The previous article is now “inactive” and not accessable, and this is the 3rd article today regarding the same situation. I will repost my previous post in this one.
Here is a quote from the article: “It appears that consumers’ names, addresses, Social Security numbers and credit reports may have been viewed by these individuals, who posed as legitimate business customers with a lawful purpose for accessing information about individuals which, in fact, was not the case.”
Sure sounds like a breach to me. If a person (or group of persons) gets into a system w/o permission and is able to look/steal/view documents/information, that is definitely a breach. Does Choice Point not know the definition of breach?
Choice Point is saying that what you correctly call a breach was not caused by an individual or group who successfully attacked the firewall or electronic security of their system. Essentially, any of their customers could misuse the information they have access to. The whole system depends upon good faith use of the information contained within it…always a scarey proposition, but a risk we accept every day when we give some clerk our credit card and ID.
In a way the Choice Point situation might be analagous to a horribly expensive but effective missle defense system that would be of small consolation to an Omaha destroyed by a bomb transported by Federal Express!
This was and is a “Breach”. Get ready folks this is just the tip of the iceburg. A short time ago we were discussing insurance company use of credit scores. That computer information, although sometimes incorrect, has your DOB, drivers license number, social security number, credit and address information. Don’t be surprised when this information starts being stored in india. Do you think someone earning $400.00 per month won’t be tempted to sell this information. God help anyone in California or Texas that has a water claim. These people are finding thier insurance not renewed or rates increased. Some are having trouble selling or buying a home after the property has be tagged as a water mold exposure.
So, the same people that said they have measures inplace to keep unauthorized users from accessing data, are procaliming that magically one set of data – how much – not reaaly sure or they are not saying – that was compromised is different then this “other” set of data and it’s intact. Any self interest there? Is one set of protection standards less rigid than other and, if so, why?
My question is what do we, insurance companies do to help or protect our customers that me be effected? Do we have some sort of obligation to our insured?
We personally cannot do much since all the info is stored with Choice Point, and THEIR system was hacked. As long as you do your best on your side to protect the info it’s the best you can do.
Funny how in my email today I have a notice from Choicepoint that effective immediately they will no longer allow score or ADD reports unless ordered through a company sponsored account…
Not a problem since we don’t order them any other way – but looks like they are moving the blame for policing access to the companies instead of Choicepoint.
The story in Ins Journal is a puff piece compared to the reports of some legit news outfits. Guess it pays to advertise. The industry has let CP get too much of a monopoly, too much power. In this case they float a story and if it doesn’t work they have another the next day. When enough policyholders realize what the industry is giving to them, besides the screen scraping, and what they are doing with it there will be hell to pay. Some politician is going to make this a national issue at some point about big business knowing all. Is it really okay for Jiffy Lube to sell all my info when I get the $19.99 oil change or Pizza Hut to sell my unlisted phone #?
Hal,
You got it right, there will be hell to pay sooner rather than later. Some politician and aggressive reporter will have a field day with the insurance industry. I believe the information in these reports, many times wrong, are going to be made avialable to the public. Just like credit reports, companies will object, then be forced to comply. As an agent we tell new clients thier claims records and perhaps thier credit reports will be viewed. You can bet as a result of this hack Insurance carriers and ChoicePoint are preparing for law suits. Guess what? the settlements will be added to premiums when Exec’s heads should roll.
Choicepoint says: “Our insurance customer database is 100 percent secure”. That’s not the issue, the issue is who is accessing the data. Choicepoint sells data used for background checks but can’t check the background of the people using their data? The answer to that, of course, is yes because there really is no such thing as a comprehensive background check. But that’s another topic of discussion away from the CLUE issue.
By the way, if in the case of the Independent Agent who supposedly “owns” his client data how can the insurers provide the claims data they do to Choicepoint or ISO without compensating the agent? Specifically, how can they provide the insureds name and address to third parties like Choicepoint and ISO? If the insurers started giving away the Independent Agent’s dec page data tomorrow would the agents be upset?
This must have been in the works for some time. Has anyone reviewed ChoicePoint’s new sevice agreement being circulated-are they responsible for anything?
The Insurance companies moved to credit scoring and now these data bases are hugh. This is ripe for abuse. Notice how we now have a product to sell for Identity Theft. Also, notice how little it covers. Not a conspirancy – incompetance maybe or….
