Not sure how I feel about this. I have 2 friends with kids that got into trouble, but are basically good kids. They have struggled finding good jobs because of it. One was some theft 10 years ago and the other was drug possession. But I see the other side, too. Maybe it shouldn’t be so black and white. (Absolutely NO pun intended!)
So now employers have to determine which criminals can be trusted to manage their stores? This is total BS. Also, almost all crime insurance policies are void regarding employees with prior records of theft so maybe the EEOC should sue the crime insurance companies as well for their contribution to discrimination.
This isn’t a high value department store, this is a dollar store. We’re a country that at least still pretends that our judicial system is about rehabilitation and serving your time. If someone who serves their time years ago can’t get a job at a Dollar store, where are they supposed to look for work? You want to lock people up and then have them completely unable to actually work for a living so they have to continue to live off of the taxes of others?
This article simply says they have to hire a consultant to make sure their criminal background check process is above board. It’s not saying they have to hire rapists and murderers. It even mentions the type of criteria that might make someone with a record an allowable employee.
This is way off topic but I have done a decent amount of prison ministry and I can assure you that our criminal justice and incarceration system has nothing to do with reforming or rehabilitating inmates. Unfortunately, the prison system in our country tends to harden criminals. The vast majority of institutions don’t have the ability or desire to actually reform the prison population. And, yes, there is a large part of the prison community that could actually return to society and be productive members, however, that is the unfortunate exception. I have met individuals in prison serving year long sentences for theft being forced to share a cell block with hardened, impenitent, murderers. True story.
That’s an interesting perspective, Augustine…I have heard that some prisons often makes people worse than when they went in. Something definitely needs to be done.
Personally,after watching all the seasons of “Oz” I made up my mind that there was no way I was ever going to prison. It worked better than any “scared straight” program out there…
If you want to be terrified, I’d suggest the third season of the podcast Serial. They spent a year hanging out around a courthouse in Ohio, observing the different cases and systems at place. It is truly haunting, the things that occur in our justice system every single day.
November 22, 2019 at 4:53 pm
Jon says:
Like or Dislike:
5
2
Sadly Augustine you are 100% correct. I don’t believe our system rehabilitates or reforms in the slightest, but I know that is the “intent” behind our system, broken though the system is. We made incarceration a business that eats the poor, and sadly there is no easy fix. It’s one of the biggest flaws in modern American society, and with for-profit prisons on the rise, one of the biggest factors pushing our country towards inevitable dystopia.
My brother was incarcerated from 17-23, and he has pulled his life together thankfully with a solid career as a plumber. His story is such a rarity, the more you hear about our “justice” system the worse it gets. It doesn’t help that the police view themselves as warriors of light in our country, despite the fact that a large number are corrupt or imbalanced.
My 80 year old father and a handful of other retired executive types started a mentoring program for prisoners in their county jail. They loved doing it and felt they had an impact on some of the young men. After about a year, the county told them they could no longer do it as someone was sneaking drugs to the inmates. My dad’s group knew it was the guards doing that, but the county thought these 80 year old men were doing it. So the program was killed. Very disappointing to my dad.
That is very unfortunate. The prison system is so massively corrupt. At a prison in my area they held a full on sting operation to find out which guard was smuggling in phones. They caught him red-handed and he was allowed to retire early with full benefits. This was after who knows how long of smuggling phones in for thousands and thousands of dollars. It’s absurd what we let our corrections system get away with.
November 20, 2019 at 8:51 pm
knowall says:
Like or Dislike:
5
6
I’d like to have a ‘dollar’ for every time the race card has been used inappropriately – against any person
Funnily enough, people who complain about the “race card”? Often racist. You’re the same crowd that likes the phrase “I’m not racist but…” if those words ever enter your mind? You’re probably a racist. People that aren’t racist don’t tend to complain about these things.
Maybe ‘race card’ is not the right word. All I’m saying is that whether you’re white, black red or inbetween you may have been penalized or discriminated against because of your color, or to be honest, your sex (male or female).
