How about the gopher who either sees his shadow or not. That should be a good model for them to use to predict if we have 6 more weeks of winter or not. These Progressive modelers have not had much luck the past few years predicting hurricanes or whether the ocean was rising or the polar cap melting.
This is the biggest confidence trick in human history. Unbelievable that anyone would fall for this. These criminals that push this lie are doing to elementary school students. Every prediction and model they have come out with has been totally wrong. This woman actually gets paid to come up with these, in my opinion, dubious models. Most weather people cannot get a 10 forecast correct, let alone 5 to 10 year cycles. Remember global cooling, global warming , now climate change, horrible hurricanes!!
(1) The earth’s temp’s have steadily increased over the recent decades
(2) 2014 was the hottest year on record for the planet
(3) Feb 2015 was the 2nd hottest Feb in history for the world, even though we all know it snowed a bunch in the NE US
(4) While polar ice caps did increase during a couple months last year, the earth’s entire level of sea ice actually decreased
Anyone want to refute those facts with evidence and not just speculation? I’ll gladly review any links you may have which you feel disputes those points.
I agree it was supper cold around the Great Lakes in February and the water even froze, but that’s just one sliver of the globe.
When talking about climate change, we need to look at the planet as a whole and not just one part that’s experiencing winter (after all, it’s summer in the other half of the world right now).
“The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for February 2014 tied with 2001 as the 21st highest for February at 12.51°C (54.64°F), or 0.41°C (0.74°F), above the 20th century average of 12.1°C (53.9°F) since record keeping began in 1880. This month marked the 29th consecutive February and 348th consecutive month (29 years) with a global temperature above the 20th century average. The last below-average global temperature for February and for any month was February 1985.”
I’m sorry, but you have to first prove those facts.
What was the method of measure?
We have not had temperature measuring methods for very long at all, and the data points have been debated for where we actively monitor temperatures. There may easily be another 500 points we didn’t monitor that show the net was neutral, by comparison to the 500 points we do monitor. Get the point? We don’t have a global monitor that has enough monitoring points.
The claim that this was the hottest time period weighing 100 years is usually the hockey schtick theory, shown later to be false in this link. It isn’t accurate.
We don’t have measures that show your item 1 and 2 are accurate. There is no measure that could prove over billions of years 2014 was the hottest year, and bluntly, you are a dumbass for saying it.
Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass, while you yourself are trying to call out people as being dumbasses for questioning your comment. Should I not question it and just accept it? We had this conversation before didn’t we?
“We don’t have measures that show your item 1 and 2 are accurate. There is no measure that could prove over billions of years 2014 was the hottest year, and bluntly, you are a dumbass for saying it.”
Apparently you can’t read. He said that 2014 was the hottest year ON RECORD, not the hottest year ever. Meaning that it was the hottest year since we began keeping records of global temperature.
Also, the hockey stick has been confirmed by multiple different researchers using multiple different methods. The one paper that claimed that it was false was written by a mining exploration company director and an economist, neither of which had any kind of formal training in climatological science.
The data is inaccurate according to a blog that reposted content compiled by a fringe think tank from Australia. I think NASA, NOAA, the National Academy of Sciences, The Royal Society, and dozens of other international science academies representing 10s of thousands of scientists from all over the world have just a smidgeon more credibility than some random blog that cherry picks studies, some of which have critical flaws that anyone can google if they bothered to fact check the information they’re being fed.
Do you honestly think they’re all engaged in a global conspiracy to suppress the truth? Wake up. You’ve been bamboozled by a manufactured controversy cooked up by energy companies and right wing think tanks. The energy companies are operating in the exact same way the tobacco companies did in decades past, manufacturing controversy where none really exists by having paid shills publish papers with forgone conclusions, down to hiring the exact same PR firms that the tobacco companies used to try to spin smoking as a harmless activity.
I certainly showed my methodology, and it was not any bit “boob” you ass.
He has to show what method of measure shows that this was the hottest year of the Earth’s existence. That’s a bold statement.
Further to the point: I showed several methods and the flaws for determining the Earth’s temperature over time.
Did you even read the link?
I am not a Boob. It’s getting really old, boy. I show research, and it doesn’t support your “naive” uneducated, dumb ass perception, and that makes me a boob and lazy in research?
“He has to show what method of measure shows that this was the hottest year of the Earth’s existence. That’s a bold statement.”
