefs since we do not have an official platform? We allow individuals to make up their own minds regarding each issue. I have heard the term RINO and DINO, but never IINO.

            The reason we are volatile is because we have no allegiance toa party and have no problem voting against someone if we do not like how they are voting or representing us.

            I always listen to those with more experience, even if I disagree. The problem I have with Agent, and my father-in-law, is that they are quick to label me as a Democrat, Liberal, Progressive, Socialist because I do not agree with the Conservative platform 100%. That is extrmemly offensive and disrespectful. I put a lot of effort and research in forming my opinions based on facts and evidence. It bothers me that people make statements that should be based in fact, and cannot provide a source of their information when I cite my sources.

          • October 9, 2013 at 7:23 pm
            bob says:
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            “Voting out all incumbents would send a clear message that we the people are fed up with how Washington is currently running the country. Please provide a rational approach to sending a similar message to our representatives.”

            Sending a message does not promote a policy or removal of a policy. You sent a clear message that you didn’t like the ACA in the 2010 voting time period. But you won’t vote in more republicans to get it removed entirely, now you are voting out incumbents.

            My point about the shut down is that it is not President Obama’s shut dowm. Both sides are My problem with tying the PPACA repeal to the funding of the government is that it is a non-starter from the Senate and President’s perspective. I like Representative Ryan’s approach. Let’s try to get some entitlement and tax reform, and remove delaying, defunding, or repealing the PPACA from the negotiation.”

            Ron, yes, it freaking is. The congress gets authority on spending measures, they run it through senate and the president to pass only because they have to as any law the president has to sign. Obama has said he will veto any law they pass that is not “clear” and will then come back and negotiate later. This means that he won’t do negotiations on debt until he gets his way, and won’t let congress pass a bill. Did you see my link? The democrats didn’t accept even ONE bill in 1000 days that the republicans put forward. Not one. This is his fault, he has been polarize, and calls it being “held hostage” that the congress wants to pass a different budget (as they are elected to do) and he won’t pass it (which he is technically elected to do to in terms of veto). Reid called it akin to “having a gun held” to their heads that the republicans said they wanted to pass an alternate budget. Really Ron, not their or Obama’s fault? He did this same thing on the super committee and other areas. He’s an @$$hole who has not passed a single thing the republicans wanted. You disagree? List the item! List ONE. One Jobs bill, no matter how small. They have presented hundreds. While you will say “does the president start that law” and the answer is “no” technically, he owns the fact that he has not said in public, “I want to look at passing this law” as he has seen all of them, and supported it. He has not supported one. Bills don’t pass when they will be voted on arrival, they don’t even get started.

            “The reason we are volatile is because we have no allegiance toa party and have no problem voting against someone if we do not like how they are voting or representing us.” No, it’s because you don’t like “any” politics. As such, you tend to do the “vote out incumbents” technique. This is no different than the Christmas tree approach. If you didn’t know that Obama was going to pass the ACA when he spelled it out on election day, your party was a fool. You basically changed your mind twice since it was passed. First against, then for (or rather against removing it). The type of volatile I’m referring to is not the type aligned with party. I’m talking about changing your mind on laws and issues.

            “How can you say that Independents have a history of voting against their own beliefs since we do not have an official platform? We allow individuals to make up their own minds regarding each issue. I have heard the term RINO and DINO, but never IINO.”

            Officially, do you have a platform? No.

            Here’s how I can say you’re voting against your beliefs: Democrat ones don’t change. Neither do republicans. Yet consistently we have had over 50% of the population wanting a smaller government, and against the ACA, and one that has not voted in a republican party to get rid of those issues. There is only one possibility to match up with those polls: Your side agrees with smaller government and are against the ACA and as of yet have yet to actually vote per those policies, you are rather voting on political winds, or the “vote out incumbent” and “dissatisfaction” method. Being dissatisfied with a recession is not a reason to keep voting for a party that keeps putting things in place that are against your beliefs.

            “I always listen to those with more experience, even if I disagree. The problem I have with Agent, and my father-in-law, is that they are quick to label me as a Democrat, Liberal, Progressive, Socialist because I do not agree with the Conservative platform 100%. That is extrmemly offensive and disrespectful. I put a lot of effort and research in forming my opinions based on facts and evidence. It bothers me that people make statements that should be based in fact, and cannot provide a source of their information when I cite my sources.”

            A: You do not source quote all your sources. No one does.
            B: It bothers me that you don’t just look it up, and then think about common sense to see if he could be right or wrong. He is wrong often. He’s also right often.
            C: It also bothers me that you compare an abusive type of personality with republicans, and then said that’s why you were against republicans.

            “What does it tell you that 90% of incumbents up for re-election in 2012 won? It tells me that the people gave their representatives a green light to keep up the status quo which is not working.”

            And to direct this again: What does it tell you? I’m genuinely curious on this one. In regards to potential policy changes for the FUTURE what does it say when priors win? That voting out incumbents will change policies? You have to look at who voted for what. You could vote out all the guys that tried change, and replace them with more people trying to take out of the mentality of “vote out incumbents” to push an agenda. Believe it or note, democrats are good at this. Don’t say republicans are. Great depression: Swing to democrat for over 60 years, there was a flip in the 50’s for a few years but that was it. You can’t honestly tell me that was because the republicans sucked that bad. It was because democrats knew how to play people like a flute.

          • October 10, 2013 at 11:37 am
            Ron says:
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            Bob,

            I am not going to go line-by-line addressing your points since we will have to agree to disagree.

            There are a couple of things upon which I will challenge you.

            You said, “Bills don’t pass when they will be voted on arrival, they don’t even get started.” I will assume “voted” is a typo and you meant “vetoed”. If that is the case, then how come there have been 2564 Presidential Veotes in our history and only 110 were overridden? That tells me that some bills do get to the President’s desk then vetoed. Please list all of the jobs bills that President Obama has vetoed. That tells me that it is not the President, but the House and Senate who cannot agree and that falls upon both parties. Just as I do not think that the Republicans should completely fold, I do not think Democrats should either. That is my opinion and you will never change that.

            I did not say I source quote everything I say. But who cites more than I do? Definitelly not you or Agent.

            The reason I do not look up Agent’s information is because I do not believe it is true. If he would cite his source, then I would do the research to determine if it is accurate and/or requires some context.

            You said, “It also bothers me that you compare an abusive type of personality with republicans, and then said that’s why you were against republicans.” What are you talking about? Please provide some example.

            Most elected officials either cannot or will not be able to implement their policies and many only vote to please their campaign financing source(s) and/or party to get re-elected. We need to change their mentality to focus on doing what is right for the people. If we tell all elected officials and challengers that we will no longer put up with these shenanigans, they focus more on the people and less on those who help them get re-elected. I am not saying it will work, but it is a better approach than the status quo or blindly voting for any one party to remove the obstructionism.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:12 pm
            bob says:
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            Ron,

            Don’t be a dishonest son of a B@2%# when talking to me.

            Provide some examples? How about when you said you hated that mentality of you’re either with us or against us, like your (step father I believe, might be wrong) you just said it what, 2 days ago when talking to Agent and you forgot?

            I noticed you didn’t direct the other areas, answer as to why? You can’t.

            Moving on to the veto: Listen punk, when Obama in public says he will veto any bill that doesn’t pass “clear” through the senate (meaning funding every aspect of government, no cuts) regarding appropriating funds, as is done each year and is CONGRESSIONAL authority, as per our government process, it doesn’t matter that the veto doesn’t get to his desk. You said “oh boo hoo what about the 2,000 some bills that do?” THEY DON’T MATTER. What matters is a case by case basis, not cherry picking, statistic manipulation, got it you punk?

            Why am I mad? YOU KNOW YOU’RE WRONG and you’re plainly trying to act like a smart a$$ and challenge based on conceptual rather than factual.

            Let’s stick factual: Right now, Obama has said if any budget is appropriated that doesn’t fund all aspects of government, he will veto it. What do you think the appropriation process of the government exists for you moron? It exists for the congress to change the budget as needed. They aren’t “holding a gun” to Reid’s head, they aren’t “holding hostage” as Obama said, and Obama does have ultimate say here.

            You said you wouldn’t want the democrats to compromise, just as the republicans. STOP TALKING VAGUE CONCEPTS.

            You said to agent you want a smaller government and don’t like the ACA. Then you do in fact want the democrats to compromise. Unless just for the sake of a concept, you don’t want them to compromise. WHY don’t you want compromise from the left? WHAT don’t you want them to compromise on?

            You are contradictory to the point of insanity, OR you are disingenuous, and I will NOT pull punches when it comes to that crap Ron!

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:15 pm
            Libby says:
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            I do “fact-check” Agent and 9 times out of 10 he is wrong &/or fibbing. The other 1 time he is usually exaggerating or is quoting totally out of context. You can’t believe anything he says.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:20 pm
            bob says:
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            Also, Ron,

            YOU DO NOT SOURCE QUOTE MORE THAN ME.

            Let’s just end that myth. I only don’t source quote what I really don’t need to.

            I have posted VERBATIM the lines of the law for the patriot act, and a link showing them to Libby.

            I have posted VERBATIM the sections of the law from the government website for the gay marriage law in WA and shown the 2 sections the republicans had a problem with here to Libby.

            I have posted VERBATIM the CRA .GOV links for Leahman brothers, WAMU, Bank of America, etc. I also source quoted the sites who showed their contribution requirements. The reason I don’t post sources, AGAIN is because I have posted them before and you, Libby, and Planet either ignored them, or source quoted inferior posts that I dissected, and annihilated.

            I have source quoted VERBATIM the speech Bush W had when going to war with Iraq.

            I then compared VERBATIM the link for Clinton’s “you will not defy the will of the world” speech.

            I have posted youtube links, VERBATIM showing Al Gore saying we had every piece of intelligence to intervene with Iraq, (before Bush W, we are talking a long time ago) and then near exact wording with him stating later that we had “no” evidence at all that stated we should intervene with Iraq.

            I have posted VERBATIM the names of the water boarded terrorists, when the torture victim gave the information that lead to Osama (obtained before Obama’s presidency) and differentiated them as they all have close to the same name. There are 3.

            I will NOT post these repeated times to the same people who lost the debates before. Which is why you see me constantly tell Libby that she’s wrong without source quoting AGAIN. You have SEEN these links, and they far outstrip your pathetic ability to attempt source quoting. I have NEVER seen you source link to direct code from a government website for a LAW.

            You incompetent, fool!

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:21 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            I will agree that on a post per post basis, that Agent is probably wrong closer to 8 out of 10 times.

            On a concept by concept basis, it is 50/50. He says the same things quite a bit. He only has about 10 concepts.

            He uses the wrong sources to justify those concepts quite often as well. But that does not make the concept wrong. As such, he’s right about half the time.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:39 pm
            Ron says:
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            Bob,

            You are letting your emotions get the best of you are you are being disrespectful. I have never called you any names nor debated in any disrectful manner. Trust me, between you and Agent, it is not easy.

            I only asked what you meant by that comment only because I did not understand. Now that I do, I apologize if you were offended that I do not like the you’re either with us or against us mentality. I do not think that is an abusive type of personality in and of itself and was not meant to be an insult to all Republicans.

            I am not going to keep going back and forth on issues with you where it is clear we will never agree.

            I always loved when people say to others, “you’re wrong and you know it”. Cracks me up every time.

            Regarding the veto issue. If your position is that there is no need to start a bill that will be veoted, why has the House passed 40+ bills to repeal the PPACA and hundreds of jobs bills? If you want to blame the Senate Democrats for not passing the bill and putting it on the President’s desk, then I am with you.

            The President, regardless of who is in office, cannot pass or veto a law that is not on his desk. He is not a dictator.

            You do realize that a veto is not the end, right? If the President is the only one not smart enough to realize that a bill is good, the veto can be overriden.

            One FINAL thought, I will not repond to any more of your insult-ladened, disrespectful posts. If you believe that makes you a winner, go ahead. It sounds like your ego needs some boosting. I feel sorry for you!