Therein maybe is my issue, in that I find it far less likely for a white person to have been penalized or discriminated against at anywhere even close to the level of a “black red or inbetween” person as you describe them. This is the issue with the “all lives matter” movement. If your response to Black Lives Matter is to say All Lives Matter, you’re missing the point.
If I were an employer, I may be willing to take a risk with someone who had a minor theft charge many years ago. Sometimes people grow up and mature, but not always. I don’t think it’s a clear cut issue though. If you are interviewing someone who has a couple theft charges on their record, and they are eyeballing the cash register during the interview, maybe they aren’t the correct person for the position?
Totally agree. The article even mentions the problem isn’t the background check at all, it’s that it unfairly was discriminatory. I think the answer is that they hire a consultant to tweak their hiring criteria based on the background check, to make sure they’re not unfairly discriminating. A lot of companies use a background check, these guys just seemed to be using it as an excuse to not hire black employees unfortunately.
Next week’s news: “Discrimination consultant sued for discrimination.”
You know why that will never happen? Because Dollar Store is going to be forced to hire a lot of bad apples now just because of their race, in order to avoid this happening again.
You advocate for rehabilitation. Fine, everyone is on board with that. But you ignore the first rule of hiring: the greatest predictor of future behavior is past behavior.
It isn’t so easy as you suggest. That’s why liberals don’t open businesses to hire the people they think are being discriminated against; it’s not so easy.
Since they’re being ordered to hire a criminology consultant if they want to keep using a criminal background check, it’s unlikely that they will “be forced to hire a lot of bad apples”. They could just, you know, interview their candidates well. I’m not saying they hire anyone with a record, as I intended, but the law is the law. You’re complaining about them being ordered to follow the law. Go do business in Somalia if you don’t like it, these are the laws.
So you think you can interview prospective employees with criminal backgrounds and with complete certainty know that they will all turn out to be a great employee.
Clearly, you have never hired anyone before. It is always a crap shoot. Now add in the criminal background and tell me again how easy it is.
November 25, 2019 at 10:45 am
Jon says:
Like or Dislike:
5
1
I never said I could, I merely said they’re being ordered to hire a criminology consultant to continue their criminal background check. Maybe actually read before you respond?
You have a criminal record and I’m supposed to ignore it, smdh.
Not sure how I feel about this. I have 2 friends with kids that got into trouble, but are basically good kids. They have struggled finding good jobs because of it. One was some theft 10 years ago and the other was drug possession. But I see the other side, too. Maybe it shouldn’t be so black and white. (Absolutely NO pun intended!)
So now employers have to determine which criminals can be trusted to manage their stores? This is total BS. Also, almost all crime insurance policies are void regarding employees with prior records of theft so maybe the EEOC should sue the crime insurance companies as well for their contribution to discrimination.
This isn’t a high value department store, this is a dollar store. We’re a country that at least still pretends that our judicial system is about rehabilitation and serving your time. If someone who serves their time years ago can’t get a job at a Dollar store, where are they supposed to look for work? You want to lock people up and then have them completely unable to actually work for a living so they have to continue to live off of the taxes of others?
This article simply says they have to hire a consultant to make sure their criminal background check process is above board. It’s not saying they have to hire rapists and murderers. It even mentions the type of criteria that might make someone with a record an allowable employee.
This is way off topic but I have done a decent amount of prison ministry and I can assure you that our criminal justice and incarceration system has nothing to do with reforming or rehabilitating inmates. Unfortunately, the prison system in our country tends to harden criminals. The vast majority of institutions don’t have the ability or desire to actually reform the prison population. And, yes, there is a large part of the prison community that could actually return to society and be productive members, however, that is the unfortunate exception. I have met individuals in prison serving year long sentences for theft being forced to share a cell block with hardened, impenitent, murderers. True story.
That’s an interesting perspective, Augustine…I have heard that some prisons often makes people worse than when they went in. Something definitely needs to be done.
Personally,after watching all the seasons of “Oz” I made up my mind that there was no way I was ever going to prison. It worked better than any “scared straight” program out there…
If you want to be terrified, I’d suggest the third season of the podcast Serial. They spent a year hanging out around a courthouse in Ohio, observing the different cases and systems at place. It is truly haunting, the things that occur in our justice system every single day.
