If they’re really concerned about the work-force issue as opposed to political grand-standing, here’s the test.
Have them publish a rule or revision that says 50 or more employees OR 2,000 TOTAL WEEKLY WORKER HOURS. This way it would apply whether you have 50 ppl working 40 hrs/wk; 35 ppl working 58 hrs/wk; or 80 ppl working 25 hrs/wk.
As evidenced by ten people disliking your comment, and only three people liking it, i’d say about three times as many americans disagree with obamacare.
The insurance industry is notoriously right-wing, so I expect that on this forum. There have been plenty of articles out about it and I stand by my statement. After all, Obama didn’t get a second term for nothin.
August 5, 2013 at 9:42 am
CalDude says:
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Americans want FREE healthcare; there is NO SUCH THING. Every country that has FREE health care also has a significantly higher taxbase. If we include it in your taxes, it SEEMS free….
August 5, 2013 at 10:01 am
Libby says:
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I don’t expect free health insurance and I don’t think the majority of the majority expect it to be free either.
August 5, 2013 at 4:07 pm
Patti Cake in the East says:
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That’s true, Libby. I guess they’re satisfied with their free Obama phones.
August 2, 2013 at 5:11 pm
Agent says:
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Libby, the American People may favor some form of a Healthcare fix, but they are against Obamacare in poll after poll. The last one I saw was AP and it is now 54% against, about 40% for and the rest undecided. I have a feeling that the undecided will come out against shortly as more an more people will be disillusioned with hours getting cut or joining the unemployed ranks as more and more employers have to do what they can to stay in business.
Agent – If you read correctly, that is exactly what I said. The majority are in favor of healthcare for all citizens. I did not mention Obamacare.
August 5, 2013 at 9:50 am
Ron says:
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Libby,
Agent’s lack of reading comprehension gets extremely frustrating sometimes. Maybe we need to use smaller words and type slower.
August 8, 2013 at 3:11 pm
Agent says:
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So Libby, you say you are in favor of Healthcare Reform and you didn’t mention Obamacare. Do you now agree that it is a disaster or what Max Baucus (D) called a train wreck? Do you see the potential that it will ruin the health system in this country? I expect you to come back and trumpet its merits just like Ron tends to do. By the way, if you think Great Britains system is a good model to follow, you are further gone than I thought.
August 9, 2013 at 9:58 am
Libby says:
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I think Obamacare has some issues and they need to be addressed. But no, I am not in favor of repealing it and would not characterize it as a “train wreck.” I, too, wish we had gone to single-payor, universal healthcare in this country. But the Republicans are the ones that fought that tooth and nail. So now you are stuck with Obamacare and you still don’t like it. Even though the mandate and the exchanges were all Republican ideas.
I’m not sure what you people want, except as Celtica said “that the GOP would prefer that only GOP members be able to afford health care insurance, so as to kill off everyone else. It will be the only way that they can win elections.”
August 9, 2013 at 12:31 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
Here we go again. Please quote me where I trumpeted the ACA. Oh yeah, you can’t.
Either be prepared to back your assertions about me and my positions with evidence or stop making them.
I have mentioned in the past that I do not like the ACA, but at least the Democrats are trying to do something to fix our broken healthcare system. What were the Republicans doing when they had control of all 3 branches of government? Oh yeah, they were overseas fighting terrorists.
August 5, 2013 at 12:51 pm
Libby says:
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Sarge has struck again, so I’ll re-post:
The majority of Americans are IN FAVOR of healthcare for all citizens. Again, where do you get your information???
Libby, everyone is in favor of healthcare. The question is, at what quality and cost? I know people who lived in Britain and Canada, and though they’re great people, all they can say about the national health service there is bad.
Some people even moved here BECAUSE we have quality healthcare. Don’t expect that to last if Obamacare is implemented. And I wonder why it’s taking so long? Can you say bureaucracy?
Why it’s taking so long? It’s on track for 10/1/13 last I heard; the original date for implementation.
I, too, have spoken to people from Canada and U.K. and have not heard those negative stories. So I guess it’s all in who you talk to about it.
August 9, 2013 at 3:03 pm
jw says:
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I don’t KNOW anyone in the UK or Australia, but I regularly read the blog of an author in the UK and have friends on Goodreads from Australia and some of the EU countries. These people have all, at one time or another, had positive comments about their healthcare options. Not one of them has said they would like to try the US way. In fact, the author I follow was championing the UK healthcare for her diabetic husband and autistic son. Two things that are expensive for the patient in the US.
August 9, 2013 at 3:07 pm
jw says:
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I am all for a single payor/universal health care system. The system we have now is broken. No doubt someone would discount my reasoning to an emotional decision. They’d be right. I won’t apologize for what I feel.
August 2, 2013 at 1:40 pm
Libby says:
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Good comment, InsGuy. Way to think outside the box.
I guess I must have hit home Libby & Ron. Any criticism of your favorite Healthcare law and you jump right to the attack. Go crawl in a hole Ron. The majority of Americans don’t like this Obamanation and you just can’t stand it.
“my favorite Healthcare law”??? It’s the ONLY Healthcare law. I will not apologize for being pro-Universal Healthcare. What kind of citizen would not be?
“What kind of citizen would not be” you ask? The kind of citizen that believes in the open, free market…the kind of citizen that believes in Capitalism and not the Government cramming something down their throats that they don’t want.
Please tell me the last time this country functioned with an open, free market?
Hint: you probably weren’t born yet.
August 6, 2013 at 8:37 am
Libby says:
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Maybe you should take a page from Hawaiian employers:
“In interviews, leaders and employers in Hawaii referred with surprising earnestness to an “aloha spirit” and a sense of familial obligation known as ohana to justify providing care to nearly everyone.”
You need a little ohana in your life P.C. Maybe then you wouldn’t be such a cold-hearted scrooge.
August 6, 2013 at 2:23 pm
Big D says:
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May I ask Libby where universal health care has been a resounding or even a moderate success? and If it is auch a great thing why millions of immigrants are not flocking to those countries. perhaps we could save the government a little money and the government could just buy tickets and the first three months living expenses for those who want universal healthcare and aid them in their pursuit of happiness.
Although I know you will all argue with me, how about U.K, Canada, and Australia for starters? I’ve already done all the research and posted my sources on another thread, so please don’t ask me to do it again. None of you right-wingers read them anyway.
August 6, 2013 at 10:31 pm
jw says:
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Just an FYI – all those countries that Libby mentioned have much stricter immigration laws. Especially Australia. So, that is most likely why there isn’t a hoard of unwashed masses heading for the UK, Canada or Australia.
August 6, 2013 at 10:32 pm
jw says:
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By the way, I haven’t done any research on universal health care, I just happen to read about immigration recently.
August 13, 2013 at 11:26 am
Agent says:
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So Libby, perhaps you or Ron will give us some metrics on whether the workers will get hurt on the newest delay regarding the out of pocket expenses which are due to rise. Yes, it is all over the internet and even the NY Times has an article on it. Supposedly, the ACA put down strict guidelines in the bill for maximum out of pocket expenses of $6,350 per Individual and $12,700 per family. Now, companies will be allowed to set their own out of pocket maximums and some may not have a maximum at all. When we have markets who have to take all the PreX’s out there sure to enroll, I would bet that most markets will have much higher out of pocket expenses on the plans offered. Will this hurt workers or not?
Typical politician, if they are afraid of the truth call it anecdotal. She is “out there” I agree with that but not how she meant it.
1) Employers do not announce that they are cutting hours and jobs to avoid the insurance burden
2) Employees have no where to turn if it is done because it is not illeagal. So just suffer.
3) Does it happen? Ask the restaurant workers in Massachusetts if they are now part time.
4)Where do our “leaders” think the money comes to pay the new Tax (that is what SCOTUS called it)? It comes from the Employers income. If that means he does not have any or only a small percentage of what he had before why should he pay it?
5) Health Care for all is a Good Idea Funded Wrong. By a bunch of dopes who exempted themselves from the law they passed.
Libby, it is interesting that you mention the Great State of Hawaii who are so benevolent and have such an Aloha spirit that they are offering all the more unfortunate citizens a one way ticket back to the mainland since they don’t want to support them anymore. You criticize employers for cutting back employee hours calling them greedy and here we have a whole state dumping people entirely.
Please explain what, exactly, you are saying and your source for this statement.
I was referring to the article provided by CalDude about Hawaii’s employer mandate to provide health insurance to all workers over 20 hours. Perhaps you’d like to take a look at how well that system works for the Great State of Hawaii. Then comment.
Libby, I can’t force you to watch the news and I doubt CNN has run a story on it, but it is all over the internet. Hawaii thinks it is a good idea to get rid of the unfortunate by giving them a one way plane ticket. Does this sound like a good idea? I thought liberals wanted to take care of these poor people, not send them away.
All over the internet??? I couldn’t find ONE story on this. So, I will be unable to comment on something I can not find any information on. Like most of your statements, I will take this one with a grain of salt since it is obviously skewed and lopsided. If it is as jw portrays, then I don’t see anything wrong with what Hawaii is doing. Aren’t you from Texas where you want to throw everyone out? I would think you’d be applauding Hawaii and leading a bandwagon in your state to follow in their footsteps.
August 8, 2013 at 3:04 pm
Agent says:
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Libby, You won’t find it on the Huffington Post. Even jw found it. I thought Democrats were all about helping the downtrodden. Had a Republcan government done this, you would be all over them for throwing away people and sending them away.
August 8, 2013 at 3:56 pm
Libby says:
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Agent – I googled it, so I wasn’t just looking at liberal sites for this. And yes, liberals are about helping the downtrodden but not EVERY down and out person. That would be impossible. Sending someone living on the beach back to their home (as long as it’s not dangerous for them) is not cruel and unusual. They are not U.S. citizens. And you know I have said I don’t think we need to be the world police &/or savior.
August 6, 2013 at 10:38 pm
jw says:
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Libby, it is true. But like I mentioned in my reply to Agent, it’s all about tourism.
How do you know these poor unfortunate souls are not US citizens? Did you know that we are letting more Mexicans in at the border if they say they are asking for political asylum from the cartels? That is a novel approach for letting more illegals in, isn’t it. Much safer than swimming the river or tunneling under. They are being put up in hotels at our expense. They will then be shown how to apply for food stamps, Obamacare and whatever else they want to get on the dole.
August 14, 2013 at 9:30 am
Libby says:
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I’m calling bullsh*t on that. Cite a source or shut up.
August 6, 2013 at 10:36 pm
jw says:
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Hawaii isn’t sending back the citizens who were born there. They are trying to get the people who moved to Hawaii to live on a beach to leave. Why? Hello! It interferes with tourism. Who wants to go to the beach and deal with the bums. I am serious, these people moved to Hawaii thinking they could live on the beach. This has been an issue for decades and I have no problem with the government sending people back to their real homes.
Hey FFA, I happened to hear on the radio today that our wonderful Congress, who is taking their August vacation along with the President suddenly reached an agreement to help out their Congressional staffers with Obamacare premiums since their costs are due to rise dramatically. This has been brewing for a while and many of the staffers said they would have to leave government if they had to pay for the outrageous premiums coming their way. It is always about them. What help is the rest of America getting? All we get is the shaft from government.
They already have insurance, FFA. They don’t need insurance through an exchange. Same as me. I already have insurance, so this law won’t affect my coverage.
Actually Libby, the staffers were brought in under Obamacare and will be losing their gold plated coverage as a benefit. Why do you think they are making such a big deal about this? They have to apply under the exchanges and costs are much more so their bosses all got together to get them taken care of. I wonder how much this will cost the taxpayers for the 2,000+ staffers on the Congressional payroll.
August 2, 2013 at 4:37 pm
Libby says:
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What it’s been costing all along, I suppose. Government perks. I don’t like them any more than you do.
August 5, 2013 at 4:09 pm
Patti Cake in the East says:
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Keep telling yourself that, Libby. You just keep on telling yourself that….
August 2, 2013 at 4:18 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
The President NEVER gets a vacation. They need to be ready 24/7 to handle an emergency or crisis. That also applies when President Bush was breaking records for taking “vacations” to his ranch and every other President before them.
Ron, it is obvious you have had a hard week by your comment. The President never gets a vacation?? Your President stays on vacation most of the year. I hardly think GW’s little trips to Waco to chop wood and ride his dirt bike cost the taxpayers anything like the Hawaii, Martha’s Vineyard vacations Obama takes. Why can’t your President just go to Camp David for some relaxation at the already paid for retreat? It is also just a short helicopter ride. That is what GW did and that is fine with me. He also didn’t rent entire golf clubs in Florida to get a lesson with Butch Harmon and play with Tiger Woods.
Will you EVER be able to comprehend what I write? Where did I state that the President never goes anywhere? I made no comment about how any President spends their time away from the Oval office. I only made the comment that they are on call 24/7/365. What I meant is that he never can get away and forget about work.
In fact, he is playing golf as we speak. They showed an iron shot he hit on one of the holes. I don’t think the ball made it past the ladies tee. When Tiger played with him in Florida, all he said was the President was a decent putter. That speaks volumes to me about his tee to green game.
August 13, 2013 at 4:03 pm
Libby says:
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Who gives a sh*t how good of a golfer he is? I don’t want a President too good at golf because that’s a game you don’t play well without a lot of practice. I want him running the country, not playing golf. But with that said, everyone is entitled to a little relaxation. Even you go golfing to relax and you don’t have one nth of the stress he does.
August 5, 2013 at 10:52 am
Suze says:
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Ron,
Yes an active president should be ready 24/7 to handle emergencies and crisis moments…. where was he during the Benghazi attacks???
That tragedy and the response are 2 my critcisms of President Obama. That should not have occurred and should have been handled much better.
August 5, 2013 at 11:07 am
Agent says:
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Actually, he was at the White House during Benghazi, but they can’t account for what he was doing. Maybe he was out back practice putting on the green. I hardly think he was in the situation room since he took no action to save the Ambassador and the Seals. A new report is out that up to 22 CIA operatives were on the ground in Benghazi. Why did they make no attempt to help. I submit that 22 of them could have handled the terrorists and driven them off. Why are these people being hidden now, subjected to polygraphs and told to keep their mouths shut? This “phony” scandal seems to have more to it than they want told.
August 5, 2013 at 12:16 pm
Agent says:
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Suze, didn’t you realize that Benghazi was a “Phony” scandal? I wonder where they are hiding all those CIA guys to keep them from testifying. Why are they having to sign non-disclosure agreements? Why do they have to keep taking polygraphs monthly? Why do we have no answers on what was going on with the gun running operation to Syria almost a year later?
August 5, 2013 at 1:21 pm
Libby says:
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Agent – Instead of trying for the 41st time to repeal the ACA, why doesn’t Congress subpoena the CIA agents and have them testify?
If there was something nefarious going on in Benghazi, I want to know about it. And I know you do, too.
As far as Syria goes, this is what Obama has said about military intervention:
Obama “would say, ‘If you are going to propose specific steps, tell me where they lead,'” said Ross, now at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. “I don’t think you can look at it independently from Iraq and Afghanistan. And particularly the sense that these are easy to get into and hard to get out of.”
I appreciate that position. Do you really want to send American troops into Syria? If so, WHY??
August 6, 2013 at 6:54 pm
james says:
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Exactly. This President (and don’t forget MEchelle) gets more vacation than any US leader in history.
August 7, 2013 at 7:55 am
Ron says:
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James,
Please cite your source.
Actually, George W. Bush and Herbert Hoover lead the way in vacation time. Interesting that the Great Recession and Great Depression , the 2 biggest financial collapses in our history, began while each was President. I am not blaming either, just stating facts.
If you have different facts, please provide ansd cite your source.
