Hartford Financial was involved in the sub prime mortgage mess and had to get a bailout from the taxpayers. Is it any wonder that they have not done well in the aftermath.
Every company on earth was harmed by the subprime mortgage mess, and six large insurance companies took TARP funds. The Hartford was wounded by guaranteeing income on variable annuities. Get your facts straight or no one should listen to you.
The Hartford purchased the Federal Trust Corp bank of Florida in 2009. I am quoting their official statement to the WSJ: “Hartford’s purchase of Federal Trust is contingent on Treasury’s approval of Hartford’s application for TARP aid.” That bank had ~$600MM in assets. Hartford used this purchase to become eligible to accept $3.4 billion in TARP funds which they repaid. Then last year HIG took a $70MM charge in the 2nd quarter on its agreement to sell the bank.
This is a throw back to the 1980s, when underwriting discipline was trumped by the greed of large corporate takeovers of insurers keyed to profit and splitting up insurers for profit. Insurers are not commodities with pieces that can be successfully bought and sold for profit by large investment houses. The Hartford is the sum of its parts, and the investors should simply suck it up, accept that their investment is not returning what they anticipated short term, and learn that their investment mistakes have consequences. These people feel that they are entitled to a profit regardless of their mistakes. This must end.
What a surprise from Goldman Sachs! A report that says if the company broke up it would be a great thing – for Goldman Sachs!
Why does any company trust anything that GS has to say anymore? Of course we know why a hedge fund manager would want to break the company up. Short-term profit (taxed at 15% or less) is all they care about.
Surprise, surprise… Some “Hedge Fund” crook wants to break up the company for his short term gain. I say NO WAY! Mr. Paulson obviously does not know the insurance business, or chooses to ignore it. Insurance is for the long term, not short term gains. Go invest somewhere else if you want huge short term profits. You will not get it from insurance companies. Slow and steady is the name of the game here.
Paulson pushed for drastic measures at HIG and asserted the management team was not doing its job to maximize shareholder value. He pointed to the GS’s report as an exampleand strongly suggested the HIG team do a better job at explaining what they intend to do to boost the company value which is at the bottom compared it its peers PE ratios.
Paulson has fallen on his face before. I would lose a lot of confidence in The Hartford if it allowed itself to be influenced by this obvious stock manipulation play by Goldman Sachs and Paulson. He (Paulson) may be the largest individual shareholder, but he ain’t the ONLY shareholder. Mr. Paulson, if you don’t like how this is playing out, SELL (probably at a loss).
If it’s such a lousey investment, why doesn’t Paulson DIVEST? The Hartford is an iconic brand. The insurance business has been manipulated too much and too often by these greedy investment types, from Sandy Weill, to Warren Buffett, all scheming what they think they can gain short-term. Just look at what they’ve done to the image of insurance – commoditizing it and training the public that cheap equals good. We all suffer from their grandiosity and fleeting celebrity.
over and over again, we see the same “ME ONLY” attitude. the era of maximum return for minimum effort continues unabated and unchallenged for the most part. how anyone with the name of paulson could get the ear of or try to manipulate/bully a company as historically reputable and consistent as the hartford is beyond reason. it is a testament of our wayward age in america. respect has changed meaning today. our ideals, self-image and integrity have been bought, sold and politicized by special interests concerned only about themselves. powerless? listen to the man…let him ply his trade of greed with the footnote…to hell with the consequences.
I have often said the worst thing that has happened to insurance was allowing companies to go public. The investment communities are only concerned and try to force management teams to make decisions based solely on what will make our numbers good next quarter rather than what do we need to do to reach our goal 5-10 years down the road. They are all so short sighted now, they would pee in their pants to warm their behinds during an arctic expedition!
Seems as though this is an industry issue, and not just The Hartford. High combined ratio for he industry in 2011 and a continued soft market?!?! Maybe Paulson has a valid argument because the industry itsel is in alot of trouble and the weather won’t be any more cooperative going forward.
