If insurance entities that write across state lines are subsidizing illegal pot growers, i.e. black markets in states where pot is legal, then ALL states in which those (many!) insurers write insurance are subsidizing ILLEGAL activities. So, the age-old phrase ‘taxation without representation’ comes to mind in this instance. I do not wish to be ‘taxed’ by kings in countries, or legislators in states, wherein I do not reside.
I await my ‘badge of honor’ in the form of multiple down votes by stoners who will not reply in coherent text form.
You’re not actually saying anything except that you don’t want to be “taxed” where you don’t reside. You as usual, say a lot of words without actually bringing anything meaningful to the table.
Favorite line from the piece….”a black market of perhaps equal size is thriving.” Are they serious? The marijuana illegal drug market is way, way bigger than any legal marketplace.
Do you have any data to back that claim up? It’s my understanding that a lot of the illegal marijuana market is excess crops being sold to states where it is still illegal because the process of passing through regulations to sell legally is so backed up that they can’t actually process all of the marijuana submitted.
I agree, there is definitely still a large illegal black market, but I doubt it’s way, way bigger than the legal marketplace, at least within the state. Legal marijuana has a significantly better product for nearly the same price at this point, there’s little incentive to use the illegal market within the state anymore.
I’m happy to share what I can find if you do! As I stated though, my statements are at least based on personal experience with business owners. Are yours? Didn’t think so.
No you’re not, we’ve had several conversations in which you refused to prove your point.
You literally said you didn’t have to. You share yours first. We’ll see what you have.
March 15, 2020 at 9:07 pm
PolarBeaRepeal says:
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Personal experiences with business owners are necessary to ‘prove’ my statement?! WTF?!
Insurance companies that write in 50 states are writing insurance in pot-legal states and pot-not legal states. The subsidies mentioned in the article are shared across all 50 states, some of which are pot-illegal states. QED.
Your turn, junior; let’s hear from your ‘experiences with business owners’ on how subsidies borne by national insurers due to legal state pot ISNT affecting policyholders’ INSURANCE COSTS in pot-illegal states….
March 16, 2020 at 11:04 am
Jon says:
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You keep using this word, subsidies, but that’s not what we’re talking about. This article is talking about insurance fraud, which is a much different thing. Aside from your condescension, true business owners I deal with aren’t trying to commit insurance fraud to pay for grow houses. So maybe you should educate yourself on what a subsidy actually is? It doesn’t seem like you understand the difference between subsidies and insurance fraud gramps LOL
As usual Jon speaks with little knowledge of the subject, other than he sounds like a doper. The black market in Cali IS thriving, and it has not slowed at all due to legalization, and it is bigger than the legal market, why else are local drug busts hauling in tons of illicit weed to be destroyed? The only thing legalization has done is to pad the pockets of those cities where they convinced the people the taxes collected will out weight the problems dope creates, to bad that theory is not panning out, reality is, as usual, far different! Light up another one Jon, enjoy the ride.
Because heroin users should all die of preventable diseases like your pal Mike Pence allowed, right? Studies have shown that countries that have focused on recovery and treatment for addiction have better results than the US focusing on incarceration, but again you would like to ignore things like “fact” because they contradict you. OK Boomer.
Treatment could be argued, since you’re potentially preventing the spread of disease. Which I’ll tell you, if someone’s struggling with addiction issues already, adding Hepatitis C or HIV to that isn’t going to help any. Additionally, you’re preventing a future burden on society in people without jobs or income needing medical care, be it in prison or on the streets someone’s paying for it.
March 12, 2020 at 8:12 am
PolarBeaRepeal says:
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No, treatment is treatment, not prevention. Do a search online for the meaning of those words, junior.
March 11, 2020 at 2:09 pm
Jon says:
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Can you provide any data for that? Even hearsay, do you write any dispensaries in California? I do, and I’ve spoken to these business owners in the community. You can insult me because you don’t like what I’m saying that’s fine, it only speaks to your ignorance and lack of knowledge.
