Welcome employees to the new Healthcare reality. Higher deductibles, higher out of pocket expenses all for a slightly higher premium. You can thank Jonathon Gruber for fixing Healthcare in America.
sorry agent, it was a reality long before the ACA was passed..Cost, premiums have been going up for a decade, with several double digit years in there….but what the heck, it feels good to blame “them”….
You might want to be creative and pick a different moniker than mine if you want to opine. How do you like Gruber’s solution to fixing Healthcare? Yes, it does feel good to blame serial liers for deceiving the American People, the low information voters who thought they were going to get something for nothing. The smoking gun is up to 4 videos now on the flaming elitist who derides the “stupid voters” he pulled the wool over their eyes.
My moniker is short and sweet Ron and even you can read it. Was that you imitating me or the moniker thief Booger? You have been really quiet after the election. Did something happen on that fateful Tuesday that shut you up for a while?
November 14, 2014 at 3:49 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
What is with the insults? Why would I need or want to imitate you?
I was happy about the election results. I just hope the Republicans will finally begin to govern. When can we expect them to fix everything (2017 is not acceptable) and how will we quantify their success or failure?
November 14, 2014 at 4:19 pm
Libby says:
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“What is with the insults?”
LOL! Ron, you know that’s Agent’s M.O. as he complains about everyone insulting him.
He’s a hypocrite, man.
November 14, 2014 at 4:55 pm
Agent says:
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So Ron, you are allowed to insult me and when I come back on you, you claim to be insulted. I am glad you were happy with the election results. Some of your cohorts weren’t and are in complete denial. By the way, the House passed the Keystone Pipeline bill again today, the first of many to come. Now, Harry Reid can block it from being voted on again to protect the President from vetoing it. We will give them the opportunity to move forward or be obstructionists. In January, Reid won’t be able to block so it will be on Obama to start signing or vetoing. Mary Landrieu really wants it now after being silent for 6 years. She thinks she will pick up some votes. I don’t think Dirty Harry will lend a sympathic ear, but I could be wrong.
November 13, 2014 at 5:10 pm
SWFL Agent says:
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In no way will I defend the ACA, but there’s probably an argument to be made that rising healthcare costs have more to do with new designer drugs for just about everything, more treatment options that keep the elderly & terminally alive longer, and the “invention” of new illnesses. Throw in legal costs and a healthcare bureaucracy that is “too big to fail” and this is what we have. I’ve yet to hear anyone offer any solutions. Because these solutions would be perceived as rationing care, providing substandard care, or discriminatory.
there is a relatively simple solution, Universal Health Care. We need to remove a profit motive from health care. I equate this to defense, education, and infrastructure as necessities for which all Americans should have equal access. Health insurance companies can create “Cadillac Plans” for people to be able to purchase separately for better coverage. Just like private schools.
Exactly. Universal care will end overtreating for profit, lawsuits for bogus med mal claims, and make health care much more cost effective. Costs will go DOWN, while everyone will have access to adequate care.
For those that want it, they can buy up similar to the U.K. with Harley Street. BTW, I don’t hear anyone in the U.K., Canada, or Australia complaining about their healthcare.
And Agent, ther is no such thing as a “Pathway to Death.” You and Sarah Palin need to get a clue.
Throw it in there, too. I have always been a proponent of tort reform.
The only point I have made is that malpractice lawsuits have been proven to be a very small driver of health insurance premiums. About one half of 1 percent.
In IL, a guy dies because he did not follow doc advice and take his heart meds. Widow sues. $3Mil against the doc and $3Mil against the ER he was taken to. Didn’t even go to court. Whats the point in Cook County.
Change the legal system to be like England, watch the savings hit your health insurance bill.
Remove the Profit incentive, what the point of R&D??? Just to be a “Good Guy”?
November 14, 2014 at 12:16 pm
Ron says:
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FFA,
I did not say that pharmaceutical companies and medical device suppliers could not have a profit motive. I also would not have a problem with a for-profit company that specializes in R&D. Kind of like how we have private companies that supply equipment to the military and private contractors who do infrastructure.
My position is that health insurance should not be driven by profit.
November 14, 2014 at 4:55 pm
draetish says:
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You’re wrong Libby, Gruber Buber disclosed that there is a death panel.
November 17, 2014 at 3:44 pm
FFA says:
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Ron, my post was in response to – ““honestly earned”?”.
I disagree, Ron. Public monopolies, as evidenced by public education, social security and Medicare/VA, are notoriously unaccountable, wasteful and ineffective. At first, they are called “safety nets” to lift the poor. In time, however, politicians use entitlements to agitate class envy and spread misery so nobody else is better off. History proves that profits, honestly earned, create choices for consumers and elevate the quality of care.
There are millions of people who will say public education, social security and Medicare/VA have given them opportunites to be successful, maintain their lifestyle in retirement and save their lives without going bankrupt. Sometimes we have to accept some inefficiencies in order to benefit those without the means to afford such services. Nothing is perfect, even private companies.
You hit the nail on the head when you said, “History proves that profits, honestly earned, create choices for consumers and elevate the quality of care.”
While that is a completely true statement, who determines what constitutes “honestly earned”? That is a very subjective statement.
My issue is that health insurance companies care far more about their bottom lines than their consumers’ well being. That is exactly what a for-profit company is suppose to do.
November 17, 2014 at 12:11 pm
Jenny says:
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Well said, Adam.
November 17, 2014 at 1:31 pm
FFA says:
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Ron, its simple… Poorly managed companies fail. properly managed companies take care of their customers. Came home from Cali late last night to find a long standing restaurant that was taken over by the kids of the founder (passed away) closed their doors. I know one of the (former) employees who will verify that the place was run into the ground by the lids that took it over. Degrading employees, pissing off customers ect…
Leaving bad debt of $2Mil is what the rumor mill is saying.
November 17, 2014 at 2:36 pm
Ron says:
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FFA,
I am not sure how your post is relevant. I understand how the free market works in theory. I just do not think people’s health care should have a profit motive. In addition, wht if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable? These are people’s lives, not just a meal.
The problem with the health care issue is that the people who need it the most are being left out because the health insurance companies are run so well (record profits). We need to take away the profit motive for health insurance companies and stop all of the declines for coverage, lifetime limits and non-renewal/cancellations. Those seem to be concerns of the right as well, they just have done nothing about it. Tort reform and selling across state lines will help, but not to the extent necessary.
November 17, 2014 at 3:12 pm
Agent says:
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Ron, I think Adam has it right and you have it wrong. “Some inefficiencies” in the public domain? Public education is a disaster and the teachers unions are only interested in their pension plans, not properly educating our kids. Social Security is on course to go bankrupt in about 15 years after Progressive politicians robbed the Trust Fund and put it in the General Fund so they could waste it on worthless projects/programs. Of course, the now proven deceit, lack of transparency of Obamacare is yet another government program threatening to bankrupt the country if it is allowed to stand. You people that want single payer are willing to let the government have complete control over your lives, tell you what doctor to see, whether you can have an operation or not and a friendly bureaucrat on the other end of the line is really looking out for you. That is like the lemmings willingly jumping into the pit without a thought in the world. Thanks, but no thanks.
November 17, 2014 at 3:17 pm
Libby says:
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Agent – Newsflash! You don’t control your health care anymore now than you would with Universal Care. Your health insurance carrier tells you who you can see, whether they will pay for a procedure or not, and you think the friendly claim adjuster on the other end of the line cares about helping you? You are delusional.
With Universal Care, you could purchase excess coverage for those things you don’t like about what’s given to you. Just like you can do now. Don’t like your plan? Pay more for a better one? Don’t mind your plan? Great! Cuz it’s free.
November 17, 2014 at 3:48 pm
FFA says:
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And Ron, There was a market for the pre X crowd. In Il it was called ICHIP. Agreed, it needed some work. high Deductibles and high cost. But we have that now for everyone.
So, I ask again, just what issues did the PPACA resolve? everyone is paying more for higher deds.
November 17, 2014 at 9:02 pm
Ron says:
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FFA,
How many times do I need to state that I am against the PPACA? Why are you and the others on the right asking me to defend and/or explain the law?
November 14, 2014 at 9:30 am
Agent says:
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Well SWFL, would you prefer that we copy Britain and put the elderly on the “Pathway to Death” if they have a serious illness? I think it is great that new drugs have been developed to treat illness although there still isn’t a workable vaccine for Ebola. Legal costs due to no Tort Reform play a part in rising costs and the Healthcare Bureaucracy is a nightmare as we have seen.