I’m reading on my company’s website a news article on choicepoint that’s much harsher than this one by insurancejournal. One line is “ChoicePoint said 145,000 people were being notified by the company that their personal information may have been stolen.” Another statement by The Los Angeles Times that’s in the same article states, “The ring, which operated for more than a year before it was detected, has defrauded at least 750 people, The Los Angeles Times reported, quoting a county sheriff’s detective.”. I don’t understand why they would just notify 35K people in California without notifying the others. THAT’S responsibility. It could be you: Ten years down the line you hear from a bank wanting payment on a ferrari you never bought, a mortgage company wanting payment on a million dollar house you never owned, and lawsuits coming at you because the identity thief gave YOUR information in an accident THEY may have caused. *Sigh* What a wonderful world we live in.
I guarantee George Bush will put a stop to this. He would never let a big corp. run rampant like this. He will get to the bottem of this fraud and make sure that no customers are hurt! CP will be heavily prosecuted or fined just like ENRON!
Can’t believe the news media is not also mentioniong the law suit choice point lost where in they were using information from agents inquiries for credit scoring to make up marketing lists of expiration dates to sell to other companies and agents
Bob,
Where have you been? George Bush blocked the prosecution of the CEO of Enron for years. That’s what you get when you are a friend and large donator. As sure as God made green apples the folks at ChoicePoint donated to both parties. Don’t you understand that ChoicPoint is part of the insurance & banking industry that were very big donors to the President. The network is already being set up to beat these charges, I hope they are not successful. Probable outcome, they will settle without admitting guilt in Federal court. The individual consumers be dammed.
I brought up the issue about Choicpoint having agents data in my earlier post. Where I mentioned that part of the CLUE system contains data that may be the agents data in some instances. The insureds name and address for example. If in some circumstances the agent “owns” his client list how can the insurer provide Choicepoint data elements off the declarations page that the insurer has no right to?
Instead of there being a discussion about the subject at hand we have some Michael Moore brown-nose hijacking this discussion thread so he can trash the president.
By the way, since someone wants to talk about it so badly, many many many people around the world thought Iraq had WMD’s, including numerous Democrats like John Kerry. Besides being loose with the truth Kerry never would release his full military records. And Kery had the bad fortune to have a man named John O’Neill against him. Fortunately, Kerry his looney wife are not in the White House.
As far as ENRON? ENRON had it’s fun during Bill Clinton’s watch when all the .com and pumping and dumping insanity was taking place. Today, the ENRON investigation is one of the largest single DOJ investigations in history. The FBI has A BUILDING full of people in Houston working on that case. I’ve met some of them. If you think the Bush Administration is running cover for Ken Lay or anyone else you are simply not informed. Put the Michael Moore DVD away. It’s BS!
If it were up to me Joe, people like you would be put in jail for talking bad about the president during a time of war. You should be sent to a concentration camp and tortured indefinitely with no access to a lawyer. You are lucky you live in America where our governement doesnt believe in those things.
I agree with bobby, just becasue Ken Lay and George Bush are best friends, and Ken Lay hangs out at the white House doesnt mean that Goerge Bush would ever give Ken Lay a break. George has found Jesus, and thats whats most important. Just becasue he has a DWI and has used cocain, that shouldnt be held against him now becasue that was a long time ago. While John Kerry was over there screwing around getting shot, Bush was serving his time at home protecting texas from those dirty Mexicans/ Praise Jesus. If we didnt have all the Mexicans and Blacks and Irish bringing us down, this country woulnt be in this mess.
bobby,
Sounds like you have some intellegence. How can Bob Schill call himself a Christian? Lets see he hates Blacks, Mexicans, tht Irish, liberals, probally all the blue States. I consider myself a Christian but I do not wear it on my sleeve, my actions speak for themselves. Do you really think Jesus hates Blacks, Mexicans, the Irish and lets add Jews and Italians, got a feeling Bob hates them also. By the way I’m a proud Italian American. My Dad and all three brothers volunteered for military service. We were taught the least we could do is serve our country for four years. Kind of feel close to Jesus, you know he was a Jewish Roman. In other words an Italian. Did you know he liked to share and break his bread, dip it in olive oil and sip some red wine, just like my family. Just kidding Bob, don’t want to burst your bubble. Don’t remember reading that Jesus ever hated anyone except the money handlers in the Temple. AS far as being a fan of Michael Moore, he is an AH (now rich) just like Jerry Farwall and Pat Robertson. Hey Bob did you ever put your body where your mouth is? Did you ever serve your country? Last email guys, I have enough fun with racist Bob. Please don’t take your anger out on your love ones, life is to short.