August 13, 2013 at 5:55 pm
Agent says:
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Yes, Libby. This President has played more golf than the combined 5 before him including Slick Willy. He should be decent by now. By the way, I relieve my stress on weekends by pretending the ball is a liberal. I have been getting about 30 yards more distance on my tee shots. It is amazing what a little anger can do to increase the club head speed.
August 8, 2013 at 12:27 pm
james says:
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Ron, I’ll NEVER defend Bush for anything, thanks to Iraq. But it’s not really how many days of vacation, but what they do. It’s where he goes, how many taxpayer dollars he spends doing it, and most importantly, the image of problem confrontation avoidance he presents while doing it.
Refusing to cut short his time in Hawaii just because Fort Hood got shot up by a home grown Muslim terrorist. Telling our Navy to go shell Ghadaffi and then immdiately bugging out. There’s Martha’s Vinyard, Spain, Colombia, and more.
If, as you say, “it’s not really how many days of vacation”, then why did you previously state, “This President (and don’t forget MEchelle) gets more vacation than any US leader in history.”?
I disputed your statement and cited my source. Can you cite yours indicating President Obama gets more vacation than any U.S. leader in history? None of the sources you provided support that statement.
August 9, 2013 at 8:43 am
Libby says:
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Ron: James will post links to sources that have nothing to do with his statements. I think he thinks if he puts them there it gives him credibility. He doesn’t think we’ll actually look at them.
August 2, 2013 at 4:35 pm
Don't Call Me Shirley says:
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Much the same way that Mitt Romney’s supporters denied or ignored all of the people he has put out of a job over the years, while paying himself millions for running companies into the ground and destroying businesses.
Libby, I want the complete truth and nothing but the truth about Benghazi. You should want the same thing. Did we have a gun running operation going there? Why was there such a CIA presence on the ground at the annex and why didn’t they go to help the Ambassador? No, I don’t want US troops in the quagmire of Syria. We should not intervene and should let Allah sort it all out since they are all bad actors. The most we should offer is humanitarian assistance to the good citizens who flee the country. Assad is bad news and Al Quida is worse.
So, Agent. Let me clarify. You agree 100% with my previous post, then right? Because that’s EXACTLY what it said. Do you argue for argument’s sake or you just can’t stop yourself?
You have done well my prodigy. Accept that it is happening, but deny that it is harmful. That is right out of my playbook. Let us also move all Workers Compensation to exchanges. That will be the final death knell to private enterprise as we know it.
Really FFA, that’s your comment for a sentence which reads in it’s entirety “A top U.S. healthcare official on Thursday challenged claims by Republican lawmakers that the country’s healthcare reform law is causing workers to lose hours or benefits, saying she is aware of only isolated cutbacks”
You simply eliminate the part about challenging Republican lawmakers claims and then attribute the rest of the sentence to her as though that’s the intent of what she said.
You should be ashamed of yourself. This shows clearly that any comment you make can and should be ignored by everyone, regardless of their politics.
InsGuy very wise…..my teenagers have to asked their employers for more hours when they saw their employers still seeking for new hires…..when they asked for more hours, they were simply told, you have too many hours this week –but I guess “minors” and the “types” of jobs they hold — aren’t considered part of the work force….
I mowed lawns, threw papers and any other odd job I could because my family didn’t have two nickels to rub together. We were expected to pitch in and we did. The work ethic was ingrained real deep. Today’s kids, not so much.
I did the same. Two paper routes daily. one in the Am and one after school. My dad was upper mid class – my brother did scam $1.375M and counting out of him, but made me earn my way.
Me too – except the maid thing. I also worked in a Van Conversion shop. Left that because a bunch of Coke Heads were running the place. They were never shy about it including in front of the 15 year old shop hand. Also shoveled a lot of snow…. Blizzard of 79 . Big bucks to me at 16 (for a 16 yr old).
August 2, 2013 at 4:47 pm
Sargeant Major says:
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Hi Agent,
I had a lot of bad jobs. I worked at a gas station which was OK and additionally washed cars behind the station for extra cash. The owner let me keep the car wash money because he sold more gas, oil changes etc when I was there. I also worked on a farm bailing hay in 95 degree weather and worked in a sweat shop machining parts in a non air conditioned building, no union and 12 hour days for less than a third of what the union guys made
August 2, 2013 at 5:18 pm
FFA says:
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Awe Sarge…. I was trying to forget my Farm Days – shoveling out the barn, bailing hay. Oh, the smell of Pig S&^%.
August 2, 2013 at 4:41 pm
Don't Call Me Shirley says:
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You got to have a stick and a bag? Just a little Friday humor. Actually I can relate to taking any work available as a teen. Yardwork and paper routes, until I was able to move up to fast-food.
I lasted 9 days at McDonald’s. When they put me on the french fry station for the third day in a row, I’d had it!
August 2, 2013 at 5:03 pm
Agent says:
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Hi Sergeant, I also worked in a theater as an usher back in the day when they had ushers. In school all day, work nights until the last feature was over. It was a challenge to get the homework done, but I devised some ways to do most of it in study hall at school. I still managed to have good grades and one thing I learned growing up was a very strong work ethic and did not look for a hand out. Still, I couldn’t have gone to college without a scholarship. Today’s kids have no clue what we went through growing up. I am afraid they are going to get a big dose of reality real soon.
August 2, 2013 at 2:48 pm
FFA says:
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I don’t respond to personal attacks. Nor do I dis respect any ones right to their opinion. Its a free country.
Trolling is intentionally saying something inflammatory just to get people agitated and thereby start a “war of words”. As in – the person who does it is a troll.
The past 18 months have really aged me… Feeling the stress & pain every day.
Wedding tomorrow. Good to see that young people actually still believe in that. Of course, the success will be determined by the commitment to the commitment.
In college, took a family & marriage class. Instructor defined marriage by a Commitment to Conflict resolution.
I would be willing to bet that many of the long term marriage have had their share of arguments / disagreements. My marriage is in tact because of our ability to GET OVER IT!
August 9, 2013 at 3:12 pm
jw says:
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“Commitment to Conflict resolution”
That is priceless and oh, so accurate. My 21st anniversary is soon. (this is my second marriage – I didn’t keep the bozo from college)
FFA, can you imagine God looking down on this country right now and blessing it when he sees what is going on with human beings thinking they have all the answers to life’s problems, the Secular movement which is in control currently? This country is on fire, people are at each others throats, do not seek wisdom from God and wonder why their world is falling apart. This blog is just a microcosm for what is going on and it really is sickening how far the society has fallen in a few decades. The country has terrible leadership and has noticeably been in failure mode for many years with no end in sight. My refuge is my church on Sundays. They keep telling me God is in control and I have to believe that.
All you have to do is look in the mirror. You are one of the people perpetuating the vehement disagreements on this blog.
As you have the right to go to your refuge on Sundays, you must respect the rights of those you do not seek wisdom from God. That is upon what this country was built. Religious freedom also means freedom from religion.
As a side note, I am a proud, practicing Catholic who enjoys going to Church on Sundays as well.
Since, as you say, “the country has terrible leadership and has noticeably been in failure mode for many years with no end in sight,” you agree with me that it is not just President Obama.
I disagree with you because your ideas are bad Ron and you don’t have an original thought and have to go to a government website to argue what is right and wrong. I wonder how you balance your Secular agenda with your religious beliefs. I will agree with you that government has been very bad for many years including Democratic & Republican administrations and Congress. The worst part of it started out with Jimmy Carter, we had a brief respite with Ronny and then we had the serial liar/cheater of Clinton, the RINO Bush’s and now we are in the very worst episode of governmental disaster in the nations history.
What ideas have I proposed of which you disagree? I have only presented facts, with a cited source, to dispute much of your rhetoric. That is my only agenda.
Please present any evidence where I have put forth a Secular agenda. My religious beliefs tell me to love and respect others and to not judge. That is God’s job, not ours.
The RINO excuse needs to go away. Just because a Republican doesn’t vote and/or implement policies that cater to your idea of the Republican platform, does not mean they are not Republicans. Did you ever think that once they get into office, they are faced with the reality that compromise is necessary to move the country forward? President Clinton signed welfare reform amd NAFTA. Does that make him a DINO? No, it makes him a reasonable person who understood the need for compromise in politics. Just look at how he worked with the Reopublican Congress to obtain budget surpluses.
August 12, 2013 at 8:40 am
Ron says:
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Agent,
One other thing.
You stated, “we are in the very worst episode of governmental disaster in the nations history.”.
2 Questions:
1. Really? Did you ever hear about the Civil War?
2. Do Republicans bare any responsibility at all for this?
August 9, 2013 at 8:47 am
Libby says:
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“FFA, can you imagine God looking down on this country right now and blessing it when he sees what is going on with human beings thinking they have all the answers to life’s problems, the Secular movement which is in control currently?”
Oh ye of little faith. God has always blessed this world and all his children in it. There has been war and strife and greed and lust since time began. He does not stop loving us and blessing us. Yours is a punitive God. Mine is a loving God.
If He needs to call me today, I’m ready, willing, and able.
August 2, 2013 at 3:07 pm
Captain Planet says:
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Time will tell if this actually hurts American workers or not. I personally do not know of any person who is having hours reduced or their job eliminated due to the PPACA. I am sure there are some out there, but I don’t know of any. What we do know is who the PPACA will help. The millions that are currently not insured, those with pre-existing conditions, young adults up to the age of 26, those that have had lifetime limits exhausted, those who would otherwise be bankrupt as healthcare costs are the number one cause of such financial hardship.
I know of a lot of my clients and family members. One of my clients works for a major national chain. All their 30 hour workers have been notified. We are talking Thousands of people nation wide under one employer.
I am sure IL skews the national average. Our unemployment rate is 2% higher the national average.
I have lost all my Group health except for one or two. Commis used to be 12K + annually. Now – not even close. Lucky if its 2K annually.
What we all know is that Tort Reform would have helped everyone – not just the folks you are pointing out…
FFA, they weren’t about to put in Tort Reform since most of our lawmakers were trial attorneys prior to being elected. That would kill the goose that laid the golden egg. You know what they say, 500 attorneys at the bottom of the ocean is a start.
FFA, I thought it was funny that our current IRS head was testifying before the Senate the other day and said he didn’t want to be on Obamacare either. The head of the enforcement agency of this terrible law doesn’t want it??? Hmm! He likes his gold plated government insurance. It is good for us, but not him.
August 2, 2013 at 3:46 pm
Perplexed says:
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Bureal of Labor Statistics says that we are slowly being converted to a part-time worker society. The conversion accelerated drastilly in the last few months, and especially in June, when part time jobs exploded higher by 360,000 while full time jobs dropped by 240,000.
Of the 953,000 jobs “created” so far in 2013, only 23%, or 222,000 were full-time! Sooo, Planet, even if you don’t know anyone personally that has been affected, you will soon.
Perplexed, did you see the info that came out that Kelly Services is the second biggest employer in the country right behind Wal Mart? Does that tell us anything about what the employment situation is in this country? We are increasing the temps and part timers and decreasing the full time workers. Do you think Kelly Services provides Healthcare to temps and part time workers? I think not. Planet is blissfully ignorant of what is going on. He just keeps whistling a happy tune which reminds me of Emperor Nero who fiddled while Rome was burning.
I noticed yopu make the comment regarding Kelly Services being the #2 emploeyr in the U.S. a couple of times and decided to do some research. Something anyone with an Economics degree would do when presented with a fact.
Here is the history of the number of temporary employees Kelly Services has placed since 2001. This came directly from their Annual Reports on their website, not some blog or Conservative/Liberal website.
2001 – 700K
2002 – 700K
2003 – 700K
2004 – 700K
2005 – 700K
2006 – 750K
2007 – 750K
2008 – 650K
2009 – 480K
2010 – 530K
2011 – 550K
2012 – 560K
Ron, Take notice of the year their labor force reduced! What’s your comment on the BLS information about part time jobs? I’m amazed that Planet can ignore the fact that employers every where, even in Abilene, Tx., where the economy is growing because of the oil & gas industry, are changing full time employees to part time. IT’S HAPPENING.
August 5, 2013 at 12:07 pm
Libby says:
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He’s not ignoring it. He just said he doesn’t know anyone that has had that happen. You guys really ALL need to take an English comprehension lesson.
August 5, 2013 at 12:13 pm
Ron says:
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Perplexed,
I was only presenting facts. My point is that the number of temporary employees hired by Kelly Services is actually down from their all-time high. Agent and the rest of the right are trying to make it sound like this is brand new when it is not.
I just wanted to know why they all of a sudden concerned about the number of temporary employees hired by Kelly Services when the number indicates they should have be more concerned previously.
August 5, 2013 at 11:24 am
InsGuy says:
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I was signed up with Kelly Svcs & AccountTemp back in the 80’s. They both provided healthcare of some sort. If I recall, as long as you so many hours a month within the last 12 mos you qualified. I don’t recall all the particulars but they did provide at way less than full-time hrs.
Agent – Temp and part-time are 2 different things. The BLS report out in March, 2013 clearly states the labor market improved in 2012 and further states there are 114,109,000 full-time workers to 27,661,000 part-time workers. Of those part-time employees, 19,509,000 work part-time because of NON-economic reasons; in other words it’s their choice. Please, please, please STOP regurgitating your conservative poppycock and DO SOME RESEARCH.
True, but that demographic employment shift has nothing to do with Obamacare and everything to do with long-term union-busting, a desire for higher profit margins, and no loyalty toward workers on the part of employers…Truth be told, this alarming trend (not a new phenomenon) illustrates EXACTLY why we need to be able to buy into an affordable health care system…and it WILL be if all participate! For example, Medicare is astoundingly efficient and, once cost-containment provisions more firmly take hold, it will be economical as well.
Yes, Bluegirl. Obamacare is union busting allright. They are jumping up and down at Obama for putting in a plan that will get rid of their gold plated negotiated plans and throw union members to the exchanges. If that happens, many will just drop their union membership and that will be the end of the unions. Jimmy Hoffa, Jr. wants Obama to subsidize union plans. Won’t that be great for the taxpayers? Put the blame where it lies.
You can thank Agent’s idol, Milton Friedman for that, Bluesgirl. That was his theme. Profits at all costs with no regard for the employees that have gotten you where you are.
You are right James. I studied him thoroughly on my way to an Economics degree. Poor Libby likes John Maynard Keynes whose policies have succeeded in bringing this country to the verge of bankruptcy and downgraded credit. She is a willing lemming to jump into the pit of oblivion.
August 2, 2013 at 4:00 pm
FFA says:
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Cap, I know your a big D Rose fan. Was wondering of they showed his interview down your neck of the woods last week.
He was asked who the best player is in the NBA today and he responded D Rose. The guy didn’t even play last year even after his personal doc and team doc cleared him.
He really needs a break out season to get people (teammates included) to forget. Trestman is in the same shoes. already piling up season ending injuries in Bear Camp.
This article is very poorly written and edited; it is very biased toward the PPACA. It makes no mention of the companies that were threatened by the Obama Administration when they announced they would have to restate their financial positions based on the increased costs of the PPACA. It notes the delay till 2015 even though this was not done in compliance with the law; an arbitrary executive decision by Obama, purely political to push off the pain until after the midterm elections.
If we’re going to review the actual impacts of the law, let’s hear Tavenner name which large companies she met with. Certainly if they’re on board, this should cause any issue..it is “the law” ..right?
As the saying goes “there is something rotten in Denmark.”