What kind of stupid question is that Ron? In view of the Gruber revelations, please tell the class how that is the way to handle Healthcare Reform. Please cite your sources on how fraud and deception and lack of transparency are good for America or how bribery, coercion to get lawmakers to vote for it was used. Your side were thugs and agenda driven to the detriment of the country. Spin your way out of that.
November 14, 2014 at 3:58 pm
Ron says:
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Agent,
It is not a stupid question for anyone else, but you. The point is that tort reform will impact less than one half of one percent of your health insurance premiums.
If you have different statistics, please provide and cite your source.
I have stated many times that I am against the PPACA. Why do you expect me to defend Gruber or President Obama?
When did I ever say, “fraud and deception and lack of transparency are good for America or how bribery, coercion to get lawmakers to vote for it was used.”? How am I suppose to cite a source for a state,ment I never made?
My side, Independents, has never had a voice in government and wants Republican and Democrat thugs gone.
November 17, 2014 at 1:33 pm
FFA says:
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Don’t forget the defensive medicine that adds to the cost. Docs / Hospitals have to run every single test even if its one in a mill chance they might have some form of rare disease.
From my understanding, “defensive” medicine is a bit of a misnomer. Yes, many times they run too many tests and overprescribe because of litigious fear. But far more often they do it because they get paid a commission. This is especially true in end-of-life situations.
Basically, because of the profit motive, Doctors prescribe treatments and tests patients don’t need because those doctors, say oncologists for example, get paid a % of that treatment. 60 Minutes had a good expose on it a few weeks ago (a link!!! just for you Bobby).
You understanding is limited in its personal experience. You just not old enough to have experienced it first hand. You are still invincible.
November 17, 2014 at 5:36 pm
Stan says:
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Not invincible, just handsome. Actually, I am not really worth a whole lot except to the govt bc I sort of owe them quite a bit of money.
But that being said, and as weve discussed elsewhere, Tort reform to combat defensive medicine and over-zealous med mal lawsuits are really a small portion of overall healthcare spending.
November 18, 2014 at 11:31 am
FFA says:
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Stan Says: “But that being said, and as weve discussed elsewhere, Tort reform to combat defensive medicine and over-zealous med mal lawsuits are really a small portion of overall healthcare spending”
Spoken like an experienced lawyer. They taught you well. Bogus Med Mal (and many more) suits happen all the time especially in this neck of the woods. OBamas home county is one of the worst.
November 18, 2014 at 11:49 am
Stan says:
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I didnt say that they were uncommon, I said that as a percentage, they are not even close to being the main protagonist in the story of Rising Healthcare Costs.
November 18, 2014 at 12:04 pm
Libby says:
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He’s right, FFA.
November 19, 2014 at 10:26 am
FFA says:
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Boots on the ground – personal experience tells me the Govt is fudging them stats. They need to protect their fellow liars.
November 20, 2014 at 11:09 am
Stan says:
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FFA, if you dont believe govt stats under a Democratic president, are you equally skeptical under a Republican one? Im serious. You cant have it both ways.
November 17, 2014 at 5:33 pm
Agent says:
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Libby, stop with the BS. You are digging a deeper hole for yourself. My wife has had 12 surgeries in the past 15 years and we haven’t had any problems with insurance carriers paying for them as long as they were pre-authorized through the doctor. All we had to do was pay the deductible and co-pays and we were good. I don’t think the government bureaucrats would be so helpful if it came down to the same situation given their track record.
“I don’t “think” the government bureaucrats would be so “helpful…” You think your insurance carrier is “helpful” because they pay for your wife’s surgery? They are contractually obligated to do so.
You don’t know what the government would or wouldn’t do if there was universal care. You just pontificate based on nothing, zero, bubkus. Of course they would cover necessary surgeries. Why wouldn’t they?
My Dad, Father-in-Law, and Brother-in-Law all receive(d) treatment from the V.A. They never scrimped on them in the least. You know about one guy you heard about that had a bad experience with the V.A. and you condemn the whole system. There are bad experiences on the private side of medicine, too. Just ask Duncan Thomas.
November 19, 2014 at 10:25 am
FFA says:
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Libby Says “You don’t know what the government would or wouldn’t do if there was universal care. You just pontificate based on nothing, zero, bubkus”
With all the lies and deceit thrown at Joe/Jane average person, you trust the govt? You your self has acknowledge the lies by this and previous administrations. Now you want to trust the liars with your health? Track record from DC tells me that no one has earned trust.
Care to buy some swamp land in FLA?
November 20, 2014 at 11:18 am
Stan says:
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Personally, I do trust the government over most other sources. Especially non-partisan offices like the CBO.
At the end of the day, we really dont have a choice. The government is uniquely positioned to solve problems that we cannot solve for ourselves. These include national defense, regulating financial markets, keeping lead out of toys, protecting national forests, etc.
November 13, 2014 at 4:37 pm
m & m says:
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“Health plan costs up slightly”?? Mine has increased almost 60% in the last 2 years!
My premium went up 95% last year with BCBS. Then I moved to Humana. We are going to meet with the rep Monday. This premium is going up 54%. Inflation is real. I’m ticked. Oh, I have no health problems at all.
How are your deductibles and out of pocket expense William? Are you part of the young group that Progressives said had to carry the load for the older, sicker patients?
Ron says:
“I was happy about the election results. I just hope the Republicans will finally begin to govern. When can we expect them to fix everything (2017 is not acceptable) and how will we quantify their success or failure?”
Wait a minute Ron, you expect the Republicans to fixed all that Obama and his Adminstration destroyed by 2017? All I hear Democrats saying is oh maybe now the Republicans can start doing something. Well you damn right now we can since we have the majority in both houses and hopefully shut Obama and his Hope and Change down. What a bunch of liars!
yes we did, but he didn’t do and got re-elected based on lies and cover ups. Wow Democrats must be so proud of all the deceit and fraud it’s party is famous for.
So Ron, what did he do but pass the trillion dollar stimulus which created almost no jobs and added to his legacy as the biggest spender in the history of the country. $7 trillion and counting. Did I see any proposals from him to lower taxes and incentivize business to hire? He did pass Obamacare which is the biggest job killer ever passed and full of new taxes. How do you like those 1.5% to 2% increases in GNP? We should be at 4.5% or higher annually after the recession. We have had several recovery summers which weren’t recoveries. Do you think bad public policy had anything to do with that?
First, the president is not responsible for the economy, period. That falls on Congress.
Second, the economy does not suck for everyone. I am doing far better than I was before he was elected. Is it because of him or any other politiican? Of corse not. I busted my ass working full time while earning my Master’s Degree. This just shows that if you want to be successful, it does not matter who is the president.
Third, you misunderstood my point. I want to know when we can expect the Republicans to fix the economy. Since President Obama was being criticized by the Republicans less than 1 year in office for not fixing the economy from the second worse financial collapse in our history, I figured they can fix it in less than two. If they want to win the White House in 2016, they better make it happen.
I guess the real question I am asking is: when can we expect the economy to start booming with the Republicans controlling Congress? And, if it does not happen, can we blame them or is it still solely President Obama’s fault?
Ron, do us a favor and give Stan a job in your office so he will not keep blaming Republicans and business for not providing him a top end job. I am glad you are doing well and commend you for getting your Masters. Stan has three degrees and cannot find work.
By the way, GW has been blamed for 6 years for anything and everything and Obama has just made things worse. When has he proposed anything that incentivizes business to create jobs? It took Reagan about three years with pro business policies from the huge recession mess he inherited from Carter. It will take at least that long or longer to recover from the Obama legacy of excessive taxation, the albatross of Obamacare, the EPA implementing job killing regulations etc.
November 17, 2014 at 2:42 pm
Stan says:
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Agent, I feel like I’ve been clear about this. I dont blame republican politicians, I blame YOU for being so dumb as to vote against your own self interest. Splitting hairs, maybe, but I wanted to make sure that I was clear.
And really, the fact that you can defend Bush is astonishing. The man was a trainwreck by literally any objective standard. You’d be better off to acknowledge it and move on.
November 17, 2014 at 2:47 pm
FFA says:
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Ron, Soon as Obama Care gets tossed off the books and business KNOW what the future holds for cost, the job market will loosen up.
November 17, 2014 at 3:09 pm
Libby says:
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LOL Agent! Bush has been blamed for the past 14 years! Don’t forget the 8 he was in office. He sucked then and we’re still feeling the brunt of it now.