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:54 pm
            Libby says:
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            Ron- welcome to the real Bob. He calls hurling insults and telling people what they think and don’t think debating. Then he bullies you to death. Why do you think Captain Planet completely ignores him? (That drives him crazy, by the way.)

            At one time we had gotten to a place of understanding, but that didn’t last long. I think he’s a very angry person that gets a huge ego boost beating up on people through a blog. He stated the other day that he “kicked my teeth in” a few times and I could tell he was very proud about that…

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:55 pm
            bob says:
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            Ron,

            You deserved that, and don’t act like you didn’t try to do make a shift there based on tact rather than fact. You were relying on it to make a win for you, and for that I feel sorry for you, you don’t have actual points, over image points. Your form of insults while not vulgar, are no less of insults as a side comment, and your posts are generally laden with them.

            Moving on: Are you attempting to say that the house has not voted on bills to pass despite Obama’s veto threat currently? Because you’re wrong. They have passed a few to continue certain areas of spending. If you’re trying to say that the senate is at fault for not passing those, and not Obama, despite Obama’s clear attempt to get them to fight with his statement that he would veto, well then on a technicality you’re right, in the real world, you’re just wrong. When the senate says no, and the president says he’ll veto, they are working in union. Plain and simple. Obama threatening veto does contribute to this shut down. I might add, your example with the 40 + votes is not related to the topic at hand. I don’t even know why you brought it up. At all.

            As to the ego, it is not an ego to demand for someone to debate honestly, not to attempt for “class” points over topic points, and for them to not forget what they said or pretend they didn’t say it a few days ago, and then lie and say they didn’t mean it. Even trying to say that it’s about my ego is further doing that, and is actually source of YOUR ego to not admit you’re being a jerk. I don’t tolerate it, won’t tolerate it, never will. You don’t get to lie, debate disingenuously, and then try to mop up the pile of @%@% you just left behind.

          • October 10, 2013 at 7:04 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            Welcome to the real bob, eh?

            The real bob is one who will knock your face in if you lie, act disingenuous, lose on points, throw in an indirect insult, or try to move the topic on a concept rather than the facts at hand.

            Either you debate fair with me, or I take the gloves off and knock your teeth in.

            Dishonest debating isn’t tolerated. Smart @$$ comebacks are not tolerated. Being inconsistent or a hypocrite doesn’t fly, especially when you feign right then vote left. Ron has bluntly held double standards, and has used a passive aggressive mindset to try and win arguments. When he does it, I’ll call him a punk, (because he is, it’s called when you do a deviation from the topic such as the amount of veto rather than the bill Obama has killed, it’s a deviation tactic and is acting like a “punk”) and I’ll call him a dishonest piece of trash when he tries to say he didn’t make an insulting comment toward the right. It’s called high and mighty. And I don’t play the game.

            I’m willing to say whatever, however, because I don’t believe in the high and mighty crap, or the “If I talk this way I’m better than you” crap.

            A lot of libertarians are the same way if you have not noticed, which is what I am.

          • October 11, 2013 at 10:08 am
            Libby says:
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            “Either you debate fair with me, or I take the gloves off and knock your teeth in.

            Dishonest debating isn’t tolerated. Smart @$$ comebacks are not tolerated. Being inconsistent or a hypocrite doesn’t fly, especially when you feign right then vote left.”

            I guess you think you’re pretty special, Bob. You, and only you, can decide when someone is debating honestly or not. And you know exactly how people you don’t even know voted.

            And as far as smart-assed comebacks, does this ring a bell? “You tell me how they should have done it differently in the gay marriage law here. Can’t? Then be quiet and sit down with the bull argument!”

            You are the KING of smart-assed comebacks. Why do we have to tolerate yours, but you don’t ours?

          • October 14, 2013 at 7:27 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            That comment I said was not “smart assed”, and it was relevant to the topic at hand.

            You really need to mature. When a little kid comes in and says “them der republicans are against dem dere gays!” and then I present solid facts showing how they are not, and then state shut up and sit down, it’s not a smart a$$ comment. It’s direct and in your face.

            Smart @$$ would be a lot more like my recent comment when I said to Ron that he himself said presidents don’t determine debt, and yet if that’s true it’s congress, and if that’s true, the republicans are the only congress to have a surplus in an incredibly long amount of time, which he gave credit to Clinton, a president, and then I tied in the government shut downs with Obama not being the end all, but apparently if he gave Clinton the credit for the surpluses that resulted from the 1995 shut down, he must believe they do have an end all ability.

            That’s smart @$$ and perfectly relevant.

      • October 9, 2013 at 2:44 pm
        Agent says:
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        Hi FFA. Did you hear about the new movement in America? It is called “Occupy America” and was started by the “Greatest Generation” who were denied access to the WW11 Memorial. They just ran the Barrycade and went on in. I see reports of all across America, people are taking down these Barrycades, running over the cones in the driveways to get to the monuments, parks etc. I think America is getting very tired of this Administration and all the pain they are trying to inflict.

        Another clip I heard from the President in yesterdays sham of a news conference. He said that in any negotiation, there is give and take. Interpretation – Republicans give and I take. Is that a good assessment?

        • October 9, 2013 at 5:45 pm
          Agent says:
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          Ron, you should listen to your father in law more since he has the wisdom of years and has seen the history more than you have. Do you ever consider that you are being offensive and disrespectful to him and me with your spiel? You can’t even admit that the Progressives are ruining the country even if the evidence hits you in the noggin. How much more evidence do you need to make up your undecided mind? You won’t find it on a government website, I can assure you. A little common sense would go a long way. Conservatism is not a bad thing. A small government which doesn’t overreach or try to solve every problem citizens have, doesn’t tax the citizens too much, does not control every aspect of our lives and is committed to protecting us from enemies, foreign and domestic is a good thing. You should know this, but you can’t grasp it. You say that you don’t agree with the Conservative Platform 100%. Is it just the social issues, or do you think conservative fiscal policy is a bad thing?

          • October 9, 2013 at 6:19 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            What is your problem with reading comprehension????????????????

            I just said, “I always listen to those with more experience, even if I disagree.”

            How have I been disrespectful? Please be specific. I have even apologized when I have been corrected or misinterpreted someone else’s post. You have yet to reciprocate with the same courtesy. I have asked you multiple times to not label me as anything, but an Independent. You asked me once to not put you in a box with Republicans and I have honored that request.

            Progressives are ruining this country!! Happy now?

            I have made it clear multiple times that my concern about the Conservative platform is completely social issues. Why are you guys so against allowing consenting adults to marry, females from making decisions regarding their bodies and health, and allowing people to have freedom from religion? You speak so passionately about freedom and liberty except when people are living their lives differently than you think they should.

            In addition, Conservatives speak about fiscal responsibility, but results show otherwise.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:02 pm
            bob says:
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            Oh really Ron,

            So remind me, presidents don’t affect the debt right?

            It’s congress. So Reagan got his tax cuts. The economy boomed. If you don’t agree, you’re not a moderate.

            So uhm, if you’re consistent, the debt isn’t Reagan right?

            But more interestingly, who determines spending? Congress. Reagan had a democrat congress. Now even better to show how much of a hypocrite you are:

            Will you say Reagan could have done a veto against the democrat’s spending bills? Really? So the republican can stop a spending bill? No wait? They can if it’s Reagan, but not if it’s the current government shut down?

            Get the picture yet Ron?

            1995-2000, who had control of spending? History has shown we have rarely had surpluses. The democrats didn’t have congressional spending authority for 40 years. The moment they did, we have our first surpluses in roughly the same time, for a period of about 5 years. Is that coincidence Ron?

            What data do you have against republicans and spending?

            Between that time frame Ron, 1930’s to 2000 the Republicans had control of congress less than 10 years. So what data do you have?

            What data do you have that goes along with your mindset of “presidents don’t affect debt”?

            What “bill” did Reagan pass to increase the debt? It wasn’t the tax cuts. Data proves otherwise on that one. Spending actually increased immensely, and again, who controls that? Congress.

            Now I’m quite done with your “rhetorical” statements that you said you never do.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:04 pm
            bob says:
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            I meant “president” can stop a spending bill, not republicans.

            “So the *president* CAN stop a spending bill? No wait? They can if it’s Reagan, but not if it’s the current government shut down? *with Obama* (you said that Obama’s veto threat is not a hindrance, and that an actual veto would not be finite. Yet you also said the republicans don’t have the numbers to get what they want, so how are they going to over ride a veto? Are you ever consistent? Or do you always say what if, could be, maybe, oh but what about that? You aren’t thinking correctly)

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:06 pm
            bob says:
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            Also this should say “The republicans didn’t have congressional spending authority for 40 years. The moment they did, we have our first surpluses in roughly the same time, for a period of about 5 years. Is that coincidence Ron?”

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:10 pm
            Agent says:
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            Ron, you have admitted that your father-in-law thinks you are a Democrat, Socialist, Liberal, Progressive. I think the ones close to you may have you pegged just about right. How is Thanksgiving Dinner at that house? Do you and your father-in-law just watch the football game and not speak? Every time you post that you agree with me, you spend the second half of the post disagreeing with me. I guess that goes hand in hand with a fence sitting Independent who can’t decide what is right and wrong. Isn’t that fence getting harder to sit on by now?

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:46 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            I also explained that thinks for the same reason you do.

            First, I love and have a lot of respect for my father-in-law because he worked hard and raised a great daughter (plus 2 others that are OK).

            I haven’t had a Thanksgiving dinner with him since he retired from Ford and goes to Florida for the winter in early October, just in time to miss my children’s birthdays. Nice Grandpa.

            We actually speak quite often and respectfully. I have convinced him that we do agree on most issues and we both accept that we will not change the other’s opinion about other issues. Lucky for my marriage and sanity, we never resort to any name calling.

            However, one of my fondest memories was when we were having dinner and a political discussion began, but was quickly ended when his oldest daughter reminded him that they used to collect food stamps, something I have never done.

            In addition to that, he now enjoys a comfortable retirement due to his union pension, Social Security and Medicare. The perfect hypocritical Conservative, rail against the benefits you enjoy.

            I am glad that you finally recognize that we do agree on some issues. Many of my Democrat/Liberal friends think I am a Republican/Conservative at times. It just goes with the territory of being an Independent. The difference is that they do not disrespect my position when we disagree, but listen openly and try to learn why I believe what I believe.

          • October 10, 2013 at 7:13 pm
            bob says:
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            Wow Ron. So many labels, I’m sorry to say your family has these inconsistency issues often as you do.

            Collecting food stamps doesn’t make you a democrat. The person that said that to your family member at the table was the person in the wrong, your family member who went silent, did not speak volumes in their silence.

            Republicans are for responsible spending. So being on it once, when you needed, fine. Being on it for life: Not fine. Welfare, fine when you need it, not when you live off it. So your family member who was on it was not a hypocrite for being conservative and using food stamps. I’m sure there is more to the story, but if there is you’re going to have to explain how what I said above isn’t the case.

            Moving on: Social security and medicare is something that republicans are against getting out of control. Only the most extreme republicans want those gone in full. Rarely do they ever want that. This again shows the inconsistency when you said that your family member was the typical republican hypocrite for collecting it, and also shows you are not as much of a moderate as you think, and are still extremely gullible from the left. You find your family hypocrites for using what they paid for. What they have a problem for is excess spending. There is an innate difference. Did Romney run on getting rid of medicare? No. But Obama tried to sell that one, and it became the lie of the year this last election from the democrat campaign.

        • October 10, 2013 at 1:24 pm
          Agent says:
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          Bob, I will cut you a little slack since you are from the great state of Washington, one of the most liberal states in the union and the home of the infamous Patty Murray. What does that tell us about politics in the state and what the agenda is?

          • October 10, 2013 at 7:14 pm
            bob says:
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            Agent,

            Patty Murray…I forgot to list her. She’s the worst.

          • October 11, 2013 at 5:30 pm
            Agent says:
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            Wow Ron, Your father in law retired from Ford and he was doing Food Stamps? I always thought they made good money and didn’t need the dole. By the way, Social Security is not an entitlement. He paid into it all his working life and is now getting something back from his contribution. Medicare is also something that employers contribute to. By the way, Medicare premiums are deducted from Social Security payments and I assume he has a Supplemental to pay what Medicare doesn’t. By the way, Ford is the only automaker that wasn’t bailed out and they have done well without it, unlike Government Motors who is still struggling.