A lot of good comments here. Here you have a company trying very hard to do the right thing, to focus on profit and healthy underwriting which long term will yield very positive results for shareholders, agents, and most important – customers. Yet Wall Street will not leave well enough alone and wants to see dramatic share increases at all costs regardless of the impact to the operation. Kudos to McGee and team for trying to do the right thing and restore American businesses to the way it should be – stable, reliant, and in it for the long haul.
The Hartford’s CEO and Executive Team are positioning the company for a much brighter future, please continue to do want you feel is right and keep up the good work and the share price down the road will reflect.
I fail to see how The Hartford is making changes for the better as stated above by David. They were almost bankrupt when Allianz “loaned” them $2 Billion Dollars prior to the TARP funds. Let’s not forget the massive infusion of cash from Allianz as it shows The Hartford was given nearly $5.5 Billion Dollars and yet they were unable to make any of the necessary changes to stay competitive.
My opinion; We will see Allianz or another major player purchase The Hartford in the next 12 to 24 months. Every agency owner knows Allianz is looking to buy another Carrier and make sure they have investments in the US in case the Euro flops. They own Fireman’s Fund, but they are only a small niche player. The Hartford would give them the technology and name they desire.
This is why I only like to work with Super Regional Carriers, preferably Mutuals. This company like Travelers, CNA, Etc. Do not know wether they are coming or going. I remember the Hartford in Florida in 1993 canceled all of their workers Comp business, then the very next year told us we had to have 40% of our premium in the WC line or the time they sent us our 25 year plaque and came and took pictures with us, then the very next day sent our agency a termination letter. Or when CNA, told us that we had to sell CNA Unisource a PEO, Then the next year closed it down. Give me a break! Who can work with Wall street run insurance carriers? Not me!
Sarah, you are right. When financial/investor type people get involved in the insurance business, there is usually trouble brewing. There have been more than a few cases when banks bought insurance agencies because they thought it was easy pickings to pick up business. Later, they found out it wasn’t what they thought it would be and don’t like the swings in the soft and hard market among other things.
Hartford Financial was involved in the sub prime mortgage mess and had to get a bailout from the taxpayers. Is it any wonder that they have not done well in the aftermath.
Every company on earth was harmed by the subprime mortgage mess, and six large insurance companies took TARP funds. The Hartford was wounded by guaranteeing income on variable annuities. Get your facts straight or no one should listen to you.
The Hartford purchased the Federal Trust Corp bank of Florida in 2009. I am quoting their official statement to the WSJ: “Hartford’s purchase of Federal Trust is contingent on Treasury’s approval of Hartford’s application for TARP aid.” That bank had ~$600MM in assets. Hartford used this purchase to become eligible to accept $3.4 billion in TARP funds which they repaid. Then last year HIG took a $70MM charge in the 2nd quarter on its agreement to sell the bank.
This is a throw back to the 1980s, when underwriting discipline was trumped by the greed of large corporate takeovers of insurers keyed to profit and splitting up insurers for profit. Insurers are not commodities with pieces that can be successfully bought and sold for profit by large investment houses. The Hartford is the sum of its parts, and the investors should simply suck it up, accept that their investment is not returning what they anticipated short term, and learn that their investment mistakes have consequences. These people feel that they are entitled to a profit regardless of their mistakes. This must end.
What a surprise from Goldman Sachs! A report that says if the company broke up it would be a great thing – for Goldman Sachs!
Why does any company trust anything that GS has to say anymore? Of course we know why a hedge fund manager would want to break the company up. Short-term profit (taxed at 15% or less) is all they care about.
Wildplace, Amen to that!
Surprise, surprise… Some “Hedge Fund” crook wants to break up the company for his short term gain. I say NO WAY! Mr. Paulson obviously does not know the insurance business, or chooses to ignore it. Insurance is for the long term, not short term gains. Go invest somewhere else if you want huge short term profits. You will not get it from insurance companies. Slow and steady is the name of the game here.
Paulson pushed for drastic measures at HIG and asserted the management team was not doing its job to maximize shareholder value. He pointed to the GS’s report as an exampleand strongly suggested the HIG team do a better job at explaining what they intend to do to boost the company value which is at the bottom compared it its peers PE ratios.
