$2.3 billion for destroying an entire ecosystem wasn’t nearly enough. Wonder if the justices that overturned this one were the same ones appointed by our Oilman in Chief?
In Alaska, Riki Ott, a fisherman and scientist and longtime environmental activist in the Prince William Sound town of Cordova, where most of the area’s fishing fleet is concentrated, was disappointed by the ruling.
“We were really counting on punitive damages paying for our long-term losses in the fishery. That’s obviously not going to happen,” Ott said. “Well, that’s an affront to everyone’s sense of justice.”
-ummmm sounds to me like future losses should have been taken into account in the compensatory damages, not as a component of the punative damages.
Does that matter? The fact that the amount is a drop in the bucket to Exxon does not take away from the fact that the SCOTUS has the responsibility to apply the law equally across the board. Excessive punitive damages are excessive regardless of the defendants ability to pay.
Huge punitive awards are the primary reason we have seen such a exponential increase in litigation. Everyone wants to sue now over even the most trivial things (I’m not saying the Valdez spill was trivial) and lawyers are more than willing to oblige. Why? Because of the huge awards and the potential to hit the litigation lottery.
Our civil law system is like a runaway train and until there are major changes such as a “Loser pays all” type of system it is only going to get worse.
Too many people sue thinking they are hurting nobody but the big, bad corporations and insurance companies, and they can afford it right? Only a drop in the bucket after all. We all know the reality is that everyone, regardless of economic status, ends up paying more in the price of goods and services as well as higher premiums due to out of control litigation.
It would be nice if we could all work together to return our government to the people it is supposed to represent, following its seizure in the Cheney coup of 2000, assisted by Shell, BP, the Saudis, the Supreme Court (remember that part?) and the Bush family. Now I know what it is like to be treated like a citizen of a third world country by the big corporations, often allied with dictatorial governments. It would be nice to live in America again, instead of Big Oil’s Amerika.
You folks are really going to suffer withdrawals when Bush leaves office aren’t you? Think of it: 8 years of your life devoted to the hate and derision of one man and all that will end soon. Who will you turn your sights on then when we are still in Iraq, oil is still high priced and big business stays big and most likely gets bigger? You can only blame Bush for your unhappiness for so long before hopefully you realize that happiness comes from within and not out of a political party.
nah, we’ll still blame everything on Bush, kind of like the way the Clintons are still blamed for everything that happened during Bush’s term. “Sure, Bush did this, but CLINTON DID THAT!!!”
We (the) People (not “you people”) congratulate you on having drunk so deeply of the recent right wing kool aid. Now, drink just one more glass and we won’t have to disturb you in that cave int which you are already retreating.
Turn off your Fox News. Put the Bible (dusty as it really is in your case) in the other room. Stop listening to your politicized preacher now looking to trade in his Hummer. Get some real books and some real friends. Develop critical thinking skills!
Oh, heck, why bother. Just close your cave door. It smells bad anyway and we could all use some fresh air.
Or, better yet, go serve in Iraq or Afghanistan. As the sturdy Midwestern National Guardsmen recently said on a PBS report–“Our orders are to drive around until we get blown up.” Take one of their places, big guy. I’m sure they’d appreciate it.
“Exxon Mobil, BP, Shell and Total will apreciate it too. It’s all the same to them.”
These oil companies are proving to be the principal beneficiaries of the so-called war on terorism. More like a state-sponsored war on consumers for the ultra-rich. And the beauty part–guess what the beauty part is?–their kids don’t serve in the military…just ask Paris Hilton and her crowd.
What I like best about this blog is the almost unanamous opinion that money grows on trees and there really is such a thing as a Free Lunch and that THEY are out to get us! WE are THEY and WE will pay for it.
There is a free lunch when you control the most powerful (for now) government on earth. Free breaklast and dinner too! Wake up and smell the crude oil, man! It stinks to high heaven!
So, if someone has a Bible, reads it, loves the Lord, goes to church, that makes him/her a right winger that’s ruining the country and empowering Exxon? Is that the thrust of your pitiful connect the dots post?
Didn’t get the memo? Behind on your TPS forms again? Tsk, tsk.
Your Fox News-like attempt to polarize the debate (along the lines of the false choices offered over the years by Rove–with us or agin’ us; cut and run or hard on) is an old and discredited tactic. World opinion changed vs. the US years ago and now it is changing in the US. This is hardly news to non-right-wingers. The days of this simple-minded “paint the other side as extremists” approach are over.
Aint that what I’m doing here? Nah, I’m in the middle. You’ve just lost sight of where that is because you have gone too far to the right with the Cheney, Rove, Fox crowd.
Anyway, our boys for the oil companies’ record profits! Gung ho!
Let’s bring all these debates back to the killing reality for our families and neighbors in Iraq. Let’s remember that right wing extremism got us into there and we have to respond to right wing extremism in the correct way. Disempower it as soon as constitutionally possible!
In spite of all the distractions, including $4.50 oil: “It’s the war, stupid!”
BTW, with the Donks in the majority now for how long? I lost count after Nancy Pelosi’s “first 100 days” of change where not one single major Democrat sponsored piece of legislation was enacted. Where are the impeachment charges against Bush? you would think with all the “OVERWHELMING evidence” of his criminal conduct he’d have been long gone by now. And why are we still in Iraq? Weren’t the donks swept into power because they were going to get us out of Iraq quickly?
Amazing how Bush is supposed to be a stupid, inarticulate, alcoholic cocaine addict and yet he has managed to win the Presidency twice over the best the left had to offer and even with the Donks in control of both sides of the aisle they can’t seem to figure out how to defeat him. What does that say about the left?