Again, I asked Tiger for data to back up his claim. You’re not offering that data either. Why is that, I wonder? Maybe because you don’t have it.
You’re making a lot of bold claims that are just not based in reality. You sound like another delusional, misinformed boomer.
I will light one up, and I’ll write more business than you, and I’ll actually provide references for my claims. Nice try, boomer.
Can you provide evidence of your claim that there are “significantly more unregulated dispensaries/stores than legal ones”? Because it seems pretty difficult for an illegal dispensary to get a storefront, want to amend that comment maybe?
Your link does provide info, sure, but nowhere in that does it say the black market is significantly larger than the legal market. Again, can you provide evidence? Because your claims don’t match up to the data you’re providing. You can certainly say there’s a black market, but you obviously have never tried to open a store front somewhere if you think illegal businesses are setting that up that willy-nilly.
And as someone who has purchased both off of the black market and the regular market, again, there is no comparison. My local contact was providing 4 grams of cannabis for roughly $30, whereas my local dispensary can do 3.5 grams for $25. The taxes make the dispensary around $31, sure. But the quality? I have roughly a gram leftover from the last time I didn’t buy from a dispensary because it was so bad I’d rather waste it. That’s the quality jump we’re talking about that your side likes to completely disregard.
Again, try listening to someone who actually knows what they’re talking about for once instead of just parroting Fox News talking points.
It is important to stress the ‘break point’ at which the level / magnitude of taxation will compel customers to buy from black markets to avoid high, punitive taxes of a ‘high’ demand product. IF taxes were lower, buyers in a market for a good or service would prefer the LEGAL source of a good, despite slightly higher total cost due to the tax element in the price. California is a ‘high’ tax state. Socialist states will also set a tier structure of sales taxes and other taxes, in part reflecting the inelastic demand for a product or service.
It’s really important to stress that old people don’t actually understand how modern transfer of information takes place. You see we all have a device at our fingertips capable of routing information from all over the world to us at a moments notice, a wealth of resources available. Yet old people are afraid and only listen to Fox News and don’t research things like marijuana, but they LOVE to give their opinions on such topics despite a lack of knowledge. We in younger generations answer to this with the phrase: OK Boomer to display the lack of respect and concern we have for any often incorrect assertion made by your generation.
March 13, 2020 at 5:27 pm
Jon says:
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LOL “old people know more than you” ridiculous blanket statement. A person being old does not mean they are intelligent or knowledgeable, a problem your generation is woefully unprepared to realize. Which is why you’re so inclined to fear based decision making, and enjoy Fox News. Stop trying to troll every single left-wing poster on every partisan issue, you are clearly just trolling.
Re-posted due to an invasion of stoners who aren’t in the insurance industry down-voting my OP in this comment section:
PolarBeaRepeal says:
Poorly-rated. Like or Dislike:
Thumb up 4
Thumb down 16
Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
If insurance entities that write across state lines are subsidizing illegal pot growers, i.e. black markets in states where pot is legal, then ALL states in which those (many!) insurers write insurance are subsidizing ILLEGAL activities. So, the age-old phrase ‘taxation without representation’ comes to mind in this instance. I do not wish to be ‘taxed’ by kings in countries, or legislators in states, wherein I do not reside.
I await my ‘badge of honor’ in the form of multiple down votes by stoners who will not reply in coherent text form.
Reply
Oh my gosh Polar, random stoners aren’t coming on this site to down-vote you. You said something that many people disagreed with. You reposting it will only stay up because a majority of people who down-voted you will leave after the initial discussion.
You are saying a lot of things that are just not correct. Stop the false information already bud, or if it is true, back it up with facts and stats which you have not done.
“Reposting due to an invasion of stoners who aren’t in the insurance industry down-voting my OP”
Dude…I can’t take anything you post seriously ever again. Do you really think that is what happened to your original post? That this insurance article somehow made its rounds in stoner circles and they all went out of their way to come here and down-vote you? That is either extremely egotistical and/or extremely delusional.
Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
You’re not actually saying anything except that you don’t want to be “taxed” where you don’t reside. You as usual, say a lot of words without actually bringing anything meaningful to the table.
Thanks for your opinion, junior. I’ll take it into consideration…. for a moment.
Not a stoner, but I did downvote your post 53 times.
Favorite line from the piece….”a black market of perhaps equal size is thriving.” Are they serious? The marijuana illegal drug market is way, way bigger than any legal marketplace.
Do you have any data to back that claim up? It’s my understanding that a lot of the illegal marijuana market is excess crops being sold to states where it is still illegal because the process of passing through regulations to sell legally is so backed up that they can’t actually process all of the marijuana submitted.
I agree, there is definitely still a large illegal black market, but I doubt it’s way, way bigger than the legal marketplace, at least within the state. Legal marijuana has a significantly better product for nearly the same price at this point, there’s little incentive to use the illegal market within the state anymore.
Do you have any data to back up your misunderstanding?
I’m happy to share what I can find if you do! As I stated though, my statements are at least based on personal experience with business owners. Are yours? Didn’t think so.
No you’re not, we’ve had several conversations in which you refused to prove your point.
You literally said you didn’t have to. You share yours first. We’ll see what you have.
Personal experiences with business owners are necessary to ‘prove’ my statement?! WTF?!
Insurance companies that write in 50 states are writing insurance in pot-legal states and pot-not legal states. The subsidies mentioned in the article are shared across all 50 states, some of which are pot-illegal states. QED.
Your turn, junior; let’s hear from your ‘experiences with business owners’ on how subsidies borne by national insurers due to legal state pot ISNT affecting policyholders’ INSURANCE COSTS in pot-illegal states….
You keep using this word, subsidies, but that’s not what we’re talking about. This article is talking about insurance fraud, which is a much different thing. Aside from your condescension, true business owners I deal with aren’t trying to commit insurance fraud to pay for grow houses. So maybe you should educate yourself on what a subsidy actually is? It doesn’t seem like you understand the difference between subsidies and insurance fraud gramps LOL
Captain obvious strikes again. I smell pizza.
As usual Jon speaks with little knowledge of the subject, other than he sounds like a doper. The black market in Cali IS thriving, and it has not slowed at all due to legalization, and it is bigger than the legal market, why else are local drug busts hauling in tons of illicit weed to be destroyed? The only thing legalization has done is to pad the pockets of those cities where they convinced the people the taxes collected will out weight the problems dope creates, to bad that theory is not panning out, reality is, as usual, far different! Light up another one Jon, enjoy the ride.
Bond- wasn’t that passed by the same people that outlawed my straw for my Pepsi but hands out needles to heroin users?
Because heroin users should all die of preventable diseases like your pal Mike Pence allowed, right? Studies have shown that countries that have focused on recovery and treatment for addiction have better results than the US focusing on incarceration, but again you would like to ignore things like “fact” because they contradict you. OK Boomer.
Jon – free needles is not “focusing on recovery and treatment”
Treatment could be argued, since you’re potentially preventing the spread of disease. Which I’ll tell you, if someone’s struggling with addiction issues already, adding Hepatitis C or HIV to that isn’t going to help any. Additionally, you’re preventing a future burden on society in people without jobs or income needing medical care, be it in prison or on the streets someone’s paying for it.
No, treatment is treatment, not prevention. Do a search online for the meaning of those words, junior.
Can you provide any data for that? Even hearsay, do you write any dispensaries in California? I do, and I’ve spoken to these business owners in the community. You can insult me because you don’t like what I’m saying that’s fine, it only speaks to your ignorance and lack of knowledge.
Again, I asked Tiger for data to back up his claim. You’re not offering that data either. Why is that, I wonder? Maybe because you don’t have it.
You’re making a lot of bold claims that are just not based in reality. You sound like another delusional, misinformed boomer.