November 17, 2014 at 3:12 pm
Ron says:
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FFA,
As much as I and the majotiry of Americans have been against the PPACA, the Republicans better have a real, workable replacement ready that provides very similar benefits or they will be tossed out of office even faster than the Democrats. A large segment of the opposition does not like it because there was not even a public option. I hope the Republicans do not think tort reform and allowing policies to be sold across state lines will be sufficient.
Agent,
If you do not think Republicans will be blaming President Obama after he is out of office, you are sorely mistaken. Democrats still blame President Reagan for some things and Republicans still blame Presidents Carter and Clinton. Neither party is immune to or above the blame game. This is one of the main reasons that I am an Independent, I think both parties are terrible.
November 17, 2014 at 3:28 pm
FFA says:
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Ron, Isn’t Medicaid a public option? I would rather have my Old Plan back. There appears to be no true stop loss as every time the wife visits the PT & Pain Clinic, there is a copay. I have spent more on Med bills this year on a PPACA plan (BCBS Gold) then I have in years past. PPACA has increased my expense as well as taking away part of the deductibility of it all (7% vs 10%. Rating up my producer today, F 30 1 dep – she asked me how that’s affordable. All I had to explain that was its OBamas idea of what affordable is. Even though I am picking up more subsidy – I now legally have 4 dependents, my premiums are going up.
What problems has this solved? Not Pre X as that was available. What issues has it created? See Stan. He should have had several offers the week he graduated. No one wants to hire any more as the companies don’t know where this is headed. Supreme Ct should be deciding this thing today. Americans need to know.
November 17, 2014 at 3:53 pm
Ron says:
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FFA,
Medicaid is not a public option. It is health care for the poor. There are milions of working poor who make too much to qualify.
The point is this, health care/insurance as we knew it is gone forever. It is time to strat exporing opportunities to fix what is still wrong and imporve upon it.
I have never heard of a business hiring for any other reason than demand. Costs and expenses are in constant flux whether it is health care, taxes, wages, vendors, utilities, rent, etc. Many businesses have started, expanded, hired, and grown to be more profitable than ever since this law has passed. It happens under all administrations and economies. Hard work, innovation and perseverance will always trump government influence.
I believe in capitalism and the free markt for nearly every inwdustry. I also believe that there are some industries for which profit should not be the main driver.
You never answered my question, “what if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable?”
November 17, 2014 at 5:22 pm
FFA says:
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Ron says “what if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable?”
In IL, I Chip was available. I do agree it needed some attention. I will also agree that Medicaid needed help too. Also COBRA. Work within the frame work that was already established with the Tech Infrastructure that – you know – worked.
To tear down the entire system? Stans already gripping about having to carry the load for the older folks. My 30 yr old producer changed her tune about this when she saw in black and white whats happening. She wanted to argue with me about things today. All I could say was to pick up the phone and call Obama and ask him why…
Whats gonna happen when these young folks decide they don’t want to support us old folks?
November 18, 2014 at 8:56 am
Libby says:
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You know FFA, I have paid for everything I have in this life. Nobody ever gave me anything. But I do not begrudge contributing to a system that will provide health care for all citizens. I think that is a worthy and noble cause.
The previous system WASN’T working. You keep going on about CHIP. CHIP was expensive. It was meant for people that couldn’t get coverage in the standard market, but had money. It didn’t help the poor or the working poor.
You are all wrong about this issue. Health care is a RIGHT, not a privilege reserved for the privileged.
November 18, 2014 at 10:37 am
FFA says:
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Libby, my point on IChip was that it was available. I agree fully it needed work. These are the folks that should have got premium assistance. I do not begrudge giving someone help while they get back on their feet. I too have paid for everything I got. No one gave me anything.
Yesterday, I got notice of policy changes with no mention of premium. New Co Pays have been added that will cost me more.
I have said it before and I will say it again. The system needed work, not to be torn down completely and replaced with higher costs as that is what we have. Higher out of pocket. Worse service at the carrier level. Misleading Policy Language such as Stop Loss.
November 18, 2014 at 11:00 am
Libby says:
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FFA – the entire system was NOT torn down. It should have been, but it’s not. Coverage is still provided by private for-profit carriers. I should be provided to all citizens as part of the taxes we all pay in. I’d much rather cut aid to Egypt and provide healthcare to citizens. Wouldn’t you???
November 18, 2014 at 11:25 am
FFA says:
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Libby, the infrastructure and distribution systems that were in place worked very well. Now its an Hour + hold time. Hope the web site don’t crash. Cost was way down. out of Pocket was much lower then hat it is now. It was a true stop loss. People could keep their coverage. People could keep their doctors. Agents were involved, not criticized and called unethical. I find it very offensive being called Unethical by a liar.
Again, I agree that Health Care needed to be reformed, but not on this large scale transformation. Even now, its hard to keep on top of all that is going on. Almost need another producer to help with the calls coming in. But when they go on Healthcare.gov to complete, it erases my Agent info and I put the effort in for nothing in return. Previously, we used to make 15%. Now we make 5%. We were not informed the commissions would get pounded down like that before it was to late to make an informed choice. Need 3x the amount of people on the books just to break even revenue wise.
November 18, 2014 at 12:06 pm
Libby says:
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“Libby, the infrastructure and distribution systems that were in place worked very well.”
Yeah, for people that could AFFORD it. How about the millions of people that couldn’t? It didn’t work too well for the, FFA.
Sorry that your costs have risen, so have mine. If we had just done universal care, we could have lowered everyone’s costs.
November 19, 2014 at 10:20 am
FFA says:
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Libby Says “Yeah, for people that could AFFORD it.
Sorry that your costs have risen, so have mine.”
So now it is more affordable? Obama have the Opposite dictionary open when he wrote this thing?
November 19, 2014 at 11:48 am
FFA says:
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Libby Says: “You know FFA, I have paid for everything I have in this life. Nobody ever gave me anything”
Of course you have. Your parents taught you to be self reliant as did mine and almost all of our generation.
Haven’t heard from Stan… Maybe he scored his job. Hoping the best for him and all the other college grads that were dis illusioned . mis lead. Lied to.
November 19, 2014 at 11:55 am
Libby says:
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Yes, it’s affordable now to alot of people that didn’t have any before. It might cost more for those of us that did have it before. Cost of doing business.
I don’t support the ACA, but I support the idea of access to healthcare for all citizens. It can be done. It wasn’t being done before.
November 19, 2014 at 1:15 pm
FFA says:
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Libby, if it cost more then it did 12 months ago with higher OOP costs, how is that more affordable for people today that could not afford it 12 – 24 Months ago? Speaking old school if it cost more then it is less affordable.
November 17, 2014 at 2:56 pm
Agent says:
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Ron, When the country was in the doldrums at the start of the recession, I don’t recall anyone expecting Obama to fix it in one year. That has never been done with any President or Congress in my memory. I know you don’t recall it, but Clinton had a recession going on at the end of his second term. We would have had some recovery going on with the Bush Tax cuts passed on a bi-partisan basis, but a little thing called 9/11 happened 9 months into his Presidency. That would ambush anything anyone could have tried. By the way, Democrats and Republicans joined hands and backed him on the War on Terrorism until they decided to blame him for unfunded wars. Give Stan a job so he won’t have time to blog nonsense all day every day.
But yet, you support OBama and his lies? Its ok for Dems to lie and not Repbs?
November 17, 2014 at 4:07 pm
Libby says:
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I didn’t say that, FFA. But I do weigh the degree of the lie. A lie that kills thousands of our young men and women v. if you like your plan, you can keep your plan? Sorry. No comparison.
November 17, 2014 at 4:33 pm
Agent says:
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Well Libby, the Republicans were too smart to join hands with a Progressive Socialist who rammed this terrible Healthcare Law down our throats in the middle of the night with no bi-partisan support. Now, it turns out, it was a lie of biblical proportions. Grubergate to add to the list of all other scandals by this Administration. How much corruption and outright lies are you willing to tolerate before writing them off?
November 17, 2014 at 4:51 pm
Libby says:
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Grubergate. LOL! Be serious Agent. All the Dems did was present the law in the best possible light in order to get it passed.
It’s what any good salesman does. They address adverse perceptions up front and sometimes a little smoke and mirrors are used. So what? That’s not lying or fraud.
Grow up. It’s how business is done. In another couple of weeks Gruber will have gone the way of Ebola. Never to be heard of again.