Paulson has fallen on his face before. I would lose a lot of confidence in The Hartford if it allowed itself to be influenced by this obvious stock manipulation play by Goldman Sachs and Paulson. He (Paulson) may be the largest individual shareholder, but he ain’t the ONLY shareholder. Mr. Paulson, if you don’t like how this is playing out, SELL (probably at a loss).
If it’s such a lousey investment, why doesn’t Paulson DIVEST? The Hartford is an iconic brand. The insurance business has been manipulated too much and too often by these greedy investment types, from Sandy Weill, to Warren Buffett, all scheming what they think they can gain short-term. Just look at what they’ve done to the image of insurance – commoditizing it and training the public that cheap equals good. We all suffer from their grandiosity and fleeting celebrity.
over and over again, we see the same “ME ONLY” attitude. the era of maximum return for minimum effort continues unabated and unchallenged for the most part. how anyone with the name of paulson could get the ear of or try to manipulate/bully a company as historically reputable and consistent as the hartford is beyond reason. it is a testament of our wayward age in america. respect has changed meaning today. our ideals, self-image and integrity have been bought, sold and politicized by special interests concerned only about themselves. powerless? listen to the man…let him ply his trade of greed with the footnote…to hell with the consequences.
I have often said the worst thing that has happened to insurance was allowing companies to go public. The investment communities are only concerned and try to force management teams to make decisions based solely on what will make our numbers good next quarter rather than what do we need to do to reach our goal 5-10 years down the road. They are all so short sighted now, they would pee in their pants to warm their behinds during an arctic expedition!
If Paulson doesn’t like what he bought he can get out of the investment.
Seems as though this is an industry issue, and not just The Hartford. High combined ratio for he industry in 2011 and a continued soft market?!?! Maybe Paulson has a valid argument because the industry itsel is in alot of trouble and the weather won’t be any more cooperative going forward.
A lot of good comments here. Here you have a company trying very hard to do the right thing, to focus on profit and healthy underwriting which long term will yield very positive results for shareholders, agents, and most important – customers. Yet Wall Street will not leave well enough alone and wants to see dramatic share increases at all costs regardless of the impact to the operation. Kudos to McGee and team for trying to do the right thing and restore American businesses to the way it should be – stable, reliant, and in it for the long haul.
The Hartford’s CEO and Executive Team are positioning the company for a much brighter future, please continue to do want you feel is right and keep up the good work and the share price down the road will reflect.
I fail to see how The Hartford is making changes for the better as stated above by David. They were almost bankrupt when Allianz “loaned” them $2 Billion Dollars prior to the TARP funds. Let’s not forget the massive infusion of cash from Allianz as it shows The Hartford was given nearly $5.5 Billion Dollars and yet they were unable to make any of the necessary changes to stay competitive.
My opinion; We will see Allianz or another major player purchase The Hartford in the next 12 to 24 months. Every agency owner knows Allianz is looking to buy another Carrier and make sure they have investments in the US in case the Euro flops. They own Fireman’s Fund, but they are only a small niche player. The Hartford would give them the technology and name they desire.
There is no need for the P&C business in the markeplace
well, bye
This is why I only like to work with Super Regional Carriers, preferably Mutuals. This company like Travelers, CNA, Etc. Do not know wether they are coming or going. I remember the Hartford in Florida in 1993 canceled all of their workers Comp business, then the very next year told us we had to have 40% of our premium in the WC line or the time they sent us our 25 year plaque and came and took pictures with us, then the very next day sent our agency a termination letter. Or when CNA, told us that we had to sell CNA Unisource a PEO, Then the next year closed it down. Give me a break! Who can work with Wall street run insurance carriers? Not me!
Sarah, you are right. When financial/investor type people get involved in the insurance business, there is usually trouble brewing. There have been more than a few cases when banks bought insurance agencies because they thought it was easy pickings to pick up business. Later, they found out it wasn’t what they thought it would be and don’t like the swings in the soft and hard market among other things.
GREED,GREED, GREED,Let’s pray that level headed insurance management can hold out against a greedy sob stockholder.