Again, that wasn’t his claim. You are trying to refute an argument he did not make. A classic strawman technique. The claim was that 2014 was the hottest year we have ever recorded, which has been proven to be true based on data provided by NASA, NOAA, the Japan Meteorological Association, and the Hadley Center in the UK.
Also, your link to a climate denier’s blog that cherry picked 7 papers (some of which I have shown to be extremely flawed if not false outright) does not constitute “showing research.” It shows how desperate the denialist position is, that one must scour obscure blogs that repost drivel taken from the website of a fringe organization like the Australian Climate Skeptics Party. When every single major scientific organization on the planet disagrees with you, it may be time to reexamine your beliefs.
March 6, 2015 at 9:57 am
Rosenblatt says:
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David – thank you for taking the lead and responding to bob’s various posts on this subject. I really appreciate it — I probably would’ve gotten too hung up on his insults, accusatory tone, and his lack of understanding of what I wrote.
On that last point, you are 100% correct that I was not saying 2014 was the hottest year EVER on the planet, just that it was the hottest year EVER RECORDED on the planet.
I’m looking forward to when you and I don’t agree on a subject as I believe you’ll be able to discuss and debate your points logically and without any vitriol or insults, which would be a nice departure from how some people here (but not all of them) talk about things on this site.
February 27, 2015 at 5:22 pm
Casbah says:
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Obviously, science is hard. Nearly 100 years after Einstein’s theory of relativity was published, we’re seeing the evidence of it from the Hubble telescope’s data collections. Unfortunately, by the time we have 50 years’ worth of emperical data confirming unnatural changes in the climate, to satisfy everyone, we’ll be toast. The global reinsurers aren’t ignoring the predictions – they have too much skin in the game. Also unfortunately, we all do.
Hi Sandra. As I’m sure you know, Climate Change specifically deals with long-term trends for the entire planet. The article you posted, while accurate, is limited scope: it’s only referencing Antarctic sea ice, not all of the sea ice across the planet.
It’s a little similar to this winter: some people have asked “how can the earth’s temperatures be rising when we’ve received record cold and snowfall in the US?” The answer is pretty simple: While the US was cold and snowy, it’s balanced out by the rest of the planet’s temperatures.
So you can see 100+ inches of snow in Boston, but across the planet, the global temperature was the hottest it’s ever been in January on record.
FYI: In the south, ice melts away almost completely every year. The new ice produced each year is thinner and more volatile than the older more stable ice in the Arctic. This is another reason why Antarctic sea ice levels are difficult to predict.
Hypothetical question – (assuming they have similar starting points) if Arctic ice decreased by 30% in the past 5 years, but Antarctic ice increased by only 10%, would you agree the overall change would net a 20% reduction in sea ice in spite of the Antarctic ice level rising?
Global Warming, Climate Change or as I prefer to call it Spring, Summer, Fall and Winter is all a giant scam created by the scientist Al Gore and George Soros. The left has dreamed of a way to circumvent Congress and create a Carbon Tax through the EPA on the worlds largest industry, The Energy Sector. Just think how appealing to a liberal it is to get their hands on a made up Carbon Certificate they can sell to the highest bidders.
Sarah, it is easy to rain on the Climate Change believers parade. The volcano eruption in Iceland a few years ago erased every single effort man has made to reduce carbon and there are about 200 active volcanos spewing out this crud every single day. In 1991, Mt Pinatubo erupted in the Philippines and spewed out more greenhouse gases than the entire human race had emitted in all its years on earth. There is not a thing humans can do about volcanos erupting. It is just a part of the cycle and the earth always rebounds. Climate change people think man is at fault for this and they are just plain dumb.
Can those of you who don’t believe in climate change/global warming/whatever they’re calling it nowadays, tell me why? Why do you think so many scientists would fake something like this? What would be the purpose?
Please don’t respond with the stock “Liberals! Al Gore! Obama!!!” vitriol. I’m not looking for a fight, I’m really curious.
Serious question here… BS, why do you think so many scientists cooked the books on Climate Change and were forced to resign after they were discovered? Why are you such a true believer and think this trumped up science is accurate?
BS was sincerely asking for the logic behind the viewpoint you share with many other, and you couldn’t even tell him why you believe what you do. Hypocritical Agent once again doesn’t take his own advice of “just answer the question and you’ll fare much better.”