November 17, 2014 at 5:17 pm
Agent says:
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Ron, you complain about Republicans should have something workable in short order to fix Obamacare or they will be tossed quicker than the Democrats. Need I remind you that we have had this dastardly law for over 4 years now and it is more hated than ever. Do you think this disaster in a year or so when we still have Obama in office and the veto pen at the ready? No, we will have to get a Republican President in office in 16 to do anything serious. This law is so rife with lies, deceipt, hidden taxes and language even legal scholars can’t understand that major surgery is necessary. Pare it down to about 100 common sense language pages and delete the 20,000 pages of extra regulations and that is a start. You should apply the same standards to Republicans as you gave Democrats. They made the mess and Republicans will have to fix it for everyone. By the way, there has not been a national outcry for single payer except by a few far left bozos. Get it in your head Ron, big government does not work since it is inherently wasteful, corrupt and inefficient.
“No, we will have to get a Republican President in office in 16 to do anything serious.”
Oh, well. I guess you’re screwed then.
November 14, 2014 at 5:06 pm
Agent says:
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I agree draetish. Poor Ron wants everything fixed in a hurry, doesn’t he? Obama has made a mess of biblical proportions for 6 years. His band of thieves and their deeds have almost wiped out the country. There are about 300 bills languishing on Reid’s desk that have been gathering dust. A good start is to debate and vote on them. Then, Obama can sign or veto. I would also like to see Goober Gruber called up to a Select Committee to answer to all his lies. I certainly think that would be interesting. Actually, he should be prosecuted for his misdeeds. We should also consider cutting the EPA down to size and either defunding them or get them down to a shell so they can’t do any more harm to business.
I am surrounded by Republican working class whites. They make up most of the demographic in my neck of the woods. I can’t speak for them, but I have spoken to alot of them.
They see Democrats as spendthrifts that want to give away all of their hard-earned tax money to lazy loafers that don’t want to work. On social issues, we most all agree. It’s the illusion of Democrats supporting giving people something for nothing that turns them off. WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME WELFARE REFORM!
Working being the important word. Don’t care what color anyone is, they just don’t want the Govt sticking their hands into their pockets especially with the BS that is gong on in Washington.
I have a good one for you FFA. The title is – Why our Healthcare Costs Are So High
Here is what happened to Kevin. Kevin walked into a doctor’s office and the receptionist asked him what he had. Kevin said: Shingles. So she wrote down his name, addres, medical insurance number and told him to have a seat.
Fifteen minutes later, a nurse’s aid came out and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. So she wrote down his height, weight, a complete medical history and told Kevin to wait in the examining room.
A half hour later, a nurse came in and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. So the nurse gave Kevin a blood test, a blood pressure test, an electrocardiogram and told Kevin to undress and wait for the doctor.
An hour later, the doctor cam in and found Kevin sitting patiently in the nude and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. The doctor asked where? Kevin said, Outside in the truck. Where do you want me to unload em?
I’ll agree with Welfare Reform. Start by kicking out the illegals and get them off the US dime. Kick the moochers off the welfare system. Give them a time frame to get their act together. If they don’t want to help themselves, I don’t want to help them either. Stop trying to be the world police department. Under OBama, no one fears us. Bring our boys home, line the borders and let the Mid east kill themselves off.
So FFA, the President shrugged his shoulders – Gruber who? There has been confirmed 19 visits to the White House by Gruber to meet with the President, advisors etc. Not as many visits as the IRS director, but a substantial number. They are all into this deception, mammoth lie up to their eyeballs.
For once, I agree with you Libby. I may add that a lot of working class Democrats are also upset with the Democratic Party and voted the other way in the election. The party of blame, division, race, hate and lie did not do so well and had nothing positive to offer. The latest Gallup poll reflects this. Grubergate has galvanized opposition to Obama and his policies. I saw his little press conference at lunch while he was in Australia. They asked him about Gruber and he did almost the same thing as Pelosi in her Sargeant Schulz imitation.
This is simplistic, Agent. Lots of working class dems are not upset with obama because of his policies, they are upset that he didnt do enough. In other words, they are mad that Obama capitulated to YOU. I myself fall into this camp. Elections matter, and in 2010 and 2012 the Democrats should have taken a page from the republican handbook: run rampant and pass reforms across the board.
I’ve got news for you Stan. Obama hasn’t capitulated or compromised on anything in 6 years. We don’t think he will ever see the light and will continue to veto anything that doesn’t fit with his leftist agenda. He is all agenda all the time. A smart President would see if he can work out some deals that would help the country. The track record on cooperation is non-existent. His cohort in this is Harry Reid who has blocked everything to the tune of 300+ bills. Good thing Harry is a short timer. We may get some things done if the veto pin doesn’t get in the way.
November 17, 2014 at 4:38 pm
Agent says:
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Wrong again Stan the uninformed. Only the hardest core left has been upset that Obama didn’t go far enough. Working class moderate Democrats are as put off as working class Republicans. We know you are part of the hard core left with all your previous posts. You should really consider applying to the Obama Administration as a spokesman. Of course, that job might only be for two years and then you would be out on the street again with your three degrees.
November 17, 2014 at 4:53 pm
Libby says:
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I’m sure Hillary will keep him on.
November 17, 2014 at 4:55 pm
Libby says:
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He’s young, handsome and smart! He might make a great “intern” for her! Stan – don’t wear a blue dress.
November 19, 2014 at 11:50 am
FFA says:
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“I’m sure Hillary will keep him on.”
She will need a boy toy just like billy boy needed his interns…
November 17, 2014 at 3:13 pm
Libby says:
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The Democratic Party is NOT a party of blame, division, race, hate, and lies. The fact that you say this is in itself divisive, hateful and a lie. Look in the mirror Agent.
So I know you don’t stay up with the news Libby so I will forgive your ignorance on how this last election went and what Democrats did to try to stay in office. It was appalling seeing them play the race, gender, hate card to the max and to see the lies exposed. Had you caught some of Wendy Davis tactics, you could see first hand how she lost by nearly 1 million votes.
November 17, 2014 at 4:52 pm
Libby says:
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Your side has it’s own set of tactics, Agent. It’s called politics. Karl Rove anyone?
Grow up!
November 17, 2014 at 1:37 pm
FFA says:
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So Agent, whats with Dallas Ft Worth Airport shutting down after 2 ” of snow yesterday? Appears you not used to global warming. Denver just delayed me for 5 hours with a major ice storm.
No FFA, I guess DFW isn’t used to Global Warming yet and may not have all the snow ploughs that the frozen tundra does since it is so rare down here. By the way, interesting football weekend. Glad to see your Bears finally win again although I still have reservations about the quarterback. Green Bay really kicked the Eagles butt all over the field. There was a good reason why Sanchez was let go by the Jets. Also, Peyton Manning is still struggling and lost to the very average Rams. 398 yards passing and could only get 7 points. What is that all about? The best team in the league is someone nobody talks about, the Arizona Cardinals. They just have a lot of good players and play as a team.
Yesterday day was a travel day for me. Didn’t catch any F Ball at all. AZ just keeps getting it done even with their 2nd string QB. Sanchez was a flop from his first game. Darn Glad Payton fell on his face yesterday. He usually kills me in FF, but not this week. I have a one point lead and got the rookie in Pitts going and he has the RB in Pitts. It boils down to how Big Ben wants to score – in the air or on the ground. Playing for the third seed tonight… Worst case, I’ll have the 4th with just two weeks to go. A win tonight will pull me away from the pack.
Well FFA, Big Ben shouldn’t have a lot of trouble with the lowly Titans who are pretty much at the bottom of the NFL currently in about every category. I doubt if I will watch much of it, especially if it is like last Sunday or Monday’s games. I like games that are competitive like Kansas City/Seattle. Those guys were knocking the snot out of each other for 60 minutes.
FFA, I did watch more of the game than I planned since it was competitive and the Titans gave Big Ben a lot of trouble before finally falling by 3 points. That rookie quarterback from LSU had his first pass picked off for 6, but came back and actually had the Titans ahead for much of the game. He may have a future since he has a gun for an arm.
November 18, 2014 at 11:04 am
Libby says:
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Thanks for the play-by-play Agent. I felt just like I watched it myself. Oh, wait a minute! I did.
November 18, 2014 at 11:28 am
Agent says:
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Libby, is your name spelled FFA? The reason why you are scorned so much is because you butt into other peoples conversation on a regular basis. It is not an attractive trait to have. By the way, did you watch your favorite quarterback fail again or were you taking your nap?
November 18, 2014 at 12:08 pm
Libby says:
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You know, Agent. I’m only scorned by a handfull of you and yours. There are others that actually appreciate my point of view. I probably have about as many fans as you do.