Bob,
Such passion, guess you forgot about the 1st Amendment. No one brought politics into this conversation until you did. I can only speak for myself, I paid my dues flying in the Navy, saw good men die. Now we have two Chichen Hawks in the White House who dodged the draft. We have the best of our young dead & disabled for a lie. Your Royal President, never left US soil before becoming the Leader of the Free World. Mr. Bush bankrupt his oil company but not before he got his cash out and left the stoclholder with nothing. He allowed his friends to lie about John McCain in the South. He allowed some creep from Texas to lie about John Kerry. As for your coment about sending me to a concentration camp and torture; I wouldn,t wish that on anyone, but listning to your BS feels like torture to me. Grow up Bob, go visit a VA hospital. Talk to Reservist who were discharged with missing limbs. Ask them how long they have been waiting for treatment, ask them how many of these folks lost their jobs and homes.
You make me sick, you should support the troops! THey are fighting for our freedom! Without them killing the terrorists they would be here by now and Iraq would take over the US. Saddam Husane blew up the world trade center, then we found out proof that he had nuculer weapons, so we had to kill their people to save humanity. This country rules, we are more civilized than any other country, so we must kill to make everyone free and safe! I keep up on politics on the internets every day, and from what I can tell from the media, George Bush is the best thing to happen to this country. I dont care how many black people were disenfranchised, and I dont care how many of those electronic voting machines were rigged, anything to keep George Bush in office is worth it. So shut up, becasue you are not patriotic/
Bob,
Now the true colors come out, you are not only an AH you are a racist, a rightwinger, probally from a red state, a phony Christian and a Chicken Hawk right winger. Those Black people you don’t care about are dying at a higher % in the Middle East than any other group. Let me guess, you never put your life on the line for your country, tell me I’m wrong. In your form of patriotism its ok to rigg the ballat box as long as Chicken Hawk wins. I happen to believe President Bush won fair and square this time around. You say you keep up with currant affairs, perhaps you should expand your brain and read both sides of the arguement. I for one want George Bush to be successful, it would be good for America and the rest of the world. His Administration misinformed us about WMD in Iraq, undermaned our troups in the MidEast by 40,000, gave no bid contracts to Halaburton,left thousands of disabled vets out in the cold, can not account for over 6 Billion of rebiulding funds in Iraq, allowed the Ben family to leave the USA after 911 over the objection of the FBI & CIA, allowed ENRON to rob utility users and now wants to make SS a wind fall for the stock market. Not sorry I make you sick, maybe a tour in Iraq would help. I do support and love our troops, not just in phony words, go to VA hospital or clinic and help some disabled vet get his or her benefits. What I don’t support is Chicken Hawks sending our kids to die on a lie. I hope you never have to face a group of fanatic people, driven by their God, trying to blow you up. Hope you enjoy the President’s week-end, some service person gave his or her life so you and could disagree.
I am not a racist, I hate all ethnicities equally. My origianl point was that Choice point should not be held accountable. They are just trying to make money hand over fist like the rest of us. Thats why George Bush lets them do whatever they want. They could sell everyones credit information to the highest bidding terrorist and George Bush would sit by and choke on a pretzel. They have a monopoly on our personal information and are in cahoots with our govt. They will not be fined and they will not be punished, this is only the tip of the iceberg, you watch. This game will be over soon, the Amercian economy will soon collapse.
Bob,
Hate to burst your bubble, but many agents I know, care about thier clients and are not out just for the money. Perhaps that’s your problem, money is your God, not character and hard work.
Just thought you would like to know, you have something in common with the Blacks you hate. Science tells us we all share a gene from a black woman in central Africa. Scientist believe over thousands of years of plagues, illness the only humans that servised were people with this gene. Using your analysis, companies that sell drugs that kill, steal seniors retirement should not be accountable. “They are trying to make money hand over fist”. I pray Bob is not an agent or broker, God help his clients.
I must say I am amazed that you couldn’t pick up on the blatant sarcasm covering Bob Schill’s posts. I did enjoy reading the posts back and forth though they were rather entertaining.
M, Glad you enjoyed the rambling emails. Sometmes we just have to blow off steam. Thank God we live in the USA, just incase the Justice Department is listening. The next 4 years in insurance and politics will be very entertaining. How would you like to be sitting on the royalties, on a book, with tape backup of President Bush.
So what is wrong with the companies accepting responsibility for the security of this information? The companies are the ones who want to use all this information. Let them bear the responsibility.
How could you tell it was sarcasm? You can find people posting such things seriously at places like democraticunderground.com all the time.