Climate change true believers are much like the low information voters that put our current President in office. NASA said that there was no measurable change in earth’s average temperature last year. I believe it was .05 of 1%. The only hot air was what came out of the Climate Change peoples lips.
“NASA said that there was no measurable change in earth’s average temperature last year”
I call BULLSH&*!!
“Global temperatures in 2014 shattered earlier records, making 2014 the hottest year since record-keeping began in 1880…
Every continent set heat records last year…
The warmth on land and in the oceans broke previous temperature records set in 2005 and 2010 the scientists with NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) announced.”
Do you have any source for your “fact” that NASA actually said there weren’t any measurable changes, or will you just ignore this post because I provided evidence to prove you just made sh1t up and posted it as a “fact” again?
March 3, 2015 at 12:38 pm
BS says:
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“The year 2014 was Earth’s warmest in 134 years of records, according to an analysis of surface temperature measurements by scientists at NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS). In a separate, independent analysis, scientists at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) also found 2014 to be the warmest on record. With the exception of 1998, the ten warmest years in the instrumental record (dating to 1880) have all occurred since 2000.”
First, thank you for finally addressing President Obama as your president too.
Second, since when do you believe information from a government agency? You either trust their information or you don’t, period.
March 3, 2015 at 3:54 pm
bob says:
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I’m sorry, we did NOT track a multitude of world wide data points for temperature in the 1880s’. The link you provided did not list the method of measure.
If they are going off the few towns that tracked temperature, then there are not enough data points to make that bold of a statement.
Also do you not remember the science videos as a kid?
I recall them saying that if the temperature were even 1 degree higher, life wouldn’t be possible on earth, or 1 degree colder, for a long term average.
I call BS on the 1.4F temperature increase since 1880 until I see the data, which that link doesn’t show.
Stating something as fact doesn’t make it so. So what was their method of data?
Which towns? Was it the tree ring method? That is the most common.
If it was towns, how many were shown? What thermometers were used? We didn’t have advanced tech back then.
You are beyond foolish on this.
March 3, 2015 at 6:18 pm
BS says:
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“The December 2014 average combined global land and ocean surface temperature was record high in the 135-year period of record, at 0.77°C (1.39°F) above the 20th century average of 12.2°C (54.0°F).
The December 2014 globally-averaged land surface temperature was the third highest on record, at 1.36°C (2.45°F) above average. The globally-averaged ocean surface temperature was also third highest for December on record, at 0.55°C (0.99°F) above average.
The average combined global land and ocean surface temperature for January–December 2014 was the highest on record among all years in the 135-year period of record, at 0.69°C (1.24°F) above the 20th century average.”
I have personally called you out on this lie before Agent. Why do you keep repeating it? “Eight committees investigated the allegations and published reports, finding no evidence of fraud or scientific misconduct.”
I suppose the simple answer would be that I believe in science. Not blindly, but when highly respected scientists say XYZ, I do tend to believe them.
However, that’s not to say that I’m not open to hearing other theories and having my mind changed. If there are counter arguments to something, I want to hear them.
I tried googling “climate change scientist forced to resign” and only saw articles about the climate change scientist who resigned after he got blowback when he joined the Global Warming Policy Foundation. If you’re referring to the Climatic Research Unit email controversy that David mentioned, that seemed more like people taking single sentences out of context and making non-issues into controversies.
But maybe I’m just missing something? Like I said earlier, I really do want to know what makes people disbelieve in climate change. Can you tell me what makes you believe the way you do? Do you have any links that would help illustrate it?
Bob, I guess you got to Rosenblatt since he is calling you every name he can think of in the troll tradition. I thought your evidence was quite good even if it was a bit wordy.
In the words of the great Leonard Nimoy (Mr. Spock), it is logical. Live long and prosper.
Agent – the only insults I sent to bob (MARCH 3, 2015 AT 4:38 PM) were the words/phrases/sentences he used to insult me earlier in this thread.
Therefore, you should be calling bob out for being a troll as he was the first to use all those insults towards me, and all I did was copy him by writing back the same exact insults he wrote to me.
You just choose to ignore it, and to monitor shaky data at best.
The real question is why do you buy into it? Can you show solid methodology?
Where are the temperature monitoring devices from 100 years ago? Tree rings? That was shown to be inaccurate.
You are the ones blindly believing something that has not been proven.
The fact is that conservatives have real reasons to doubt this. Some in the public are always stupid. You are focusing on that.