I’ll explain it again to you. This is a blog, B-L-O-G. That means anyone can respond to any post by anyone. Got it? Just because you addressed your comment to FFA doesn’t mean I can’t comment on it’s silliness.
November 19, 2014 at 11:18 am
Agent says:
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So FFA, we may not see Ron for a while since he is under 6′ of snow in Buffalo and it is still snowing from the reports I have seen. How is that Global Warming working for the frozen tundra?
News reports this AM, we in Chicago should not see this cold for at least another month…. But its here. Global Warming… Another catch phrase by a politician.
In Cali last week, the tour guide stated that each wind mill cost over $500,000 each with monthly maintenance to be performed.
Yes FFA, the report on Buffalo is blamed on the Great Lakes being warmer than the air and causing the blizzard. That will be blamed on man as well. I guess when the lakes freeze over like last year, it will stop snowing.
November 19, 2014 at 6:27 pm
FFA says:
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Well Agent, my guess would be that Mother Nature will do what she want when she wants for whatever reason she wants… There will never be a theory (Global Warming) that she will abide by. You want a weather forecast? Look out the window. Don’t like what you see, wait an hour and look again…
Welcome employees to the new Healthcare reality. Higher deductibles, higher out of pocket expenses all for a slightly higher premium. You can thank Jonathon Gruber for fixing Healthcare in America.
sorry agent, it was a reality long before the ACA was passed..Cost, premiums have been going up for a decade, with several double digit years in there….but what the heck, it feels good to blame “them”….
You might want to be creative and pick a different moniker than mine if you want to opine. How do you like Gruber’s solution to fixing Healthcare? Yes, it does feel good to blame serial liers for deceiving the American People, the low information voters who thought they were going to get something for nothing. The smoking gun is up to 4 videos now on the flaming elitist who derides the “stupid voters” he pulled the wool over their eyes.
Yeah. Because the moniker “Agent” is soooooo creative on an insurance blog.
My moniker is short and sweet Ron and even you can read it. Was that you imitating me or the moniker thief Booger? You have been really quiet after the election. Did something happen on that fateful Tuesday that shut you up for a while?
Agent,
What is with the insults? Why would I need or want to imitate you?
I was happy about the election results. I just hope the Republicans will finally begin to govern. When can we expect them to fix everything (2017 is not acceptable) and how will we quantify their success or failure?
“What is with the insults?”
LOL! Ron, you know that’s Agent’s M.O. as he complains about everyone insulting him.
He’s a hypocrite, man.
So Ron, you are allowed to insult me and when I come back on you, you claim to be insulted. I am glad you were happy with the election results. Some of your cohorts weren’t and are in complete denial. By the way, the House passed the Keystone Pipeline bill again today, the first of many to come. Now, Harry Reid can block it from being voted on again to protect the President from vetoing it. We will give them the opportunity to move forward or be obstructionists. In January, Reid won’t be able to block so it will be on Obama to start signing or vetoing. Mary Landrieu really wants it now after being silent for 6 years. She thinks she will pick up some votes. I don’t think Dirty Harry will lend a sympathic ear, but I could be wrong.
In no way will I defend the ACA, but there’s probably an argument to be made that rising healthcare costs have more to do with new designer drugs for just about everything, more treatment options that keep the elderly & terminally alive longer, and the “invention” of new illnesses. Throw in legal costs and a healthcare bureaucracy that is “too big to fail” and this is what we have. I’ve yet to hear anyone offer any solutions. Because these solutions would be perceived as rationing care, providing substandard care, or discriminatory.
SWFL Agent,
there is a relatively simple solution, Universal Health Care. We need to remove a profit motive from health care. I equate this to defense, education, and infrastructure as necessities for which all Americans should have equal access. Health insurance companies can create “Cadillac Plans” for people to be able to purchase separately for better coverage. Just like private schools.
Exactly. Universal care will end overtreating for profit, lawsuits for bogus med mal claims, and make health care much more cost effective. Costs will go DOWN, while everyone will have access to adequate care.
For those that want it, they can buy up similar to the U.K. with Harley Street. BTW, I don’t hear anyone in the U.K., Canada, or Australia complaining about their healthcare.
And Agent, ther is no such thing as a “Pathway to Death.” You and Sarah Palin need to get a clue.
Just how will it stop the bogus law suites?
FFA,
Throw it in there, too. I have always been a proponent of tort reform.
The only point I have made is that malpractice lawsuits have been proven to be a very small driver of health insurance premiums. About one half of 1 percent.
http://www.factcheck.org/2009/10/malpractice-savings-reconsidered/
In IL, a guy dies because he did not follow doc advice and take his heart meds. Widow sues. $3Mil against the doc and $3Mil against the ER he was taken to. Didn’t even go to court. Whats the point in Cook County.
Change the legal system to be like England, watch the savings hit your health insurance bill.
Remove the Profit incentive, what the point of R&D??? Just to be a “Good Guy”?
FFA,
I did not say that pharmaceutical companies and medical device suppliers could not have a profit motive. I also would not have a problem with a for-profit company that specializes in R&D. Kind of like how we have private companies that supply equipment to the military and private contractors who do infrastructure.
My position is that health insurance should not be driven by profit.
You’re wrong Libby, Gruber Buber disclosed that there is a death panel.
Ron, my post was in response to – ““honestly earned”?”.
Ron, I wholeheartedly agree.
I disagree, Ron. Public monopolies, as evidenced by public education, social security and Medicare/VA, are notoriously unaccountable, wasteful and ineffective. At first, they are called “safety nets” to lift the poor. In time, however, politicians use entitlements to agitate class envy and spread misery so nobody else is better off. History proves that profits, honestly earned, create choices for consumers and elevate the quality of care.
Adam,
There are millions of people who will say public education, social security and Medicare/VA have given them opportunites to be successful, maintain their lifestyle in retirement and save their lives without going bankrupt. Sometimes we have to accept some inefficiencies in order to benefit those without the means to afford such services. Nothing is perfect, even private companies.
You hit the nail on the head when you said, “History proves that profits, honestly earned, create choices for consumers and elevate the quality of care.”
While that is a completely true statement, who determines what constitutes “honestly earned”? That is a very subjective statement.
My issue is that health insurance companies care far more about their bottom lines than their consumers’ well being. That is exactly what a for-profit company is suppose to do.
Well said, Adam.
Ron, its simple… Poorly managed companies fail. properly managed companies take care of their customers. Came home from Cali late last night to find a long standing restaurant that was taken over by the kids of the founder (passed away) closed their doors. I know one of the (former) employees who will verify that the place was run into the ground by the lids that took it over. Degrading employees, pissing off customers ect…
Leaving bad debt of $2Mil is what the rumor mill is saying.
FFA,
I am not sure how your post is relevant. I understand how the free market works in theory. I just do not think people’s health care should have a profit motive. In addition, wht if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable? These are people’s lives, not just a meal.
The problem with the health care issue is that the people who need it the most are being left out because the health insurance companies are run so well (record profits). We need to take away the profit motive for health insurance companies and stop all of the declines for coverage, lifetime limits and non-renewal/cancellations. Those seem to be concerns of the right as well, they just have done nothing about it. Tort reform and selling across state lines will help, but not to the extent necessary.
Ron, I think Adam has it right and you have it wrong. “Some inefficiencies” in the public domain? Public education is a disaster and the teachers unions are only interested in their pension plans, not properly educating our kids. Social Security is on course to go bankrupt in about 15 years after Progressive politicians robbed the Trust Fund and put it in the General Fund so they could waste it on worthless projects/programs. Of course, the now proven deceit, lack of transparency of Obamacare is yet another government program threatening to bankrupt the country if it is allowed to stand. You people that want single payer are willing to let the government have complete control over your lives, tell you what doctor to see, whether you can have an operation or not and a friendly bureaucrat on the other end of the line is really looking out for you. That is like the lemmings willingly jumping into the pit without a thought in the world. Thanks, but no thanks.
Agent – Newsflash! You don’t control your health care anymore now than you would with Universal Care. Your health insurance carrier tells you who you can see, whether they will pay for a procedure or not, and you think the friendly claim adjuster on the other end of the line cares about helping you? You are delusional.
With Universal Care, you could purchase excess coverage for those things you don’t like about what’s given to you. Just like you can do now. Don’t like your plan? Pay more for a better one? Don’t mind your plan? Great! Cuz it’s free.
And Ron, There was a market for the pre X crowd. In Il it was called ICHIP. Agreed, it needed some work. high Deductibles and high cost. But we have that now for everyone.
So, I ask again, just what issues did the PPACA resolve? everyone is paying more for higher deds.