It is ashame that healthcare in the US has become a political campaign issue.It would be more prudent to find ways to improve the Affordable Healthcare Act of 2010 than to continually have votes to repeal the law. The Affordable Healthcare of Act of 2010 authrozied the creation of a separate entity known as Patient-Centered Outsomes Research Institute and their mission is to fund patient centered research so that patients can be better informed about a specific treatment. I serve as a Patient Reviewer and can report that the applications submitted for medical research funding are 110% patient centered. The intent is to enable the patient more able to make decision on his or her situation. It would border on a crime if this supported research was eliminated. Our elected officials in the Senate and House of Representatives have to get their act together and work to make universal healthcare available to all segments of our population. The political bickering has to stop right now, not tomorrow or the next day.
How absolutely ridiculous this Patient Centered Outcomes Research Institute. Sounds like someone needed a job. Like someone doesn’t already know best for our medical care????? Like perhaps our doctor? I mean do you really think our doctor’s are just gouging the system and that some “Institute” is going to police them???????? We don’t need one more ENTITY involved. Don’t doctor’s generally follow medical research wherein they already know what is successful in terms of treatment? don’t ya bet they already stay up on that? Like we need an Obama created committee to educate our stupid doctors? How stupid is that. I have noticed that liberals get really impressed by “institutes”. The Affordable Care Act authorized all sorts of BS. LIke 28,000 IRS agents. Did you know that the California exchange alone is hiring something like 21,000 employees to administer this exchange? But that California officials were led to believe that they were full time jobs, come to find out they are part time, to avoid providing health insurance. Libs just can’t accept this law sucks.
Where is California getting the money to hire 21,000 employees to administer the exchange? Is Kathleen cutting them a check? They better throw in some Navigator funds as well to walk the applicants through that 10 page app.
No-one really knows how or if this will work. If the “millions” of uninsured people actually do buy insurance and the employers start providing coverage for their employees, this idea may actually work. However, if all that income from the newly insured people does not materialize, this may go down as the biggest failure of this administration. We can all make assumptions, but until it’s tested, we won’t know if it works.
The health rate Have go up 4 time since obamacare was passed.
There is no way the low or middle class can afford health care.
what will happen will is people work less so they can get medicaid for free and cost the goverment more. like when Rome Empire gave free food and the goverment fell.
Im not so much worried about the premiums. What is going to happen to tax rates is my big concern. These yahoos funding countries that don’t even like us. Why????
Green Energy in Africa??? Why??? Don’t we have hungry kids going to bed every night and he is worried about Green Energy in Africa???
Agent said- ” I also worked in a theater as an usher back in the day when they had ushers. In school all day, work nights until the last feature was over. It was a challenge to get the homework done.”
Hi Agent, been out of town, got back last night and thought I would get a chuckle this morning. I came from a tough neighborhood so our job prospects had to be made by the job searcher. I actually liked the gas station. We were full service and I was the guy gassing the cars, washing the windows and checking the oil while the boss was working on cars in the shop. Then when I had 5 minutes I was washing cars or washed them after my shift.
Hey Sargeant, Give me the lowdown on the Accounting lady working for the City of Detroit that got caught after she ripped off the city for $500,000K. Can we say Detroit has been the cesspool of the country for a while now?
FFA, Fill me in on Dixon, Il. I didn’t see that one. How can these people do these things without anyone auditing the books annually? Is Dixon taking bankruptcy because of missing funds?
Comptroller went years and years. She opened up a World Class Horse Breeding organization. Millions for an RV.
A temp busted her. She was on vacation. Something didn’t add up and the games began.
I think the total was $53 Million.
Dixon is getting plenty back from selling the assets. But $53mill??? How does that get missed??? Spanned (I think) 4 mayors.
August 3, 2013 at 12:34 pm
Sargeant Major says:
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Agent, a good story for you. At the station we had some guys who came in decked Caddys or maybe Buicks. These guys were made guys. People knew it but nobody said anything. They would come in and say “Hey kid gas er up”. So I did. Then often they would say, “hey kid can you buff er up?” I always said “sure”. They showed up a lot and I thought I was the best car wash service in Detroit. Ha! Come to find out my boss, the owner had a “relationship/friendship” with them. When I asked how my boss knew them he said they were friends and “traded favors”.
One day I washed a guys car. He was huge and dressed impeccably. He sat on a bench talking with my boss while I washed the car. When the car was done he came out and gave me a $20.00 bill. I said I did not have any change and he said” You don’t need any, keep it”. I about fell over. Then he came up to me, put his arm around me and said ” If anybody ever gives you a hard time you just let me know and I will take care of it”. I said “OK”. When he left I asked my boss about what he said and he said well I have the best security system in town and now you have too.
It seems everyone in that area saw what had happened and I never, ever had a problem with anyone.
Sargeant, when I was in college, during the summer months, I worked at grocery stores stocking, checking, carrying out groceries. I could make enough to last me through the school year, but I had to watch my pennies pretty close. We sold programs at football games to make a little extra as well.
I saw a re-run of Robocop the other night. It made me think of Detroit. In the movie, they were trying to combat crime in “Old Detroit” which was very much like what you have up there right now. Robocop worked cheap and did a lot of bad guys in.
Let’s see..does PPACA help:
-those younger employees who because of the 3:1 age band who will have to pay much more for their insurance?
-those businesses which hesitate about hiring that 50th employee because they know PPACA will add huge overhead?
– all businesses that will pay the health insurance premium tax that the companies will have to pass through?
– those employees who were on a limited benefit plan which is now illegal so the employer cuts back on numbers of employees simply to make ends meet?
– employees who were working more than 30 hours a week but no more?
– the taxpayers who are left footing the bill for the expansion of Medicaid in many states and paying for the subsidies in the exchanges for people making up to 400% of the federal poverty line?
I personally do not know if Taverner is as respected and as nonpartisan as the article states. I do know that she is still touting the Obama party line…we’ll make it work even if it can’t.
Really? When are these people going to come into the real world where people actually do work. I can’t tell you how many people I know have had their hours cut because of this. I am just waiting to see how much I am going to end up paying for this health program on top of what I have to pay for myself. How many years is it going to take the next president to clean up this mess?
My guess is she never visited any small towns. She probably stayed in the bigger towns to get more data. Coming from a small town, most of the smaller business are cutting peoples hours to 25 hours/week to avoid Obamacare. Around here, it definitely isn’t isolated. Just to make a living, people have to juggle two to three jobs with no benefits. I am glad I am not a younger person just entering the job market, but I fear for my children.
I just came from calling on a country club for their insurance renewals. The club is placing all employees as of October on part time status even though they didnt have to do so due to them being at 48 employees. They are having all employees put in 25 hours so they are not subject to the ACA next year. Cancelling their coverage with Blue Cross and Blue Shield and paying them a fixed dollar amount for coverage $250 a month.
The country club set? Cabot says it is a business with 48 employees. That’s a small business. Not a big business. Just because a business is a country club, that does not make them all wealthy or part of what one could call the country club set. Many small business are indeed cutting back on hours as are some large ones. Look at Darden Restaurants, Olive Garden Red Lobster cut back hours a year ago. When these things affect your family, it is not isolated, it’s reality. Something that the government spokesperson in this article fails to acknowledge.
You’ve never heard of a public course where you do not have to be a member?
August 6, 2013 at 7:50 am
jw says:
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TxLady – did you read the original post? Cabot said, “I just came from calling on a country club…”
August 6, 2013 at 12:59 pm
Agent says:
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Libby, it is obvious that you don’t know how Country Clubs operate. They get dues from members to pay their overhead expenses including payroll of employees. When their expenses go up, they have to assess members higher dues. When it gets so high, members resign their memberships and then the club is in big trouble and have to cut payrolls and expenses or they are out of there. I am very familiar with golf clubs since I play all the time. Some in our area have raised their dues and cart fees to try to make it. My club is right on the verge of making it unaffordable to belong there. If it fails, that is more unemployment. I know this is a difficult concept for you and Ron to absorb.
August 6, 2013 at 1:32 pm
Libby says:
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It figures you would be a member of a country club, Agent. And I’m very familiar with how they work, as I have not only insured a few but my brother-in-law is on the board of his club. This club had only 48 employees, so there was no need for them to cut hours to 25 in order to avoid Obamacare. Therefore, it is not because of Obamacare that this is happening. Kind of a hard concept for you and others to understand, too. Not every cut in the budget is because of Obamacare.
August 5, 2013 at 1:47 pm
Ron says:
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Cabot,
Sounds like the country club is doing this more out of spite than to avoid a penalty since they automaically avoid the penalty by having less than 50 full-time employees.
Sounds like a sound business decision to me. 50 employees this year could very well turn into 25 next and so on and so on till they get the number right.
Wonder where we are landing for the tax rate to cover what seemingly will be shortfalls on the budget.
I recently applied for a 2nd job working evenings at Sears (yes, some of us are willing to work two jobs). I found out in the interview process they do not offer more than 29 hours per week to ANY employee outside of the Store Manager. The reason; They flatly stated the cost of Obamacare was prohibitive and they will no longer offer ANY positions outside of a single Store Manager over 29 hours per week.
At one time, Sears was a very large Employer. Now, their ‘Homegoods’ stores are commission only, and while they have a limit of 29 hours per week, they will not work you close to 29 hours in fear of going over the limit. I was told the most I could expect was 20-24 hours per week. Whether you are for or against Obamacare, this is sad news.
Sears isn’t the only company doing this. We have an insane number of people in the 16-22 range who cannot find a job. If they are fortunate, they will get on part time somewhere working 15 to 20 hours per week. Papa John’s and Denny’s are both following Sears. While neither is a place someone wants to be employed full time, at least it was an option for those desperate for work. Not anymore.
Maybe if Sears and other retailers were to take a page from Costco’s book they would not be having so many troubles to the point where they are cutting more from its employees.
Pay and respect your employees and they will stay and perform. In addition you will have 100 people waiting for each employee’s job if they underperform.
My Client that got her hours cut works at Home Depot.
When I was a Cost Co member, customer service was so bad I cancelled my membership card and renewed with Sams.
Just like the employees at Hobby Lobby who would have liked birth control to be covered by their health insurance, your client should just go somehere else to work, maybe Costco.
Ron, she lives in IL where the unemployment rate is consistently 2% higher then the national average.
She is looking for anything to replace the hours she lost. It now makes it necessary for her to have three jobs.
All was well before Obama Care with her being able to afford her bills.
BTW, Poor Customer Service was my one encounter there at my local location.
When a service rep says I don’t know and walks away with out any effort, its enough for me.
Additionally, my wife did not like the product mix there. So, it was an easy decision to cancel my card.
We just got a Costco. I love it! It’s an hour away, so I don’t get to shop there very often. I’m very glad I haven’t had customer service problems. That is one thing I will confront immediately. Just because it’s not my strong suit doesn’t mean I will put up with crap.
August 6, 2013 at 8:18 pm
james says:
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Ron, this is called anecdotal evidence. Kudos to ANY business that pays well and respects its employees!
But the vast majority of them are worried about just staying in business. Costco is in an industry with high barriers to entry, hence less competition.
FFA, the Progressives on this site just blame corporate greed on what is going on. They just can’t understand that businesses all across this country are having issues with this terrible bill and are taking the necessary steps to stay in business. It is basically a cost cutting strategy to offset increased expenses coming their way. You and I know as agents that we haven’t seen any overhead expenses come down in the past 4 years. Our payroll, utilities, rent, E&O, Commercial Package, Internet connection have all gone up along with many companies cutting our commissions in some areas. We are expected to do more with less and sell more to stay even. P&C customers are having to pay more for renewals and it is a tougher sell in this economy.
I was able to find rent MUCH CHEAPER as the vacancy rate is out of this world high in this town. Rents have to come down and land lords look to minimalize the loss and avoid foreclosure.
City Hall don’t seem to give a darn as they try and push forward with another Commercial Development. One developer after another decline their offer. City Hall refuses to let land lords rent to whom ever is willing to rent from them. They want retail. No retail is moving in. Most have closed their doors.
That’s a double edged sword. You’re benefiting from the vacancies, but it is sad that there are so many vacancies.
August 6, 2013 at 10:44 am
Agent says:
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UCT, he promised us when he was first elected that he would fundamentally transform America. How do we like being fundamentally transformed now? Economic malaise, higher taxes, a part time work society and a President who has no concept of how to grow an economy. By the way, Congress and the President agreed to take care of Congressional staffers so they won’t have to worry about the big increases in their healthcare premiums.
I am still waiting for you to answer my question regarding the number of temporary workers Kelly Services has placed year by year since 2001.
Please list all of the Presidents with a business/economics background and the economic data while they were in office.
Example, since we are holding President Obama responsible for the current economy, you must do the same for any past President. Meaning, President Hoover does not get credit for what happened during FDR’s administration and President Reagan does not get credit for what happened during President Clinton’s administration even if it was their policies that lead to those positive economic conditions.
Since you have an Economics degree, you should know how to do the research.
Ron, if you were a student of real history instead of revisionist history, you wouldn’t have to go to some of your government websites to prove your points. It is much easier to pick the Progressive President’s who put in the disastrous spending policies than it is for Conservatives who had some business sense. The list starts with Teddy Roosevelt,Woodrow Wilson, FDR ( one of the worst), then in the modern era Jimmy the peanut farmer, Clinton and now Obama. Some of the RINO’s were Nixon, Bush Sr., Bush Jr. who only half believed and did RINO things and adopted some of the Keynsian spending/prime the pump philosophy that has this country in such a mess. Ronny was the best even if you disagree. He followed Milton Friedman and the great Al Laffer on economic policy. You know what, people criticized Eisenhower because he didn’t do much, but the nation’s economy was growing during his tenure and that was a good thing. The government that governs least governs best in my opinion. Obviously, the government that governs most governs the worst as we see the graphic examples every day now.
Friedman. Hmmm. Wasn’t he the creator of the “World’s Dumbest Idea”???
August 6, 2013 at 4:31 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
So, once again you are unable to answer my questions.
That is why you little to no credibility.
Are you sure your degree is not in Philosophy?
Are you referring to President Reagan who doubled the national debt, increased spending by 2.5% per year and added over $1 trillion to our debt? In addition, he signed bills that increased taxes and spent more (22.4% of GDP), than President Carter (20.8% of GDP).
Would Friedman approve of Reagan’s spending increases? I highly doubt it.
August 6, 2013 at 11:09 pm
jw says:
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Man, it is so funny to read “revisionist history” in a post. No matter which side someone believes, in their minds the other side believes “revisionist history.” LOL
August 6, 2013 at 11:57 am
Libby says:
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You have a very skewed perception of reality, Agent. The economic malaise started under the previous administration. You can’t possibly blame that mess on Obama. And things have IMPROVED under his leadership. I understand not fast enough for you, but according to projections he is on target. And if you had bothered to read my post about the BLS report, you would see that we DO NOT have a part-time work society. In fact, the majority of part-timers WANT to be part-time. Healthcare for everyone? Just a pipe dream 5 years ago. Now becoming a reality. THAT is MY version of reality.
Whose reality is skewed Libby? We have had 6 years of economic malaise created by Progressives who have had control of Congress and the White House. Big spending Keynsian spending has only added to the malaise. Obama is on target allright to take this economy right on down. This country never got out of the recession no matter what you say. You may be happy with 1% growth, widespread unemployment, a part time workforce, big increases in healthcare and all other cost of living expenses, but I am not. Bernanke and his Fed boys are perpetrating the next big financial bubble as we speak with his “quantitative easing” printing money 24/7 and inflation on interest rates will be starting in October. It will make the crisis of 08-09 look small by comparison. Mark my words, you will not like the results.
I think the latest statistic speaks volumes of the new jobs added to the economy since 2009 90% are part time jobs. This dispite the efforts by the Fed to make money available to companies to expand and grow. Perhaps in the future our employees, ie. congress will read a bill, and know what is in it before they pass it as law. It would also be nice if they considered the the ramifications and outcomes of the bill before they voted for or against it, but that would require them to live in the real world.
