I understand the perception, the term negotiate, in simple language what can a contractor, roofer do when he is working with a homeowner and the insurance company didn’t pay for hail damage and wouldn’t pay our price, what should can we do?
Can we discuss the damage they missed because of our expertise in this area?
Can we discuss the price that we are charging?
Can we discuss the scope because of code changes and the roof needs to brought up to code?
So without roofing contractors homeowners will just get abused by insurance companies.
I have been on several inspections where the insurance company with malice doesn’t pay the homeowner what they should get and they will have to hire a substandard contractor to do the work.
Hey Bruce, the issue is with contractors who control the situation from the very beginning. Usually what happens is the repairs are so over inflated that homeowners end up with huge claims that create future problems. The companies promise is to pay for covered risks. However, they are forced, for one reason or another, to dump risks that have multiple or large losses. The insured now has to buy new insurance on a property with losses and a cancellation. The new insurance can result in surcharges or losing the claim free discount. A good contractor should assist in the process, but its not his job to be in control of the situation. Just something to consider.
I think the big concern is the actual role the contractor plays. They should definately assist the homeowner, but its not their place to take the place of the insured. The contract is between the insured and the company. Some contractors over inflate their estimates so much that it can cause a potential cancellation from the carrier. Whether right or wrong, the insured has to find new insurance. New insurance with losses can be difficult. Most companies do not charge for cat losses, but if the insured has other losses it can create problems. Eg. My roof cost 50% less than a guy a few doors down with same size roof and same type of work. Both was insurance work. I am actually working on his insurance now qnd I have this to deal with. When cat losses happen, everybody and their brother is out looking for insurance work.
To make it illegal for the contractor to identify damage that an insured is unaware of, write an estimate for the damages, and then create a situation where it is illegal for that contractor to negotiate that estimate is unfair for the insured. The insurance company can use other familiar contractors to dispute the findings of the first contractor; the insured typically doesn’t bring in another adjuster to get a second opinion. There are certainly contractors abusing the system, however the alternative is worse. In most cases the insured needs an advocate, unfortunately that becomes the contractor.
Mike, I couldn’t agree more, the insured does need an advocate-that’s why there are Licensed Public Insurance Adjusters! Nothing against contractors, your services are defintetly required however, not to negotiate or manage claim recoveries. The attorneys associated with the Unauthorized Practice of Law Committee (UPLC) would have a field-day with contractors/restoration companies if they knew you were attempting to negotiate or manage a claim recovery!
We are providing a free service to the insured, if it wasn’t for the roofing companies as an advocate to the homeowner or business owner then the insured would have to rely on a public adjuster who charges the homeowner, is this proper. Are public adjusters in the best interest of the homeowner, NO WAY! Most ligate roofing and contractors use the price list the insurance companies use, so price issue is only because the insurance company don’t use the proper scope. Yes roofing companies make the homeowner aware they have hail damage new or old, do you think the insurance company is going to volunteer and do free inspections without being called. Advocates create a checks and balance from both sides. We do it as a free service without charging. Yes there is more claims because of the awareness. Most states don’t hold a hail claim against an insured the last I seen. I’ve been in this business for 30 years and have seen as much abuse from the insurance side as I have from the roofing side.
When an adjusters misses the damage from hail who does a Homeowner call?
When an adjusters leaves off lines items that need to be upgrade due to codes who do they call?
If the adjuster doesn’t inform the homeowner they have code upgrade, or “Law and Ordinance” how are they going to know they should be paid?
My understanding is if you are a public adjuster you can charge a fee, but you can’t do the work or be involved in the repair process, the homeowner pays the PA and now the homeowner will not have enough money needed to do the repairs, this doesn’t make since.
Give me solutions and I will pass it on to our industry to make the best for the homeowners and insurance adjusters.
Bruce, as a Licensed Public Adjuster and having worked at one of the largest PA firms in the Nation for over 10 years I can assure you, PROFESSIONAL Public Adjusters do not TAKE money from policyholders, they MAKE money for policyholders by ensuring that the policyholder is RIGHTFULLY compensated for the damages they have sustained according to the policy(s) in effect at the time of the loss. Most policyholders NET 20-30% more than they would have received, even after the Public Adjuster has been compensated, by engaging the services of a professional public adjuster over any other management process available. (NOTE: If the policyholder was not entitled to the “additional funds”, the insurance carrier would not have paid them!) States require public adjusters to be licensed for a reason. They, unlike roofers, contractors, restoration/cleaning companies, whose motivation is pure profit and allegiance to the insurance company representative(s) for this claim and future business, are educated in and understand policy terminology, are up to date on current industry conditions and must adhere to a professional code of ethics to maintain their licensure. When a claim is managed by a professional public adjuster, the policyholder will be informed of what their rightful financial compensation is and then they can put the neccesary repairs out for competitive bid. The reason roofers, contractors and restoration/cleaning companies do not like this method is because they are not in control (they actually have to submit a bid and attempt to secure a contract in a competitive environment) and their alliance with the insurance company representative(s) is no longer in play. The policyholder will not be signing a “direct pay authorization”, will actually understand that the damages are being paid out of THEIR recovery money and will see what they are being charged BEFORE signing a contract.