          • October 11, 2013 at 5:33 pm
            Agent says:
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            Bob, wasn’t Patty Murray on the committee to study the budget last time and make recommendations to the President to trim etc or do I have it wrong? That committee was doomed from the start since they couldn’t really agree on anything, kind of like Congress is with the President.

        • October 11, 2013 at 2:02 pm
          Agent says:
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          Today, the big rig truckers are coming to town to join the vets. Last month, the bikers went to protest the ill fated million Muslim march that had less than a hundred. I guess they didn’t want to mess with several thousand patriotic bikers. FFA, the worm has turned. We are going to take this country back. We are mad as h – – – and aren’t going to take it anymore.

      • October 10, 2013 at 10:53 am
        Agent says:
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        Hey FFA, How is it going up there in your area? Are you signing up oodles and gobs of people? How about that Healthcare.gov site? Isn’t it wonderful. I saw a report that in Maryland and Minnesota, it will not give a list of network doctors for the state. I wonder how an enrollee is supposed to find out if they can keep their doctor. It is easy to see that the geeks who set up the site didn’t have a clue and this is after Sebelius spent $300+million on it and they had 3 years to get it set up.

        By the way, sorry about your Bears loss. They seem to be a little down right now, but they are too good to stay down. My Cowboys are living up to my 8-8 prediction. Romo looked like a $108 million quarterback for 58 minutes and a minimum wage quarterback in the final two minutes. He has a penchant for throwing interceptions at the worst possible time. He had receivers open all over the field and chose to throw to Witten who had triple coverage. That is the difference between a winning team and a losing team.

        • October 10, 2013 at 1:44 pm
          FFA says:
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          Been a lot of traffic on the web site. A LOT….
          Phone has been ringing more and more every day.
          My Community / Charity event is this week end. Should spike activity. May need to go pluck some more off the unemployment line to get through the initial surge…

          My wife called me not too long ago. Per the WGN news, someone got into health.gov and deleted every ones user pass word. So, yet another marketing hook – an endorsement for local agents…. I have a presentation for a Group coming on 10/15/2013 in front of a charity board that will be distributing info to their clients.

          My Land Lord has 135 people on a group policy. He cut full timers to get under 50. I will be sitting down with him next Tuesday to discuss the what is what with his situation.

          Been getting requests from Wisconsin too. Hired a producer when I was there last week end….

          The Market potential is Hugh!!!!

          • October 10, 2013 at 2:03 pm
            Libby says:
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            Go get ’em, Tiger!

          • October 10, 2013 at 2:45 pm
            FFA says:
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            Due to the poor tech & way this is being implemented, plays right into the Local Agent hook.

            This is gong to be OBamas legacy – the complete and total nightmare of enrolling everyone in such a short time frame. Should have been broken down. Maybe everyone from 55-65 enrolls in Oct, 55-44, November and son on and so on….

            his mistake is seemingly playing into my gain….

            I love it. Someone called me today and asked me about and I quote “The Cease Pool OBama expects us to swim in.” I did 10 minutes of bitchin about what a bum this guy is and set an appointment to close it….

          • October 10, 2013 at 2:54 pm
            FFA says:
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            And Libby, you sound like my former DM from my captive days. Some say your qualified for that position if you can say that with a smile on your face…

          • October 10, 2013 at 2:54 pm
            Agent says:
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            Good for you FFA. I hope everything works out and you can make a living at this since you have had a lot of rough breaks in the past year. What is this I hear about your esteemed Governor trying to make it unlawful for employers to ask if an applicant has ever had a felony conviction? If I were an employer, I think I would have a right to ask if someone had a criminal history before hiring them. Is this true? What do you make of it?

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:11 pm
            FFA says:
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            Not sure agent. I have not been watching the news for about three weeks now. So here would be the break down…
            The Fed Govt don’t really care about peoples job or lives. Ditto with the state. After all,it is Ill Politics in the White House. OBama Care is a mess. Someone got shot in Chicago – another innocent. Weather, take your best guess…
            Then at 10:26pm, I flip on the sports.

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:20 pm
            Libby says:
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            He banned the question on State applications. I guess they were having a hard time finding qualified candidates WITHOUT a felony in Illinois! LOL!

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:22 pm
            Libby says:
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            Here’s the official spiel:

            “applications will now not be tossed aside at first glance due to past mistakes, offering people the chance to fully present their skills and capability.

            One in four work-eligible adults has some type of criminal record, according to the National Employment Law Project, and employers often immediately dismiss their applications when they see “the box” has been checked. African-Americans are most at risk.”

        • October 10, 2013 at 4:06 pm
          FFA says:
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          The injury bug is getting us. Melton – Out for the season. Wooten hurt. Another back up lineman is hurt.

          I really wish I could have watched that agent v libby game. I bet it goes down as the best game of the season. Maybe I’ll catch the rerun on the NFL network in June or something like that. Ive seen Whitten battle 3x coverage before and win that one. So, if your going to throw into 3x coverage, Whitten not a bad option.

          • October 10, 2013 at 4:27 pm
            Libby says:
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            Just so the record is straight:

            Libby 51
            Agent 48

            Touche!

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:08 pm
            Agent says:
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            Congratulations Libby, your team beat an average 2-2 team by 3 and gave up 48 points in the process. Where was that vaunted defense all game? Romo went for over 500 yards passing. Better get it fixed before you play someone good.

            FFA, Romo had receivers open all over the field when he tried to force the ball to his buddy. Demarco Murray was wide open in the middle of the field waving his arms with no one within 15 yards of him. Unfortunately for us, Romo will continue to do the same thing over and over hoping for a different result, kind of like Democrats running the government.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:00 pm
            Libby says:
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            Yeah, well we did that with half our team on injured reserve, buddy. Don’t you worry how they’ll perform against better teams. They’re going to do just fine.

    • October 11, 2013 at 10:40 am
      Agent says:
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      Well wvagt, the numbers are out. In the first week, 51,000 determined healthcare buyers managed to complete an application. I would like to know how many did it on the state exchanges and how many went to the dysfunctional healthcare.gov and got it. Judging from the first week, I don’t think it will improve much since so many people got sticker shock with the premiums, deductibles, out of pocket expenses they saw.

      • October 11, 2013 at 5:37 pm
        Agent says:
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        Yes Libby, you also don’t have Von Miller due to drug suspension. He was the best pass rusher you had until he fell from grace. I guess he liked that legal weed and couldn’t resist temptation.

  • October 4, 2013 at 2:01 pm
    San Fran Nan says:
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    You have to buy the policy to find out what’s in the policy.

    • October 9, 2013 at 2:37 pm
      Agent says:
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      Ron, just because Kimmel is considered a comedy show does not mean the questions asked of the public were not valid. The interviewer asked the question on whether the citizen liked Obamacare or the ACA. They had no clue it was the same bill. It goes to show people have not been paying attention or their IQ is so low, they just liked the inflection of Affordable Care Act and the negatives of Obamacare. They are now finding out it should be called the Unaffordable Care Act. I disagree with your definition of critical thinking. People that can think critically can make up their mind early in the game what is right and what is wrong. They don’t sit around on fences hoping politicians will eventually say something they can hang a hat on. We obviously had a lot of low information voters in the past 2 Presidential Elections. How is that Hope & Change working out for us? It is astounding to me how easy it is to manipulate voters with slogans and not look any further. That is not exactly critical thinking in my view.

      • October 9, 2013 at 3:02 pm
        Ron says:
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        Agent,

        It was not my definition of critical thinking.

        There will always be low IQ, uninformed people voting for all candidates.

        I wonder how many people interviewed knew that they were the same. The problem with comedy shows is that they only show what is funny. If someone said, “They are both the same” they would not put it on the air. Understand?

        Independents DO NOT sit on the fence, we acquire as much information as possible about all candidates, process that information, then make a choice. I know that takes time, effort and intelligence. Just keep voting for the Conservative candidate. It sounds much easier.

        • October 9, 2013 at 3:16 pm
          bob says:
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          Ron,

          No. You guys don’t.

          You’ve proven that one. You look at hot topics in the moment.

          You rarely look up prior history and voting topics to see who should be removed.

          Example: ACA, Stimulus, QE, lower tax rates, lower spending.

          Have you looked at polls regarding independents? They simultaneously agree with the majority of conservative beliefs and vote democrat. How in the world does that make sense?

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:17 pm
            bob says:
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            Currently. I should say over the election cycle since Obama they vote like that.

            One can definitely say independents got it right in 1995 with the republican congress, democrat president at the time.

          • October 9, 2013 at 5:24 pm
            Agent says:
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            I have the answer for you Bob. Independents say they are smart, weigh all the options and remain uncommitted, undecided until right before the election and then their liberal side votes Democrat just about every time. I kind of doubt that many have Conservative beliefs or they wouldn’t vote like they do.

          • October 10, 2013 at 9:23 am
            Libby says:
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            This is an easy one, Bob. You just won’t get it or accept it, but I’ll keep trying. Here goes:

            People “simultaneously agree with the majority of conservative beliefs and vote democrat” because WE JUST DON’T LIKE THE REPUBLICANS THAT ARE REPRESENTING YOUR PARTY. That is a HUGE problem you have.

            I know you have a hard time believing people vote, buy, make decisions, etc. based on their emotions, but they do. Until you get some half-way likeable/reasonable people out front, it will continue.

            Now, feel free to call me names, berate me, and otherwise “knock my teeth out” as you have said you enjoy doing.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:44 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            I only knock your teeth out when you act like a jerk.

            I make a point of saying I will do so, when I get a condescending comment that doesn’t actually have a main point, but rather is just to make me look incredible.

            Moving on: The only real point you made there is that the republican party has a bad image.

            I will repeat: The image is not the republican issue. The democrats took advantage of a crises, and now every time the republicans do their job, (the government shut down, it is the congressional job to pass a budget and it is their choice what it is. Obama can veto it, but it is actually congresses authority, and now that he is threatening a veto on any non clear bill he says that they are holding him hostage. Irony much? It’s their job.). It keep on happening, your side is convincing themselves that we have a bad image. We don’t.

            If you looked at bills that were voted on, like I have shown you, and you didn’t keep trying to find one offers like Palin, Akin, and etc, then you would actually vote well.

            For every Akin, or whoever you list as an extreme republican that you try to state is the republican norm, I can list a Pelosi, Barbara Boxer, Harry Reid, Maria Cantwell, Chris Gregoire, all people who actually are focus heads of the left and their beliefs do in fact reign, and my favorite, Governer locke, who replied to me that higher tuition was absolutely necessary to ensure that we were competitive and that he would do everything necessary to make sure we had as high of tuition as possible.

            You’re wrong about what the republican party is about. Entirely wrong. And that’s not their fault.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:15 pm
            Libby says:
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            By “voting well” I assume you mean Republican? I told you McCain would have had my vote if not for Palin. That is not singling an extremist out to make you look incredible. That’s a fact.

            I knew you would not accept the fact that Republicans have a bad image. I don’t know why I even bothered. Rather than discuss it like an adult, you dismiss it out of hand because you take it as an insult.

            Here is a link to an article that points out, better than I can, what I mean.

            http://www.creators.com/opinion/thomas-sowell/inarticulate-republicans.html

          • October 10, 2013 at 7:31 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            Read that, and it’s an opinion piece that does not go over everything that Boehner said, but rather what the writer knew that he said.

            As I have said many times: Go look up Romney’s 401k plan. Look up Obama’s. It is not that republicans don’t advertise, it’s that liberal media refuses to post it. It took me a full day to find Romney’s plan. It does exist. Guess which sites had it? They were conservative leaning, which is why no one read it.

            Boehner has talked about the government shut down, he has said again and again the same basics as Obama, that the democrats could choose to end this, but he also explained that them not passing a budget was not holding ransom. He explained that they pass the budget each year. The fact is people are refusing to listen to republicans. This does not mean they are responsible for their bad image.