“The number of persons employed part time for economic reasons (sometimes referred to as involuntary part-time workers) was essentially unchanged at 8.2 million in July. These individuals were working part time because their hours had been cut back or because they were unable to find a full-time job. (See table A-8.)”
Leave it to Libby the Liberal to cite the Bureau of Labor Statistics to try to justify the terrible unemployment/underemployed in this country. They have been cooking the books for the last three years not reporting all the citizens who have dropped out of the workforce or are working part time to make ends meet. If the real figures were used, we have in excess of 15% unemployment/underemployment in this country and growing. I don’t know about the other Conservatives on this blog, but I don’t trust bureaucrats in this administration to give me the true picture of what is going on. I look at what business is doing and there are numerous stories of businesses cutting back, limiting hours or laying people off.
That is how you earn credibility. At least give people the option to review where you get your information, then they can form their own opinion based on that information.
Ron, I wish I could trust my government to give me the straight scoop on what is going on, but they haven’t earned my trust at all for the past 6 years. You are like a lamb being led to slaughter and just believe anything they say. Almost anything you and Libby post have a government website to try to prove your point. Anyone with common sense knows we have been consistently lied to by government on about everything. You probably think Jay Carney is giving the truth on every news conference he has done the past 3 years. Not so much and he has been caught lying, but just shrugs his shoulders or says it is under investigation, kind of like the other minions of this administration who say I don’t know, can’t recall or it is under investigation.
August 7, 2013 at 8:05 am
Ron says:
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Agent,
They are the only ones who provide any data whatsoever. Remember, these are not political appointees. They are career civil servants who work during several administrations, both Republican and Democrat. Do you have any actuual proof that they are cooking the books or is that just what O’Reilly, Hannity, and Gallagher are telling you? All you provide are Republican talking points and empty rhetoric. Talk about a lamb. Do you do any research? If so, you should be able to cite a source.
I do not trust any one single source for information and take any political appointee with a grain of salt due to their personal agenda.
August 7, 2013 at 9:00 am
Libby says:
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Agent – I was not justifying anything. Only proving that the statements on here about part-time work taking over the country are false. Are employers cutting back? Some of them are, but many are not. My office has hired at least 5 new people in the past 4 months. Mostly in the benefits arena where they see a fantastic opportunity in the future. That’s what smart business people do. They take a challenge and turn it into an opportunity. Not like your kind that just sit around bitching and moaning about everything but doing nothing.
I’m sure the picture is not as rosy as I portray, but neither is it the doom and gloom that you portray. I would venture to say the truth lies somewhere in the middle.
August 7, 2013 at 9:29 pm
b says:
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Ron, if you’re going to cite politics, being that you mention all these Presidents, look at the big picture. President Reagan ran up the deficit, as did Jimmy Carter before him. But he did it to win the Cold War. And guess what? We WON. If Clinton hadn’t squandered that, we wouldn’t be worried about terrorists in every city and airport. Not that Bush helped. I did NOT vote for him in 2004.
Why is deficit spending OK to fight wars, but not help Americans who are hungry, sick and struggling? If the wars are important enough to fight, then they should be important enough to raise taxes to pay for it.
August 7, 2013 at 9:15 pm
james says:
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Australia has stringent immigration? Not until recently. Wonder why in 2011-12, India sent 29,018, and China sent 25,509? My mom’s boyfriend, an Australian, told me about all the desperate Indonesians who wanted to get on the welfare rolls. The people going there are not wealthy or looking for high quality healthcare.
So you want some statistics Ron? Following is posted from an article by Larry Elder, a noted author and radio show host who is a black man by the way. He is one of the few that see what is going on so he wrote the article after research. It is titled: When Will They See That This Is One Bad Recovery?
Fact1 – First Quarter gross domestic product numbers for 2013 were revised downward from 1.8% to 1.1%. Comparing from the last deep recession in 81-82,the recovering economy grew at 4.1%
Fact 2 – Labor Participation Rate – When Obama took office, it stood at 65.7%. After 4 1/2 years of malaise, it is 63.4% a 34 year low.
Fact 3 – Food Stamps – 47.5 million today and increasing 13% a year from 2008-12.
Fact 4 – 9 million on Social Security Disability, double the number of the late 90’s – – many admitting they could work, but chose not to look.
Fact 5 – Just to keep pace with new entrants into the job market, the economy must produce 150,000 new jobs per month. With Obama’s four years of recovery, the average monthly jobs created is 97,020 compared with the recovery of 81-82 of 233,333 per month.
Compare these appalling statistics to Reagan who dug us out of the Jimmy Carter mess. He cut taxes dramatically, reduced spending and the economy took off. In three years, civilian employment was increased 8.9% and 9 million jobs created. I know these facts will not make a dent in your Progressive brain, but I was willing to try.
Did Conservative commentator Larry Elder cite his sources? I would be interested to know where he gets his information.
Why is the fact that he is black relevant? The Republicans are the ones who keep preaching that all black people vote for Democrats. I know that there are many black Republicans and Conservatives. Is that a shock to you?
Is it your opinion that all black people agree all of the time? Do you just start foaming at the mouth every time a black man disagrees with President Obama and his policies because it provides concrete support for your position?
Besides, there are a lot of white people who have railed against Republicans. Many times with unfounded rhetoric.
Please quote me where I was championing the recovery and Obama’s efforts? My biggest issues with the Republicans are as follows:
1. They kept saying that President Obama made things worse when most economic indicators showed some improvement. If they did not like the rate of the recovery, then fine. But to say it got worse is just disingenuous. I have asked multiple time of metrics, with a source cited, showing economic indicators that got worse and all I received was higher unemployment in IL.
2. Since their number one priority was to make President Obama a one-term President, I believe it is possible that they have purposely sabotaged any idea President Obama had that could have improved the recovery.
3. They will take zero responsibility for their part in the current political stagnation and negative cultural in Washington, DC. Do the Senate Democrats and President Obama bear some responsibility? ABSOLUTELY!
4. Their position that deficit spending is OK to fight wars, but not to help Americans who are hungry, sick and struggling. Just as Jesus would have wanted it, right?
Did the Democrat controlled Congress play any role in the recovery during Reagn’s administration, or was he a dictator and did whatever he wanted? You do realize that changes to taxes and spending start in Congress, right? At least the Congress back then gave something for President Reagan to sign. What has this Congress, including the Senate Democrats, given President Obama?
Ron, the legislation never makes it past Harry Reids desk and is not debated or voted on. It is pretty hard to get anything to a Presidents desk if it is dumped in the waste basket. By the way, the now infamous Harry Reid said last weekend that the Republicans are blocking the President’s agenda because he is African American. How racist is that? I am not making this up Ron. It is from his own lips and I heard it and was in disbelief this so called leader is still in the government. It is Obama’s policies that are being opposed Ron and has nothing to do with him being African American.
He hopes Republicans who oppose the president do so “based on substance and not the fact that he’s an African-American.”
So he didn’t come out and accuse them of racism, just said he hoped it wasn’t because of racism. I know, it is splitting hairs, but if you are going to quote someone it’s important to quote them correctly.
August 12, 2013 at 4:32 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
If you believe that President Obama’s race plays no part in the obstruction of his policies, you are extremely naive. It may not necessarily be the legislators themselves, but I would wager a whole lot of money that their financial backers are still fuming that someone with African heritage is the President.
All he said was, “I say this seriously. I hope it’s based on substance, and not the fact that he is African American.” That is a HUGE difference than saying that the Republicansd ARE blocking his agenda because he is black.
Really? CNSNews. The RIGHT new. RIGHT now? Surely, you jest.
Besides, this article fails to prove Obamacare hurts workers. Only that some carriers will not participate in some states. It plainly states Georgia has 5 participants even after Aetna and Coventry withdrew. Surely you will be able to find an option with one of five carriers.
If you really want Aetna, go to them directly. But chances are, they will be more expensive.
james, I agree with you to a point. I am a Blue Cross agent and they are totally in bed with Obama and are actively promoting the enrollment of young people into the Exchanges because their CEO said they weren’t making any money on Individual Health now so they are in favor of doing it because it is subsidized. I know there are several Blue Cross divisions spread out, but the Home Office is in Illinois so you can make the connection.
Agent – They may not be for much longer. Trend continues, they will be out of here soon.
Read the writing on the wall at State Farm. If they do leave, watch our unemployment rate soar. Bloomington area is consistently 4% lower on the unemployment rate then the rest of the state.
So Ron, I take it that you approve of what Reid said since you didn’t say anything to the contrary. Why would the leader of the Senate say what he did if he weren’t race baiting? You should know how politicians speak by now. That statement was totally uncalled for and the inference was very clear. Wake up Ron. Harry Reid is a bad character and you know it.
I did not approve nor disapprove. I only corrected you. Who do you think you are, misquoting a United States Senator. You may criticize anyone you want, but at least be honest.
Maybe Senator Reid was being honest about how he felt. You have mentioned of the unprecedented dysfunction in Washington. We have gone through more difficult economic, political and cultural times in the past. The only thing different is the race of the President. If you think that is purely coincidence, you are very naive. I am not saying it is all about race, but to think it has nothing to do with it is disingenuous.
How come you do not respond directly to what I post when I challenge you? Is it because all you have is empty rhetoric with no credible support?
I respectfully request you stop using any labels (Progressive, Liberal, etc.) about me unless you have evidence to support such a claim. I am a proud Independent.
I got the answer I was expecting from you Ron. You officially approve of race baiting from the Democratic side. They have only been doing this for 4+ years. Anyone disagreeing with the policies of this President has to be a racist, right? I had to laugh when you posted that perhaps Reid was being honest about how he “felt”. It is all about feelings with Democrats. I have about concluded that your mother must have dropped you on your head as a baby for you to turn out the way you did. If you are an Independent, you are about the most left leaning Independent on any of these forums.
Once again your lack of reading comprehension skills is on display.
I have not approved of any race baiting, but I do believe there are many people who oppose President Obama because of his race. Do you really believe that everybody that grew up in the 50’s and 60’s has accepted the fact that we have a President with African roots?
However, I will agree with you that most people who oppose him do so because his policies would adversly affect them personally.
I can honestly say that I am better off now than I was in 2008. He has done nothing to make my life worse. You can preach fear and doomsday all you want, I make my decisions based on facts and results. If you cannot provide any facts (with a cited source) that dispute mine, you lose.
The fact that you will not acknowledge that President Obama’s race has played even a small role in his opposition is evidence that you are ignorant and a racist.
I find it amazing that you say it is all about feelings with Democrats, yet you very rarely support your feelings with facts. Then you, “concluded that your mother must have dropped you on your head as a baby for you to turn out the way you did.” How can you be so disrespectful? You know absolutely nothing about my mother, her ability to raise a child, or me.
Why must you resort to insults? You have lost the small amount of credibility you had with me.
August 13, 2013 at 2:46 pm
Agent says:
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Ron, Why weren’t you outraged about Reid’s race baiting which is so obvious? I don’t want you to say you haven’t approved of race baiting. I want you mad about it like I am. You paint with a broad brush about everyone growing up in the 50’s & 60’s not accepting a President with African roots. Are there racists out there who didn’t want Obama elected? Yes, but I wasn’t one of them. I gave him a pass for about 3 months in his first campaign when he told Joe the Plumber we had to spread the wealth around. Reading more about his nefarious background convinced me he was not the man for the job. Everything he has done since reinforces that belief. Reid is a useful far left idiot who has protected him at every turn by not allowing debate or vote on a lot of legislation to send to his desk so he won’t have to veto it. I am glad to see you agree on one point that most people oppose him based on his agenda and what he has rammed down our throats that are killing this economy and nation. By the way, one of the worst racists ever in the Senate was the now deceased Robert Byrd, D-WV who was active in the KKK back in the day and didn’t apologize for it for 40 years until right before his death.
August 13, 2013 at 3:29 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
You said, “You officially approve of race baiting from the Democratic side.”, then you said, “I don’t want you to say you haven’t approved of race baiting. I want you mad about it like I am.”. Make up your mind.
There are things that I am upset with Senator Reid about, not bringing up some bills passed by the House for example, but I just do not see this as race baiting. I think anyone who takes his statement as anything more than a concern about possible racism influencing decisions, is looking for more than what is there. I tend to agree that he brought a legitimate concern of many Americans from all races.
Thank you for acknowledging that race has played a part in the opposition to Obama by some people.
I never meant to say you were against President Obama because of race, only that you would be racist if you thought race played no part in his opposition.
I am assuming that you mentioned Senator Byrd as a racist only because he was a Democrat. What are the chances an old white guy from WV could be a racist, regardless of political party affiliation? Shocking!
Not sure why that is relevant to bring up to me. I do not recall ever saying only Republicans could be racist.
As I have asked several times in the past, do you have any quantifiable proof, with a cited source, that his policies are killing this economy and nation. I know you gave me statistics presented by Larry Elder and I read the article. However, he did not cite any of his sources.
I would be especially be interested in something showing that the wealth has been spread around. The ACA does not count since it has not gone into full effect yet.
Finally, are you going to apologize for insulting my late mother?
August 13, 2013 at 3:57 pm
Libby says:
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Agent, I was crucified on this blog when I suggested Sarge caught a piece of shrapnel in his head to explain his sorry a*s. How dare you speak of someone’s mother! That’s disrepectful and rude. You need to apologize. Immediately.
August 13, 2013 at 5:12 pm
Agent says:
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Ron, once again you fail the test to condemn Harry Reid for his obvious racist remarks. You say you are upset that he hasn’t passed on legislation that should have been debated and voted on, but don’t see anything racist about him. This man is the worst example of a majority leader in the Senate’s history and all you are upset about is his lack of action on legislation. I am really tired of people calling Conservatives or Republicans racists if they disagree with Obama’s policies. This has really divided the country. Race warfare, class warfare is the mantra being used. I do apologize about the mother comment. You tend to stir me up sometimes with your comments.
August 14, 2013 at 7:59 am
Ron says:
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Agent,
Typical of a Republican. Your sole goal is the get someone to condemn another, not try to improve things.
What are your feelings about Senator McConnell’s statement after President Obama was elected that their number one goal was to make him a one-term President? Can you be any more disrespectful? Another Republican failure. What about the goal of getting the country back on track from the financial collapse?
Please provide some evidence, other than his statement, that indicates Senator reid is a racist. That statement itself is not racist. He is only concerned that racism may have played some role in the opposition to President Obama. If all of the opposition is truly based on substance and not race, then why should you or any other Republican or Conservative be offended by the comment?
I would much rather fail for not condemning someone who said something that many Americans, including me, are concerned about than fail to provide support for my feelings. That is where you constantly fail. You spread Republican and Conservative talking points and empty rhetoric and your only source(s) come from right-wing, Conservatives with no data to back them up. Can I assume you will continue this approach or will you actually do some research and provide facts to back up your positions?
If you truly have a degree in Economics you should know the importance of providing statistical support, and citing your source, for your arguments.
I accept youer apology. You also stir me up too, but I believe in civil discourse and respectful debate. Even though Libby and Captain have tossed around some insults to some of you on the right, most insults come from Bob, Sarge, Patti, Sarah, and you.
If they’re really concerned about the work-force issue as opposed to political grand-standing, here’s the test.
Have them publish a rule or revision that says 50 or more employees OR 2,000 TOTAL WEEKLY WORKER HOURS. This way it would apply whether you have 50 ppl working 40 hrs/wk; 35 ppl working 58 hrs/wk; or 80 ppl working 25 hrs/wk.
How about just repealing a bad law that the vast majority of the citizens do not want or support?
The majority of Americans are IN FAVOR of healthcare for all citizens. Again, where do you get your information???
As evidenced by ten people disliking your comment, and only three people liking it, i’d say about three times as many americans disagree with obamacare.