The politicians however, are all ivy league. None, let me repeat that NONE of them simply reject it for an ideological reason. They reject it based on a lack of evidence.
I am a little shocked that the conservatives here are not arguing properly at all.
And again, I must point out yet again how while Agent and I agree, note how we disagree. Agent has been talking cliches of cooking the books.
I just showed several different ways of how it is weighed to rosenblatt, and asked most importantly which measure has consistently been used and is accurate to show global warming on a long term basis?
The answer is: There is no accurate measure. That is the debate.
Bob, do you REALLY want to talk about this, or do you just prefer to insult me every chance you get? Right now, there will be no debate due to your incessant need to attack me.
What ever happened to “treat others as you wish to be treated”, you stupid, condescending controlling dumbass? Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass, you hypocrite.
See how that last paragraph failed to accomplish my intent of having a real discussion? Maybe now you’ll be able to post something about how you disagree with me without insulting me at the same time.
If you can give me a reply without any insults, I will be glad to civilly respond to your arguments point for point.
To those who need reading comprehension help (e.g. Agent), please note the insults I threw at bob were the exact same words he insulted me with earlier in this thread. I only did that to point out how insulting someone in a reply completely detracts from pursuing an honest and civil discussion/debate.
“Condescending controlling dumbass” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:49 PM
“Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:40 PM
“Hypocrite” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:40 PM
Rosenblatt, you are like the pot calling the kettle black. You and Libby lead the league in insulting behavior and when someone retaliates, you get all offended. I know exactly what he means since I have been insulted 50 times more than anyone else on this blog.
Agent – bob threw out the first 3 insults and it was me who retaliated by using his exact words against him. Bob did not retaliate, he initiated the insults. Get your facts straight.
March 3, 2015 at 5:12 pm
David says:
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I see your 7 papers and raise you 13,926. A review of 13,950 papers on climate change found that only 24 or 0.17% rejected the consensus. That’s pretty much a rounding error. You have cooks and paid shills in every field of science, they just make up the extreme fringe.
Also, because I was curious, I looked at one of the articles mentioned on the website you linked. It cites a scientist named Roy Spencer who has “developed a reputation for making serial mistakes that other scientists have been forced to uncover.”
I have neither the time nor the inclination to vet the other papers, but if they’re willing to link to discredited researchers I have severe doubts that any of the other articles are up to snuff either.
I read that the average temperature has increased about 1 degree in the last 100 years. My question is, how accurate were those thermometers 100 years ago? And where were they placed then versus where they are placed now. Any bets that they are in more urban, naturally warmer, settings now?
I read where everyone is concerned about the increase in average temperatures over the last 30 or so years. Temperatures have always fluctuated over time on this planet. Remember the ice ages? 25 years in the lifetime of this planet is NOTHING!
I wonder if they are doing research on the Easter Bunny or ghosts as well?
How about the gopher who either sees his shadow or not. That should be a good model for them to use to predict if we have 6 more weeks of winter or not. These Progressive modelers have not had much luck the past few years predicting hurricanes or whether the ocean was rising or the polar cap melting.
Biggest scam since Y2K
This is the biggest confidence trick in human history. Unbelievable that anyone would fall for this. These criminals that push this lie are doing to elementary school students. Every prediction and model they have come out with has been totally wrong. This woman actually gets paid to come up with these, in my opinion, dubious models. Most weather people cannot get a 10 forecast correct, let alone 5 to 10 year cycles. Remember global cooling, global warming , now climate change, horrible hurricanes!!
(1) The earth’s temp’s have steadily increased over the recent decades
(2) 2014 was the hottest year on record for the planet
(3) Feb 2015 was the 2nd hottest Feb in history for the world, even though we all know it snowed a bunch in the NE US
(4) While polar ice caps did increase during a couple months last year, the earth’s entire level of sea ice actually decreased
Anyone want to refute those facts with evidence and not just speculation? I’ll gladly review any links you may have which you feel disputes those points.
edit: February *will be* the 2nd hottest Feb in history – obviously the month isn’t over just yet
Wow. My fault. Take 3 on my 2nd point: January 2015 was the 2nd hottest January for the world, not February. Sorry for the confusion. #meaculpa
That was my 3rd point, not 2nd.
From the Chicago Tribune earlier this week:
It’s so cold the Great Lakes are turning into massive frozen plain
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/la-na-great-lakes-frozen-over-20150223-story.html
I agree it was supper cold around the Great Lakes in February and the water even froze, but that’s just one sliver of the globe.