FFA,
How many times do I need to state that I am against the PPACA? Why are you and the others on the right asking me to defend and/or explain the law?
Well SWFL, would you prefer that we copy Britain and put the elderly on the “Pathway to Death” if they have a serious illness? I think it is great that new drugs have been developed to treat illness although there still isn’t a workable vaccine for Ebola. Legal costs due to no Tort Reform play a part in rising costs and the Healthcare Bureaucracy is a nightmare as we have seen.
Agent,
Please tell the class what percentage of premium increases is going toward legal costs. Don’t forget to cite your source.
What kind of stupid question is that Ron? In view of the Gruber revelations, please tell the class how that is the way to handle Healthcare Reform. Please cite your sources on how fraud and deception and lack of transparency are good for America or how bribery, coercion to get lawmakers to vote for it was used. Your side were thugs and agenda driven to the detriment of the country. Spin your way out of that.
Agent,
It is not a stupid question for anyone else, but you. The point is that tort reform will impact less than one half of one percent of your health insurance premiums.
http://www.factcheck.org/2009/10/malpractice-savings-reconsidered/
If you have different statistics, please provide and cite your source.
I have stated many times that I am against the PPACA. Why do you expect me to defend Gruber or President Obama?
When did I ever say, “fraud and deception and lack of transparency are good for America or how bribery, coercion to get lawmakers to vote for it was used.”? How am I suppose to cite a source for a state,ment I never made?
My side, Independents, has never had a voice in government and wants Republican and Democrat thugs gone.
Don’t forget the defensive medicine that adds to the cost. Docs / Hospitals have to run every single test even if its one in a mill chance they might have some form of rare disease.
From my understanding, “defensive” medicine is a bit of a misnomer. Yes, many times they run too many tests and overprescribe because of litigious fear. But far more often they do it because they get paid a commission. This is especially true in end-of-life situations.
Basically, because of the profit motive, Doctors prescribe treatments and tests patients don’t need because those doctors, say oncologists for example, get paid a % of that treatment. 60 Minutes had a good expose on it a few weeks ago (a link!!! just for you Bobby).
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/the-cost-of-cancer-drugs/
You understanding is limited in its personal experience. You just not old enough to have experienced it first hand. You are still invincible.
Not invincible, just handsome. Actually, I am not really worth a whole lot except to the govt bc I sort of owe them quite a bit of money.
But that being said, and as weve discussed elsewhere, Tort reform to combat defensive medicine and over-zealous med mal lawsuits are really a small portion of overall healthcare spending.
Stan Says: “But that being said, and as weve discussed elsewhere, Tort reform to combat defensive medicine and over-zealous med mal lawsuits are really a small portion of overall healthcare spending”
Spoken like an experienced lawyer. They taught you well. Bogus Med Mal (and many more) suits happen all the time especially in this neck of the woods. OBamas home county is one of the worst.
I didnt say that they were uncommon, I said that as a percentage, they are not even close to being the main protagonist in the story of Rising Healthcare Costs.
He’s right, FFA.
Boots on the ground – personal experience tells me the Govt is fudging them stats. They need to protect their fellow liars.
FFA, if you dont believe govt stats under a Democratic president, are you equally skeptical under a Republican one? Im serious. You cant have it both ways.
Libby, stop with the BS. You are digging a deeper hole for yourself. My wife has had 12 surgeries in the past 15 years and we haven’t had any problems with insurance carriers paying for them as long as they were pre-authorized through the doctor. All we had to do was pay the deductible and co-pays and we were good. I don’t think the government bureaucrats would be so helpful if it came down to the same situation given their track record.
“I don’t “think” the government bureaucrats would be so “helpful…” You think your insurance carrier is “helpful” because they pay for your wife’s surgery? They are contractually obligated to do so.
You don’t know what the government would or wouldn’t do if there was universal care. You just pontificate based on nothing, zero, bubkus. Of course they would cover necessary surgeries. Why wouldn’t they?
My Dad, Father-in-Law, and Brother-in-Law all receive(d) treatment from the V.A. They never scrimped on them in the least. You know about one guy you heard about that had a bad experience with the V.A. and you condemn the whole system. There are bad experiences on the private side of medicine, too. Just ask Duncan Thomas.
Libby Says “You don’t know what the government would or wouldn’t do if there was universal care. You just pontificate based on nothing, zero, bubkus”
With all the lies and deceit thrown at Joe/Jane average person, you trust the govt? You your self has acknowledge the lies by this and previous administrations. Now you want to trust the liars with your health? Track record from DC tells me that no one has earned trust.
Care to buy some swamp land in FLA?
Personally, I do trust the government over most other sources. Especially non-partisan offices like the CBO.
At the end of the day, we really dont have a choice. The government is uniquely positioned to solve problems that we cannot solve for ourselves. These include national defense, regulating financial markets, keeping lead out of toys, protecting national forests, etc.
“Health plan costs up slightly”?? Mine has increased almost 60% in the last 2 years!
Obamacare was passed in 2010.
My premium went up 95% last year with BCBS. Then I moved to Humana. We are going to meet with the rep Monday. This premium is going up 54%. Inflation is real. I’m ticked. Oh, I have no health problems at all.
How are your deductibles and out of pocket expense William? Are you part of the young group that Progressives said had to carry the load for the older, sicker patients?
Ron says:
“I was happy about the election results. I just hope the Republicans will finally begin to govern. When can we expect them to fix everything (2017 is not acceptable) and how will we quantify their success or failure?”
Wait a minute Ron, you expect the Republicans to fixed all that Obama and his Adminstration destroyed by 2017? All I hear Democrats saying is oh maybe now the Republicans can start doing something. Well you damn right now we can since we have the majority in both houses and hopefully shut Obama and his Hope and Change down. What a bunch of liars!
And Libby before you start in…..shut up!
Draetish,
Yes, I do. The right expected President Obama to fix the economy in his first year. What goes around, comes around.
Since the economy has shown consistent, all be it slow, improvement since 2010, it should easy for them to get it ramped up in 2 years.
yes we did, but he didn’t do and got re-elected based on lies and cover ups. Wow Democrats must be so proud of all the deceit and fraud it’s party is famous for.
So Ron, what did he do but pass the trillion dollar stimulus which created almost no jobs and added to his legacy as the biggest spender in the history of the country. $7 trillion and counting. Did I see any proposals from him to lower taxes and incentivize business to hire? He did pass Obamacare which is the biggest job killer ever passed and full of new taxes. How do you like those 1.5% to 2% increases in GNP? We should be at 4.5% or higher annually after the recession. We have had several recovery summers which weren’t recoveries. Do you think bad public policy had anything to do with that?
Ron, in his first year? It’s now been over 5 years, and the economy still sucks.
Jenny,
First, the president is not responsible for the economy, period. That falls on Congress.
Second, the economy does not suck for everyone. I am doing far better than I was before he was elected. Is it because of him or any other politiican? Of corse not. I busted my ass working full time while earning my Master’s Degree. This just shows that if you want to be successful, it does not matter who is the president.
Third, you misunderstood my point. I want to know when we can expect the Republicans to fix the economy. Since President Obama was being criticized by the Republicans less than 1 year in office for not fixing the economy from the second worse financial collapse in our history, I figured they can fix it in less than two. If they want to win the White House in 2016, they better make it happen.
I guess the real question I am asking is: when can we expect the economy to start booming with the Republicans controlling Congress? And, if it does not happen, can we blame them or is it still solely President Obama’s fault?
Ron, do us a favor and give Stan a job in your office so he will not keep blaming Republicans and business for not providing him a top end job. I am glad you are doing well and commend you for getting your Masters. Stan has three degrees and cannot find work.
By the way, GW has been blamed for 6 years for anything and everything and Obama has just made things worse. When has he proposed anything that incentivizes business to create jobs? It took Reagan about three years with pro business policies from the huge recession mess he inherited from Carter. It will take at least that long or longer to recover from the Obama legacy of excessive taxation, the albatross of Obamacare, the EPA implementing job killing regulations etc.
Agent, I feel like I’ve been clear about this. I dont blame republican politicians, I blame YOU for being so dumb as to vote against your own self interest. Splitting hairs, maybe, but I wanted to make sure that I was clear.
And really, the fact that you can defend Bush is astonishing. The man was a trainwreck by literally any objective standard. You’d be better off to acknowledge it and move on.
Ron, Soon as Obama Care gets tossed off the books and business KNOW what the future holds for cost, the job market will loosen up.