I understand the PA role, but does a PA really want to deal with a $8,000 job? The issue, if a homeowner or business has hail damage, and it hits an metro area like New York I don’t think there is enough PAs out there to help the consumer, the insurance companies will hire inexperience claims adjusters and the consumers ends up hiring a contractor on price because the insurance adjuster didn’t pay or clarify the total process of the claim properly. So a well trained roofing contractor who is trained to scope and price the roof properly and surrounding property will end up getting more for the home owner than a PA will, especially on small jobs. Now large losses I understand.
So your committing insurance fraud by over estimating the claim? If insured are paid exactly what their claim is worth and then you take your 10% then they are losing 10%? If you inflate the claim to ten percent higher than it is worth and then take your 10% you are correct they are loosing no money!
Why are you assuming the insurance company is paying anything close to what the insured is owed? Studies show insurance companies pay 25-40 cents on the dollar if the insured does not use a PA.
No one is inflating anything. The insurance companies are ‘deflating’ settlements.
If Alabama is correct then all claims should be handled by attorneys. All company adjusters should immediately be replaced with licensed attorneys to handle claims on behalf of the insurance company, otherwise company adjusters are also practicing law.
While we’re on the topic of the Unauthorized Practice of Public Adjusting (UPPA) and contractors, there is another group out there that should be included. They are Certified Public Accountants that hold themselves out as able to represent clients with insurance claims vs their Insurers, especially having to do with business interruption and other time element losses and the like, that do so without being licensed as Public Insurance Adjusters. They should be scrutinized when the States are monitoring improper and illegal adjusting activities also.
Who better than a contractor to establish the real cost of replacement or repairs for a claim. Adjusters can assessed damaged but they rely on computer software to establish cost. A cost that is prepared by a company on a based average and adjusted to the locale where the damage occurs based on unit costs that have no reality to the replacement or repair costs.
i agree with someone needing a lic; to pratice (public adjusters role) however i am a general contractor and i have been in the (insurance industry now for more than 25-yrs handling only insurance work) i work along with our clients to get a fair settlement for them so that the insurance does not take advantage of them. Did you know this is a fact ( 86% of all property claims are 62% under paid ) give that some thought.
I love when people admit to breaking the law in writing.
It doesn’t matter if you’ve been doing it for 1000 years, if you are not a licensed public adjuster you should refer the claim to a PA. They will legally protect the client and get them the proper settlement.
I understand the perception, the term negotiate, in simple language what can a contractor, roofer do when he is working with a homeowner and the insurance company didn’t pay for hail damage and wouldn’t pay our price, what should can we do?
Can we discuss the damage they missed because of our expertise in this area?
Can we discuss the price that we are charging?
Can we discuss the scope because of code changes and the roof needs to brought up to code?
So without roofing contractors homeowners will just get abused by insurance companies.
I have been on several inspections where the insurance company with malice doesn’t pay the homeowner what they should get and they will have to hire a substandard contractor to do the work.
Hey Bruce, the issue is with contractors who control the situation from the very beginning. Usually what happens is the repairs are so over inflated that homeowners end up with huge claims that create future problems. The companies promise is to pay for covered risks. However, they are forced, for one reason or another, to dump risks that have multiple or large losses. The insured now has to buy new insurance on a property with losses and a cancellation. The new insurance can result in surcharges or losing the claim free discount. A good contractor should assist in the process, but its not his job to be in control of the situation. Just something to consider.
I think the big concern is the actual role the contractor plays. They should definately assist the homeowner, but its not their place to take the place of the insured. The contract is between the insured and the company. Some contractors over inflate their estimates so much that it can cause a potential cancellation from the carrier. Whether right or wrong, the insured has to find new insurance. New insurance with losses can be difficult. Most companies do not charge for cat losses, but if the insured has other losses it can create problems. Eg. My roof cost 50% less than a guy a few doors down with same size roof and same type of work. Both was insurance work. I am actually working on his insurance now qnd I have this to deal with. When cat losses happen, everybody and their brother is out looking for insurance work.
To make it illegal for the contractor to identify damage that an insured is unaware of, write an estimate for the damages, and then create a situation where it is illegal for that contractor to negotiate that estimate is unfair for the insured. The insurance company can use other familiar contractors to dispute the findings of the first contractor; the insured typically doesn’t bring in another adjuster to get a second opinion. There are certainly contractors abusing the system, however the alternative is worse. In most cases the insured needs an advocate, unfortunately that becomes the contractor.
Mike, I couldn’t agree more, the insured does need an advocate-that’s why there are Licensed Public Insurance Adjusters! Nothing against contractors, your services are defintetly required however, not to negotiate or manage claim recoveries. The attorneys associated with the Unauthorized Practice of Law Committee (UPLC) would have a field-day with contractors/restoration companies if they knew you were attempting to negotiate or manage a claim recovery!