            This is if anything a poor example Libby, and you should realize that. References are small and in between, it full out lies that CBO versus OMB was how they advertised the government shut down, it wasn’t. Look it up. Those are not the only things Republicans talked about. It is a narrow-minded piece, already convinced republicans don’t do their advertising.

            Paul Ryan for about 15 years presented his plan, it wasn’t on TV once until the Romney Ryan ticket. Then they said Ryan didn’t have a credible plan. It’s a about a 15 year old plan! Not credible? Have you read it? It’s a book, a full book of CBO studies, of theory, and how to jump start the economy. Paul Ryan said to go see his plan, and where to see it. When Biden lied on tv about his plan and lied often about what they wanted to do to medicare, Ryan simply said look at my plan, here’s what my plan does, and regardless, my plan is not the same as Romney’s, here’s what the plan does.

            Every time the republican explains you don’t listen, nor does the public, and that is not the fault of republican’s image, it’s the fault of the public. There’s a reason why I call left leaners cowards. They typically have a belief that they are more open minded, it’s common. It is because they are? No. I’ve shown it isn’t. Do they believe that because of republicans? No. Akin is a one off story, and homo-phobes like Santorum are one offs too. So why do they believe it? Easy answer: The democrats hammer it home, and if one party could be considered the progress of it, the other has to by default be the enemy.

            No matter what you show, having been raised in Washington, having seen how people turn liberal, having been liberal growing up, I know why people believe what they do about republicans (it is primarily social issues that keeps people democrat too, which is an interesting one, most democrats do agree economically around here), and you own that lock stock and key, to the letter Libby. It’s your self growth problem as to why you believe republicans are the enemy of women, gays, and blacks. Every time a republican doesn’t vote for a “women’s rights” bill, they get slammed by democrats, and it works. Negative democrat campaigns work. Negative republican ones don’t. The Lilly whatever act that they said Romney was against for example, he wasn’t against it because of women’s rights. It gave you the right to go after a company, even if the person who discriminated against you was no longer there. Retroactive suing as it were. Say I hired my co worker (I did) and I was a jerk (I’m not) and then my boss here after I leave gets sued. It would stick him with my sexual advances as an example. So, Romney not voting for it, anti women. Bam, republicans are anti women. In washington: republicans were against two sections of a bill, those were for good reason. The republicans pointed it out, the democrats just lied and said they were against gays. Now the perception? Republicans are against gays.

            Why do democrats believe republicans are against gays? That battle, which the democrats lied to win, had the media agree with them to win, and never reported why the republicans were against it.

            Have you seen the ads? Couples saying “you don’t have to be against gay marriage to be against this bill. This is about passing a law that works, which our alternative does, please read the bill at this website”. What in the world was bad marketing about that? Answer: Public refused to trust republicans, refused to read the wording. Was that because of republicans, or the democrats who lied? Answer: Democrats.

            I can give more examples, involving the DHT scenario in Oregon, and the flight regulations made by the Ohio Senator. It works the same way every time. Every time the republican defends himself/herself, he’s bad. BAAADDDD. You tell me how they should have done it differently in the gay marriage law here. Can’t? Then be quiet and sit down with the bull argument!

          • October 11, 2013 at 9:12 am
            Libby says:
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            Bob – you had me with your post until the very end. “You tell me how they should have done it differently in the gay marriage law here. Can’t? Then be quiet and sit down with the bull argument!”

            That is why you are not listened to or respected.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:08 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            If you’re willing to let go of all my points, solely because I tell you that you need to stop acting the way you do about your beliefs, (the sit down and be quiet comment means stop throwing a fit about those aspects I just directed) then that’s more of an issue than me telling you to stop doing it.

            But fine.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:50 pm
            Libby says:
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            Bob, I didn’t say I let go all of your points, but I did thumb you down. I still took in what you had to say. I just wish you didn’t find it necessary to s*it all over me at the end of every post.

        • October 9, 2013 at 5:33 pm
          Agent says:
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          This issue is not funny Ron no matter how you try to dismiss it. It is deadly serious and low information voters elected this man twice. What a terrible mistake! The bill is coming due and millions will be waking up soon to realize it. If Independents are so smart, how come they lean liberal and vote liberal? The answer is they are liberal and may as well be Democrats who like to tax and spend their way to prosperity, right? We have a President who thinks we aren’t increasing the debt when we raise the debt limit. Not exactly Econ 101, wouldn’t you agree?

    • October 9, 2013 at 2:39 pm
      jack says:
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      And then when they buy it they will not be able to read it.

      • October 9, 2013 at 5:19 pm
        Agent says:
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        Hey Bob, We needed the Independent vote in 95 to keep Slick Willy and Hillary in check. They thought they could run a bunch of things past the American People including Hillarycare. Hold the phone, not so much. Newt shut them down and forced a government shutdown on government spending until Slick Willy got the message and capitulated and did a Balanced Budget. Clinton didn’t fix the economy. It was fixed for him by Congress. If Clinton had the House and Senate back then, we would have had the same problems we have now with an overreaching, inept, bloated government and taxed to the gourd. Thank God for the Republic with three branches of government who serve as checks and balances to keep out of control Progressives from ruining the country. I must admit that they are still doing a pretty good job of ruining it since many of the go along to get along RINO’s have helped them out.

  • October 4, 2013 at 2:29 pm
    Rusty says:
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    It’s the tip of the iceberg. Just like Nancy Pelosi said “We have to pass the bill to know what’s in it”. Now she might have to say,”You’ll have to enroll in the program to find out its cost”. I cannot imagine a private company selling a product like the government has with this one. And, because there is no incentive to cut costs, the problems will just keep piling up requiring more and more gov’t employees and taxpayer money to address them. It is just another wealth transfer mechanism with lots of room for cost overruns, not to mention fraud.

    • October 4, 2013 at 2:46 pm
      jack says:
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      I saw a stat that said 75% of the people in NC that went to sign up ended up being told they qualified for medicaid. It’s just another way to get people hooked on government handouts. It will bankrupt the system. It was planned to!

      • October 4, 2013 at 4:29 pm
        Agent says:
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        I guess they will have to rush a busload of Navigators to Louisiana because they had 0 enrollees the first day. Those Cajuns just can’t figure out what to do.

      • October 7, 2013 at 10:13 am
        Ron says:
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        Jack,

        Please provide your source. I tried to find something to verify this FACT, but couldn’t.

        I do not need any other commentary, just the source.

        Let’s see if you can follow simple instructions.

        • October 9, 2013 at 2:31 pm
          jack says:
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          instructions- find it yourself

      • October 8, 2013 at 8:04 am
        Ron says:
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        Jack,

        Since you could not provide a source, reasonable people will assume that you just made that up. Way to push your agenda without evidence.

        • October 8, 2013 at 8:25 am
          wvagt says:
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          Ron,
          I’ve seen that stat as well, but I’ll admit that I haven’t been able to find the source again – work prevents me from giving it a lot of time. Regardless, it is out there, and Jack didn’t just make it up.

          • October 8, 2013 at 9:04 am
            Ron says:
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            wvagt,

            Just because a stat is “out there” does not make it true. That is why I prefer to verify the source. There are too many “stats” that are put out out there by those for and against this law. Some are true, some not, and some need context. That is why I prefer to research before making a judgement.

          • October 8, 2013 at 9:44 am
            wvagt says:
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            Ron,
            I admit that I haven’t had time to research the source, because quite frankly it doesn’t seem important enough to pursue. I only commented because you implied that Jack made it up. He didn’t – I saw it, too.

          • October 8, 2013 at 10:59 am
            Ron says:
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            wvagt,

            Fair enough. Point taken.

          • October 9, 2013 at 12:55 pm
            Agent says:
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            Ron, it could also be said that because a stat is on a government website does not make it true. The government is trying to paint a rosy picture about this, but won’t say how many enrolled. They have to know how many hits they had on the website and how many followed through to apply. Perhaps sticker shock is in play now.

          • October 9, 2013 at 1:39 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            I agree with you. That is why I go to multiple sources (Fox, CNN, government sites, etc.) for my information, process that information and use critical thinking to come up with a logical conclusion based on facts and evidence. I do not rely on rhetoric or talking points from any one side of an issue.

            If you took that approach, instead of focusing your attention on Conservative talking points, you might have a better understanding of why I am an Independent and hold both sides accountable.

            And when I make a statement, I provide the source. That is what bothers me the most about the bloggers from the right. They rarely provide a source even when asked. Libby, Captain Planet and myself are the only ones who consistently cite our sources. For someone who claims to have any college degree, let alone Economics, that should be important.

          • October 9, 2013 at 2:31 pm
            jack says:
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            Ron, thanks for the backup.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:25 pm
            bob says:
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            Ron,

            Really? You don’t rely on rhetoric?

            Remind me your opinion on spending, budgets, republicans, and smaller government. What do you think about republicans when it comes to the budget, and trying to get it lower? Now what do you think of democrats? The republicans have been trying since 2010 to get the budget plans the people want. You have not insulted the democrats for blocking that. You have not insulted them for the failed budget committee, which failed based on democrat ideals of increased taxes (which independents consistently do not agree with, and greater than 50% of the population consistently do not agree with). Look up Rasmussen, then look up the percentage of people for lower taxes and lower spending to fix the economy. You have not held the democrats accountable for trying to make a scene of the sequester, which is minimal and is what people want (lower spending) you haven not been angered by the democrats forcing the higher taxes last year, against public opinion, you have not been angered by their trying to state that the republicans have not “negotiated” regarding spending, whereas the democrats struggled to pass a budget even in their majority, or any aspects of their tactics. In fact, I have not seen you once hold democrats accountable. You mainly say “how would this be different with republicans?” or “how is debt different for Obama than Reagan?” or any one of the “it doesn’t matter for democrats because they are all the same” arguments.

            Before you do:

            http://www.politifact.com/ohio/statements/2012/apr/26/john-boehner/john-boehner-says-senate-dems-havent-passed-budget/

            Let’s not forget the democrats absolutely refused to work with the republicans on the budget the entire time since the republicans took majority in congress (the budget deciders).

            But you on many occasions have said how republicans are more extreme with regards to refusing to negotiate. The republicans won a majority because the independents want their tax and budget plans. I should say wanted, because now they are just saying “vote out the incumbents” again.

            Also I should note:

            I do provide sources. And I should also note: Libby and Planet are the ones who have made just about the most inaccurate statements in this site (with the exception of Agent). However, Agent does happen to often have quite a bit right.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:42 pm
            Libby says:
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            “Libby and Planet are the ones who have made just about the most inaccurate statements in this site (with the exception of Agent). However, Agent does happen to often have quite a bit right.”

            Wrong. You don’t agree with me, but I don’t am not inaccurate (except about where bin Laden was killed – which you still bring up 2 years later.) I DO provide sources and will back up any statement I make. Unless it’s just an opinion. And in that case, I’m entitled to mine.

          • October 9, 2013 at 7:31 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            I will ask again:

            Where was Osama Bin Laden found? Inside or outside the “axis of evil”?

            You stated Afghanistan. Afghanistan. Your facts have consistently been off base on matters of Iraq. You didn’t even know what the “axis of evil” was.

            You commented that the “least controversial” sections of the patriot act were re-passed. I then copied and pasted the laws that were re-passed for you to read. They were in fact the most controversial.

            More importantly, you had not read them prior.

            You are the most consistently inaccurate person in this site along with planet.

            Planet once said he was Catholic. Only recently to finally come out that he “was” catholic, and is now Lutheran. Do you remember when he actually talked to me, and when he did he brought up being catholic? I said he was not, called him a liar, and said I could tell he was not an active catholic. Turns out he was lying. I don’t forget things. And I haven’t forgotten about your slip ups.

          • October 10, 2013 at 9:36 am
            Libby says:
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            Bob: I, unlike you, have learned from my mistakes. Both of those things you brought up happened two years ago. That hardly makes me the most inaccurate poster on this blog.

            As far as Captain being a Catholic, I think most Catholics think that once a Catholic, always a Catholic. Whether they practice on not. And what difference does it make to you, anyway?