The insurance industry is notoriously right-wing, so I expect that on this forum. There have been plenty of articles out about it and I stand by my statement. After all, Obama didn’t get a second term for nothin.
Americans want FREE healthcare; there is NO SUCH THING. Every country that has FREE health care also has a significantly higher taxbase. If we include it in your taxes, it SEEMS free….
I don’t expect free health insurance and I don’t think the majority of the majority expect it to be free either.
That’s true, Libby. I guess they’re satisfied with their free Obama phones.
Libby, the American People may favor some form of a Healthcare fix, but they are against Obamacare in poll after poll. The last one I saw was AP and it is now 54% against, about 40% for and the rest undecided. I have a feeling that the undecided will come out against shortly as more an more people will be disillusioned with hours getting cut or joining the unemployed ranks as more and more employers have to do what they can to stay in business.
Agent – If you read correctly, that is exactly what I said. The majority are in favor of healthcare for all citizens. I did not mention Obamacare.
Libby,
Agent’s lack of reading comprehension gets extremely frustrating sometimes. Maybe we need to use smaller words and type slower.
So Libby, you say you are in favor of Healthcare Reform and you didn’t mention Obamacare. Do you now agree that it is a disaster or what Max Baucus (D) called a train wreck? Do you see the potential that it will ruin the health system in this country? I expect you to come back and trumpet its merits just like Ron tends to do. By the way, if you think Great Britains system is a good model to follow, you are further gone than I thought.
I think Obamacare has some issues and they need to be addressed. But no, I am not in favor of repealing it and would not characterize it as a “train wreck.” I, too, wish we had gone to single-payor, universal healthcare in this country. But the Republicans are the ones that fought that tooth and nail. So now you are stuck with Obamacare and you still don’t like it. Even though the mandate and the exchanges were all Republican ideas.
I’m not sure what you people want, except as Celtica said “that the GOP would prefer that only GOP members be able to afford health care insurance, so as to kill off everyone else. It will be the only way that they can win elections.”
Agent,
Here we go again. Please quote me where I trumpeted the ACA. Oh yeah, you can’t.
Either be prepared to back your assertions about me and my positions with evidence or stop making them.
I have mentioned in the past that I do not like the ACA, but at least the Democrats are trying to do something to fix our broken healthcare system. What were the Republicans doing when they had control of all 3 branches of government? Oh yeah, they were overseas fighting terrorists.
Sarge has struck again, so I’ll re-post:
The majority of Americans are IN FAVOR of healthcare for all citizens. Again, where do you get your information???
Libby, everyone is in favor of healthcare. The question is, at what quality and cost? I know people who lived in Britain and Canada, and though they’re great people, all they can say about the national health service there is bad.
Some people even moved here BECAUSE we have quality healthcare. Don’t expect that to last if Obamacare is implemented. And I wonder why it’s taking so long? Can you say bureaucracy?
Why it’s taking so long? It’s on track for 10/1/13 last I heard; the original date for implementation.
I, too, have spoken to people from Canada and U.K. and have not heard those negative stories. So I guess it’s all in who you talk to about it.
I don’t KNOW anyone in the UK or Australia, but I regularly read the blog of an author in the UK and have friends on Goodreads from Australia and some of the EU countries. These people have all, at one time or another, had positive comments about their healthcare options. Not one of them has said they would like to try the US way. In fact, the author I follow was championing the UK healthcare for her diabetic husband and autistic son. Two things that are expensive for the patient in the US.
I am all for a single payor/universal health care system. The system we have now is broken. No doubt someone would discount my reasoning to an emotional decision. They’d be right. I won’t apologize for what I feel.
Good comment, InsGuy. Way to think outside the box.
I guess I must have hit home Libby & Ron. Any criticism of your favorite Healthcare law and you jump right to the attack. Go crawl in a hole Ron. The majority of Americans don’t like this Obamanation and you just can’t stand it.
“my favorite Healthcare law”??? It’s the ONLY Healthcare law. I will not apologize for being pro-Universal Healthcare. What kind of citizen would not be?
“What kind of citizen would not be” you ask? The kind of citizen that believes in the open, free market…the kind of citizen that believes in Capitalism and not the Government cramming something down their throats that they don’t want.
Patti,
Please tell me the last time this country functioned with an open, free market?
Hint: you probably weren’t born yet.
Maybe you should take a page from Hawaiian employers:
“In interviews, leaders and employers in Hawaii referred with surprising earnestness to an “aloha spirit” and a sense of familial obligation known as ohana to justify providing care to nearly everyone.”
You need a little ohana in your life P.C. Maybe then you wouldn’t be such a cold-hearted scrooge.
May I ask Libby where universal health care has been a resounding or even a moderate success? and If it is auch a great thing why millions of immigrants are not flocking to those countries. perhaps we could save the government a little money and the government could just buy tickets and the first three months living expenses for those who want universal healthcare and aid them in their pursuit of happiness.
Although I know you will all argue with me, how about U.K, Canada, and Australia for starters? I’ve already done all the research and posted my sources on another thread, so please don’t ask me to do it again. None of you right-wingers read them anyway.
Just an FYI – all those countries that Libby mentioned have much stricter immigration laws. Especially Australia. So, that is most likely why there isn’t a hoard of unwashed masses heading for the UK, Canada or Australia.
By the way, I haven’t done any research on universal health care, I just happen to read about immigration recently.
So Libby, perhaps you or Ron will give us some metrics on whether the workers will get hurt on the newest delay regarding the out of pocket expenses which are due to rise. Yes, it is all over the internet and even the NY Times has an article on it. Supposedly, the ACA put down strict guidelines in the bill for maximum out of pocket expenses of $6,350 per Individual and $12,700 per family. Now, companies will be allowed to set their own out of pocket maximums and some may not have a maximum at all. When we have markets who have to take all the PreX’s out there sure to enroll, I would bet that most markets will have much higher out of pocket expenses on the plans offered. Will this hurt workers or not?
Typical politician, if they are afraid of the truth call it anecdotal. She is “out there” I agree with that but not how she meant it.
1) Employers do not announce that they are cutting hours and jobs to avoid the insurance burden
2) Employees have no where to turn if it is done because it is not illeagal. So just suffer.
3) Does it happen? Ask the restaurant workers in Massachusetts if they are now part time.
4)Where do our “leaders” think the money comes to pay the new Tax (that is what SCOTUS called it)? It comes from the Employers income. If that means he does not have any or only a small percentage of what he had before why should he pay it?
5) Health Care for all is a Good Idea Funded Wrong. By a bunch of dopes who exempted themselves from the law they passed.
Libby, it is interesting that you mention the Great State of Hawaii who are so benevolent and have such an Aloha spirit that they are offering all the more unfortunate citizens a one way ticket back to the mainland since they don’t want to support them anymore. You criticize employers for cutting back employee hours calling them greedy and here we have a whole state dumping people entirely.
Please explain what, exactly, you are saying and your source for this statement.
I was referring to the article provided by CalDude about Hawaii’s employer mandate to provide health insurance to all workers over 20 hours. Perhaps you’d like to take a look at how well that system works for the Great State of Hawaii. Then comment.
Libby, I can’t force you to watch the news and I doubt CNN has run a story on it, but it is all over the internet. Hawaii thinks it is a good idea to get rid of the unfortunate by giving them a one way plane ticket. Does this sound like a good idea? I thought liberals wanted to take care of these poor people, not send them away.
All over the internet??? I couldn’t find ONE story on this. So, I will be unable to comment on something I can not find any information on. Like most of your statements, I will take this one with a grain of salt since it is obviously skewed and lopsided. If it is as jw portrays, then I don’t see anything wrong with what Hawaii is doing. Aren’t you from Texas where you want to throw everyone out? I would think you’d be applauding Hawaii and leading a bandwagon in your state to follow in their footsteps.
Libby, You won’t find it on the Huffington Post. Even jw found it. I thought Democrats were all about helping the downtrodden. Had a Republcan government done this, you would be all over them for throwing away people and sending them away.
Agent – I googled it, so I wasn’t just looking at liberal sites for this. And yes, liberals are about helping the downtrodden but not EVERY down and out person. That would be impossible. Sending someone living on the beach back to their home (as long as it’s not dangerous for them) is not cruel and unusual. They are not U.S. citizens. And you know I have said I don’t think we need to be the world police &/or savior.
Libby, it is true. But like I mentioned in my reply to Agent, it’s all about tourism.
How do you know these poor unfortunate souls are not US citizens? Did you know that we are letting more Mexicans in at the border if they say they are asking for political asylum from the cartels? That is a novel approach for letting more illegals in, isn’t it. Much safer than swimming the river or tunneling under. They are being put up in hotels at our expense. They will then be shown how to apply for food stamps, Obamacare and whatever else they want to get on the dole.
I’m calling bullsh*t on that. Cite a source or shut up.
Hawaii isn’t sending back the citizens who were born there. They are trying to get the people who moved to Hawaii to live on a beach to leave. Why? Hello! It interferes with tourism. Who wants to go to the beach and deal with the bums. I am serious, these people moved to Hawaii thinking they could live on the beach. This has been an issue for decades and I have no problem with the government sending people back to their real homes.
The bottom line is that to cater to 15% of the US population Congress has fouled up healthcare for the other 85%.
She says “that the country’s healthcare reform law is causing workers to lose hours or benefits, saying she is aware of only isolated cutbacks”.
So, they are aware that people are getting their hours cut and still deny that this is hurting people.
More OBama Speak.
Hey FFA, I happened to hear on the radio today that our wonderful Congress, who is taking their August vacation along with the President suddenly reached an agreement to help out their Congressional staffers with Obamacare premiums since their costs are due to rise dramatically. This has been brewing for a while and many of the staffers said they would have to leave government if they had to pay for the outrageous premiums coming their way. It is always about them. What help is the rest of America getting? All we get is the shaft from government.
Go figure. If this was such a good thing, Congress would be jumping on OBama Care too… Great for us, why not them????
They already have insurance, FFA. They don’t need insurance through an exchange. Same as me. I already have insurance, so this law won’t affect my coverage.
Actually Libby, the staffers were brought in under Obamacare and will be losing their gold plated coverage as a benefit. Why do you think they are making such a big deal about this? They have to apply under the exchanges and costs are much more so their bosses all got together to get them taken care of. I wonder how much this will cost the taxpayers for the 2,000+ staffers on the Congressional payroll.
What it’s been costing all along, I suppose. Government perks. I don’t like them any more than you do.
Keep telling yourself that, Libby. You just keep on telling yourself that….
Agent,
The President NEVER gets a vacation. They need to be ready 24/7 to handle an emergency or crisis. That also applies when President Bush was breaking records for taking “vacations” to his ranch and every other President before them.
Ron, it is obvious you have had a hard week by your comment. The President never gets a vacation?? Your President stays on vacation most of the year. I hardly think GW’s little trips to Waco to chop wood and ride his dirt bike cost the taxpayers anything like the Hawaii, Martha’s Vineyard vacations Obama takes. Why can’t your President just go to Camp David for some relaxation at the already paid for retreat? It is also just a short helicopter ride. That is what GW did and that is fine with me. He also didn’t rent entire golf clubs in Florida to get a lesson with Butch Harmon and play with Tiger Woods.
Agent,
Will you EVER be able to comprehend what I write? Where did I state that the President never goes anywhere? I made no comment about how any President spends their time away from the Oval office. I only made the comment that they are on call 24/7/365. What I meant is that he never can get away and forget about work.
Talk about being away from work, how about Congress, Republicans and Democrats.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/08/01/politics/congress-work-time/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
Ridiculous
In fact, he is playing golf as we speak. They showed an iron shot he hit on one of the holes. I don’t think the ball made it past the ladies tee. When Tiger played with him in Florida, all he said was the President was a decent putter. That speaks volumes to me about his tee to green game.
Who gives a sh*t how good of a golfer he is? I don’t want a President too good at golf because that’s a game you don’t play well without a lot of practice. I want him running the country, not playing golf. But with that said, everyone is entitled to a little relaxation. Even you go golfing to relax and you don’t have one nth of the stress he does.
Ron,
Yes an active president should be ready 24/7 to handle emergencies and crisis moments…. where was he during the Benghazi attacks???
Suze,
That tragedy and the response are 2 my critcisms of President Obama. That should not have occurred and should have been handled much better.
Actually, he was at the White House during Benghazi, but they can’t account for what he was doing. Maybe he was out back practice putting on the green. I hardly think he was in the situation room since he took no action to save the Ambassador and the Seals. A new report is out that up to 22 CIA operatives were on the ground in Benghazi. Why did they make no attempt to help. I submit that 22 of them could have handled the terrorists and driven them off. Why are these people being hidden now, subjected to polygraphs and told to keep their mouths shut? This “phony” scandal seems to have more to it than they want told.
Suze, didn’t you realize that Benghazi was a “Phony” scandal? I wonder where they are hiding all those CIA guys to keep them from testifying. Why are they having to sign non-disclosure agreements? Why do they have to keep taking polygraphs monthly? Why do we have no answers on what was going on with the gun running operation to Syria almost a year later?
Agent – Instead of trying for the 41st time to repeal the ACA, why doesn’t Congress subpoena the CIA agents and have them testify?
If there was something nefarious going on in Benghazi, I want to know about it. And I know you do, too.
As far as Syria goes, this is what Obama has said about military intervention:
Obama “would say, ‘If you are going to propose specific steps, tell me where they lead,'” said Ross, now at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. “I don’t think you can look at it independently from Iraq and Afghanistan. And particularly the sense that these are easy to get into and hard to get out of.”
I appreciate that position. Do you really want to send American troops into Syria? If so, WHY??
Exactly. This President (and don’t forget MEchelle) gets more vacation than any US leader in history.
James,
Please cite your source.
Actually, George W. Bush and Herbert Hoover lead the way in vacation time. Interesting that the Great Recession and Great Depression , the 2 biggest financial collapses in our history, began while each was President. I am not blaming either, just stating facts.
http://politic365.com/2012/05/08/obamas-vacations-of-any-president-bush-racked-up-the-most/
If you have different facts, please provide ansd cite your source.
Yes, Libby. This President has played more golf than the combined 5 before him including Slick Willy. He should be decent by now. By the way, I relieve my stress on weekends by pretending the ball is a liberal. I have been getting about 30 yards more distance on my tee shots. It is amazing what a little anger can do to increase the club head speed.
Ron, I’ll NEVER defend Bush for anything, thanks to Iraq. But it’s not really how many days of vacation, but what they do. It’s where he goes, how many taxpayer dollars he spends doing it, and most importantly, the image of problem confrontation avoidance he presents while doing it.
Refusing to cut short his time in Hawaii just because Fort Hood got shot up by a home grown Muslim terrorist. Telling our Navy to go shell Ghadaffi and then immdiately bugging out. There’s Martha’s Vinyard, Spain, Colombia, and more.
I don’t normally recommend the Huffington Post, but check these out: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/26/michelle-obama-spain-vacation-judicial-watch_n_1457302.html
http://www.politicsdaily.com/2010/08/06/michelle-obamas-lavish-spain-vacation-sparking-criticism/
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/more-vacation-month-obamas-2013_711998.html
James,
If, as you say, “it’s not really how many days of vacation”, then why did you previously state, “This President (and don’t forget MEchelle) gets more vacation than any US leader in history.”?
I disputed your statement and cited my source. Can you cite yours indicating President Obama gets more vacation than any U.S. leader in history? None of the sources you provided support that statement.
Ron: James will post links to sources that have nothing to do with his statements. I think he thinks if he puts them there it gives him credibility. He doesn’t think we’ll actually look at them.