LOL Agent! Bush has been blamed for the past 14 years! Don’t forget the 8 he was in office. He sucked then and we’re still feeling the brunt of it now.
FFA,
As much as I and the majotiry of Americans have been against the PPACA, the Republicans better have a real, workable replacement ready that provides very similar benefits or they will be tossed out of office even faster than the Democrats. A large segment of the opposition does not like it because there was not even a public option. I hope the Republicans do not think tort reform and allowing policies to be sold across state lines will be sufficient.
Agent,
If you do not think Republicans will be blaming President Obama after he is out of office, you are sorely mistaken. Democrats still blame President Reagan for some things and Republicans still blame Presidents Carter and Clinton. Neither party is immune to or above the blame game. This is one of the main reasons that I am an Independent, I think both parties are terrible.
Ron, Isn’t Medicaid a public option? I would rather have my Old Plan back. There appears to be no true stop loss as every time the wife visits the PT & Pain Clinic, there is a copay. I have spent more on Med bills this year on a PPACA plan (BCBS Gold) then I have in years past. PPACA has increased my expense as well as taking away part of the deductibility of it all (7% vs 10%. Rating up my producer today, F 30 1 dep – she asked me how that’s affordable. All I had to explain that was its OBamas idea of what affordable is. Even though I am picking up more subsidy – I now legally have 4 dependents, my premiums are going up.
What problems has this solved? Not Pre X as that was available. What issues has it created? See Stan. He should have had several offers the week he graduated. No one wants to hire any more as the companies don’t know where this is headed. Supreme Ct should be deciding this thing today. Americans need to know.
FFA,
Medicaid is not a public option. It is health care for the poor. There are milions of working poor who make too much to qualify.
The point is this, health care/insurance as we knew it is gone forever. It is time to strat exporing opportunities to fix what is still wrong and imporve upon it.
I have never heard of a business hiring for any other reason than demand. Costs and expenses are in constant flux whether it is health care, taxes, wages, vendors, utilities, rent, etc. Many businesses have started, expanded, hired, and grown to be more profitable than ever since this law has passed. It happens under all administrations and economies. Hard work, innovation and perseverance will always trump government influence.
I believe in capitalism and the free markt for nearly every inwdustry. I also believe that there are some industries for which profit should not be the main driver.
You never answered my question, “what if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable?”
Ron says “what if Company A fails and Company B, C, D, etc., who are all managed well, do not want to insure Company A’s customers becasue they are not profitable?”
In IL, I Chip was available. I do agree it needed some attention. I will also agree that Medicaid needed help too. Also COBRA. Work within the frame work that was already established with the Tech Infrastructure that – you know – worked.
To tear down the entire system? Stans already gripping about having to carry the load for the older folks. My 30 yr old producer changed her tune about this when she saw in black and white whats happening. She wanted to argue with me about things today. All I could say was to pick up the phone and call Obama and ask him why…
Whats gonna happen when these young folks decide they don’t want to support us old folks?
You know FFA, I have paid for everything I have in this life. Nobody ever gave me anything. But I do not begrudge contributing to a system that will provide health care for all citizens. I think that is a worthy and noble cause.
The previous system WASN’T working. You keep going on about CHIP. CHIP was expensive. It was meant for people that couldn’t get coverage in the standard market, but had money. It didn’t help the poor or the working poor.
You are all wrong about this issue. Health care is a RIGHT, not a privilege reserved for the privileged.
Libby, my point on IChip was that it was available. I agree fully it needed work. These are the folks that should have got premium assistance. I do not begrudge giving someone help while they get back on their feet. I too have paid for everything I got. No one gave me anything.
Yesterday, I got notice of policy changes with no mention of premium. New Co Pays have been added that will cost me more.
I have said it before and I will say it again. The system needed work, not to be torn down completely and replaced with higher costs as that is what we have. Higher out of pocket. Worse service at the carrier level. Misleading Policy Language such as Stop Loss.
FFA – the entire system was NOT torn down. It should have been, but it’s not. Coverage is still provided by private for-profit carriers. I should be provided to all citizens as part of the taxes we all pay in. I’d much rather cut aid to Egypt and provide healthcare to citizens. Wouldn’t you???
Libby, the infrastructure and distribution systems that were in place worked very well. Now its an Hour + hold time. Hope the web site don’t crash. Cost was way down. out of Pocket was much lower then hat it is now. It was a true stop loss. People could keep their coverage. People could keep their doctors. Agents were involved, not criticized and called unethical. I find it very offensive being called Unethical by a liar.
Again, I agree that Health Care needed to be reformed, but not on this large scale transformation. Even now, its hard to keep on top of all that is going on. Almost need another producer to help with the calls coming in. But when they go on Healthcare.gov to complete, it erases my Agent info and I put the effort in for nothing in return. Previously, we used to make 15%. Now we make 5%. We were not informed the commissions would get pounded down like that before it was to late to make an informed choice. Need 3x the amount of people on the books just to break even revenue wise.
“Libby, the infrastructure and distribution systems that were in place worked very well.”
Yeah, for people that could AFFORD it. How about the millions of people that couldn’t? It didn’t work too well for the, FFA.
Sorry that your costs have risen, so have mine. If we had just done universal care, we could have lowered everyone’s costs.
Libby Says “Yeah, for people that could AFFORD it.
Sorry that your costs have risen, so have mine.”
So now it is more affordable? Obama have the Opposite dictionary open when he wrote this thing?
Libby Says: “You know FFA, I have paid for everything I have in this life. Nobody ever gave me anything”
Of course you have. Your parents taught you to be self reliant as did mine and almost all of our generation.
Haven’t heard from Stan… Maybe he scored his job. Hoping the best for him and all the other college grads that were dis illusioned . mis lead. Lied to.
Yes, it’s affordable now to alot of people that didn’t have any before. It might cost more for those of us that did have it before. Cost of doing business.
I don’t support the ACA, but I support the idea of access to healthcare for all citizens. It can be done. It wasn’t being done before.
Libby, if it cost more then it did 12 months ago with higher OOP costs, how is that more affordable for people today that could not afford it 12 – 24 Months ago? Speaking old school if it cost more then it is less affordable.
Ron, When the country was in the doldrums at the start of the recession, I don’t recall anyone expecting Obama to fix it in one year. That has never been done with any President or Congress in my memory. I know you don’t recall it, but Clinton had a recession going on at the end of his second term. We would have had some recovery going on with the Bush Tax cuts passed on a bi-partisan basis, but a little thing called 9/11 happened 9 months into his Presidency. That would ambush anything anyone could have tried. By the way, Democrats and Republicans joined hands and backed him on the War on Terrorism until they decided to blame him for unfunded wars. Give Stan a job so he won’t have time to blog nonsense all day every day.
Yeah, we all joined hands and supported him until we found out HE LIED TO US.
But yet, you support OBama and his lies? Its ok for Dems to lie and not Repbs?
I didn’t say that, FFA. But I do weigh the degree of the lie. A lie that kills thousands of our young men and women v. if you like your plan, you can keep your plan? Sorry. No comparison.
Well Libby, the Republicans were too smart to join hands with a Progressive Socialist who rammed this terrible Healthcare Law down our throats in the middle of the night with no bi-partisan support. Now, it turns out, it was a lie of biblical proportions. Grubergate to add to the list of all other scandals by this Administration. How much corruption and outright lies are you willing to tolerate before writing them off?
Grubergate. LOL! Be serious Agent. All the Dems did was present the law in the best possible light in order to get it passed.
It’s what any good salesman does. They address adverse perceptions up front and sometimes a little smoke and mirrors are used. So what? That’s not lying or fraud.
Grow up. It’s how business is done. In another couple of weeks Gruber will have gone the way of Ebola. Never to be heard of again.
Ron, you complain about Republicans should have something workable in short order to fix Obamacare or they will be tossed quicker than the Democrats. Need I remind you that we have had this dastardly law for over 4 years now and it is more hated than ever. Do you think this disaster in a year or so when we still have Obama in office and the veto pen at the ready? No, we will have to get a Republican President in office in 16 to do anything serious. This law is so rife with lies, deceipt, hidden taxes and language even legal scholars can’t understand that major surgery is necessary. Pare it down to about 100 common sense language pages and delete the 20,000 pages of extra regulations and that is a start. You should apply the same standards to Republicans as you gave Democrats. They made the mess and Republicans will have to fix it for everyone. By the way, there has not been a national outcry for single payer except by a few far left bozos. Get it in your head Ron, big government does not work since it is inherently wasteful, corrupt and inefficient.
“No, we will have to get a Republican President in office in 16 to do anything serious.”