            And the “axis of evil” is a Dubya term, not an actual place. I don’t believe in axes of evil, as I don’t believe in evil. So take your Bushisms and stick them somewhere within the axis of evil you righties seem to believe exists.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:28 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            It doesn’t matter that you don’t agree with the axis of evil, you didn’t know what it involved because it was stated by Bush W. You don’t tend to research something if it involves something you have a bias against.

            For the Osama incident, it’s the only one you’ve ever admitted to being wrong on, it’s not the only one you’ve been wrong about. I only bring it up for that reason. Also, it was not two years ago.

            Don’t pretend that is a difference, that you admitted you were wrong and I never do. Do you recall recently when I said I would have to see a darn good source for the guy who tried to convince Bush W to lower troops to help his image, after he lambasted the democrats for trying to do the same? I did in fact emphasize when you showed the source link that I just needed to confirm it.

            I do in fact tell people when they are right or wrong.

            Recently I also told Agent that Ron was in fact agreeing with him, and that I thought his point was valid.

            Don’t pretend like I don’t ever agree with people. I don’t agree with democrat politics right now, and I think it isn’t hard to see that it’s a big mistake to support these guys.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:25 pm
            Libby says:
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            Why should I research a Bushism? I knew what he meant by it, but the man’s an idiot. I don’t research idiots.

            And when I said I learned from my mistake, I meant I don’t post without researching now. I learned my lesson and it was a valuable one. Thank you.

            But you have not learned from your mistakes because you continue to make assumptions and put words in people’s mouths. And instead of saying “No I don’t you little punk” why don’t you take an honest look and see if what I, and many others, say has merit.

          • October 14, 2013 at 7:35 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            Do you know why I called him a little punk?

            He labeled the right then claimed he didn’t.

            Then later on do you know what he did?

            Said how he was at the table when his step father was silenced because a lady brought up he was on food stamps once.

            That post also labeled the right, as people against social security and medicare, and hypocrites for collecting food stamps. I accused him of labeling the right when he said to agent that republicans were my way or the high way, and he hated it (more or less) then he backed away like he didn’t say it. It’s not ok to lie and say you never said something, try to say it pretty and nice, and do it for points. It’s childish.

            I’ll say “listen punk” when someone acts like they can hoodwink me. I’m not that easy to hoodwink.

            Also: I don’t make assumptions. Stop making that comment. If I have, list the assumption.

            I call people out, call them wrong, etc, I don’t make assumptions.

            The funniest thing is: Whenever you say I’m making assumptions about you when I say what makes you democrat?

            You have always told me what made you democrat. I’m re listing it, and saying I know what’s important to you, and you’re wrong. It’s not an assumption of who you are, unless you lied about who you are. Now I know the cliche come back of “assuming” is something you throw out a lot because around your liberal friends it wins some points so you don’t get dropped like a rock, but in my world, it doesn’t matter, facts do.

        • October 9, 2013 at 2:29 pm
          jack says:
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          Maybe you should assume i actually had to do some work. The stat’s out there, i don’t post stuff i don’t verify.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:24 pm
            Ron says:
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            Fine, you had work to do. Now, how about the source of that stat? Should be easy since you were able to verify before posting.

          • October 11, 2013 at 5:45 pm
            Agent says:
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            Bob, Ron has an annoying habit of starting off agreeing with your position and then spends the second half disagreeing with you. That is why he leads the league in thumbs down. If he is going to agree with my position, then agree with it instead of starting down the same tired road of why Independents are so smart. If they were so smart, they would have made up their minds by now.

  • October 4, 2013 at 3:47 pm
    jimmy says:
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    Disingenuous to call it demand when you are fined for not having insurance.

    • October 9, 2013 at 2:14 pm
      Agent says:
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      Ron, if you are going to CNN, you are getting the liberal talking points only. If you go to Fox, you get a sprinkling of both sides. Sometimes I can’t stand some of the liberals they parade around in their quest to be fair and balanced. Sometimes it comes down to a liberal screaming their agenda when they hear the Conservative side of an issue. Kind of like Libby does when she is wrong on an issue. She resorts to name calling and it has happened dozens of times on this blog. If you leaned a little more Conservative than Liberal, we could agree on more on what is wrong with the Progressive scheme and what needs to be done about it.

      • October 9, 2013 at 2:35 pm
        jack says:
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        Amen to libby not proving her point, just calling names.

        • October 9, 2013 at 2:47 pm
          Libby says:
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          You, sir, have no room to talk. “Half breed socialist pig” ring a bell? How about, “homos” or “Obuma”? You’re the last person to be throwing stones about name-calling.

      • October 9, 2013 at 2:58 pm
        Libby says:
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        Agent – I can prove a point AND call you a name all at the same time. Cause I’m a woman, W-O-M-A-N. I’ll say it again. I can bring home the bacon. Fry it up in a pan. And never, ever let you forget you’re a jerk.

        • October 9, 2013 at 6:24 pm
          Agent says:
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          God help your husband if you are actually married. How many times have you been divorced now, 2 or 3?

          • October 10, 2013 at 9:38 am
            Libby says:
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            Divorced? Once, as if it’s any of your business. God help your wife. If you even have one, she must be dumb as dirt.

          • October 10, 2013 at 11:10 am
            Agent says:
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            So Libby, one guy couldn’t take any more of you and you are working on the second one? Is he as radical as you are? I have the original model and she is as Conservative as I am. By the way, she has an accounting degree and knows a debit from a credit which you have no clue what those are. She is extremely well read and we have an extensive library so I don’t think your insult will hold any water with her.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:19 pm
            Libby says:
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            Why do you assume my ex-husband got rid of me and not the other way around?

            My current husband is a registered Republican and has been all his life. We have conversations where I sometimes agree with his point and he mine. That’s what relationships are all about. Not marrying a mini-me.

            Your wife is probably a closet liberal but is too afraid of you to admit it. Are you the bossman from hell at home, too? LOL!

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:33 pm
            jw says:
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            Seriously, Agent? That’s all ya got?

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:37 pm
            Captain Planet says:
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            The “original model”? WTF does that mean? Objectify women much?

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:16 pm
            FFA says:
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            Yes Planet, I do… Women are objects of beauty. It all starts with a physical attraction.
            Would you even have talked to your wife the very first time if you considered her to be ugly???? Would she have talked to you if you looked like a bowser??

            NO. It all starts with a physical attraction.

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:26 pm
            Libby says:
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            FFA – objectification has nothing to do with attraction.

            Objectification means treating a person as a thing, without regard to their dignity; as if interchangeable;
            as if permissible to damage or destroy; as if there is no need for concern for their feelings and experiences.

            Like keeping a binder full of women on your desk…

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:48 pm
            FFA says:
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            well Libby, guess I should have pulled put one of my dictionaries…

            Again, don’t take too much of what I say to heart today.

          • October 10, 2013 at 4:28 pm
            Libby says:
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            I won’t. And I doubt your ancient dictionaries have that definition. LOL!

          • October 10, 2013 at 4:37 pm
            FFA says:
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            Actually Libby, even the 1938 Dictionary does. I’m surprised….

          • October 10, 2013 at 5:00 pm
            Libby says:
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            Me, too. But I guess I shouldn’t be.

          • October 10, 2013 at 5:04 pm
            Captain Planet says:
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            They are not objects at all. They are people and possess inner-beauty. Physical beauty will eventually go away. It’s the inner beauty I look for because that sticks. I’ve been burned before by physical beauty. Ugly from the inside hurts worse from my personal experience. I don’t look at women as “models” or “types”, I guess. I just look at them as human. Too progressive of an idea for you?

          • October 10, 2013 at 5:12 pm
            FFA says:
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            Been stung by the beauties before myself… My wife was smoking hot when we married. She been sick for three years now and yes, I take care of her as best I can. Sometimes she just lies there crying in pain and there aint nothing I can do. I have to leave the room. The meds have put no less then 60 lbs on her. So, I may look & Guak, but I always go home at night to her… Only her…

          • October 10, 2013 at 10:33 pm
            Captain Planet says:
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            FFA, quite literally with that kind of dedication, you ‘da man! Kudos to you, brother. I don’t know you at all, but will keep her in my prayers.

            Watching the Bears beat up on the Giants right now. I realize New York is 0-5, but Cutler and Chicago look good. My dad raised me a Packer fan (I know, I know, a Cubs, Bulls, Blackhawks and…Packer fan). But, I can compliment good football when I see it. Jay is making good decisions with the ball tonight.

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:21 pm
            Agent says:
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            Sorry Planet that you couldn’t absorb my comment about my wife and the reference to my “original model”. I realize now that a pea sized brain like yours has to have it spelled out literally or you totally misinterpret what I say. Apparently liberals and conservatives speak a different language, especially when they are from different parts of the country. You have your dialect and I have mine. At least I don’t post “Ding, Ding, Ding, Ding” or “Snap”. Were you one of the lucky 5 that got your app processed in Iowa?

      • October 9, 2013 at 3:08 pm
        Ron says:
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        Agent,

        I think we do agree on more than we disagree. You are just too closed-minded to realize it. As I said before, you are quick to label anyone not 100% Conservative a Liberal, Progressive, RINO, Socialist, etc. That is your problem.

        Please list all of the things you would like me to do to stop the Progressive scheme.

        • October 9, 2013 at 3:27 pm
          bob says:
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          Vote against Obama.

          Vote republican to get the aspects you want taken care of.

          Vote democrat after they are taken care of. That’s what.

          • October 9, 2013 at 3:44 pm
            Libby says:
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            Bob – When, and for whom, have you ever voted Democrat?

          • October 9, 2013 at 4:16 pm
            Ron says:
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            OK Bob, I will be sure to vote against President Obama in 2016.

            Agent,

            That is sarcasm so do not correct me that he will not be eligible for re-election in 2016.

          • October 9, 2013 at 7:33 pm
            bob says:
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            Vote against Obama is past what you should have done.

            Vote republican now, to get rid of the ACA and make sure these debt debacles don’t keep happening, and we actually do cut the debt.

            The after, would be the next term after ACA is removed.

            Then in the future, pay attention.

          • October 9, 2013 at 7:39 pm
            bob says:
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            Oh please, when have you ever voted republican?

            My state doesn’t need a republican. I’ve lived in Washington my entire life. Maria Cantwell, Chris Gregoire, and the democrat league here I will consistently vote against. They have to go. I have to be careful saying who, but a certain person here basically went in to a business meeting, and said he would destroy every single business in that room if they didn’t support his campaign, and he could do it as long as he went to the people saying he was a democrat. I will not be more specific, because this event is something my boss is still terrified to even say what industry it was told to. I’ve talked about the building code here favoring Comcast. I want Frontier or Century link. The democrats in the snohomish county did that, and I will continue to vote against them. That’s voting on policy. Want me to list the bill that did it?

            In your state did you vote against Harry Reid? Ever? Once? Don’t talk to me about being polarized, your head is so far up the left I can’t even believe it.

            As for presidents: I did not vote Dole. I did not vote Mc Cain (skipped that year) That’s about all you need to know.

          • October 10, 2013 at 9:42 am
            Libby says:
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            I’ve voted Republican many times. As a matter of fact, I voted for Reagan. And it sounds like the Democrats in Snohomish County have turned you against Democrats. Your head is so far up the right I can’t even believe it.

          • October 10, 2013 at 9:43 am
            Libby says:
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            And McCain would have had my vote if he hadn’t chosen that sh*t for brains running mate.

          • October 10, 2013 at 12:36 pm
            bob says:
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            Ok fair enough. I’ll accept the insulting part of that because I was also mean to you. Fine.

            If you voted for Reagan, how could you possibly hate the guy?

            And you would have voted for McCain if it weren’t for Palin?

            Are you aware how inexperienced Obama was as a senator at the time of his winning election. Obama was the inexperienced, Biden made up for it. McCain was the experienced, and Palin was the inexperienced. Better to have an experienced president ticket than an experienced vice.

            Rather than who we voted for, what about what other side would you vote again for, or vote for in light of historical events?