Much the same way that Mitt Romney’s supporters denied or ignored all of the people he has put out of a job over the years, while paying himself millions for running companies into the ground and destroying businesses.
Libby, I want the complete truth and nothing but the truth about Benghazi. You should want the same thing. Did we have a gun running operation going there? Why was there such a CIA presence on the ground at the annex and why didn’t they go to help the Ambassador? No, I don’t want US troops in the quagmire of Syria. We should not intervene and should let Allah sort it all out since they are all bad actors. The most we should offer is humanitarian assistance to the good citizens who flee the country. Assad is bad news and Al Quida is worse.
So, Agent. Let me clarify. You agree 100% with my previous post, then right? Because that’s EXACTLY what it said. Do you argue for argument’s sake or you just can’t stop yourself?
You have done well my prodigy. Accept that it is happening, but deny that it is harmful. That is right out of my playbook. Let us also move all Workers Compensation to exchanges. That will be the final death knell to private enterprise as we know it.
Really FFA, that’s your comment for a sentence which reads in it’s entirety “A top U.S. healthcare official on Thursday challenged claims by Republican lawmakers that the country’s healthcare reform law is causing workers to lose hours or benefits, saying she is aware of only isolated cutbacks”
You simply eliminate the part about challenging Republican lawmakers claims and then attribute the rest of the sentence to her as though that’s the intent of what she said.
You should be ashamed of yourself. This shows clearly that any comment you make can and should be ignored by everyone, regardless of their politics.
InsGuy very wise…..my teenagers have to asked their employers for more hours when they saw their employers still seeking for new hires…..when they asked for more hours, they were simply told, you have too many hours this week –but I guess “minors” and the “types” of jobs they hold — aren’t considered part of the work force….
From my personal experience when I was a teenager–we were basically an expendable and renewable resource for employers.
Because there’s always another kid looking for 10-20 hours/week for gas/date money.
When I was a teen ager, I walked around an apartment complex with a stick and a bag picking up garbage. Was happy to do it.
I mowed lawns, threw papers and any other odd job I could because my family didn’t have two nickels to rub together. We were expected to pitch in and we did. The work ethic was ingrained real deep. Today’s kids, not so much.
I did the same. Two paper routes daily. one in the Am and one after school. My dad was upper mid class – my brother did scam $1.375M and counting out of him, but made me earn my way.
Bussed tables, washed dishes, waitressed, motel maid.
Me too – except the maid thing. I also worked in a Van Conversion shop. Left that because a bunch of Coke Heads were running the place. They were never shy about it including in front of the 15 year old shop hand. Also shoveled a lot of snow…. Blizzard of 79 . Big bucks to me at 16 (for a 16 yr old).
Hi Agent,
I had a lot of bad jobs. I worked at a gas station which was OK and additionally washed cars behind the station for extra cash. The owner let me keep the car wash money because he sold more gas, oil changes etc when I was there. I also worked on a farm bailing hay in 95 degree weather and worked in a sweat shop machining parts in a non air conditioned building, no union and 12 hour days for less than a third of what the union guys made
Awe Sarge…. I was trying to forget my Farm Days – shoveling out the barn, bailing hay. Oh, the smell of Pig S&^%.
You got to have a stick and a bag? Just a little Friday humor. Actually I can relate to taking any work available as a teen. Yardwork and paper routes, until I was able to move up to fast-food.
I lasted 9 days at McDonald’s. When they put me on the french fry station for the third day in a row, I’d had it!
Hi Sergeant, I also worked in a theater as an usher back in the day when they had ushers. In school all day, work nights until the last feature was over. It was a challenge to get the homework done, but I devised some ways to do most of it in study hall at school. I still managed to have good grades and one thing I learned growing up was a very strong work ethic and did not look for a hand out. Still, I couldn’t have gone to college without a scholarship. Today’s kids have no clue what we went through growing up. I am afraid they are going to get a big dose of reality real soon.
I don’t respond to personal attacks. Nor do I dis respect any ones right to their opinion. Its a free country.
God – yes God bless the USA!
Goodonya.
The forum needs more reasonable disparate opinions along political lines, and less trolling.
What’s trolling? That’s the second time I’ve heard the expression and I don’t know what it is. Other than fishing…
Trolling is intentionally saying something inflammatory just to get people agitated and thereby start a “war of words”. As in – the person who does it is a troll.
It kind of applies the same principle to anything. Just throwing out a line looking for a bite – at least in the mid west.
I see. Stirring the pot, so to speak.
So you misrepresent what others say and then make personal attacks on them based on your misrepresentation but you don’t respond to personal attacks.
Good to know.
I agree FFA, but I’m not as adept at ignoring the personal attacks.
I’ve been in sales since I walked out of High School. Graduated one day. Two days later hit the sales floor of a retailer. I was 18. Now, I am not….
Ah, now, you may not be 18 anymorem but you are NOT old. You’re my age, after all. ;)
The past 18 months have really aged me… Feeling the stress & pain every day.
Wedding tomorrow. Good to see that young people actually still believe in that. Of course, the success will be determined by the commitment to the commitment.
In college, took a family & marriage class. Instructor defined marriage by a Commitment to Conflict resolution.
I would be willing to bet that many of the long term marriage have had their share of arguments / disagreements. My marriage is in tact because of our ability to GET OVER IT!
“Commitment to Conflict resolution”
That is priceless and oh, so accurate. My 21st anniversary is soon. (this is my second marriage – I didn’t keep the bozo from college)
54 to 1 as of 12:59. Great comment!
FFA, can you imagine God looking down on this country right now and blessing it when he sees what is going on with human beings thinking they have all the answers to life’s problems, the Secular movement which is in control currently? This country is on fire, people are at each others throats, do not seek wisdom from God and wonder why their world is falling apart. This blog is just a microcosm for what is going on and it really is sickening how far the society has fallen in a few decades. The country has terrible leadership and has noticeably been in failure mode for many years with no end in sight. My refuge is my church on Sundays. They keep telling me God is in control and I have to believe that.
Agent,
All you have to do is look in the mirror. You are one of the people perpetuating the vehement disagreements on this blog.
As you have the right to go to your refuge on Sundays, you must respect the rights of those you do not seek wisdom from God. That is upon what this country was built. Religious freedom also means freedom from religion.
As a side note, I am a proud, practicing Catholic who enjoys going to Church on Sundays as well.
Since, as you say, “the country has terrible leadership and has noticeably been in failure mode for many years with no end in sight,” you agree with me that it is not just President Obama.
I disagree with you because your ideas are bad Ron and you don’t have an original thought and have to go to a government website to argue what is right and wrong. I wonder how you balance your Secular agenda with your religious beliefs. I will agree with you that government has been very bad for many years including Democratic & Republican administrations and Congress. The worst part of it started out with Jimmy Carter, we had a brief respite with Ronny and then we had the serial liar/cheater of Clinton, the RINO Bush’s and now we are in the very worst episode of governmental disaster in the nations history.
Agent,
What ideas have I proposed of which you disagree? I have only presented facts, with a cited source, to dispute much of your rhetoric. That is my only agenda.
Please present any evidence where I have put forth a Secular agenda. My religious beliefs tell me to love and respect others and to not judge. That is God’s job, not ours.
The RINO excuse needs to go away. Just because a Republican doesn’t vote and/or implement policies that cater to your idea of the Republican platform, does not mean they are not Republicans. Did you ever think that once they get into office, they are faced with the reality that compromise is necessary to move the country forward? President Clinton signed welfare reform amd NAFTA. Does that make him a DINO? No, it makes him a reasonable person who understood the need for compromise in politics. Just look at how he worked with the Reopublican Congress to obtain budget surpluses.
Agent,
One other thing.
You stated, “we are in the very worst episode of governmental disaster in the nations history.”.
2 Questions:
1. Really? Did you ever hear about the Civil War?
2. Do Republicans bare any responsibility at all for this?
“FFA, can you imagine God looking down on this country right now and blessing it when he sees what is going on with human beings thinking they have all the answers to life’s problems, the Secular movement which is in control currently?”
Oh ye of little faith. God has always blessed this world and all his children in it. There has been war and strife and greed and lust since time began. He does not stop loving us and blessing us. Yours is a punitive God. Mine is a loving God.
Libby, God is rolling his eyes when he sees what man is doing now. He may decide to take action. Are you ready?
If He needs to call me today, I’m ready, willing, and able.
Time will tell if this actually hurts American workers or not. I personally do not know of any person who is having hours reduced or their job eliminated due to the PPACA. I am sure there are some out there, but I don’t know of any. What we do know is who the PPACA will help. The millions that are currently not insured, those with pre-existing conditions, young adults up to the age of 26, those that have had lifetime limits exhausted, those who would otherwise be bankrupt as healthcare costs are the number one cause of such financial hardship.
I know of a lot of my clients and family members. One of my clients works for a major national chain. All their 30 hour workers have been notified. We are talking Thousands of people nation wide under one employer.
I am sure IL skews the national average. Our unemployment rate is 2% higher the national average.
I have lost all my Group health except for one or two. Commis used to be 12K + annually. Now – not even close. Lucky if its 2K annually.
What we all know is that Tort Reform would have helped everyone – not just the folks you are pointing out…
FFA, they weren’t about to put in Tort Reform since most of our lawmakers were trial attorneys prior to being elected. That would kill the goose that laid the golden egg. You know what they say, 500 attorneys at the bottom of the ocean is a start.
I do know that.
A good friend of mine is an Aviation Lawyer. He was actually advocating – after a few beers of course the English Tort System.
FFA, I thought it was funny that our current IRS head was testifying before the Senate the other day and said he didn’t want to be on Obamacare either. The head of the enforcement agency of this terrible law doesn’t want it??? Hmm! He likes his gold plated government insurance. It is good for us, but not him.
Bureal of Labor Statistics says that we are slowly being converted to a part-time worker society. The conversion accelerated drastilly in the last few months, and especially in June, when part time jobs exploded higher by 360,000 while full time jobs dropped by 240,000.
Of the 953,000 jobs “created” so far in 2013, only 23%, or 222,000 were full-time! Sooo, Planet, even if you don’t know anyone personally that has been affected, you will soon.
Perplexed, did you see the info that came out that Kelly Services is the second biggest employer in the country right behind Wal Mart? Does that tell us anything about what the employment situation is in this country? We are increasing the temps and part timers and decreasing the full time workers. Do you think Kelly Services provides Healthcare to temps and part time workers? I think not. Planet is blissfully ignorant of what is going on. He just keeps whistling a happy tune which reminds me of Emperor Nero who fiddled while Rome was burning.
Agent,
I noticed yopu make the comment regarding Kelly Services being the #2 emploeyr in the U.S. a couple of times and decided to do some research. Something anyone with an Economics degree would do when presented with a fact.
Here is the history of the number of temporary employees Kelly Services has placed since 2001. This came directly from their Annual Reports on their website, not some blog or Conservative/Liberal website.
2001 – 700K
2002 – 700K
2003 – 700K
2004 – 700K
2005 – 700K
2006 – 750K
2007 – 750K
2008 – 650K
2009 – 480K
2010 – 530K
2011 – 550K
2012 – 560K
http://ir.kellyservices.com/annuals.cfm#
Why are we only hearing about this statistic now?
Spin away.
Ron, Take notice of the year their labor force reduced! What’s your comment on the BLS information about part time jobs? I’m amazed that Planet can ignore the fact that employers every where, even in Abilene, Tx., where the economy is growing because of the oil & gas industry, are changing full time employees to part time. IT’S HAPPENING.
He’s not ignoring it. He just said he doesn’t know anyone that has had that happen. You guys really ALL need to take an English comprehension lesson.
Perplexed,
I was only presenting facts. My point is that the number of temporary employees hired by Kelly Services is actually down from their all-time high. Agent and the rest of the right are trying to make it sound like this is brand new when it is not.
I just wanted to know why they all of a sudden concerned about the number of temporary employees hired by Kelly Services when the number indicates they should have be more concerned previously.
I was signed up with Kelly Svcs & AccountTemp back in the 80’s. They both provided healthcare of some sort. If I recall, as long as you so many hours a month within the last 12 mos you qualified. I don’t recall all the particulars but they did provide at way less than full-time hrs.
Not sure anymore.
Agent – Temp and part-time are 2 different things. The BLS report out in March, 2013 clearly states the labor market improved in 2012 and further states there are 114,109,000 full-time workers to 27,661,000 part-time workers. Of those part-time employees, 19,509,000 work part-time because of NON-economic reasons; in other words it’s their choice. Please, please, please STOP regurgitating your conservative poppycock and DO SOME RESEARCH.
http://www.bls.gov/cps/lfcharacteristics.htm#fullpart
True, but that demographic employment shift has nothing to do with Obamacare and everything to do with long-term union-busting, a desire for higher profit margins, and no loyalty toward workers on the part of employers…Truth be told, this alarming trend (not a new phenomenon) illustrates EXACTLY why we need to be able to buy into an affordable health care system…and it WILL be if all participate! For example, Medicare is astoundingly efficient and, once cost-containment provisions more firmly take hold, it will be economical as well.
Yes, Bluegirl. Obamacare is union busting allright. They are jumping up and down at Obama for putting in a plan that will get rid of their gold plated negotiated plans and throw union members to the exchanges. If that happens, many will just drop their union membership and that will be the end of the unions. Jimmy Hoffa, Jr. wants Obama to subsidize union plans. Won’t that be great for the taxpayers? Put the blame where it lies.
You can thank Agent’s idol, Milton Friedman for that, Bluesgirl. That was his theme. Profits at all costs with no regard for the employees that have gotten you where you are.
Milton Friedman was one of the greatest economists of all time:
http://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/economic-sciences/laureates/1976/friedman-bio.html
I respectfully disagree.
You are right James. I studied him thoroughly on my way to an Economics degree. Poor Libby likes John Maynard Keynes whose policies have succeeded in bringing this country to the verge of bankruptcy and downgraded credit. She is a willing lemming to jump into the pit of oblivion.
Cap, I know your a big D Rose fan. Was wondering of they showed his interview down your neck of the woods last week.
He was asked who the best player is in the NBA today and he responded D Rose. The guy didn’t even play last year even after his personal doc and team doc cleared him.
He really needs a break out season to get people (teammates included) to forget. Trestman is in the same shoes. already piling up season ending injuries in Bear Camp.
This article is very poorly written and edited; it is very biased toward the PPACA. It makes no mention of the companies that were threatened by the Obama Administration when they announced they would have to restate their financial positions based on the increased costs of the PPACA. It notes the delay till 2015 even though this was not done in compliance with the law; an arbitrary executive decision by Obama, purely political to push off the pain until after the midterm elections.
If we’re going to review the actual impacts of the law, let’s hear Tavenner name which large companies she met with. Certainly if they’re on board, this should cause any issue..it is “the law” ..right?
As the saying goes “there is something rotten in Denmark.”
“It notes the delay till 2015 even though this was not done in compliance with the law…”
It is 100% within the law that the government has the ability and authority to adjust deadlines. Where do you get your information?
That was too easy, lol.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/sallypipes/2013/08/05/delay-of-obamacares-employer-mandate-exacerbates-an-already-bad-situation/
What does that have to do with my post?
It is ashame that healthcare in the US has become a political campaign issue.It would be more prudent to find ways to improve the Affordable Healthcare Act of 2010 than to continually have votes to repeal the law. The Affordable Healthcare of Act of 2010 authrozied the creation of a separate entity known as Patient-Centered Outsomes Research Institute and their mission is to fund patient centered research so that patients can be better informed about a specific treatment. I serve as a Patient Reviewer and can report that the applications submitted for medical research funding are 110% patient centered. The intent is to enable the patient more able to make decision on his or her situation. It would border on a crime if this supported research was eliminated. Our elected officials in the Senate and House of Representatives have to get their act together and work to make universal healthcare available to all segments of our population. The political bickering has to stop right now, not tomorrow or the next day.