When talking about climate change, we need to look at the planet as a whole and not just one part that’s experiencing winter (after all, it’s summer in the other half of the world right now).
“The combined average temperature over global land and ocean surfaces for February 2014 tied with 2001 as the 21st highest for February at 12.51°C (54.64°F), or 0.41°C (0.74°F), above the 20th century average of 12.1°C (53.9°F) since record keeping began in 1880. This month marked the 29th consecutive February and 348th consecutive month (29 years) with a global temperature above the 20th century average. The last below-average global temperature for February and for any month was February 1985.”
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/2014/02/
I’m sorry, but you have to first prove those facts.
What was the method of measure?
We have not had temperature measuring methods for very long at all, and the data points have been debated for where we actively monitor temperatures. There may easily be another 500 points we didn’t monitor that show the net was neutral, by comparison to the 500 points we do monitor. Get the point? We don’t have a global monitor that has enough monitoring points.
I think this article does a good job of separating the various methods weighing climate change. http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2012/10/seven-recent-papers-that-disprove-man.html
The claim that this was the hottest time period weighing 100 years is usually the hockey schtick theory, shown later to be false in this link. It isn’t accurate.
We don’t have measures that show your item 1 and 2 are accurate. There is no measure that could prove over billions of years 2014 was the hottest year, and bluntly, you are a dumbass for saying it.
Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass, while you yourself are trying to call out people as being dumbasses for questioning your comment. Should I not question it and just accept it? We had this conversation before didn’t we?
Hello hypocrite…
“We don’t have measures that show your item 1 and 2 are accurate. There is no measure that could prove over billions of years 2014 was the hottest year, and bluntly, you are a dumbass for saying it.”
Apparently you can’t read. He said that 2014 was the hottest year ON RECORD, not the hottest year ever. Meaning that it was the hottest year since we began keeping records of global temperature.
Also, the hockey stick has been confirmed by multiple different researchers using multiple different methods. The one paper that claimed that it was false was written by a mining exploration company director and an economist, neither of which had any kind of formal training in climatological science.
http://www.skepticalscience.com/broken-hockey-stick.htm
Ok, then he still has to prove we have enough reference points ON RECORD to demonstrate it was the hottest year, of which we do not.
Rather than stating he doesn’t have the background to disprove the scenario, why not read WHY they showed it was inaccurate?
Because the data IS inaccurate.
http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2014/01/the-rise-and-fall-of-hockey-stick-and.html
The data is inaccurate according to a blog that reposted content compiled by a fringe think tank from Australia. I think NASA, NOAA, the National Academy of Sciences, The Royal Society, and dozens of other international science academies representing 10s of thousands of scientists from all over the world have just a smidgeon more credibility than some random blog that cherry picks studies, some of which have critical flaws that anyone can google if they bothered to fact check the information they’re being fed.
Do you honestly think they’re all engaged in a global conspiracy to suppress the truth? Wake up. You’ve been bamboozled by a manufactured controversy cooked up by energy companies and right wing think tanks. The energy companies are operating in the exact same way the tobacco companies did in decades past, manufacturing controversy where none really exists by having paid shills publish papers with forgone conclusions, down to hiring the exact same PR firms that the tobacco companies used to try to spin smoking as a harmless activity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_opinion_on_climate_change#Statements_by_scientific_organizations_of_national_or_international_standing
Interesting how others have to prove their facts, but creationists can just pull stuff out of their magic asses with no proof necessary.
In other words:
You can’t simply state 1 2 3 and 4, without proving 1 2 3 and 4, if your goal is to have someone disprove them.
That is not how debates work.
But as usual, you are a condescending controlling ass, in the facade of an open minded moderate.
Boob, please show your methadology if youre going to be doing more debatez.
I certainly showed my methodology, and it was not any bit “boob” you ass.
He has to show what method of measure shows that this was the hottest year of the Earth’s existence. That’s a bold statement.
Further to the point: I showed several methods and the flaws for determining the Earth’s temperature over time.
Did you even read the link?
I am not a Boob. It’s getting really old, boy. I show research, and it doesn’t support your “naive” uneducated, dumb ass perception, and that makes me a boob and lazy in research?
I think not! Grow up!
“He has to show what method of measure shows that this was the hottest year of the Earth’s existence. That’s a bold statement.”