            Because here’s something that I hinted at with Ron, though did not say direct:

            I didn’t vote McCain because I felt a left shift was needed. I would vote Obama his first term. My reasoning would be for the reasoning I told Ron that I would vote republican the second term: Obama passed the ACA, and that forces republicans when they repeal it to pass an alternative, but not necessarily their 2009 alternative. It would probably force them to pass either a public option, or a subsidy along side it. For that reason, I would be OK with Obama’s first term and the republicans getting thrown off of their belief they were on the right course.

            The second term I would stick with Romney and republican congress.

            For 1992 – 2000 I would vote for Clinton, just so that republicans would not cut too much.

            If the presidency had flipped to Romney in 2012 I probably would have voted Hillary in 2016.

            Does this tell a little bit about me yet?

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:34 pm
            Libby says:
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            Although McCain had the experience, his age was a big factor in my decision. I wasn’t sure he could hold up under the pressure of being president and we’d be stuck with sh*t for brains. That’s why I voted Obama.

            And although I am for some type of healthcare for all, I am changing my mind about Obamacare. (Don’t tell Agent.) I CAN be reasonable when given the chance.

            If the Republicans can come up with a decent candidate in 2016 I will certainly give them consideration. But if things go the way I hope, Hillary will get my vote. She should have been in there in 2008.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:36 pm
            Libby says:
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            And I don’t hate Reagan. Just Bush Dubya.

          • October 10, 2013 at 1:37 pm
            Libby says:
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            Oh. And the axis of evil? Karl Rove + Dick Cheney + Dubya = Axis of Evil.

          • October 10, 2013 at 7:42 pm
            bob says:
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            Libby,

            I agree on most everything you just said. I would have voted Hillary in 2008.

            I know I’ve seen you imply that Reaganomics caused wealth disparity though, and implied the corporate dominance was based on him and deregulation.

            I did find your axis of evil comment quite a zinger and I admit I laughed.

            As a side comment: I wouldn’t have voted McCain regardless… I’m more frustrated that people stuck with Obama then I am that they voted for him the first time.

        • October 11, 2013 at 10:34 am
          Agent says:
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          FFA, you and I have similar life stories. My wife has had 5 major back fusion surgeries, almost died of a massive embalism after the last one and is still in so much pain that she lives on pain killers. We can’t travel because of it, but we do the best we can. We do take our nuptials seriously and “in sickness and in health” means something. She would take care of me if I were in the same position. Hang in their bud.

        • October 11, 2013 at 5:50 pm
          Agent says:
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          100% Conservative is a good thing Ron. 100% Progressive is a bad thing. Try Conservatism some time. You may end up liking what you see. Time for a real change of direction in this country. What we have now is a joke, but no one is laughing.

  • October 7, 2013 at 8:03 pm
    mikey says:
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    I assumed Republicans because they did not like the term Obamacare. If it were a Liberal, wouldn’t they love that term? I’m Republican btw, I just don’t always watch or read with blinders on. Both parties can be stupid.

    • October 10, 2013 at 4:54 pm
      Agent says:
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      Libby, I had to hold my nose to vote for McCain, but he was the lesser of two evils. He is a RINO personified along with his running mate Lindsey Graham. Tell me. There is a movement to encourage Dr. Ben Carson to run in 2016. As you know, he has been a brilliant Neurosurgeon at John Hopkins for the past 30 years or so. Maybe we need his no nonsense approach as a leader. He is conservative fiscally and he knows healthcare as well. Does he have your vote if he runs or are you going to stick with the modern Progressive Hillary?

      • October 10, 2013 at 4:58 pm
        Libby says:
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        I don’t know enough about Ben Carson to make that decision at the moment. I’m open to all comers, but yes, I do like Hillary. She’s got tons of experience in Washington, she’s a woman, and she’s smart as hell and tough as nails. I think that’s a terrific combination.

        • October 11, 2013 at 10:18 am
          Agent says:
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          You should Google Dr Carson sometime or better still, rent the movie – “Gifted Hands” to see his background. He succeeded in life coming from the ghettos of Detroit of all places. To use your words, he is smart as hell and tough and is not a career politician or a modern Progressive. Just what the doctor ordered to straighten out this mess we have.

          • October 11, 2013 at 10:59 am
            Libby says:
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            If he becomes a viable candidate, I will do my due diligence in researching him. It’s a little premature for me to do it now. It’s not like I can vote in your primary…

      • October 11, 2013 at 8:18 am
        Ron says:
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        Agent,

        I am not exactly sure how being a neurosurgeon for 30 years qualifies someone for President. So, now experience is not important because he is a Conservative? What are his other credentials to hold the highest public office? Please do not tell me how inexperienced President Obama was before being elected, sell me on Dr. Carson. I read his biography and see no political experience.

        A flat tax sounds great in theory and the ultimate in tax fairness, but there are some unintende consequences that need to be addressed first:

        1. It would create greater disparity between upper classes and lower classes by lower the tax rate of the rich and increasing the taxes on the middle to lower classes.

        2. That will then adversely affect the economy because the savers would be paying less in taxes and spenders would be paying more.

        3. It will adversely affect unemployment becasue we would need far less IRS employees, accountants, tax attorneys, and return preparers. Where are those people going to find jobs commensurate with their current salaries in order to maintain their homes and at least a similar lifestyle that supports the economy?

        I would be really interested to see how effective Dr. Carson would be as President if the Democrats controlled at least one house of Congress and had the same approach as the Republicans have had toward President Obama. Would he just start issuing Executive Orders to circumvent Congress? Would he stand his ground for Conservative principals and call the Democrats obstructionists? Would the Democrats be called racists for trying to stop his agenda?

        However, the reality is that if the Republicans nominate Dr. Carson as their candidate he will have a less than 10% chance of winning. That is without even knowing the Democratic candidate. You could write a 50 page thesis on why Dr. Carson would be the best candidate, and you may be right, but that is not the type of candidate for whom a majority of Americans will vote. You probably will not like that assessment, but that does not make it less true.

        • October 11, 2013 at 10:13 am
          Agent says:
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          Ron, how does being a leftist community organizer qualify to be President? How about no business experience or just voting present as a State Senator with no legislative accomplishments? How could this country have done worse than what they got? Wouldn’t it be better if all adult citizens paid some tax rather than 50% not paying any taxes at all? Wouldn’t it be better to eliminate all the loopholes the rich take advantage of to pay little tax? Wouldn’t you rather the guy making $10 million per year pay $1.5 million in taxes rather than $50,000? Wouldn’t it be better to have a much smaller IRS given their recent history or did that go right by your undecided brain? You must really be concerned that he just might have a message that would resonate with voters to throw out your objections before he even decides to run. Dr. Carson has more integrity in his little finger than all the politicians in Washington. Guess what Ron, the American people are very angry right now and they have had it with the current government and its agenda. It is time for a real change back in the “right” direction.

          • October 11, 2013 at 11:00 am
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            Do you think being insulting in your comments will make me want to be more Conservative?

            Did you miss the part in my post when I stated, “Please do not tell me how inexperienced President Obama was before being elected, sell me on Dr. Carson. I read his biography and see no political experience.”? You provided nothing to convince me that he should even be considered. Does he have a plan to gain some experience before running in 2016?

            Why is his inexperience OK with you? Because he is a Conservative? How about international diplomacy experience? How about experience handling non-medical crises? How about experience running a business? The President does far more than just work on the tax code and health care, which can only be changed through legislation.

            you did not answer these 2 questions i the event Democrats have power to obstruct as the Republicans have President Obama:
            1. Would he just start issuing Executive Orders to circumvent Congress?
            2.Would he stand his ground for Conservative principals and call the Democrats obstructionists?

            I already exlained in my post why I object to the flat tax. I fall in the 50% that pays no federal income tax because I have 3 children, a mortgage, student loans, pay state taxes, and donate to charity. If you eliminate those deductions so I pay federal income tax, then fine. I have no problem with that. Just understand that I live paycheck-to-paycheck, like nearly all of the 50%, and the money that had been going into the private sector will now go to the government. Is that what you want? What will that do to the economy?

            I have no problem reducing the IRS. Just understand that those people have homes, pay bills, raise families and put money into the economy. If they lose their jobs, where are they going to go work to continue to put money into the economy? That was my point.

            How about we eliminate all deductions and loopholes for anyone making over acertian amoun, say $1 million per year, and let the 50% keep putting money into the economy.

            You said, “Guess what Ron, the American people are very angry right now and they have had it with the current government and its agenda. It is time for a real change back in the “right” direction.” Weren’t people angry in 2012, yet they re-elected 90% of the incumbents who ran. What does that tell you? It tells me that Republicans, Conservatives, Liberals and Democrats are more concerned with voting the party line than for the best candidate or to vote someone out to send a clear message.

          • October 11, 2013 at 11:10 am
            Libby says:
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            While I agree with alot of what you said here, I have to thumb you down because you answered Ron’s question with the exact question he asked you not to use. If Obama’s lack of experience is the biggest reason he is not qualified to be President, why is that not the biggest reason why Dr. Carson should not be President?

            Do you not see how, if not hypocritical, then downright wishy-washy that sounds?

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:39 pm
            Agent says:
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            Ron, I’m sorry. I didn’t know you were part of the 50% of the working poor who pay no Federal Tax. I belong to the 50% that does pay a healthy tax every quarter and then see it wasted by our dysfunctional monstrous government. Don’t argue with me about how wonderful our government is. They have already admitted they have 880,000 non essential workers which were temporarily furloughed. Why do we need 880,000 non essential workers to regulate our lives even more?

            Tell me please what qualifications the current President had when elected other than a way with words and a slogan. No fiscal smarts, no foreign diplomacy smarts. Just an agenda and you Independents fell for it hook, line and sinker. Just look what you voted for man. Wake up from your slumber. You are like Rip Van Winkle snoozing right through this debacle.

            Even Libby is willing to give Dr. Carson a chance to develop his message and you are tearing him down without him even announcing a run. Wasn’t it nice for Obama to sic the IRS on him after Carson’s remarks at the prayer breakfast? Had you seen the speech, Carson did not directly criticize Obama, but did say the government was broken and needed to be fixed. One could see the smoke coming out of Obama’s ears. He is one vindictive dude and Narcissists cannot stand any criticism.

      • October 11, 2013 at 10:26 am
        Agent says:
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        Libby, since you keep ragging on Sarah as McCain’s running mate and says she hasn’t got any brains, how about Biden? His IQ hovers somewhere around 50 most of the time. I shutter when I think he is a heartbeat away from the Presidency. He is so stupid, he asked a Paraplegic in a wheel chair to stand and take a bow at a speech he was giving. That’s Joe being Joe. What an embarrassment he has been for 5 years. They have to hide him out most of the time to keep him from making a complete fool of himself. Notice that he isn’t in on the debt ceiling negotiations?

        • October 11, 2013 at 11:13 am
          Libby says:
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          Say what you will about Biden, but his IQ far outranks SFB Sarah. Plus I like his no nonsense, no bullshit, attitude and have for many, many years.

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:41 pm
            Agent says:
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            And your IQ is right in line with his.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:04 pm
            Libby says:
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            My IQ is 125. I think Joe’s is probably higher.

  • October 8, 2013 at 2:51 pm
    jw says:
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    This is actually a little entertaining. Kentucky, almost the bottom of the pile in education, has a functioning enrollment portal. Well. Color me impressed.

    http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-10-08/what-kentuckys-obamacare-success-might-mean-in-2014

    • October 8, 2013 at 3:56 pm
      wvagt says:
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      Perhaps the claimed success of Kentucky’s enrollment portal is directly related to your statement that Kentucky is at or near the “bottom of the pile” when it comes to education.

      • October 8, 2013 at 4:19 pm
        Libby says:
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        What does that mean?

        • October 9, 2013 at 1:38 pm
          that's right I said it! says:
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          Exactly Libby! What DOES that mean? Pot meet Kettle. If WVAgent means what I think. Hmmmm… I remember when WV was the go-to state reference for illustration of red-necks, hay-seeds, the “edu-ma-cationally challenged” et cetera.. It cannot mean Well Versed… based on some evidence I’ve seen.

