What a worthless exercise. Not only do types of industries and their concentration vary greatly by state, but benefits vary some too. Thanks to Oregon, the state that spent millions on a website for healthcare that didn’t work. Par for the course.
The article stated that the study uses the same specific set of classes based on NCCI data. So industries are included as if the national set of industries existed in each state because they have specific classes for each industry and type of job.
Benefit differences are a proper distinction; i.e. this is a comparison study of rates, which reflect benefits, among other things.
Is this showing the NCCI or other bureau rates or the actual rates policyholder’s pay after application of the loss cost multipliers? For instance, Oregon has the highest combined ratio in the nation, because of what the State Fund does to the NCCI rates (goes below pure rates). So the premiums are very low of course, but artificially so.
It’s too bad that the article doesn’t provide links to the actual study, because there is a lot of detail available on the methods and limitations. The study uses manual rates, plus assessments that are built into premiums. It is based on NCCI or similar data, since NCCI is not the rating bureau in about a third of states. NW, suggest you check out the actual studies, you will see that the comparisons exclude things like dividends and discounts. So the dividends that drive the high combined ratios in Oregon and some other states don’t affect the rankings.
The workers compensation laws in Oklahoma stink. I got hurt on the job. The attorney said I would be protected. Yea, I had to move out of the state. Workers in this state don’t have a chance!! Especially if they have an accident at a large company!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have the power to delay the case!!!!!
Following up about my last comment about Oklahoma workers compensation laws. Thank god my parents were alive to help me!!! I would have been living in the street If they were not. Not to mention having to leave thousands of dollars of personal items in an apartment and having to move 1500 miles away when my disability checks were cut by the insurance company while I was injured before my second surgery! I am recovering now and I am off medical disability infact I have got a new job were I live now and will start soon. I am still afraid of getting hurt on the job in this country. I might even consider living in Canada because of their socialized medicine. At least they don’t give you the option of living on the street if you get hurt on the job!!!! The workers compensation laws in Oklahoma need reform. So I say to Oklahomans, vote for people that will help the workers and not just the companies!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Interesting rankings method. However, it does not even start to tell the story.
The industrial classifications are generic and do not reflect primary industry costs. Industry such as mining, construction, resources extraction. The cost per $100 of payroll hour for manual forestry work involving power tools for example is $72 per $100 of average worker hour wage. The same level of coverage can be purchased in the private market for less than $6/100. It is a total cash cow for the state and reforms have been attempted to allow businesses to at least buy coverage from private sources but every time the legislation goes nowhere due to the money involved for the state.
I met a payroll in Washington state for 28 years before I quit primary due to the entirely uncompetitive, closed monopoly system of workman compensation insurance rates. We literally could not charge the customer enough to pay for the premiums and still earn any return on the high cost of capital to participate in the industry while playing by the rules. Skirt the rules and take your chances and you are profitable.
As a business in Washington, unless you self insure like Boeing or Microsoft, you must purchase your industrial insurance coverage from the state. Private insurance competition is PROHIBITED!
In other words, the state is the sole insurer and there is no private competition. Their rates schedule is absolutely byzantine and literally militant Labor & Industries staff with writing fines and auditing for potential fines.
Further, when ranking business competitiveness, surveys should include a more comprehensive methodology. For example, the total hours required by staff for tax compliance and regressive taxes like the gross income tax in Washington called the “business and occupations tax” whereas your business pays an income tax based on gross receipts, not net income. So if you are starting a business you invest everything you have at risk, gross income is still taxed even if you lose money during the tax year. For capital intensive businesses as I was in where to start a business that would gross 500K a year, requires a capital investment risk of right at about 900K and that is why new entrants to this industry segment have plummeted in the last 20 years.
The only escape that you have as a business is scale and market cap. Then you are able to buy off the legislators and local tax jurisdictions to get large multi year exemptions. Intel received a $2,000,000,000 tax break over 20 years from a county in Oregon for building a small manufacturing plant employing less than 200 workers. The local mini mart didn’t get a tax break sadly however.