Again, that wasn’t his claim. You are trying to refute an argument he did not make. A classic strawman technique. The claim was that 2014 was the hottest year we have ever recorded, which has been proven to be true based on data provided by NASA, NOAA, the Japan Meteorological Association, and the Hadley Center in the UK.
http://time.com/3656646/2014-hottest-year/
Also, your link to a climate denier’s blog that cherry picked 7 papers (some of which I have shown to be extremely flawed if not false outright) does not constitute “showing research.” It shows how desperate the denialist position is, that one must scour obscure blogs that repost drivel taken from the website of a fringe organization like the Australian Climate Skeptics Party. When every single major scientific organization on the planet disagrees with you, it may be time to reexamine your beliefs.
David – thank you for taking the lead and responding to bob’s various posts on this subject. I really appreciate it — I probably would’ve gotten too hung up on his insults, accusatory tone, and his lack of understanding of what I wrote.
On that last point, you are 100% correct that I was not saying 2014 was the hottest year EVER on the planet, just that it was the hottest year EVER RECORDED on the planet.
I’m looking forward to when you and I don’t agree on a subject as I believe you’ll be able to discuss and debate your points logically and without any vitriol or insults, which would be a nice departure from how some people here (but not all of them) talk about things on this site.
Obviously, science is hard. Nearly 100 years after Einstein’s theory of relativity was published, we’re seeing the evidence of it from the Hubble telescope’s data collections. Unfortunately, by the time we have 50 years’ worth of emperical data confirming unnatural changes in the climate, to satisfy everyone, we’ll be toast. The global reinsurers aren’t ignoring the predictions – they have too much skin in the game. Also unfortunately, we all do.
I’ve got a few bridges for sale, too.
Sorry Conservatives…..climate change IS real.
Is it weird that I pictured/heard South Park’s depiction of Al Gore saying this?
Could be a manbearpig!
So, Exadjuster…did you leave adjusting claims to become a scientist?
So, tell me how this happens
http://dailycaller.com/2015/03/02/antarctic-sea-ice-did-the-exact-opposite-of-what-models-predicted/
Hi Sandra. As I’m sure you know, Climate Change specifically deals with long-term trends for the entire planet. The article you posted, while accurate, is limited scope: it’s only referencing Antarctic sea ice, not all of the sea ice across the planet.
If you look at the Artic ice level over the years, we see sea ice decreasing significantly in that part of the world: https://ourchangingclimate.wordpress.com/2009/01/07/tipping_points_melting_ice/
It’s a little similar to this winter: some people have asked “how can the earth’s temperatures be rising when we’ve received record cold and snowfall in the US?” The answer is pretty simple: While the US was cold and snowy, it’s balanced out by the rest of the planet’s temperatures.
So you can see 100+ inches of snow in Boston, but across the planet, the global temperature was the hottest it’s ever been in January on record.
FYI: In the south, ice melts away almost completely every year. The new ice produced each year is thinner and more volatile than the older more stable ice in the Arctic. This is another reason why Antarctic sea ice levels are difficult to predict.
Hypothetical question – (assuming they have similar starting points) if Arctic ice decreased by 30% in the past 5 years, but Antarctic ice increased by only 10%, would you agree the overall change would net a 20% reduction in sea ice in spite of the Antarctic ice level rising?
Global Warming, Climate Change or as I prefer to call it Spring, Summer, Fall and Winter is all a giant scam created by the scientist Al Gore and George Soros. The left has dreamed of a way to circumvent Congress and create a Carbon Tax through the EPA on the worlds largest industry, The Energy Sector. Just think how appealing to a liberal it is to get their hands on a made up Carbon Certificate they can sell to the highest bidders.
Sarah, it is easy to rain on the Climate Change believers parade. The volcano eruption in Iceland a few years ago erased every single effort man has made to reduce carbon and there are about 200 active volcanos spewing out this crud every single day. In 1991, Mt Pinatubo erupted in the Philippines and spewed out more greenhouse gases than the entire human race had emitted in all its years on earth. There is not a thing humans can do about volcanos erupting. It is just a part of the cycle and the earth always rebounds. Climate change people think man is at fault for this and they are just plain dumb.
Serious question here…
Can those of you who don’t believe in climate change/global warming/whatever they’re calling it nowadays, tell me why? Why do you think so many scientists would fake something like this? What would be the purpose?
Please don’t respond with the stock “Liberals! Al Gore! Obama!!!” vitriol. I’m not looking for a fight, I’m really curious.