I enjoy sarcasm just as much as the next person but I don’t expect it on a site like this. I thought this was a place professional insurance people posted to. What was posted was not sarcasm. Just childish.
A lot of people believe the Michael Moore type garbage. So if someone posts that type of stuff they can be expected to be taken at their word.
While the auto database may be secure (says them) this is going to be big. I got an e-mail from the Boy Scouts of America over the weekend. Seems they use Choicepoint to run the REQUIRED background checks of ALL BSA volunteers (that’s all the Scoutmasters, Cubmasters, Den moms, committee members, etc.) We’re talking tens of thousands of volunteers, who’ve now had their info compromised.
If you are one of these people, pay special attention to “identity” in the coming months, and perhaps review the past several months for any unusual transactions…
Scoutmaster is right folks. For about $34.00 you can get all 3 credit reports and your combined credit score used by many companies. One problem is, if you are married you will need to get one on your spouse also. If you are a corp or LLC you may want to check that also.
Following are 2 sets of quotes from the article:
“The fraud did not involve hacking of any of ChoicePoint’s databases according to Chuck Jones, director of external affairs.
“The widely reported fraud investigation now taking place in California was not a breach of ChoicePoint’s network or a “hacking” incident and did not involve any of ChoicePoint’s customer information,” Jones told Insurance Journal”
Here’s the other:
“ChoicePoint has notified approximately 35,000 California residents that their information may have been accessed by a very small number of criminals posing as legitimate companies to gain access to information about consumers. Additional disclosures will be forthcoming to approximately 110,000 consumers outside of California whose information also may have been accessed.”
This was not a breach. Choicepoint allowed them access since Choicepoint looked at the data they submitted for an account with Choicepoint and gave them credentials.
I see Choicepoint hired an ex-Secret Service fellow to help them. Well, that might be a good idea as far as the Nigerian scams go but this situation has nothing to do with Nigerian scams. It has to do with the way Choicepoint handles setting up access to their systems. Then tracking that access once the account is setup.
I’m not surprised by any of this. Choicepoint is a public company and has to grow. To do so they have reached into markets that puts them in a position of providing data to some businesses that maybe they should have kept away from. Just because it’s legal to provide information to some business types does not make doing so smart from a risk management standpoint.
So, Choicepoint “looks” pretty bad here. But in the scheme of things this event is tiny compared to the amount of commerce that spins around information that’s key for some businesses to do business.
Choicepoint should know exactly who’s data was looked at and from what account(s). Since they notified 144,778 people if that means that much data was taken from Choicepoint systems by the “crooks” then I wonder how many accounts accessed the data. If it’s just a few then Choicepoint has really fallen down on keeping track of their user base.
It looks to me like Choicepoint has finally learned something here. They must do a better job of knowing who’s fingertips are in their systems.
For some time Choicepoint has been under fire from outfits like epic.org. See here:
epic is a bunch of lawyers that make money from shooting at companies like Choicepoint. Unfortunately for Choicepoint, they have made themselves a fairly good target. Which is expected because of their size and their tendency to sell data to too many entities that maybe, as I said before, they should have thought twice about.
The information genie has been out of the bottle for many years. If it’s not watched carefully by those that handle it it can bite.
“This was not a breach. Choicepoint allowed them access since Choicepoint looked at the data they submitted for an account with Choicepoint and gave them credentials.”
Um, did you even really read the article? These “people” used FAKE information to get access to information they had no right to get in the first place.
What they mean by a breach is a hacker being able to circumvent their firewall and other security measures and gaining access without them knowing or allowing them to. Since Choice Point allowed access it was not a breach of their internet security or firewal. It was however a breach in the way they confirm legitamate businesses
Yes it is not a breach by a hacker, it is a breach because of greed. Sounds like “What is the meaning of it?” If they spent their resourses on security intead of spin lawyers maybe this would not have happened. Look for these folks to file for Bankrupty protection soon. Kind of funny if you think about it, Choice Point is the company that advises Insurance companies not to write insurance for people with low credit scores.
The previous article is now “inactive” and not accessable, and this is the 3rd article today regarding the same situation. I will repost my previous post in this one.
Here is a quote from the article: “It appears that consumers’ names, addresses, Social Security numbers and credit reports may have been viewed by these individuals, who posed as legitimate business customers with a lawful purpose for accessing information about individuals which, in fact, was not the case.”
Sure sounds like a breach to me. If a person (or group of persons) gets into a system w/o permission and is able to look/steal/view documents/information, that is definitely a breach. Does Choice Point not know the definition of breach?