After the tax break was passed, unanimously I might add, there was ample contribution to the re-election campaigns of the county council members.
Pretty much sums up the entire problem of why our economy is struggling in so many sectors. Government is far too large compared to the population and industry base and crony corruption at every level is at historic proportions. Thus leaving those on the outside without political connections to bear the entire burden.
I wonder what would happen if you would give the decision/option to the workers whether they want workman’s compensation or a higher wage. Would all of the employees elect to purchase the insurance and would they work a lot safer and smarter knowing that if they have an accident they would not have any source of income. Look at the fraud that occurs all the time. Someone stubs their toe and misses a month. Someone breaks a nail and needs plastic surgery to replace the fingernail. Back in the day people used to get their arms cut off with half of their body covered in 3rd degree burns and they would be showing up to work the next day. Some claims are justified- but you did choose the line of work for a reason and you are being compensated for your labor.
The workman’s comp rates for my business field of mold remediation were $14.77/$100. The only market place for the insurance was through the state insurance fund as no insurance companies offer coverage for this field anymore. With private insurance i was paying from $7.73-$9.00/$100. I see the national averages at $1-$3 per $100 but when you take these higher class codes into consideration it really is a question as if it is worth hiring workers or using sub-contractors. At an average wage of $200/day each worker costs $8448 per year working 5.5 days/week. 5 workers cost me $42,000/year in WC benefits eating up roughly 8-10% of net income of the company. And it proved to be a waste of money because none of my workers got hurt to take advantage of this investment or ripoff. Why should a company even make safety a goal if we do not see any benefit in premiums (I am just joking- I would never want anyone to actually need it). I would rather see people make a higher wage and forego this insurance but in cases where rates are between $1-$3 i would pay that in a heartbeat but I ran into being insurance poor. I even invested into top of the line safety equipment, safety programs, and made safety my priority. Maybe I was just paying people too much money but I am a firm believer in giving people an honest wage.
What a worthless exercise. Not only do types of industries and their concentration vary greatly by state, but benefits vary some too. Thanks to Oregon, the state that spent millions on a website for healthcare that didn’t work. Par for the course.
The article stated that the study uses the same specific set of classes based on NCCI data. So industries are included as if the national set of industries existed in each state because they have specific classes for each industry and type of job.
Benefit differences are a proper distinction; i.e. this is a comparison study of rates, which reflect benefits, among other things.
Is this showing the NCCI or other bureau rates or the actual rates policyholder’s pay after application of the loss cost multipliers? For instance, Oregon has the highest combined ratio in the nation, because of what the State Fund does to the NCCI rates (goes below pure rates). So the premiums are very low of course, but artificially so.
It’s too bad that the article doesn’t provide links to the actual study, because there is a lot of detail available on the methods and limitations. The study uses manual rates, plus assessments that are built into premiums. It is based on NCCI or similar data, since NCCI is not the rating bureau in about a third of states. NW, suggest you check out the actual studies, you will see that the comparisons exclude things like dividends and discounts. So the dividends that drive the high combined ratios in Oregon and some other states don’t affect the rankings.
The workers compensation laws in Oklahoma stink. I got hurt on the job. The attorney said I would be protected. Yea, I had to move out of the state. Workers in this state don’t have a chance!! Especially if they have an accident at a large company!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have the power to delay the case!!!!!
Following up about my last comment about Oklahoma workers compensation laws. Thank god my parents were alive to help me!!! I would have been living in the street If they were not. Not to mention having to leave thousands of dollars of personal items in an apartment and having to move 1500 miles away when my disability checks were cut by the insurance company while I was injured before my second surgery! I am recovering now and I am off medical disability infact I have got a new job were I live now and will start soon. I am still afraid of getting hurt on the job in this country. I might even consider living in Canada because of their socialized medicine. At least they don’t give you the option of living on the street if you get hurt on the job!!!! The workers compensation laws in Oklahoma need reform. So I say to Oklahomans, vote for people that will help the workers and not just the companies!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Interesting rankings method. However, it does not even start to tell the story.