Serious question here… BS, why do you think so many scientists cooked the books on Climate Change and were forced to resign after they were discovered? Why are you such a true believer and think this trumped up science is accurate?
BS was sincerely asking for the logic behind the viewpoint you share with many other, and you couldn’t even tell him why you believe what you do. Hypocritical Agent once again doesn’t take his own advice of “just answer the question and you’ll fare much better.”
edit: many others
Climate change true believers are much like the low information voters that put our current President in office. NASA said that there was no measurable change in earth’s average temperature last year. I believe it was .05 of 1%. The only hot air was what came out of the Climate Change peoples lips.
“NASA said that there was no measurable change in earth’s average temperature last year”
I call BULLSH&*!!
“Global temperatures in 2014 shattered earlier records, making 2014 the hottest year since record-keeping began in 1880…
Every continent set heat records last year…
The warmth on land and in the oceans broke previous temperature records set in 2005 and 2010 the scientists with NASA and the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) announced.”
http://www.livescience.com/49479-2014-earths-hottest-year.html
Do you have any source for your “fact” that NASA actually said there weren’t any measurable changes, or will you just ignore this post because I provided evidence to prove you just made sh1t up and posted it as a “fact” again?
“The year 2014 was Earth’s warmest in 134 years of records, according to an analysis of surface temperature measurements by scientists at NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS). In a separate, independent analysis, scientists at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) also found 2014 to be the warmest on record. With the exception of 1998, the ten warmest years in the instrumental record (dating to 1880) have all occurred since 2000.”
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/NaturalHazards/view.php?id=85083
Agent,
First, thank you for finally addressing President Obama as your president too.
Second, since when do you believe information from a government agency? You either trust their information or you don’t, period.
I’m sorry, we did NOT track a multitude of world wide data points for temperature in the 1880s’. The link you provided did not list the method of measure.
If they are going off the few towns that tracked temperature, then there are not enough data points to make that bold of a statement.
Also do you not remember the science videos as a kid?
I recall them saying that if the temperature were even 1 degree higher, life wouldn’t be possible on earth, or 1 degree colder, for a long term average.
I call BS on the 1.4F temperature increase since 1880 until I see the data, which that link doesn’t show.
Stating something as fact doesn’t make it so. So what was their method of data?
Which towns? Was it the tree ring method? That is the most common.
If it was towns, how many were shown? What thermometers were used? We didn’t have advanced tech back then.
You are beyond foolish on this.
“The December 2014 average combined global land and ocean surface temperature was record high in the 135-year period of record, at 0.77°C (1.39°F) above the 20th century average of 12.2°C (54.0°F).
The December 2014 globally-averaged land surface temperature was the third highest on record, at 1.36°C (2.45°F) above average. The globally-averaged ocean surface temperature was also third highest for December on record, at 0.55°C (0.99°F) above average.
The average combined global land and ocean surface temperature for January–December 2014 was the highest on record among all years in the 135-year period of record, at 0.69°C (1.24°F) above the 20th century average.”
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/sotc/global/2014/12
I have personally called you out on this lie before Agent. Why do you keep repeating it? “Eight committees investigated the allegations and published reports, finding no evidence of fraud or scientific misconduct.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climatic_Research_Unit_email_controversy
Also, name one climate scientist that was forced to resign for “cooking the books.” Lying is a sin Agent.
Lying makes baby Jesus cry.
Hi Agent,
I suppose the simple answer would be that I believe in science. Not blindly, but when highly respected scientists say XYZ, I do tend to believe them.
However, that’s not to say that I’m not open to hearing other theories and having my mind changed. If there are counter arguments to something, I want to hear them.
I tried googling “climate change scientist forced to resign” and only saw articles about the climate change scientist who resigned after he got blowback when he joined the Global Warming Policy Foundation. If you’re referring to the Climatic Research Unit email controversy that David mentioned, that seemed more like people taking single sentences out of context and making non-issues into controversies.
But maybe I’m just missing something? Like I said earlier, I really do want to know what makes people disbelieve in climate change. Can you tell me what makes you believe the way you do? Do you have any links that would help illustrate it?
Bob, I guess you got to Rosenblatt since he is calling you every name he can think of in the troll tradition. I thought your evidence was quite good even if it was a bit wordy.
In the words of the great Leonard Nimoy (Mr. Spock), it is logical. Live long and prosper.