Sadly Augustine you are 100% correct. I don’t believe our system rehabilitates or reforms in the slightest, but I know that is the “intent” behind our system, broken though the system is. We made incarceration a business that eats the poor, and sadly there is no easy fix. It’s one of the biggest flaws in modern American society, and with for-profit prisons on the rise, one of the biggest factors pushing our country towards inevitable dystopia.
My brother was incarcerated from 17-23, and he has pulled his life together thankfully with a solid career as a plumber. His story is such a rarity, the more you hear about our “justice” system the worse it gets. It doesn’t help that the police view themselves as warriors of light in our country, despite the fact that a large number are corrupt or imbalanced.
My 80 year old father and a handful of other retired executive types started a mentoring program for prisoners in their county jail. They loved doing it and felt they had an impact on some of the young men. After about a year, the county told them they could no longer do it as someone was sneaking drugs to the inmates. My dad’s group knew it was the guards doing that, but the county thought these 80 year old men were doing it. So the program was killed. Very disappointing to my dad.
That is very unfortunate. The prison system is so massively corrupt. At a prison in my area they held a full on sting operation to find out which guard was smuggling in phones. They caught him red-handed and he was allowed to retire early with full benefits. This was after who knows how long of smuggling phones in for thousands and thousands of dollars. It’s absurd what we let our corrections system get away with.
I’d like to have a ‘dollar’ for every time the race card has been used inappropriately – against any person
Funnily enough, people who complain about the “race card”? Often racist. You’re the same crowd that likes the phrase “I’m not racist but…” if those words ever enter your mind? You’re probably a racist. People that aren’t racist don’t tend to complain about these things.
Maybe ‘race card’ is not the right word. All I’m saying is that whether you’re white, black red or inbetween you may have been penalized or discriminated against because of your color, or to be honest, your sex (male or female).
Therein maybe is my issue, in that I find it far less likely for a white person to have been penalized or discriminated against at anywhere even close to the level of a “black red or inbetween” person as you describe them. This is the issue with the “all lives matter” movement. If your response to Black Lives Matter is to say All Lives Matter, you’re missing the point.
If I were an employer, I may be willing to take a risk with someone who had a minor theft charge many years ago. Sometimes people grow up and mature, but not always. I don’t think it’s a clear cut issue though. If you are interviewing someone who has a couple theft charges on their record, and they are eyeballing the cash register during the interview, maybe they aren’t the correct person for the position?
Totally agree. The article even mentions the problem isn’t the background check at all, it’s that it unfairly was discriminatory. I think the answer is that they hire a consultant to tweak their hiring criteria based on the background check, to make sure they’re not unfairly discriminating. A lot of companies use a background check, these guys just seemed to be using it as an excuse to not hire black employees unfortunately.
Next week’s news: “Discrimination consultant sued for discrimination.”
You know why that will never happen? Because Dollar Store is going to be forced to hire a lot of bad apples now just because of their race, in order to avoid this happening again.
You advocate for rehabilitation. Fine, everyone is on board with that. But you ignore the first rule of hiring: the greatest predictor of future behavior is past behavior.
It isn’t so easy as you suggest. That’s why liberals don’t open businesses to hire the people they think are being discriminated against; it’s not so easy.
Since they’re being ordered to hire a criminology consultant if they want to keep using a criminal background check, it’s unlikely that they will “be forced to hire a lot of bad apples”. They could just, you know, interview their candidates well. I’m not saying they hire anyone with a record, as I intended, but the law is the law. You’re complaining about them being ordered to follow the law. Go do business in Somalia if you don’t like it, these are the laws.
As you implied* Not as I intended.
So you think you can interview prospective employees with criminal backgrounds and with complete certainty know that they will all turn out to be a great employee.
Clearly, you have never hired anyone before. It is always a crap shoot. Now add in the criminal background and tell me again how easy it is.
I never said I could, I merely said they’re being ordered to hire a criminology consultant to continue their criminal background check. Maybe actually read before you respond?