Choice Point is saying that what you correctly call a breach was not caused by an individual or group who successfully attacked the firewall or electronic security of their system. Essentially, any of their customers could misuse the information they have access to. The whole system depends upon good faith use of the information contained within it…always a scarey proposition, but a risk we accept every day when we give some clerk our credit card and ID.
In a way the Choice Point situation might be analagous to a horribly expensive but effective missle defense system that would be of small consolation to an Omaha destroyed by a bomb transported by Federal Express!
This was and is a “Breach”. Get ready folks this is just the tip of the iceburg. A short time ago we were discussing insurance company use of credit scores. That computer information, although sometimes incorrect, has your DOB, drivers license number, social security number, credit and address information. Don’t be surprised when this information starts being stored in india. Do you think someone earning $400.00 per month won’t be tempted to sell this information. God help anyone in California or Texas that has a water claim. These people are finding thier insurance not renewed or rates increased. Some are having trouble selling or buying a home after the property has be tagged as a water mold exposure.
So, the same people that said they have measures inplace to keep unauthorized users from accessing data, are procaliming that magically one set of data – how much – not reaaly sure or they are not saying – that was compromised is different then this “other” set of data and it’s intact. Any self interest there? Is one set of protection standards less rigid than other and, if so, why?
My question is what do we, insurance companies do to help or protect our customers that me be effected? Do we have some sort of obligation to our insured?
We personally cannot do much since all the info is stored with Choice Point, and THEIR system was hacked. As long as you do your best on your side to protect the info it’s the best you can do.
Funny how in my email today I have a notice from Choicepoint that effective immediately they will no longer allow score or ADD reports unless ordered through a company sponsored account…
Not a problem since we don’t order them any other way – but looks like they are moving the blame for policing access to the companies instead of Choicepoint.
The story in Ins Journal is a puff piece compared to the reports of some legit news outfits. Guess it pays to advertise. The industry has let CP get too much of a monopoly, too much power. In this case they float a story and if it doesn’t work they have another the next day. When enough policyholders realize what the industry is giving to them, besides the screen scraping, and what they are doing with it there will be hell to pay. Some politician is going to make this a national issue at some point about big business knowing all. Is it really okay for Jiffy Lube to sell all my info when I get the $19.99 oil change or Pizza Hut to sell my unlisted phone #?
Hal,
You got it right, there will be hell to pay sooner rather than later. Some politician and aggressive reporter will have a field day with the insurance industry. I believe the information in these reports, many times wrong, are going to be made avialable to the public. Just like credit reports, companies will object, then be forced to comply. As an agent we tell new clients thier claims records and perhaps thier credit reports will be viewed. You can bet as a result of this hack Insurance carriers and ChoicePoint are preparing for law suits. Guess what? the settlements will be added to premiums when Exec’s heads should roll.
Choicepoint says: “Our insurance customer database is 100 percent secure”. That’s not the issue, the issue is who is accessing the data. Choicepoint sells data used for background checks but can’t check the background of the people using their data? The answer to that, of course, is yes because there really is no such thing as a comprehensive background check. But that’s another topic of discussion away from the CLUE issue.
By the way, if in the case of the Independent Agent who supposedly “owns” his client data how can the insurers provide the claims data they do to Choicepoint or ISO without compensating the agent? Specifically, how can they provide the insureds name and address to third parties like Choicepoint and ISO? If the insurers started giving away the Independent Agent’s dec page data tomorrow would the agents be upset?
This must have been in the works for some time. Has anyone reviewed ChoicePoint’s new sevice agreement being circulated-are they responsible for anything?
The Insurance companies moved to credit scoring and now these data bases are hugh. This is ripe for abuse. Notice how we now have a product to sell for Identity Theft. Also, notice how little it covers. Not a conspirancy – incompetance maybe or….
I’m reading on my company’s website a news article on choicepoint that’s much harsher than this one by insurancejournal. One line is “ChoicePoint said 145,000 people were being notified by the company that their personal information may have been stolen.” Another statement by The Los Angeles Times that’s in the same article states, “The ring, which operated for more than a year before it was detected, has defrauded at least 750 people, The Los Angeles Times reported, quoting a county sheriff’s detective.”. I don’t understand why they would just notify 35K people in California without notifying the others. THAT’S responsibility. It could be you: Ten years down the line you hear from a bank wanting payment on a ferrari you never bought, a mortgage company wanting payment on a million dollar house you never owned, and lawsuits coming at you because the identity thief gave YOUR information in an accident THEY may have caused. *Sigh* What a wonderful world we live in.