          • October 9, 2013 at 2:45 pm
            jack says:
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            It means low educated people will be more inclined to try to sign up for ombumacareless and find out they qualify for medicaid or a big fat subsidized premium. It’s just another entitlement program to redistribute income and bankrupt the nation.

          • October 9, 2013 at 2:48 pm
            Libby says:
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            You should know all about “low-educated” (aka uneducated) people coming from South Carolina. LOL!!

      • October 9, 2013 at 8:54 am
        jw says:
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        Huh? Are you trying to say “claimed” as in not true?

      • October 10, 2013 at 8:02 am
        jw says:
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        It appears EVERYONE missed my point.

        Hello? My point was strictly about the fact the online portal WORKS.

        That’s it.

        • October 10, 2013 at 9:44 am
          Libby says:
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          Don’t worry, jw. I got your point. Everyone else is too busy trying to take pot shots to pay attention.

          • October 10, 2013 at 11:17 am
            jw says:
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            Oh. Okay. Any time anything works here, I’m surprised. Sad, I know.

  • October 10, 2013 at 1:56 pm
    FFA says:
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    HMMMMM. Maybe odumber should bring in the folks from KY to do the fed…

    • October 10, 2013 at 2:15 pm
      Libby says:
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      Odumber? Really FFA? I’m disappointed in you.

      • October 10, 2013 at 2:52 pm
        FFA says:
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        I’m off my game today.
        My Community event starts tomorrow and I have a new location, new employees, new neighbors. Last year had over 2000 visitors at the booth. Just want it to go with out a hitch. I can see the city folks across the street. They don’t like me too much.

        This is a big week end for us.

      • October 10, 2013 at 3:20 pm
        Agent says:
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        Better watch out FFA or Libby will call you a nasty name. I am used to it. We call him Obummer here.

        • October 10, 2013 at 3:28 pm
          Libby says:
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          I would never call FFA a nasty name. He, unlike you, treats me with respect.

          • October 10, 2013 at 3:30 pm
            Agent says:
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            The only way you will get my respect is to back off your Progressive agenda. Stick to P&C issues and I might agree with you.

          • October 10, 2013 at 4:33 pm
            Libby says:
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            Agent – I don’t have a Progressive agenda. That’s you putting words in my mouth and labeling me. I’m sure most of my agenda is in line with yours, except for pro-choice, gay marriage, womens rights, and other topics you use to label me Progressive.

            I also said I am beginning to change my mind about Obamacare (NOT universal healthcare, though) but you must have missed that one. I am not happy with the job Obama has done, but I’m not happy with the entire Congress either. They all suck and need to be fired.

            We need to get a budget done and start addressing our debt. We need to streamline the tax code and close the loopholes. We need to take a close look at where our money goes and tighten our collective belt. We need to address fraud in all entitlement (Republican word) programs. We need to stop Corporate welfare. We need to build back the middle class that has eroded away during the last 20 to 40 years.

            Is any of that close to your agenda???

          • October 10, 2013 at 4:55 pm
            Libby says:
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            Jeez, Agent. Why’d you thumb me down on that?

          • October 10, 2013 at 10:24 pm
            Captain Planet says:
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            He thumbs you down because you are Libby. He thumbs me down because I am Captain Planet. He’d rather see our comments go away. Or, in other words, he’d rather not see our comments.

    • October 10, 2013 at 3:46 pm
      Agent says:
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      Hey FFA, I have the quote of the decade for you.

      “The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the US Government cannot pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that, “the buck stops here”. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.”

      Barack H. Obama, March 2006

      It is too bad he didn’t believe his own speech. $6 Trillion in new debt in 4 years, kicking the can down the road and not reigning in spending, living on continuing resolutions instead of getting the fiscal policy right will tend to undermine a Presidency.

      • October 10, 2013 at 4:46 pm
        Agent says:
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        Hey Libby, maybe I can hit on one post that you may agree with me on. How about we fire all the politicians in Washington? They have a current approval rating of 8%. This could be like Colorado where they have recalled two state Senators already for being too radical and trying to take their guns. They are now going after another one, Evie Hudak and she will be toast in the next recall election. If successful, the balance of power in the state Senate there will swing to the Republicans and they can reign in and stop their radical governor from doing anymore damage. Does that meet with your approval?

        • October 10, 2013 at 4:54 pm
          Libby says:
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          Yes. I’ve already said it over and over and over. They’re all getting fired by me come election day.

          And I’ve also said that democracy worked the way it’s supposed to work in Colorado. If those constituents didn’t think their elected officials were representing their interests, they have every right to recall them. While I may not agree on the issue at hand (gun control), I have no problem with how that worked out.

          • October 10, 2013 at 6:07 pm
            Agent says:
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            Libby, I liked what you said for a change. I think it has been a couple of months now and several hundred posts. The only thing I disagree with is that the United States of America is not a Democracy. It is a Constitutional Republic with three separate but equal branches of government, even in states. If we just had a Democracy, there would be total anarchy and all the unwashed in society would dictate how the country was run. As bad as our politicians are, they do tend to check and balance each other over time.

          • October 11, 2013 at 9:33 am
            Libby says:
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            I understand we are a Republic, but it was democracy (majority rule) that recalled those elected officials. And it worked the way it is supposed to work. I don’t need a Civics lesson.

          • October 11, 2013 at 1:52 pm
            Agent says:
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            Your home state has awakened Libby. It is a beautiful state I have visited several times and I have friends that live there. They have been appalled at the scum that got elected and now they are doing something about it. Perhaps the purple will be gone and replaced by red in the next few years.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:08 pm
            Libby says:
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            It is a beautiful state, but I think scum is a pretty harsh description. Those were good folks with good intentions. Unfortunately, they didn’t line up with their constituents values. Why do you have to hurl insults when someone disagrees with one idea you hold dear? You don’t know a thing about those people.

      • October 10, 2013 at 4:47 pm
        Libby says:
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        Agent – While I agree we have a huge amount of debt, increasing or not increasing the debt ceiling does not change that fact.

        “No matter how much you object to a level of indebtedness or the way in which money is being spent or allocated, the debt ceiling is not a mechanism that reverses deficit trajectories or resets spending priorities. It’s a simple affirmation of the fact that Congress has obligations it is compelled to honor, or risk default.

        Now contemporary critics of Obama point to this speech as an example of hypocrisy, a charge that might stick if they weren’t all rushing to take the position that Obama took in 2006!

        When you permit stupid ideas to go out into the world without putting a check on them, one of the natural consequences is that stupidity gets legitimized. Obama’s in the rather unique position to rue the day he indulged himself in this tradition, and the rest of us are in the unique position to know better the next time anyone else tries to participate in it. It’s all fun and games until you shoot your own eye out.”

        I liked this article.

        http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/10/obama-debt-ceiling_n_4079604.html

        • October 11, 2013 at 9:54 am
          Agent says:
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          Libby’s favorite website, one of the chief apologists for this regime. Even they think Obama was stupid to utter those famous words. Now, it is coming back to bite him in the butt. Talk about hypocrisy! Yes, no matter how you spin this debt limit and the obligations of the government to pay their bills, they are spending a trillion more than they are taking in and the debt keeps rising as a result. Time for the 888,000 non essential federal workers to go along with all incumbents in the next election. America is mad as h – – – and we aren’t going to take it anymore.

          • October 11, 2013 at 10:00 am
            Libby says:
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            I knew you would attack the source. Did you even look at the article?

            And hypocrisy is the right now doing what you are criticizing Obama about – not voting on an increase to the debt ceiling. At least his vote was symbolic at best, as there was no way the increase was not going to go through back then.

            Your position will cause terrible damage to an already damaged nation. Shame on you.

        • October 11, 2013 at 9:59 am
          Agent says:
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          Thank God we have a mechanism to recall or defeat bad politicians who try to impose their will on the people for an agenda. The mid terms will be interesting next time. The incumbents should start making other plans and that goes for both parties in states and at the Federal level. It should be an interesting day in DC today. The big rig truckers are descending on it and the vets keep coming. They have had it with this government which has gone way too far.

      • October 11, 2013 at 2:45 pm
        Agent says:
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        Libby, I am going to hold you to your statements and if I don’t, I know Bob will. In light of the many failures of the Federal Government and these fiacos coming out almost daily, why would you turn your Healthcare over to them? Do you really think Big Brother will look out for you and treat you fairly? Wake up and smell the coffee.

        • October 11, 2013 at 4:22 pm
          Libby says:
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          What statements are you holding me to? Just so I know you actually understand them.

          • October 11, 2013 at 5:58 pm
            Agent says:
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            You said you were having reservations about Obamacare, but still favored the public option. See, I can read and I will hold you to them.

          • October 14, 2013 at 10:35 am
            Libby says:
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            You are correct. I do favor a public option.

  • October 10, 2013 at 3:58 pm
    FFA says:
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    Well agent, he is a politician from… well you know where.

    • October 10, 2013 at 4:39 pm
      Agent says:
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      Yes, I know where he is from, the land of Lincoln. Apparently, Lincoln the Republican did not rub off on the community organizer in chief. If you have noticed some of the nasty posts done by Libby recently, she thinks I am wrong 8 out of 10 times because I champion the Conservative cause. If I am, she is wrong 99 times out of 100.

      • October 10, 2013 at 4:51 pm
        Libby says:
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        My posts aren’t nasty, Agent. It’s true. I have caught you spewing so much misinformation, old wives tales, urban legends, and downright fibs it’s unbelievable.

        And the funny thing is when I do, you immediately go silent. I guess you think if you ignore me, then it didn’t happen. But it did. And it does. And it will continue. That’s why I fact check everything you post and will call you out every time.

        And yes, I have been wrong. Plenty of times. And when I am, I fess up. You have yet to do this. Once.

        • October 10, 2013 at 5:25 pm
          Agent says:
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          Fact check this Libby! Go on Newsmax.com and today’s edition has an interesting story on why Healthcare.gov does not work and the astronomical cost to the taxpayer for this piece of trash website. It has plenty of facts for you and interviews with software designers and their analysis of the problem. I did have the estimate of the cost wrong. It started out estimated to cost $93 million and now it is up to $634 million with no end in sight. Silly me, I had seen in prior months the cost of $300+ million. It is likely to cost over a billion after several more months of debugging it. I wonder if the government will still tax the citizens if they can’t apply due to delays in the application process.

      • October 10, 2013 at 5:01 pm
        FFA says:
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        Agent says: “the land of Lincoln”. that’s old school We are now know as the Land of Corruption.

        • October 11, 2013 at 9:45 am
          Agent says:
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          Congrats to your Bears FFA. It is nice to have a semi easy game with the hapless Giants. Poor Eli seems to have lost his Mojo and throwing stupid interceptions at the wrong time.

      • October 11, 2013 at 9:40 am
        Ron says:
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        Agent,

        Libby actually said you are wrong 9 times out of 10. It was Bob who said you are wrong 8 out of 10 times.

        You are not wrong because you champion the Conservative cause, you are wrong because you are wrong. Either that or the whole Conservative cause is wrong.

        • October 11, 2013 at 9:48 am
          Agent says:
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          Ron, I may be a champion of the Conservative Cause, but I am not a fence sitting, undecided Independent who has to consult with a website to know what to think and to use common sense to determine what is right and wrong in our country. The Conservative cause is not what is wrong with this country, but creepy Progressive Socialism is the culprit and the evidence mounts daily, but you are too stupid to realize it.

          • October 11, 2013 at 9:55 am
            Libby says:
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            You’re wrong because you get your information from Newsmax, and they lie. And you believe them. Shame on you. A quick google search is all you need to debunk their bunk. But you can’t be bothered. You are the laziest bossman I’ve ever seen.

          • October 11, 2013 at 10:32 am
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            You call me stupid, yet you do not know the difference between an undecided and Independent, cannot support statements that should be verifiable with data, and even Bob said you’re wrong 8 out of 10 times.

            I do not need to consult any websites, but I do need verifiable facts to make a decision. Unlike some people, I do not rely on rhetoric and talking points that cannot be supported by facts.

            I never said the the Conservative casue is what is wrong with this country, only that Conservatives tend to be inaccurate with their facts or they cannot support them with evidence outsides of their own eyes and common sense.