Couldn’t agree more, Deane.
How absolutely ridiculous this Patient Centered Outcomes Research Institute. Sounds like someone needed a job. Like someone doesn’t already know best for our medical care????? Like perhaps our doctor? I mean do you really think our doctor’s are just gouging the system and that some “Institute” is going to police them???????? We don’t need one more ENTITY involved. Don’t doctor’s generally follow medical research wherein they already know what is successful in terms of treatment? don’t ya bet they already stay up on that? Like we need an Obama created committee to educate our stupid doctors? How stupid is that. I have noticed that liberals get really impressed by “institutes”. The Affordable Care Act authorized all sorts of BS. LIke 28,000 IRS agents. Did you know that the California exchange alone is hiring something like 21,000 employees to administer this exchange? But that California officials were led to believe that they were full time jobs, come to find out they are part time, to avoid providing health insurance. Libs just can’t accept this law sucks.
Where is California getting the money to hire 21,000 employees to administer the exchange? Is Kathleen cutting them a check? They better throw in some Navigator funds as well to walk the applicants through that 10 page app.
No-one really knows how or if this will work. If the “millions” of uninsured people actually do buy insurance and the employers start providing coverage for their employees, this idea may actually work. However, if all that income from the newly insured people does not materialize, this may go down as the biggest failure of this administration. We can all make assumptions, but until it’s tested, we won’t know if it works.
The health rate Have go up 4 time since obamacare was passed.
There is no way the low or middle class can afford health care.
what will happen will is people work less so they can get medicaid for free and cost the goverment more. like when Rome Empire gave free food and the goverment fell.
Im not so much worried about the premiums. What is going to happen to tax rates is my big concern. These yahoos funding countries that don’t even like us. Why????
Green Energy in Africa??? Why??? Don’t we have hungry kids going to bed every night and he is worried about Green Energy in Africa???
Agent said- ” I also worked in a theater as an usher back in the day when they had ushers. In school all day, work nights until the last feature was over. It was a challenge to get the homework done.”
Hi Agent, been out of town, got back last night and thought I would get a chuckle this morning. I came from a tough neighborhood so our job prospects had to be made by the job searcher. I actually liked the gas station. We were full service and I was the guy gassing the cars, washing the windows and checking the oil while the boss was working on cars in the shop. Then when I had 5 minutes I was washing cars or washed them after my shift.
Hey Sargeant, Give me the lowdown on the Accounting lady working for the City of Detroit that got caught after she ripped off the city for $500,000K. Can we say Detroit has been the cesspool of the country for a while now?
Agent – Did you miss what happened in Dixon IL??? $500K is peanuts to the millions she ripped off.
FFA, Fill me in on Dixon, Il. I didn’t see that one. How can these people do these things without anyone auditing the books annually? Is Dixon taking bankruptcy because of missing funds?
Comptroller went years and years. She opened up a World Class Horse Breeding organization. Millions for an RV.
A temp busted her. She was on vacation. Something didn’t add up and the games began.
I think the total was $53 Million.
Dixon is getting plenty back from selling the assets. But $53mill??? How does that get missed??? Spanned (I think) 4 mayors.
Agent, a good story for you. At the station we had some guys who came in decked Caddys or maybe Buicks. These guys were made guys. People knew it but nobody said anything. They would come in and say “Hey kid gas er up”. So I did. Then often they would say, “hey kid can you buff er up?” I always said “sure”. They showed up a lot and I thought I was the best car wash service in Detroit. Ha! Come to find out my boss, the owner had a “relationship/friendship” with them. When I asked how my boss knew them he said they were friends and “traded favors”.
One day I washed a guys car. He was huge and dressed impeccably. He sat on a bench talking with my boss while I washed the car. When the car was done he came out and gave me a $20.00 bill. I said I did not have any change and he said” You don’t need any, keep it”. I about fell over. Then he came up to me, put his arm around me and said ” If anybody ever gives you a hard time you just let me know and I will take care of it”. I said “OK”. When he left I asked my boss about what he said and he said well I have the best security system in town and now you have too.
It seems everyone in that area saw what had happened and I never, ever had a problem with anyone.
Sargeant, when I was in college, during the summer months, I worked at grocery stores stocking, checking, carrying out groceries. I could make enough to last me through the school year, but I had to watch my pennies pretty close. We sold programs at football games to make a little extra as well.
I saw a re-run of Robocop the other night. It made me think of Detroit. In the movie, they were trying to combat crime in “Old Detroit” which was very much like what you have up there right now. Robocop worked cheap and did a lot of bad guys in.
Let’s see..does PPACA help:
-those younger employees who because of the 3:1 age band who will have to pay much more for their insurance?
-those businesses which hesitate about hiring that 50th employee because they know PPACA will add huge overhead?
– all businesses that will pay the health insurance premium tax that the companies will have to pass through?
– those employees who were on a limited benefit plan which is now illegal so the employer cuts back on numbers of employees simply to make ends meet?
– employees who were working more than 30 hours a week but no more?
– the taxpayers who are left footing the bill for the expansion of Medicaid in many states and paying for the subsidies in the exchanges for people making up to 400% of the federal poverty line?
I personally do not know if Taverner is as respected and as nonpartisan as the article states. I do know that she is still touting the Obama party line…we’ll make it work even if it can’t.
Really? When are these people going to come into the real world where people actually do work. I can’t tell you how many people I know have had their hours cut because of this. I am just waiting to see how much I am going to end up paying for this health program on top of what I have to pay for myself. How many years is it going to take the next president to clean up this mess?
My guess is she never visited any small towns. She probably stayed in the bigger towns to get more data. Coming from a small town, most of the smaller business are cutting peoples hours to 25 hours/week to avoid Obamacare. Around here, it definitely isn’t isolated. Just to make a living, people have to juggle two to three jobs with no benefits. I am glad I am not a younger person just entering the job market, but I fear for my children.
I just came from calling on a country club for their insurance renewals. The club is placing all employees as of October on part time status even though they didnt have to do so due to them being at 48 employees. They are having all employees put in 25 hours so they are not subject to the ACA next year. Cancelling their coverage with Blue Cross and Blue Shield and paying them a fixed dollar amount for coverage $250 a month.
Thanks Obama!
Figures. The country club set doesn’t worry about the welfare of their employees. Just like Corporate America. Way to go Corporate GREED.
The country club set? Cabot says it is a business with 48 employees. That’s a small business. Not a big business. Just because a business is a country club, that does not make them all wealthy or part of what one could call the country club set. Many small business are indeed cutting back on hours as are some large ones. Look at Darden Restaurants, Olive Garden Red Lobster cut back hours a year ago. When these things affect your family, it is not isolated, it’s reality. Something that the government spokesperson in this article fails to acknowledge.
You have to be a member of the country club to be on the board. Those are the people making this decision. I stand by my statement.
You’ve never heard of a public course where you do not have to be a member?
TxLady – did you read the original post? Cabot said, “I just came from calling on a country club…”
Libby, it is obvious that you don’t know how Country Clubs operate. They get dues from members to pay their overhead expenses including payroll of employees. When their expenses go up, they have to assess members higher dues. When it gets so high, members resign their memberships and then the club is in big trouble and have to cut payrolls and expenses or they are out of there. I am very familiar with golf clubs since I play all the time. Some in our area have raised their dues and cart fees to try to make it. My club is right on the verge of making it unaffordable to belong there. If it fails, that is more unemployment. I know this is a difficult concept for you and Ron to absorb.
It figures you would be a member of a country club, Agent. And I’m very familiar with how they work, as I have not only insured a few but my brother-in-law is on the board of his club. This club had only 48 employees, so there was no need for them to cut hours to 25 in order to avoid Obamacare. Therefore, it is not because of Obamacare that this is happening. Kind of a hard concept for you and others to understand, too. Not every cut in the budget is because of Obamacare.
Cabot,
Sounds like the country club is doing this more out of spite than to avoid a penalty since they automaically avoid the penalty by having less than 50 full-time employees.
Sounds like a sound business decision to me. 50 employees this year could very well turn into 25 next and so on and so on till they get the number right.
Wonder where we are landing for the tax rate to cover what seemingly will be shortfalls on the budget.
Interesting neutral article regarding “universal” healthcare that has been in place for nearly 40 years….
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/17/health/policy/17hawaii.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
For those that think this doesn’t hurt employees…
I recently applied for a 2nd job working evenings at Sears (yes, some of us are willing to work two jobs). I found out in the interview process they do not offer more than 29 hours per week to ANY employee outside of the Store Manager. The reason; They flatly stated the cost of Obamacare was prohibitive and they will no longer offer ANY positions outside of a single Store Manager over 29 hours per week.
At one time, Sears was a very large Employer. Now, their ‘Homegoods’ stores are commission only, and while they have a limit of 29 hours per week, they will not work you close to 29 hours in fear of going over the limit. I was told the most I could expect was 20-24 hours per week. Whether you are for or against Obamacare, this is sad news.
Sears isn’t the only company doing this. We have an insane number of people in the 16-22 range who cannot find a job. If they are fortunate, they will get on part time somewhere working 15 to 20 hours per week. Papa John’s and Denny’s are both following Sears. While neither is a place someone wants to be employed full time, at least it was an option for those desperate for work. Not anymore.
Maybe if Sears and other retailers were to take a page from Costco’s book they would not be having so many troubles to the point where they are cutting more from its employees.
http://money.cnn.com/2013/08/06/news/economy/costco-fast-food-strikes/index.html?iid=HP_LN
Pay and respect your employees and they will stay and perform. In addition you will have 100 people waiting for each employee’s job if they underperform.
My Client that got her hours cut works at Home Depot.
When I was a Cost Co member, customer service was so bad I cancelled my membership card and renewed with Sams.
FFA,
Just like the employees at Hobby Lobby who would have liked birth control to be covered by their health insurance, your client should just go somehere else to work, maybe Costco.
I am guessing that if poor customer service was a global issue for Costco members they would not have realized annualized net income increases of 14.5% from 2010 to 2012.
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/is?s=COST+Income+Statement&annual
It is amazing that a company can provide good pay and benefits to its employees and still profit handsomely.
Ron, she lives in IL where the unemployment rate is consistently 2% higher then the national average.
She is looking for anything to replace the hours she lost. It now makes it necessary for her to have three jobs.
All was well before Obama Care with her being able to afford her bills.
Its going to hit your home town too.
BTW, Poor Customer Service was my one encounter there at my local location.
When a service rep says I don’t know and walks away with out any effort, its enough for me.
Additionally, my wife did not like the product mix there. So, it was an easy decision to cancel my card.
We just got a Costco. I love it! It’s an hour away, so I don’t get to shop there very often. I’m very glad I haven’t had customer service problems. That is one thing I will confront immediately. Just because it’s not my strong suit doesn’t mean I will put up with crap.
Ron, this is called anecdotal evidence. Kudos to ANY business that pays well and respects its employees!
But the vast majority of them are worried about just staying in business. Costco is in an industry with high barriers to entry, hence less competition.
Why the hell should Hobby Lobby have to pay for employee’s birth control? That’s ludicrous.
Because it’s the LAW.
FFA, the Progressives on this site just blame corporate greed on what is going on. They just can’t understand that businesses all across this country are having issues with this terrible bill and are taking the necessary steps to stay in business. It is basically a cost cutting strategy to offset increased expenses coming their way. You and I know as agents that we haven’t seen any overhead expenses come down in the past 4 years. Our payroll, utilities, rent, E&O, Commercial Package, Internet connection have all gone up along with many companies cutting our commissions in some areas. We are expected to do more with less and sell more to stay even. P&C customers are having to pay more for renewals and it is a tougher sell in this economy.
I was able to find rent MUCH CHEAPER as the vacancy rate is out of this world high in this town. Rents have to come down and land lords look to minimalize the loss and avoid foreclosure.
City Hall don’t seem to give a darn as they try and push forward with another Commercial Development. One developer after another decline their offer. City Hall refuses to let land lords rent to whom ever is willing to rent from them. They want retail. No retail is moving in. Most have closed their doors.
That’s a double edged sword. You’re benefiting from the vacancies, but it is sad that there are so many vacancies.
UCT, he promised us when he was first elected that he would fundamentally transform America. How do we like being fundamentally transformed now? Economic malaise, higher taxes, a part time work society and a President who has no concept of how to grow an economy. By the way, Congress and the President agreed to take care of Congressional staffers so they won’t have to worry about the big increases in their healthcare premiums.
Agent,
I am still waiting for you to answer my question regarding the number of temporary workers Kelly Services has placed year by year since 2001.
Please list all of the Presidents with a business/economics background and the economic data while they were in office.
Example, since we are holding President Obama responsible for the current economy, you must do the same for any past President. Meaning, President Hoover does not get credit for what happened during FDR’s administration and President Reagan does not get credit for what happened during President Clinton’s administration even if it was their policies that lead to those positive economic conditions.
Since you have an Economics degree, you should know how to do the research.
Ron, if you were a student of real history instead of revisionist history, you wouldn’t have to go to some of your government websites to prove your points. It is much easier to pick the Progressive President’s who put in the disastrous spending policies than it is for Conservatives who had some business sense. The list starts with Teddy Roosevelt,Woodrow Wilson, FDR ( one of the worst), then in the modern era Jimmy the peanut farmer, Clinton and now Obama. Some of the RINO’s were Nixon, Bush Sr., Bush Jr. who only half believed and did RINO things and adopted some of the Keynsian spending/prime the pump philosophy that has this country in such a mess. Ronny was the best even if you disagree. He followed Milton Friedman and the great Al Laffer on economic policy. You know what, people criticized Eisenhower because he didn’t do much, but the nation’s economy was growing during his tenure and that was a good thing. The government that governs least governs best in my opinion. Obviously, the government that governs most governs the worst as we see the graphic examples every day now.
Friedman. Hmmm. Wasn’t he the creator of the “World’s Dumbest Idea”???
Agent,
So, once again you are unable to answer my questions.
That is why you little to no credibility.
Are you sure your degree is not in Philosophy?
Are you referring to President Reagan who doubled the national debt, increased spending by 2.5% per year and added over $1 trillion to our debt? In addition, he signed bills that increased taxes and spent more (22.4% of GDP), than President Carter (20.8% of GDP).
http://money.cnn.com/2010/09/08/news/economy/reagan_years_taxes/index.htm
Would Friedman approve of Reagan’s spending increases? I highly doubt it.
Man, it is so funny to read “revisionist history” in a post. No matter which side someone believes, in their minds the other side believes “revisionist history.” LOL
You have a very skewed perception of reality, Agent. The economic malaise started under the previous administration. You can’t possibly blame that mess on Obama. And things have IMPROVED under his leadership. I understand not fast enough for you, but according to projections he is on target. And if you had bothered to read my post about the BLS report, you would see that we DO NOT have a part-time work society. In fact, the majority of part-timers WANT to be part-time. Healthcare for everyone? Just a pipe dream 5 years ago. Now becoming a reality. THAT is MY version of reality.
Whose reality is skewed Libby? We have had 6 years of economic malaise created by Progressives who have had control of Congress and the White House. Big spending Keynsian spending has only added to the malaise. Obama is on target allright to take this economy right on down. This country never got out of the recession no matter what you say. You may be happy with 1% growth, widespread unemployment, a part time workforce, big increases in healthcare and all other cost of living expenses, but I am not. Bernanke and his Fed boys are perpetrating the next big financial bubble as we speak with his “quantitative easing” printing money 24/7 and inflation on interest rates will be starting in October. It will make the crisis of 08-09 look small by comparison. Mark my words, you will not like the results.
I don’t mark your words now or ever.