Agent – the only insults I sent to bob (MARCH 3, 2015 AT 4:38 PM) were the words/phrases/sentences he used to insult me earlier in this thread.
Therefore, you should be calling bob out for being a troll as he was the first to use all those insults towards me, and all I did was copy him by writing back the same exact insults he wrote to me.
http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com/2012/10/seven-recent-papers-that-disprove-man.html
The logic is out there (X-files reference)
You just choose to ignore it, and to monitor shaky data at best.
The real question is why do you buy into it? Can you show solid methodology?
Where are the temperature monitoring devices from 100 years ago? Tree rings? That was shown to be inaccurate.
You are the ones blindly believing something that has not been proven.
The fact is that conservatives have real reasons to doubt this. Some in the public are always stupid. You are focusing on that.
The politicians however, are all ivy league. None, let me repeat that NONE of them simply reject it for an ideological reason. They reject it based on a lack of evidence.
I am a little shocked that the conservatives here are not arguing properly at all.
And again, I must point out yet again how while Agent and I agree, note how we disagree. Agent has been talking cliches of cooking the books.
I just showed several different ways of how it is weighed to rosenblatt, and asked most importantly which measure has consistently been used and is accurate to show global warming on a long term basis?
The answer is: There is no accurate measure. That is the debate.
Bob, do you REALLY want to talk about this, or do you just prefer to insult me every chance you get? Right now, there will be no debate due to your incessant need to attack me.
What ever happened to “treat others as you wish to be treated”, you stupid, condescending controlling dumbass? Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass, you hypocrite.
See how that last paragraph failed to accomplish my intent of having a real discussion? Maybe now you’ll be able to post something about how you disagree with me without insulting me at the same time.
If you can give me a reply without any insults, I will be glad to civilly respond to your arguments point for point.
Otherwise, F-off. Your move.
To those who need reading comprehension help (e.g. Agent), please note the insults I threw at bob were the exact same words he insulted me with earlier in this thread. I only did that to point out how insulting someone in a reply completely detracts from pursuing an honest and civil discussion/debate.
“Condescending controlling dumbass” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:49 PM
“Sorry to throw in an insult, but hard rebukes are needed for that level of dumbass” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:40 PM
“Hypocrite” – bob’s post on MARCH 3, 2015 AT 3:40 PM
Rosenblatt, you are like the pot calling the kettle black. You and Libby lead the league in insulting behavior and when someone retaliates, you get all offended. I know exactly what he means since I have been insulted 50 times more than anyone else on this blog.
Agent – bob threw out the first 3 insults and it was me who retaliated by using his exact words against him. Bob did not retaliate, he initiated the insults. Get your facts straight.
I see your 7 papers and raise you 13,926. A review of 13,950 papers on climate change found that only 24 or 0.17% rejected the consensus. That’s pretty much a rounding error. You have cooks and paid shills in every field of science, they just make up the extreme fringe.
http://www.motherjones.com/blue-marble/2012/11/chart-only-017-percent-peer-reviewed-papers-question-global-warming
Also, because I was curious, I looked at one of the articles mentioned on the website you linked. It cites a scientist named Roy Spencer who has “developed a reputation for making serial mistakes that other scientists have been forced to uncover.”
http://www.dailyclimate.org/tdc-newsroom/2011/09/spencer-faulty-science
I have neither the time nor the inclination to vet the other papers, but if they’re willing to link to discredited researchers I have severe doubts that any of the other articles are up to snuff either.
A rule of thumb that helps me keep my faith:
If it’s cold it’s weather, if it’s warm it’s climate.
Richard, I am with Sarah on this. Spring, Summer, Fall, Winter like it has been for eons.
To borrow from The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, “DON’T PANIC!”
Glad these chicken little, Kool-Aid drinking, climate changers weren’t around during the little ice age a couple hundred years ago. They’d be sacrificing virgins to appease the weather gods. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/24/solar-lull-little-ice-age-sun-scientists_n_4645248.html
I read that the average temperature has increased about 1 degree in the last 100 years. My question is, how accurate were those thermometers 100 years ago? And where were they placed then versus where they are placed now. Any bets that they are in more urban, naturally warmer, settings now?
I read where everyone is concerned about the increase in average temperatures over the last 30 or so years. Temperatures have always fluctuated over time on this planet. Remember the ice ages? 25 years in the lifetime of this planet is NOTHING!