I will light one up, and I’ll write more business than you, and I’ll actually provide references for my claims. Nice try, boomer.
I agree with Jon here. Provide some evidence proving your point. Otherwise, it just seems like speculation or blatant bias.
The black market is thriving in CA. There are significantly more unregulated dispenseries/stores than legal ones. The typical MJ user will happily frequent an illicit store and save a boatload in taxes. Which by the way CA increased 1/1/20: https://www.fool.com/investing/2019/11/24/no-joke-california-will-increase-its-cannabis-tax.aspx
Can you provide evidence of your claim that there are “significantly more unregulated dispensaries/stores than legal ones”? Because it seems pretty difficult for an illegal dispensary to get a storefront, want to amend that comment maybe?
Your link does provide info, sure, but nowhere in that does it say the black market is significantly larger than the legal market. Again, can you provide evidence? Because your claims don’t match up to the data you’re providing. You can certainly say there’s a black market, but you obviously have never tried to open a store front somewhere if you think illegal businesses are setting that up that willy-nilly.
And as someone who has purchased both off of the black market and the regular market, again, there is no comparison. My local contact was providing 4 grams of cannabis for roughly $30, whereas my local dispensary can do 3.5 grams for $25. The taxes make the dispensary around $31, sure. But the quality? I have roughly a gram leftover from the last time I didn’t buy from a dispensary because it was so bad I’d rather waste it. That’s the quality jump we’re talking about that your side likes to completely disregard.
Again, try listening to someone who actually knows what they’re talking about for once instead of just parroting Fox News talking points.
It is important to stress the ‘break point’ at which the level / magnitude of taxation will compel customers to buy from black markets to avoid high, punitive taxes of a ‘high’ demand product. IF taxes were lower, buyers in a market for a good or service would prefer the LEGAL source of a good, despite slightly higher total cost due to the tax element in the price. California is a ‘high’ tax state. Socialist states will also set a tier structure of sales taxes and other taxes, in part reflecting the inelastic demand for a product or service.
It’s really important to stress that old people don’t actually understand how modern transfer of information takes place. You see we all have a device at our fingertips capable of routing information from all over the world to us at a moments notice, a wealth of resources available. Yet old people are afraid and only listen to Fox News and don’t research things like marijuana, but they LOVE to give their opinions on such topics despite a lack of knowledge. We in younger generations answer to this with the phrase: OK Boomer to display the lack of respect and concern we have for any often incorrect assertion made by your generation.
LOL “old people know more than you” ridiculous blanket statement. A person being old does not mean they are intelligent or knowledgeable, a problem your generation is woefully unprepared to realize. Which is why you’re so inclined to fear based decision making, and enjoy Fox News. Stop trying to troll every single left-wing poster on every partisan issue, you are clearly just trolling.
Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
Oh my gosh Polar, random stoners aren’t coming on this site to down-vote you. You said something that many people disagreed with. You reposting it will only stay up because a majority of people who down-voted you will leave after the initial discussion.
You are saying a lot of things that are just not correct. Stop the false information already bud, or if it is true, back it up with facts and stats which you have not done.
Can you prove your assertion?
I can prove you’re a delusional old man, reading your posts is really all it takes for that.
Please prove that stoners are here first. You made a bad argument you cannot support and I will debate you on this as you post nonsense frequently.
Your levels of hypocrisy and denial are astounding.
To clarify, my response is not to Flawedlogic. The person I was responding to was deleted rightfully.
I wouldn’t use the term subsidizing.
This is insurance fraud. The ill-gotten proceeds from insurance fraud are used to fund pot growers.
“Reposting due to an invasion of stoners who aren’t in the insurance industry down-voting my OP”
Dude…I can’t take anything you post seriously ever again. Do you really think that is what happened to your original post? That this insurance article somehow made its rounds in stoner circles and they all went out of their way to come here and down-vote you? That is either extremely egotistical and/or extremely delusional.
Still not a stoner. Definitely in the industry. Downvoted one MILLION times.
::EVIL LAUGH::