I think the latest statistic speaks volumes of the new jobs added to the economy since 2009 90% are part time jobs. This dispite the efforts by the Fed to make money available to companies to expand and grow. Perhaps in the future our employees, ie. congress will read a bill, and know what is in it before they pass it as law. It would also be nice if they considered the the ramifications and outcomes of the bill before they voted for or against it, but that would require them to live in the real world.
Big D,
Please cite the source of your statistic.
Straight off the BLS website:
“The number of persons employed part time for economic reasons (sometimes referred to as involuntary part-time workers) was essentially unchanged at 8.2 million in July. These individuals were working part time because their hours had been cut back or because they were unable to find a full-time job. (See table A-8.)”
http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm
Leave it to Libby the Liberal to cite the Bureau of Labor Statistics to try to justify the terrible unemployment/underemployed in this country. They have been cooking the books for the last three years not reporting all the citizens who have dropped out of the workforce or are working part time to make ends meet. If the real figures were used, we have in excess of 15% unemployment/underemployment in this country and growing. I don’t know about the other Conservatives on this blog, but I don’t trust bureaucrats in this administration to give me the true picture of what is going on. I look at what business is doing and there are numerous stories of businesses cutting back, limiting hours or laying people off.
Agent,
At least she does cite her sources.
That is how you earn credibility. At least give people the option to review where you get your information, then they can form their own opinion based on that information.
Ron, I wish I could trust my government to give me the straight scoop on what is going on, but they haven’t earned my trust at all for the past 6 years. You are like a lamb being led to slaughter and just believe anything they say. Almost anything you and Libby post have a government website to try to prove your point. Anyone with common sense knows we have been consistently lied to by government on about everything. You probably think Jay Carney is giving the truth on every news conference he has done the past 3 years. Not so much and he has been caught lying, but just shrugs his shoulders or says it is under investigation, kind of like the other minions of this administration who say I don’t know, can’t recall or it is under investigation.
Agent,
They are the only ones who provide any data whatsoever. Remember, these are not political appointees. They are career civil servants who work during several administrations, both Republican and Democrat. Do you have any actuual proof that they are cooking the books or is that just what O’Reilly, Hannity, and Gallagher are telling you? All you provide are Republican talking points and empty rhetoric. Talk about a lamb. Do you do any research? If so, you should be able to cite a source.
I do not trust any one single source for information and take any political appointee with a grain of salt due to their personal agenda.
Agent – I was not justifying anything. Only proving that the statements on here about part-time work taking over the country are false. Are employers cutting back? Some of them are, but many are not. My office has hired at least 5 new people in the past 4 months. Mostly in the benefits arena where they see a fantastic opportunity in the future. That’s what smart business people do. They take a challenge and turn it into an opportunity. Not like your kind that just sit around bitching and moaning about everything but doing nothing.
I’m sure the picture is not as rosy as I portray, but neither is it the doom and gloom that you portray. I would venture to say the truth lies somewhere in the middle.
Ron, if you’re going to cite politics, being that you mention all these Presidents, look at the big picture. President Reagan ran up the deficit, as did Jimmy Carter before him. But he did it to win the Cold War. And guess what? We WON. If Clinton hadn’t squandered that, we wouldn’t be worried about terrorists in every city and airport. Not that Bush helped. I did NOT vote for him in 2004.
b,
The point I continue to make is that Republican Presidents have not been the more fiscally responsible, regardles of the reasons why. Check out the numbers from this website: http://useconomy.about.com/od/usdebtanddeficit/p/US-Debt-by-President.htm
Why is deficit spending OK to fight wars, but not help Americans who are hungry, sick and struggling? If the wars are important enough to fight, then they should be important enough to raise taxes to pay for it.
Australia has stringent immigration? Not until recently. Wonder why in 2011-12, India sent 29,018, and China sent 25,509? My mom’s boyfriend, an Australian, told me about all the desperate Indonesians who wanted to get on the welfare rolls. The people going there are not wealthy or looking for high quality healthcare.
http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/booklets/booklets.htm
You have to have a sponsor to move to Australia.
I stand corrected. Thanks.
So you want some statistics Ron? Following is posted from an article by Larry Elder, a noted author and radio show host who is a black man by the way. He is one of the few that see what is going on so he wrote the article after research. It is titled: When Will They See That This Is One Bad Recovery?
Fact1 – First Quarter gross domestic product numbers for 2013 were revised downward from 1.8% to 1.1%. Comparing from the last deep recession in 81-82,the recovering economy grew at 4.1%
Fact 2 – Labor Participation Rate – When Obama took office, it stood at 65.7%. After 4 1/2 years of malaise, it is 63.4% a 34 year low.
Fact 3 – Food Stamps – 47.5 million today and increasing 13% a year from 2008-12.
Fact 4 – 9 million on Social Security Disability, double the number of the late 90’s – – many admitting they could work, but chose not to look.
Fact 5 – Just to keep pace with new entrants into the job market, the economy must produce 150,000 new jobs per month. With Obama’s four years of recovery, the average monthly jobs created is 97,020 compared with the recovery of 81-82 of 233,333 per month.
Compare these appalling statistics to Reagan who dug us out of the Jimmy Carter mess. He cut taxes dramatically, reduced spending and the economy took off. In three years, civilian employment was increased 8.9% and 9 million jobs created. I know these facts will not make a dent in your Progressive brain, but I was willing to try.
Agent,
Did Conservative commentator Larry Elder cite his sources? I would be interested to know where he gets his information.
Why is the fact that he is black relevant? The Republicans are the ones who keep preaching that all black people vote for Democrats. I know that there are many black Republicans and Conservatives. Is that a shock to you?
Is it your opinion that all black people agree all of the time? Do you just start foaming at the mouth every time a black man disagrees with President Obama and his policies because it provides concrete support for your position?
Besides, there are a lot of white people who have railed against Republicans. Many times with unfounded rhetoric.
Please quote me where I was championing the recovery and Obama’s efforts? My biggest issues with the Republicans are as follows:
1. They kept saying that President Obama made things worse when most economic indicators showed some improvement. If they did not like the rate of the recovery, then fine. But to say it got worse is just disingenuous. I have asked multiple time of metrics, with a source cited, showing economic indicators that got worse and all I received was higher unemployment in IL.
2. Since their number one priority was to make President Obama a one-term President, I believe it is possible that they have purposely sabotaged any idea President Obama had that could have improved the recovery.
3. They will take zero responsibility for their part in the current political stagnation and negative cultural in Washington, DC. Do the Senate Democrats and President Obama bear some responsibility? ABSOLUTELY!
4. Their position that deficit spending is OK to fight wars, but not to help Americans who are hungry, sick and struggling. Just as Jesus would have wanted it, right?
Did the Democrat controlled Congress play any role in the recovery during Reagn’s administration, or was he a dictator and did whatever he wanted? You do realize that changes to taxes and spending start in Congress, right? At least the Congress back then gave something for President Reagan to sign. What has this Congress, including the Senate Democrats, given President Obama?
Ron, the legislation never makes it past Harry Reids desk and is not debated or voted on. It is pretty hard to get anything to a Presidents desk if it is dumped in the waste basket. By the way, the now infamous Harry Reid said last weekend that the Republicans are blocking the President’s agenda because he is African American. How racist is that? I am not making this up Ron. It is from his own lips and I heard it and was in disbelief this so called leader is still in the government. It is Obama’s policies that are being opposed Ron and has nothing to do with him being African American.
That’s not exactly what he said, Agent. He said:
He hopes Republicans who oppose the president do so “based on substance and not the fact that he’s an African-American.”
So he didn’t come out and accuse them of racism, just said he hoped it wasn’t because of racism. I know, it is splitting hairs, but if you are going to quote someone it’s important to quote them correctly.
Agent,
If you believe that President Obama’s race plays no part in the obstruction of his policies, you are extremely naive. It may not necessarily be the legislators themselves, but I would wager a whole lot of money that their financial backers are still fuming that someone with African heritage is the President.
Did you read the actual transcript of what he said? Here it is. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3053130/posts
All he said was, “I say this seriously. I hope it’s based on substance, and not the fact that he is African American.” That is a HUGE difference than saying that the Republicansd ARE blocking his agenda because he is black.
Do you not know the difference?
Actualy, it is already hurting:
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/blue-cross-aetna-united-humana-flee-obamacare-exchanges
Really? CNSNews. The RIGHT new. RIGHT now? Surely, you jest.
Besides, this article fails to prove Obamacare hurts workers. Only that some carriers will not participate in some states. It plainly states Georgia has 5 participants even after Aetna and Coventry withdrew. Surely you will be able to find an option with one of five carriers.
If you really want Aetna, go to them directly. But chances are, they will be more expensive.
james, I agree with you to a point. I am a Blue Cross agent and they are totally in bed with Obama and are actively promoting the enrollment of young people into the Exchanges because their CEO said they weren’t making any money on Individual Health now so they are in favor of doing it because it is subsidized. I know there are several Blue Cross divisions spread out, but the Home Office is in Illinois so you can make the connection.
Agent – They may not be for much longer. Trend continues, they will be out of here soon.
Read the writing on the wall at State Farm. If they do leave, watch our unemployment rate soar. Bloomington area is consistently 4% lower on the unemployment rate then the rest of the state.
So Ron, I take it that you approve of what Reid said since you didn’t say anything to the contrary. Why would the leader of the Senate say what he did if he weren’t race baiting? You should know how politicians speak by now. That statement was totally uncalled for and the inference was very clear. Wake up Ron. Harry Reid is a bad character and you know it.
Agent,
I did not approve nor disapprove. I only corrected you. Who do you think you are, misquoting a United States Senator. You may criticize anyone you want, but at least be honest.
Maybe Senator Reid was being honest about how he felt. You have mentioned of the unprecedented dysfunction in Washington. We have gone through more difficult economic, political and cultural times in the past. The only thing different is the race of the President. If you think that is purely coincidence, you are very naive. I am not saying it is all about race, but to think it has nothing to do with it is disingenuous.
How come you do not respond directly to what I post when I challenge you? Is it because all you have is empty rhetoric with no credible support?
I respectfully request you stop using any labels (Progressive, Liberal, etc.) about me unless you have evidence to support such a claim. I am a proud Independent.
I got the answer I was expecting from you Ron. You officially approve of race baiting from the Democratic side. They have only been doing this for 4+ years. Anyone disagreeing with the policies of this President has to be a racist, right? I had to laugh when you posted that perhaps Reid was being honest about how he “felt”. It is all about feelings with Democrats. I have about concluded that your mother must have dropped you on your head as a baby for you to turn out the way you did. If you are an Independent, you are about the most left leaning Independent on any of these forums.
Agent,
Once again your lack of reading comprehension skills is on display.
I have not approved of any race baiting, but I do believe there are many people who oppose President Obama because of his race. Do you really believe that everybody that grew up in the 50’s and 60’s has accepted the fact that we have a President with African roots?
However, I will agree with you that most people who oppose him do so because his policies would adversly affect them personally.
I can honestly say that I am better off now than I was in 2008. He has done nothing to make my life worse. You can preach fear and doomsday all you want, I make my decisions based on facts and results. If you cannot provide any facts (with a cited source) that dispute mine, you lose.
The fact that you will not acknowledge that President Obama’s race has played even a small role in his opposition is evidence that you are ignorant and a racist.
I find it amazing that you say it is all about feelings with Democrats, yet you very rarely support your feelings with facts. Then you, “concluded that your mother must have dropped you on your head as a baby for you to turn out the way you did.” How can you be so disrespectful? You know absolutely nothing about my mother, her ability to raise a child, or me.
Why must you resort to insults? You have lost the small amount of credibility you had with me.
Ron, Why weren’t you outraged about Reid’s race baiting which is so obvious? I don’t want you to say you haven’t approved of race baiting. I want you mad about it like I am. You paint with a broad brush about everyone growing up in the 50’s & 60’s not accepting a President with African roots. Are there racists out there who didn’t want Obama elected? Yes, but I wasn’t one of them. I gave him a pass for about 3 months in his first campaign when he told Joe the Plumber we had to spread the wealth around. Reading more about his nefarious background convinced me he was not the man for the job. Everything he has done since reinforces that belief. Reid is a useful far left idiot who has protected him at every turn by not allowing debate or vote on a lot of legislation to send to his desk so he won’t have to veto it. I am glad to see you agree on one point that most people oppose him based on his agenda and what he has rammed down our throats that are killing this economy and nation. By the way, one of the worst racists ever in the Senate was the now deceased Robert Byrd, D-WV who was active in the KKK back in the day and didn’t apologize for it for 40 years until right before his death.
Agent,
You said, “You officially approve of race baiting from the Democratic side.”, then you said, “I don’t want you to say you haven’t approved of race baiting. I want you mad about it like I am.”. Make up your mind.
There are things that I am upset with Senator Reid about, not bringing up some bills passed by the House for example, but I just do not see this as race baiting. I think anyone who takes his statement as anything more than a concern about possible racism influencing decisions, is looking for more than what is there. I tend to agree that he brought a legitimate concern of many Americans from all races.
Thank you for acknowledging that race has played a part in the opposition to Obama by some people.
I never meant to say you were against President Obama because of race, only that you would be racist if you thought race played no part in his opposition.
I am assuming that you mentioned Senator Byrd as a racist only because he was a Democrat. What are the chances an old white guy from WV could be a racist, regardless of political party affiliation? Shocking!
Not sure why that is relevant to bring up to me. I do not recall ever saying only Republicans could be racist.
As I have asked several times in the past, do you have any quantifiable proof, with a cited source, that his policies are killing this economy and nation. I know you gave me statistics presented by Larry Elder and I read the article. However, he did not cite any of his sources.
I would be especially be interested in something showing that the wealth has been spread around. The ACA does not count since it has not gone into full effect yet.
Finally, are you going to apologize for insulting my late mother?
Agent, I was crucified on this blog when I suggested Sarge caught a piece of shrapnel in his head to explain his sorry a*s. How dare you speak of someone’s mother! That’s disrepectful and rude. You need to apologize. Immediately.
Ron, once again you fail the test to condemn Harry Reid for his obvious racist remarks. You say you are upset that he hasn’t passed on legislation that should have been debated and voted on, but don’t see anything racist about him. This man is the worst example of a majority leader in the Senate’s history and all you are upset about is his lack of action on legislation. I am really tired of people calling Conservatives or Republicans racists if they disagree with Obama’s policies. This has really divided the country. Race warfare, class warfare is the mantra being used. I do apologize about the mother comment. You tend to stir me up sometimes with your comments.
Agent,
Typical of a Republican. Your sole goal is the get someone to condemn another, not try to improve things.
What are your feelings about Senator McConnell’s statement after President Obama was elected that their number one goal was to make him a one-term President? Can you be any more disrespectful? Another Republican failure. What about the goal of getting the country back on track from the financial collapse?
Please provide some evidence, other than his statement, that indicates Senator reid is a racist. That statement itself is not racist. He is only concerned that racism may have played some role in the opposition to President Obama. If all of the opposition is truly based on substance and not race, then why should you or any other Republican or Conservative be offended by the comment?
I would much rather fail for not condemning someone who said something that many Americans, including me, are concerned about than fail to provide support for my feelings. That is where you constantly fail. You spread Republican and Conservative talking points and empty rhetoric and your only source(s) come from right-wing, Conservatives with no data to back them up. Can I assume you will continue this approach or will you actually do some research and provide facts to back up your positions?
If you truly have a degree in Economics you should know the importance of providing statistical support, and citing your source, for your arguments.
I accept youer apology. You also stir me up too, but I believe in civil discourse and respectful debate. Even though Libby and Captain have tossed around some insults to some of you on the right, most insults come from Bob, Sarge, Patti, Sarah, and you.