We are providing a free service to the insured, if it wasn’t for the roofing companies as an advocate to the homeowner or business owner then the insured would have to rely on a public adjuster who charges the homeowner, is this proper. Are public adjusters in the best interest of the homeowner, NO WAY! Most ligate roofing and contractors use the price list the insurance companies use, so price issue is only because the insurance company don’t use the proper scope. Yes roofing companies make the homeowner aware they have hail damage new or old, do you think the insurance company is going to volunteer and do free inspections without being called. Advocates create a checks and balance from both sides. We do it as a free service without charging. Yes there is more claims because of the awareness. Most states don’t hold a hail claim against an insured the last I seen. I’ve been in this business for 30 years and have seen as much abuse from the insurance side as I have from the roofing side.
When an adjusters misses the damage from hail who does a Homeowner call?
When an adjusters leaves off lines items that need to be upgrade due to codes who do they call?
If the adjuster doesn’t inform the homeowner they have code upgrade, or “Law and Ordinance” how are they going to know they should be paid?
My understanding is if you are a public adjuster you can charge a fee, but you can’t do the work or be involved in the repair process, the homeowner pays the PA and now the homeowner will not have enough money needed to do the repairs, this doesn’t make since.
Give me solutions and I will pass it on to our industry to make the best for the homeowners and insurance adjusters.
Bruce, as a Licensed Public Adjuster and having worked at one of the largest PA firms in the Nation for over 10 years I can assure you, PROFESSIONAL Public Adjusters do not TAKE money from policyholders, they MAKE money for policyholders by ensuring that the policyholder is RIGHTFULLY compensated for the damages they have sustained according to the policy(s) in effect at the time of the loss. Most policyholders NET 20-30% more than they would have received, even after the Public Adjuster has been compensated, by engaging the services of a professional public adjuster over any other management process available. (NOTE: If the policyholder was not entitled to the “additional funds”, the insurance carrier would not have paid them!) States require public adjusters to be licensed for a reason. They, unlike roofers, contractors, restoration/cleaning companies, whose motivation is pure profit and allegiance to the insurance company representative(s) for this claim and future business, are educated in and understand policy terminology, are up to date on current industry conditions and must adhere to a professional code of ethics to maintain their licensure. When a claim is managed by a professional public adjuster, the policyholder will be informed of what their rightful financial compensation is and then they can put the neccesary repairs out for competitive bid. The reason roofers, contractors and restoration/cleaning companies do not like this method is because they are not in control (they actually have to submit a bid and attempt to secure a contract in a competitive environment) and their alliance with the insurance company representative(s) is no longer in play. The policyholder will not be signing a “direct pay authorization”, will actually understand that the damages are being paid out of THEIR recovery money and will see what they are being charged BEFORE signing a contract.
I understand the PA role, but does a PA really want to deal with a $8,000 job? The issue, if a homeowner or business has hail damage, and it hits an metro area like New York I don’t think there is enough PAs out there to help the consumer, the insurance companies will hire inexperience claims adjusters and the consumers ends up hiring a contractor on price because the insurance adjuster didn’t pay or clarify the total process of the claim properly. So a well trained roofing contractor who is trained to scope and price the roof properly and surrounding property will end up getting more for the home owner than a PA will, especially on small jobs. Now large losses I understand.
So your committing insurance fraud by over estimating the claim? If insured are paid exactly what their claim is worth and then you take your 10% then they are losing 10%? If you inflate the claim to ten percent higher than it is worth and then take your 10% you are correct they are loosing no money!
Why are you assuming the insurance company is paying anything close to what the insured is owed? Studies show insurance companies pay 25-40 cents on the dollar if the insured does not use a PA.
No one is inflating anything. The insurance companies are ‘deflating’ settlements.
If Alabama is correct then all claims should be handled by attorneys. All company adjusters should immediately be replaced with licensed attorneys to handle claims on behalf of the insurance company, otherwise company adjusters are also practicing law.
While we’re on the topic of the Unauthorized Practice of Public Adjusting (UPPA) and contractors, there is another group out there that should be included. They are Certified Public Accountants that hold themselves out as able to represent clients with insurance claims vs their Insurers, especially having to do with business interruption and other time element losses and the like, that do so without being licensed as Public Insurance Adjusters. They should be scrutinized when the States are monitoring improper and illegal adjusting activities also.
Who better than a contractor to establish the real cost of replacement or repairs for a claim. Adjusters can assessed damaged but they rely on computer software to establish cost. A cost that is prepared by a company on a based average and adjusted to the locale where the damage occurs based on unit costs that have no reality to the replacement or repair costs.
i agree with someone needing a lic; to pratice (public adjusters role) however i am a general contractor and i have been in the (insurance industry now for more than 25-yrs handling only insurance work) i work along with our clients to get a fair settlement for them so that the insurance does not take advantage of them. Did you know this is a fact ( 86% of all property claims are 62% under paid ) give that some thought.
I love when people admit to breaking the law in writing.
It doesn’t matter if you’ve been doing it for 1000 years, if you are not a licensed public adjuster you should refer the claim to a PA. They will legally protect the client and get them the proper settlement.