I guarantee George Bush will put a stop to this. He would never let a big corp. run rampant like this. He will get to the bottem of this fraud and make sure that no customers are hurt! CP will be heavily prosecuted or fined just like ENRON!
Can’t believe the news media is not also mentioniong the law suit choice point lost where in they were using information from agents inquiries for credit scoring to make up marketing lists of expiration dates to sell to other companies and agents
Bob,
Where have you been? George Bush blocked the prosecution of the CEO of Enron for years. That’s what you get when you are a friend and large donator. As sure as God made green apples the folks at ChoicePoint donated to both parties. Don’t you understand that ChoicPoint is part of the insurance & banking industry that were very big donors to the President. The network is already being set up to beat these charges, I hope they are not successful. Probable outcome, they will settle without admitting guilt in Federal court. The individual consumers be dammed.
I brought up the issue about Choicpoint having agents data in my earlier post. Where I mentioned that part of the CLUE system contains data that may be the agents data in some instances. The insureds name and address for example. If in some circumstances the agent “owns” his client list how can the insurer provide Choicepoint data elements off the declarations page that the insurer has no right to?
Instead of there being a discussion about the subject at hand we have some Michael Moore brown-nose hijacking this discussion thread so he can trash the president.
By the way, since someone wants to talk about it so badly, many many many people around the world thought Iraq had WMD’s, including numerous Democrats like John Kerry. Besides being loose with the truth Kerry never would release his full military records. And Kery had the bad fortune to have a man named John O’Neill against him. Fortunately, Kerry his looney wife are not in the White House.
As far as ENRON? ENRON had it’s fun during Bill Clinton’s watch when all the .com and pumping and dumping insanity was taking place. Today, the ENRON investigation is one of the largest single DOJ investigations in history. The FBI has A BUILDING full of people in Houston working on that case. I’ve met some of them. If you think the Bush Administration is running cover for Ken Lay or anyone else you are simply not informed. Put the Michael Moore DVD away. It’s BS!
If it were up to me Joe, people like you would be put in jail for talking bad about the president during a time of war. You should be sent to a concentration camp and tortured indefinitely with no access to a lawyer. You are lucky you live in America where our governement doesnt believe in those things.
I agree with bobby, just becasue Ken Lay and George Bush are best friends, and Ken Lay hangs out at the white House doesnt mean that Goerge Bush would ever give Ken Lay a break. George has found Jesus, and thats whats most important. Just becasue he has a DWI and has used cocain, that shouldnt be held against him now becasue that was a long time ago. While John Kerry was over there screwing around getting shot, Bush was serving his time at home protecting texas from those dirty Mexicans/ Praise Jesus. If we didnt have all the Mexicans and Blacks and Irish bringing us down, this country woulnt be in this mess.
As I suggested before, put the Michael Moore DVD down. Back away from it.
George W. Bush and Ken Lay are best friends? Ken Lay hangs out at the White House? Please provide proof.
Bush did get popped for drinking and driving. You said he did cocaine. Prove that too please.
I won’t address the rest of your ramblings. Or your attacks on Christians.
I wonder if liberalism is indeed some kind of mental illness…..
bobby,
Sounds like you have some intellegence. How can Bob Schill call himself a Christian? Lets see he hates Blacks, Mexicans, tht Irish, liberals, probally all the blue States. I consider myself a Christian but I do not wear it on my sleeve, my actions speak for themselves. Do you really think Jesus hates Blacks, Mexicans, the Irish and lets add Jews and Italians, got a feeling Bob hates them also. By the way I’m a proud Italian American. My Dad and all three brothers volunteered for military service. We were taught the least we could do is serve our country for four years. Kind of feel close to Jesus, you know he was a Jewish Roman. In other words an Italian. Did you know he liked to share and break his bread, dip it in olive oil and sip some red wine, just like my family. Just kidding Bob, don’t want to burst your bubble. Don’t remember reading that Jesus ever hated anyone except the money handlers in the Temple. AS far as being a fan of Michael Moore, he is an AH (now rich) just like Jerry Farwall and Pat Robertson. Hey Bob did you ever put your body where your mouth is? Did you ever serve your country? Last email guys, I have enough fun with racist Bob. Please don’t take your anger out on your love ones, life is to short.