The industrial classifications are generic and do not reflect primary industry costs. Industry such as mining, construction, resources extraction. The cost per $100 of payroll hour for manual forestry work involving power tools for example is $72 per $100 of average worker hour wage. The same level of coverage can be purchased in the private market for less than $6/100. It is a total cash cow for the state and reforms have been attempted to allow businesses to at least buy coverage from private sources but every time the legislation goes nowhere due to the money involved for the state.
I met a payroll in Washington state for 28 years before I quit primary due to the entirely uncompetitive, closed monopoly system of workman compensation insurance rates. We literally could not charge the customer enough to pay for the premiums and still earn any return on the high cost of capital to participate in the industry while playing by the rules. Skirt the rules and take your chances and you are profitable.
As a business in Washington, unless you self insure like Boeing or Microsoft, you must purchase your industrial insurance coverage from the state. Private insurance competition is PROHIBITED!
In other words, the state is the sole insurer and there is no private competition. Their rates schedule is absolutely byzantine and literally militant Labor & Industries staff with writing fines and auditing for potential fines.
Further, when ranking business competitiveness, surveys should include a more comprehensive methodology. For example, the total hours required by staff for tax compliance and regressive taxes like the gross income tax in Washington called the “business and occupations tax” whereas your business pays an income tax based on gross receipts, not net income. So if you are starting a business you invest everything you have at risk, gross income is still taxed even if you lose money during the tax year. For capital intensive businesses as I was in where to start a business that would gross 500K a year, requires a capital investment risk of right at about 900K and that is why new entrants to this industry segment have plummeted in the last 20 years.
The only escape that you have as a business is scale and market cap. Then you are able to buy off the legislators and local tax jurisdictions to get large multi year exemptions. Intel received a $2,000,000,000 tax break over 20 years from a county in Oregon for building a small manufacturing plant employing less than 200 workers. The local mini mart didn’t get a tax break sadly however.
After the tax break was passed, unanimously I might add, there was ample contribution to the re-election campaigns of the county council members.
Pretty much sums up the entire problem of why our economy is struggling in so many sectors. Government is far too large compared to the population and industry base and crony corruption at every level is at historic proportions. Thus leaving those on the outside without political connections to bear the entire burden.
Doesn’t even begin to reflect benefits to workers only interested in how it effects the business owners in dollars.
I wonder what would happen if you would give the decision/option to the workers whether they want workman’s compensation or a higher wage. Would all of the employees elect to purchase the insurance and would they work a lot safer and smarter knowing that if they have an accident they would not have any source of income. Look at the fraud that occurs all the time. Someone stubs their toe and misses a month. Someone breaks a nail and needs plastic surgery to replace the fingernail. Back in the day people used to get their arms cut off with half of their body covered in 3rd degree burns and they would be showing up to work the next day. Some claims are justified- but you did choose the line of work for a reason and you are being compensated for your labor.
The workman’s comp rates for my business field of mold remediation were $14.77/$100. The only market place for the insurance was through the state insurance fund as no insurance companies offer coverage for this field anymore. With private insurance i was paying from $7.73-$9.00/$100. I see the national averages at $1-$3 per $100 but when you take these higher class codes into consideration it really is a question as if it is worth hiring workers or using sub-contractors. At an average wage of $200/day each worker costs $8448 per year working 5.5 days/week. 5 workers cost me $42,000/year in WC benefits eating up roughly 8-10% of net income of the company. And it proved to be a waste of money because none of my workers got hurt to take advantage of this investment or ripoff. Why should a company even make safety a goal if we do not see any benefit in premiums (I am just joking- I would never want anyone to actually need it). I would rather see people make a higher wage and forego this insurance but in cases where rates are between $1-$3 i would pay that in a heartbeat but I ran into being insurance poor. I even invested into top of the line safety equipment, safety programs, and made safety my priority. Maybe I was just paying people too much money but I am a firm believer in giving people an honest wage.