            I will be interested to hear you sell Dr. Carson as a Presidential candidate based on his experience outside of being a neurosurgeon and that he is a Conservative.

        • October 11, 2013 at 1:45 pm
          Agent says:
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          Ron, and Independents can’t seem to figure out who is right and who is wrong so they continue to sit on the fence, remain undecided, keep researching, don’t use common sense, don’t see the fallacy of Progressive Socialism and all its failures. I don’t see that as a mark of intelligence. By not condemning Progressive policies, I think you actually must agree with them and that is why Independents keep voting for leftists. Why not give Conservatism a shot? Could they possibly do worse? I think not.

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:48 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            Why are you so against Independents. Is it because when actual thought and research goes into choosing a candidate, Conservative end up at the bottom of the list? Just so you know, Liberals don’t like Independents either because their are also too extreme.

            Please list all of the means of production that the government has taken over or now owns since president Obama has made us Socilaists.

  • October 10, 2013 at 4:16 pm
    FFA says:
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    This just in from Humana, the dumb asses changed the way the certificate looks. They wont accept the “old” form so I have to go in, reprint then new form and send that into the carriers because the FFM web site wont recognize the old form. I go in and do this in August, get it done and think all is well. But, thanks to someone in the govt changing their mind on how its supposed to look, I have to do it AGAIN…..

    Seems like the only qualification for the programmers was to be a Community College Droop Out..

    • October 11, 2013 at 10:53 am
      Agent says:
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      Ron, you are amazing. Almost every pundit when they are discussing politics and candidates say how important it is to win the undecided Independent vote if they want to win. You should pay more attention instead of poring over your websites to get your talking points. We will see how Dr. Carson rises in the coming months or even if he decides to run. The thing that I like is that he is very eloquent, needs no teleprompter to read from and actually has common sense which is in such short supply on the national scene. He also believes in Conservatism instead of the failed Progressive philosophy. That should be worth taking a look at.

      • October 11, 2013 at 11:45 am
        Libby says:
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        Agent – Stupid = having your mind made up before you even hear the question. That is what straight party-line voters do. NOT independents. They are undecided because they are weighing all options before making an INFORMED decision. You are the one that is showing your stupidity here by trying to portray undecided independents as “fence-sitters” or “uninformed”. They are neither of those things. They are the more intelligent ones.

        • October 11, 2013 at 1:39 pm
          Agent says:
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          We used to say the same thing about Yellow Dog Democrats where I come from. They wouldn’t care what the candidates had to say, whether the Republican opponent had good things to say, they just went into the booth and voted straight Democratic ticket every single time no matter how bad the Democratic candidates were. A similar thing happened in 08 and 12 only the low information voters believed a slogan and blindly voted for it. Many are now having voters remorse when they finally woke up and said “What happened to the country”? I didn’t think it would be like this! It is amazing that Independents can’t figure out right from wrong. I had my mind made up when he told Joe the Plumber we had to spread the wealth around. That should have done it for you too, but that is too difficult a concept for most liberals and most want a level playing field and everyone with the same limited income. You can’t make a poor man rich by making a rich man poor. You should know that but you obviously don’t.

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:33 pm
            Ron says:
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            Agent,

            That is why we need more Independents and less party line voters from both sides. There are just as many Democrats who complain about Republicans and/or Conservatives who do the same thing. The candidates know this and that is why each party will gerrymander when they can, and vote to keep their jobs more than they vote for what is best for the country.

            You also can’t make a poor man rich by making a rich man richer. The government should use tax policy to encourage spending in the private sector, not just hand money over or hope for something to trickle down. We know what actually trickles down from the rich and it is not money or jobs.

            Please list all of the actual policies President Obama has put in place and how it has spread the wealth. I want actual reults, not regurgitated lines from the campaign trail.

          • October 11, 2013 at 2:35 pm
            Captain Planet says:
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            Wealth is already being spread…to the top. Actually, flooded to the top. And, personally, I’d rather be a poor man in a rich country than a rich man in a poor country. Evidently, those in the top 1% don’t feel the same. They are okay with watching this country fall to the failed Reaganomics hoax of trickle down.

            You are reading too much Fox/Drudge/Malkin reports if you think most people are blaming the economy on President Obama. Did you see the Republican Congress’ approval percentage today? All time low for either party. The GOP is gasping and even the Koch Bros know it. That’s why they’ve temporarily called off the dogs on fueling the government shut down.

          • October 11, 2013 at 3:44 pm
            Libby says:
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            Agent – So you have a derogatory term for democrats that vote the party line regardless of candidate. What is the derogative term for a Republican that does the same thing?

          • October 11, 2013 at 3:49 pm
            Libby says:
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            Oh, Ron. You make me sigh. Still asking and expecting Agent to give you tangible answers to specific questions. You do persevere! God love you!

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:04 pm
            Agent says:
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            Ron, what we need are more Independents that actually can figure out early in the game what is right and what is wrong with the policies of the government and how the politicians pander and lie. Even though politicians are good liars, you can usually cut through the smoke screen and figure out if they are big government taxers and spenders or small government with tax cuts people and it is fairly easy for me to determine who to vote for. How is it a good thing for politicians who vote to keep their jobs rather than do the right thing for the country.

            Perhaps you should reword your demand on the actual policies Obama has put into place into redistribution of wealth. Take the biggest one – Obamacare. The second one is soaking the rich and increasing the marginal tax rate, third the ill fated Stimulus which was nothing more than rewarding supporters for re-election, didn’t create jobs and increased the debt. By the way, they blew through their ill gotten gain and are back with hat in hand for more at the trough. The more we get into this discussion, the more I am convinced you are not anything different than the typical Democrat and not an Independent. You show no outrage at Progressive dogma even though America is on fire right now. You are fiddling while Rome burns and don’t even notice it.

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:54 pm
            Libby says:
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            Agent – just curious, but why is it important that Independents “figure out early in the game what is right and what is wrong with the policies of the government and how the politicians pander and lie.”?

            As long as they figure it out by election day, that’s all that matters.

      • October 11, 2013 at 11:48 am
        Libby says:
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        You are doing a disservice to your country by voting the party line and not for the person that will do the best job.

        • October 11, 2013 at 4:07 pm
          Agent says:
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          Libby, show me a true Conservative Democrat and I will be glad to give him/her consideration to vote for. I think it will be a hard chore for you to find that person.

          • October 14, 2013 at 9:03 am
            Libby says:
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            Agent – maybe you should define Conservative, as you understand it. Is that totally a fiscal description or do you also favor the extreme views of the fanatical fundamendalists regarding social issues as well?

            I have no problem being conservative fiscally, as I have said until I’m blue in the face.

        • October 11, 2013 at 5:15 pm
          Agent says:
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          So Planet, you would rather be a poor man in a rich country. You may get your wish earlier than you thought since the Middle Class is descending to the poor class as a result of the Obama Tax and Spend machine. Maybe you are like Ron who pays no Federal Taxes like 50% of the people do currently and continue to soak us with entitlement drain. Reaganomics pulled a lot of the poor up in this country and welfare rolls shrank as more people were able to make a living. Trickle up poverty and spreading the wealth around just creates more poor people as this Administration is proving daily. I think you are reading too much Cloward & Pivin. Did you take a class from Bill Ayers up there in Chicago? That is not what this country was founded on and it is just plain wrong. I bet you really hate and envy your boss for making a success out of business. They are just so evil not to give you more of their hard earned dollars, right?

          • October 14, 2013 at 3:15 pm
            Agent says:
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            So Libby, You say that you are fiscally conservative and then vote blindly for the most disastrous spending President in the history of the country. Were you misled that Obama was going to be Conservative in spending? What part of his agenda did you not understand?

            I know you are hopped up thinking Republicans are going to take away Gay Marriage, Abortion, among other social issues. That was not going to happen and won’t happen. How about you putting on your Conservative fiscal policy hat and using some common sense for a change? How about realizing that raising the debt ceiling will increase the debt? Do you agree that a government increasing spending by a Trillion dollars over what they collect is unsustainable? What percentage of non-essential government workers would you cut? We apparently have about 880,000 according to figures released when they shut the government down. I can’t get my mind around 880,000 non essential workers. Does this not bother you and make you realize our government is bloated and out of control?

        • October 15, 2013 at 1:22 pm
          Agent says:
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          Libby, you are doing a disservice to your country by drinking the Kool Aid and voting Democratic. You are supposed to be educated and have voted twice for the worst President in the history of the country. Then, you compound it by saying you will vote for Hillary in the next election. That takes stupid to a new level.

      • October 11, 2013 at 12:06 pm
        Ron says:
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        Agent,

        You said, “The thing that I like is that he is very eloquent, needs no teleprompter to read from and actually has common sense which is in such short supply on the national scene”

        Many people said similar things about President Obama when he was running. We will see if continues to not use a teleprompter if and when he begins serious campaigning. All of the Republican and Democratic candidates were using them during speeches, but somehow only President Obama gets ripped for it.

        • October 11, 2013 at 12:11 pm
          Captain Planet says:
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          Well, to be fair, Ron, some Governors who quit their job midterm and ruin a Presidential campaign ink notes on and read from, their palms.

          • October 11, 2013 at 12:29 pm
            Libby says:
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            Some hockey mom Governors, you mean.

        • October 11, 2013 at 1:28 pm
          Agent says:
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          Ron, have you ever heard Obama try to speak without a teleprompter? Every other word is “uh” and no complete sentences are uttered. I think his famous blunder when he said he had visited 57 states was teleprompterless.

          Since you, Libby & Planet are in love with Kool Aid, I suggest you go on Michellemalkin.com today and check out the latest Obama train wreck. Two very informative stories in there. I really like the one on Planet’s home state that all of 5 people have signed up so far. I wonder if Planet was one of the lucky ones who navigated the site from hell.

        • October 11, 2013 at 2:28 pm
          Captain Planet says:
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          You betcha, Libby. Dontcha know? (wink)

          • October 11, 2013 at 4:13 pm
            Agent says:
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            Leave it to you to find a vile left wing site to criticize Michelle. Sorry she hurt your feelings. You liberals are all about feelings, aren’t you? You can’t handle the truth, so it is search and destroy with liberals. She is tough and she will hang in there. Libby should admire her for making her home in Colorado. By the way, Colorado has dumped two state Senators for being too far left and promoting gun control. The third one is coming up soon and when she is gone, the Senate will revert to Republican hands. How about that for a switch in fortune?

        • October 14, 2013 at 5:35 pm
          Agent says:
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          Ron, do you remember any of the 34 speeches the President made when trying to sell Obamacare? He should have memorized it since he said it so many times. However, the teleprompter was in evidence every single time. He tends to stumble over his words if he doesn’t have his security blanket. After the Oklahoma tornados, he promised to rush aid to “Monroe”, Oklahoma????? What was that? He was so detached, he didn’t know it was Moore, Ok that got hit after it had been on the news for days. He didn’t forget to hug Chris Christie after Sandy, did he? Birds of a feather flock together, right?

    • October 11, 2013 at 6:10 pm
      Agent says:
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      Hey FFA, This just popped up on my screen. Good news on the way. NBC, Wall Street Journal, Gallup poll just announced that over 60% of the citizens polled want all the Congress to go. A complete turnover of all has a good chance to change the toxic atmosphere in DC since none of the current ones care about the people they serve. They want a third party. I have a good name in mind – The Conservative Party. The Democratic Socialist party that has taken over the Democratic Party has to go. The Republican RINO party has to go. This is the country’s only chance of survival. Dr. Ben Carson is my man. Get behind him.

  • October 15, 2013 at 2:14 pm
    jack says:
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    Libby- to say all people from SC are uneducated is like saying all Democrats are homos, non-swimmers, or white people that vote for black people to make them feel good about themselves. Tell you what, go to Charleston County Schools website and check out who brings the grade average down in the area. Let me know what you find out. There is your uneducated and they vote democrat.

  • October 15, 2013 at 3:07 pm
    jack says:
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    I just love the article I just read from out on the left coast. “You should figure out ways to lower your income so you qualify for the tax subsidy” under obamacareless. WOW. You democrats take the cake…literally.



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