Bob,
Such passion, guess you forgot about the 1st Amendment. No one brought politics into this conversation until you did. I can only speak for myself, I paid my dues flying in the Navy, saw good men die. Now we have two Chichen Hawks in the White House who dodged the draft. We have the best of our young dead & disabled for a lie. Your Royal President, never left US soil before becoming the Leader of the Free World. Mr. Bush bankrupt his oil company but not before he got his cash out and left the stoclholder with nothing. He allowed his friends to lie about John McCain in the South. He allowed some creep from Texas to lie about John Kerry. As for your coment about sending me to a concentration camp and torture; I wouldn,t wish that on anyone, but listning to your BS feels like torture to me. Grow up Bob, go visit a VA hospital. Talk to Reservist who were discharged with missing limbs. Ask them how long they have been waiting for treatment, ask them how many of these folks lost their jobs and homes.
You make me sick, you should support the troops! THey are fighting for our freedom! Without them killing the terrorists they would be here by now and Iraq would take over the US. Saddam Husane blew up the world trade center, then we found out proof that he had nuculer weapons, so we had to kill their people to save humanity. This country rules, we are more civilized than any other country, so we must kill to make everyone free and safe! I keep up on politics on the internets every day, and from what I can tell from the media, George Bush is the best thing to happen to this country. I dont care how many black people were disenfranchised, and I dont care how many of those electronic voting machines were rigged, anything to keep George Bush in office is worth it. So shut up, becasue you are not patriotic/
Bob,
Now the true colors come out, you are not only an AH you are a racist, a rightwinger, probally from a red state, a phony Christian and a Chicken Hawk right winger. Those Black people you don’t care about are dying at a higher % in the Middle East than any other group. Let me guess, you never put your life on the line for your country, tell me I’m wrong. In your form of patriotism its ok to rigg the ballat box as long as Chicken Hawk wins. I happen to believe President Bush won fair and square this time around. You say you keep up with currant affairs, perhaps you should expand your brain and read both sides of the arguement. I for one want George Bush to be successful, it would be good for America and the rest of the world. His Administration misinformed us about WMD in Iraq, undermaned our troups in the MidEast by 40,000, gave no bid contracts to Halaburton,left thousands of disabled vets out in the cold, can not account for over 6 Billion of rebiulding funds in Iraq, allowed the Ben family to leave the USA after 911 over the objection of the FBI & CIA, allowed ENRON to rob utility users and now wants to make SS a wind fall for the stock market. Not sorry I make you sick, maybe a tour in Iraq would help. I do support and love our troops, not just in phony words, go to VA hospital or clinic and help some disabled vet get his or her benefits. What I don’t support is Chicken Hawks sending our kids to die on a lie. I hope you never have to face a group of fanatic people, driven by their God, trying to blow you up. Hope you enjoy the President’s week-end, some service person gave his or her life so you and could disagree.
I am not a racist, I hate all ethnicities equally. My origianl point was that Choice point should not be held accountable. They are just trying to make money hand over fist like the rest of us. Thats why George Bush lets them do whatever they want. They could sell everyones credit information to the highest bidding terrorist and George Bush would sit by and choke on a pretzel. They have a monopoly on our personal information and are in cahoots with our govt. They will not be fined and they will not be punished, this is only the tip of the iceberg, you watch. This game will be over soon, the Amercian economy will soon collapse.
More Michael Moore type garbage. Which is spew without any facts.
Bob,
Hate to burst your bubble, but many agents I know, care about thier clients and are not out just for the money. Perhaps that’s your problem, money is your God, not character and hard work.
Just thought you would like to know, you have something in common with the Blacks you hate. Science tells us we all share a gene from a black woman in central Africa. Scientist believe over thousands of years of plagues, illness the only humans that servised were people with this gene. Using your analysis, companies that sell drugs that kill, steal seniors retirement should not be accountable. “They are trying to make money hand over fist”. I pray Bob is not an agent or broker, God help his clients.
Let me clarify, Im not saying everything I posted was a joke bobby, Im saying evertying YOU posted was a joke.
Signed,
BOB “Schill”…..bobby how slow are you?
Joe, Ive had enough fun jerking your chain, you are the most gullible person of come across in a long time – It was fun messing with you – peace bro
So, now are you saying everything you posted was joke? If yes, grow up and stop wasting people’s time here.
I must say I am amazed that you couldn’t pick up on the blatant sarcasm covering Bob Schill’s posts. I did enjoy reading the posts back and forth though they were rather entertaining.
M, Glad you enjoyed the rambling emails. Sometmes we just have to blow off steam. Thank God we live in the USA, just incase the Justice Department is listening. The next 4 years in insurance and politics will be very entertaining. How would you like to be sitting on the royalties, on a book, with tape backup of President Bush.