Oh, well. I guess you’re screwed then.
I agree draetish. Poor Ron wants everything fixed in a hurry, doesn’t he? Obama has made a mess of biblical proportions for 6 years. His band of thieves and their deeds have almost wiped out the country. There are about 300 bills languishing on Reid’s desk that have been gathering dust. A good start is to debate and vote on them. Then, Obama can sign or veto. I would also like to see Goober Gruber called up to a Select Committee to answer to all his lies. I certainly think that would be interesting. Actually, he should be prosecuted for his misdeeds. We should also consider cutting the EPA down to size and either defunding them or get them down to a shell so they can’t do any more harm to business.
yes along with doing away with the IRS.
Really looking forward to another 250+ comment thread of open, respectful, and spirited debate, you guys.
Interesting article on why working class voters favor Republican policies.
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2014/11/democrats_can_t_win_white_working_class_voters_the_party_is_too_closely.html
I am surrounded by Republican working class whites. They make up most of the demographic in my neck of the woods. I can’t speak for them, but I have spoken to alot of them.
They see Democrats as spendthrifts that want to give away all of their hard-earned tax money to lazy loafers that don’t want to work. On social issues, we most all agree. It’s the illusion of Democrats supporting giving people something for nothing that turns them off. WE HAVE TO HAVE SOME WELFARE REFORM!
Working being the important word. Don’t care what color anyone is, they just don’t want the Govt sticking their hands into their pockets especially with the BS that is gong on in Washington.
I have a good one for you FFA. The title is – Why our Healthcare Costs Are So High
Here is what happened to Kevin. Kevin walked into a doctor’s office and the receptionist asked him what he had. Kevin said: Shingles. So she wrote down his name, addres, medical insurance number and told him to have a seat.
Fifteen minutes later, a nurse’s aid came out and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. So she wrote down his height, weight, a complete medical history and told Kevin to wait in the examining room.
A half hour later, a nurse came in and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. So the nurse gave Kevin a blood test, a blood pressure test, an electrocardiogram and told Kevin to undress and wait for the doctor.
An hour later, the doctor cam in and found Kevin sitting patiently in the nude and asked Kevin what he had. Kevin said – Shingles. The doctor asked where? Kevin said, Outside in the truck. Where do you want me to unload em?
I’ll agree with Welfare Reform. Start by kicking out the illegals and get them off the US dime. Kick the moochers off the welfare system. Give them a time frame to get their act together. If they don’t want to help themselves, I don’t want to help them either. Stop trying to be the world police department. Under OBama, no one fears us. Bring our boys home, line the borders and let the Mid east kill themselves off.
So FFA, the President shrugged his shoulders – Gruber who? There has been confirmed 19 visits to the White House by Gruber to meet with the President, advisors etc. Not as many visits as the IRS director, but a substantial number. They are all into this deception, mammoth lie up to their eyeballs.
For once, I agree with you Libby. I may add that a lot of working class Democrats are also upset with the Democratic Party and voted the other way in the election. The party of blame, division, race, hate and lie did not do so well and had nothing positive to offer. The latest Gallup poll reflects this. Grubergate has galvanized opposition to Obama and his policies. I saw his little press conference at lunch while he was in Australia. They asked him about Gruber and he did almost the same thing as Pelosi in her Sargeant Schulz imitation.
This is simplistic, Agent. Lots of working class dems are not upset with obama because of his policies, they are upset that he didnt do enough. In other words, they are mad that Obama capitulated to YOU. I myself fall into this camp. Elections matter, and in 2010 and 2012 the Democrats should have taken a page from the republican handbook: run rampant and pass reforms across the board.
I’ve got news for you Stan. Obama hasn’t capitulated or compromised on anything in 6 years. We don’t think he will ever see the light and will continue to veto anything that doesn’t fit with his leftist agenda. He is all agenda all the time. A smart President would see if he can work out some deals that would help the country. The track record on cooperation is non-existent. His cohort in this is Harry Reid who has blocked everything to the tune of 300+ bills. Good thing Harry is a short timer. We may get some things done if the veto pin doesn’t get in the way.
Wrong again Stan the uninformed. Only the hardest core left has been upset that Obama didn’t go far enough. Working class moderate Democrats are as put off as working class Republicans. We know you are part of the hard core left with all your previous posts. You should really consider applying to the Obama Administration as a spokesman. Of course, that job might only be for two years and then you would be out on the street again with your three degrees.
I’m sure Hillary will keep him on.
He’s young, handsome and smart! He might make a great “intern” for her! Stan – don’t wear a blue dress.
“I’m sure Hillary will keep him on.”
She will need a boy toy just like billy boy needed his interns…
The Democratic Party is NOT a party of blame, division, race, hate, and lies. The fact that you say this is in itself divisive, hateful and a lie. Look in the mirror Agent.
So I know you don’t stay up with the news Libby so I will forgive your ignorance on how this last election went and what Democrats did to try to stay in office. It was appalling seeing them play the race, gender, hate card to the max and to see the lies exposed. Had you caught some of Wendy Davis tactics, you could see first hand how she lost by nearly 1 million votes.
Your side has it’s own set of tactics, Agent. It’s called politics. Karl Rove anyone?
Grow up!
So Agent, whats with Dallas Ft Worth Airport shutting down after 2 ” of snow yesterday? Appears you not used to global warming. Denver just delayed me for 5 hours with a major ice storm.
No FFA, I guess DFW isn’t used to Global Warming yet and may not have all the snow ploughs that the frozen tundra does since it is so rare down here. By the way, interesting football weekend. Glad to see your Bears finally win again although I still have reservations about the quarterback. Green Bay really kicked the Eagles butt all over the field. There was a good reason why Sanchez was let go by the Jets. Also, Peyton Manning is still struggling and lost to the very average Rams. 398 yards passing and could only get 7 points. What is that all about? The best team in the league is someone nobody talks about, the Arizona Cardinals. They just have a lot of good players and play as a team.
Yesterday day was a travel day for me. Didn’t catch any F Ball at all. AZ just keeps getting it done even with their 2nd string QB. Sanchez was a flop from his first game. Darn Glad Payton fell on his face yesterday. He usually kills me in FF, but not this week. I have a one point lead and got the rookie in Pitts going and he has the RB in Pitts. It boils down to how Big Ben wants to score – in the air or on the ground. Playing for the third seed tonight… Worst case, I’ll have the 4th with just two weeks to go. A win tonight will pull me away from the pack.
Well FFA, Big Ben shouldn’t have a lot of trouble with the lowly Titans who are pretty much at the bottom of the NFL currently in about every category. I doubt if I will watch much of it, especially if it is like last Sunday or Monday’s games. I like games that are competitive like Kansas City/Seattle. Those guys were knocking the snot out of each other for 60 minutes.
FFA, I did watch more of the game than I planned since it was competitive and the Titans gave Big Ben a lot of trouble before finally falling by 3 points. That rookie quarterback from LSU had his first pass picked off for 6, but came back and actually had the Titans ahead for much of the game. He may have a future since he has a gun for an arm.
Thanks for the play-by-play Agent. I felt just like I watched it myself. Oh, wait a minute! I did.
Libby, is your name spelled FFA? The reason why you are scorned so much is because you butt into other peoples conversation on a regular basis. It is not an attractive trait to have. By the way, did you watch your favorite quarterback fail again or were you taking your nap?
You know, Agent. I’m only scorned by a handfull of you and yours. There are others that actually appreciate my point of view. I probably have about as many fans as you do.
I’ll explain it again to you. This is a blog, B-L-O-G. That means anyone can respond to any post by anyone. Got it? Just because you addressed your comment to FFA doesn’t mean I can’t comment on it’s silliness.
So FFA, we may not see Ron for a while since he is under 6′ of snow in Buffalo and it is still snowing from the reports I have seen. How is that Global Warming working for the frozen tundra?
News reports this AM, we in Chicago should not see this cold for at least another month…. But its here. Global Warming… Another catch phrase by a politician.
In Cali last week, the tour guide stated that each wind mill cost over $500,000 each with monthly maintenance to be performed.
yes… No one like the cold.
Yes FFA, the report on Buffalo is blamed on the Great Lakes being warmer than the air and causing the blizzard. That will be blamed on man as well. I guess when the lakes freeze over like last year, it will stop snowing.
Well Agent, my guess would be that Mother Nature will do what she want when she wants for whatever reason she wants… There will never be a theory (Global Warming) that she will abide by. You want a weather forecast? Look out the window. Don’t like what you see, wait an hour and look again…