So what is wrong with the companies accepting responsibility for the security of this information? The companies are the ones who want to use all this information. Let them bear the responsibility.
How could you tell it was sarcasm? You can find people posting such things seriously at places like democraticunderground.com all the time.
I enjoy sarcasm just as much as the next person but I don’t expect it on a site like this. I thought this was a place professional insurance people posted to. What was posted was not sarcasm. Just childish.
A lot of people believe the Michael Moore type garbage. So if someone posts that type of stuff they can be expected to be taken at their word.
Bob, please get a life…maybe if you were not so busy hating everyone you would already have one by now
While the auto database may be secure (says them) this is going to be big. I got an e-mail from the Boy Scouts of America over the weekend. Seems they use Choicepoint to run the REQUIRED background checks of ALL BSA volunteers (that’s all the Scoutmasters, Cubmasters, Den moms, committee members, etc.) We’re talking tens of thousands of volunteers, who’ve now had their info compromised.
If you are one of these people, pay special attention to “identity” in the coming months, and perhaps review the past several months for any unusual transactions…
Scoutmaster is right folks. For about $34.00 you can get all 3 credit reports and your combined credit score used by many companies. One problem is, if you are married you will need to get one on your spouse also. If you are a corp or LLC you may want to check that also.
Following are 2 sets of quotes from the article:
“The fraud did not involve hacking of any of ChoicePoint’s databases according to Chuck Jones, director of external affairs.
“The widely reported fraud investigation now taking place in California was not a breach of ChoicePoint’s network or a “hacking” incident and did not involve any of ChoicePoint’s customer information,” Jones told Insurance Journal”
Here’s the other:
“ChoicePoint has notified approximately 35,000 California residents that their information may have been accessed by a very small number of criminals posing as legitimate companies to gain access to information about consumers. Additional disclosures will be forthcoming to approximately 110,000 consumers outside of California whose information also may have been accessed.”
So I guess this wasn’t a breach, or a hack! Umm!!
This was not a breach. Choicepoint allowed them access since Choicepoint looked at the data they submitted for an account with Choicepoint and gave them credentials.
I see Choicepoint hired an ex-Secret Service fellow to help them. Well, that might be a good idea as far as the Nigerian scams go but this situation has nothing to do with Nigerian scams. It has to do with the way Choicepoint handles setting up access to their systems. Then tracking that access once the account is setup.
I’m not surprised by any of this. Choicepoint is a public company and has to grow. To do so they have reached into markets that puts them in a position of providing data to some businesses that maybe they should have kept away from. Just because it’s legal to provide information to some business types does not make doing so smart from a risk management standpoint.
So, Choicepoint “looks” pretty bad here. But in the scheme of things this event is tiny compared to the amount of commerce that spins around information that’s key for some businesses to do business.
Choicepoint should know exactly who’s data was looked at and from what account(s). Since they notified 144,778 people if that means that much data was taken from Choicepoint systems by the “crooks” then I wonder how many accounts accessed the data. If it’s just a few then Choicepoint has really fallen down on keeping track of their user base.
It looks to me like Choicepoint has finally learned something here. They must do a better job of knowing who’s fingertips are in their systems.
For some time Choicepoint has been under fire from outfits like epic.org. See here:
http://www.epic.org/privacy/choicepoint/
epic is a bunch of lawyers that make money from shooting at companies like Choicepoint. Unfortunately for Choicepoint, they have made themselves a fairly good target. Which is expected because of their size and their tendency to sell data to too many entities that maybe, as I said before, they should have thought twice about.
The information genie has been out of the bottle for many years. If it’s not watched carefully by those that handle it it can bite.
InformationPioneer said this:
“This was not a breach. Choicepoint allowed them access since Choicepoint looked at the data they submitted for an account with Choicepoint and gave them credentials.”
Um, did you even really read the article? These “people” used FAKE information to get access to information they had no right to get in the first place.
This was a breach plain and simple.
What they mean by a breach is a hacker being able to circumvent their firewall and other security measures and gaining access without them knowing or allowing them to. Since Choice Point allowed access it was not a breach of their internet security or firewal. It was however a breach in the way they confirm legitamate businesses
Yes it is not a breach by a hacker, it is a breach because of greed. Sounds like “What is the meaning of it?” If they spent their resourses on security intead of spin lawyers maybe this would not have happened. Look for these folks to file for Bankrupty protection soon. Kind of funny if you think about it, Choice Point is the company that advises Insurance companies not to write insurance for people with low credit scores.