Isn’t it interesting that the Bush blamers answer to their manufactured “oil crisis” is to punish the producers of the product? No other viable idea exists for them. Right wingers are just waiting to hear YOUR solution because until now your solution is “NO” to the solutions of the right. C’mon. Give it a shot and stop being so negative.
Hey Dick,
Why don’t you educate us on a couple? Surely MSNBC has supplied you with some.. You and the other two viewers should put your heads together and come up with something.
There are even solutions to the problem in Forbes magazine which is completely right wing. But like I say, you have to get your news from different sources, and you have to read the paper. It shouldn’t be my job to educate you.
I have an honest question. If Exxon makes a profit of 10 cents a gallon, even if the price sky rockets, their profit should still be 10 cents a gallon right?
The only way they should make more profit is by selling more gas, which they aren’t really doing.
Yet their profits have sky rocketed. So why cant they just take less profit in order to be good corporate citizens to the American people?
When the media talks about the price going up, they never say its because Exxon is taking more profit than they ever have in any companies history.
If Bush had been from Iowa, would the left be up in arms over the price of corn due to the alternative fuels initiatives where one of our basic staple crops is being used to make ethanol as opposed to corn meal? Bush would probably then be accused of lining the pockets of his corn cronies and of starving the poor people in Mexico since they can’t afford to buy their tortillas anymore.
Oh come on Dick. You brilliant people should educate us mislead and misguided individuals. Can’t you give us at least one of your great solutions? Other than putting a windmill on my car I haven’t heard of any from your side. Oh I forgot, I can also drive less.. that will fix the problem.
Did you actually read the article? Did you not pick up on the fact that the 2.5 billion was more than all of the other punitive damage awards affirmed on appeal? The reality is that our “justice” system is rigged for the those who can pay—the corporations. It took 19 yrs to get this decision–that is 19 yrs!. Exxon is laughing all of the way to the bank and then they plant this writer who blames it on the attorneys when only 1% of verdicts involve punitive damages. The Chamber of Commerce is on record this year indicating it will spend 100 million dollars to try and change the laws to favor Big Business. The public are willing saps as they vote their rights away and then get upset when something happens to them but they find the doors to the courthouse closed because of a change in the law they supported since “they never thought it could happen to me”. 100 million dollars can buy you a lot of propaganda. Big Business is smart and they are winning the battle as Exxon won this one. This Exxon result is the norm not the exception and until the American people wake up and start voting for politicians who will protect their interests instead of the interests of Corporate America, we will all wake up one day and realize the only ones that can afford to go to court and have laws on the books that allow them to go to court will be those businesses responsible for passing the laws that only protect their interests—this Exxon decision is just the tip of the iceberg if nayone cares to find out the truth behind the realities of our “justice system”.
Nice way to not answer a question, Dick. Is that your typical MO? Answer questions with Donk talking points spoon fed to you by Harry Reid and George Soros rather than approach the question with an intelligent answer?
“This Exxon result is the norm not the exception and until the American people wake up and start voting for politicians who will protect their interests instead of the interests of Corporate America”
Would be nice to have one who meets that criteria and has a snowballs chance in hell of winning to actualy vote for wouldn’t it? Of course then that person would have to be able to actually accomplish something once elected.
Dick – I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but libs such as yourself are hopeless. Exxon made ten cents on the dollar in 2007. I would venture to guess their profit margin in 2008 will be in the same neighborhood. This should not be considered excessive by any stretch of the imagination. The true windfall profit (defined as unexpected profit arising from causes not controlled by the recipient) is confiscated by the government in the form of a tax on gasoline sales on top of the corporate income tax confiscated from oil companies.
I have a suggestion for you, Dick. Stop whining about Bush and just vote for a fellow lib so we can all pay higher taxes, watch the government ruin our health care, reduce our military to patsy-like status, watch illegals pour across our border while footing the bill for them and further expand failed social programs. You can then look proudly upon and get a good laugh out of the shared misery we will all have to experience.
I’m sure you will have a counter to this post. Keep in mind, though, that I can easily script the old and tired lib response to matters such as these, so you don’t really have to bother. Maybe your time would be better spent picketing a gas station, building a windmill or paying homage to your Al Gore shrine.
I will not argue that Bush put together a good energy policy. No one has over the past 30 years. I want to know what your solutions are. What do you have to offer that will help out the lower income people that cannot afford to buy a Prius or a Smart Car? Maybe raising the gas tax will help them to realize that they should not be using gasoline. They should be putting solar panels on their roofs and installing windmills in their backyards… now that will help them get to work.
I can’t wait until the Dicks of the world drive dirty rotten “big business” into the ground. Then they’ll whine about lost jobs and CEOs’ golden parachutes. Drill offshore? NO! Drill in ANWR? NO! Build more refineries? NO! Peddle a bicycle for 30 minutes to toast a single slice of bread a la Ed Begley Jr.? Sounds like a great use for Nancy Pelosi’s time, doesn’t it? Just give us one idea that you would approve of, Dick–just one.
We need to discuss the verdict and not polictics BUT- We thought of running for president in my office. Ivan Boski would be sec’t of treasury, We had George Carlin as our drug Czar & homeland security, Don Imus as Press Sec’y,ADT as homeland security (got to love TYCO).
This makes about as much scense as everything that is going on.
This country needs some real leadership and whcih ever party has it regardless of them being blue or red we should for the most and best qualified candidate.
As insurance professionals we should try and keep on the topic at hand which is the court’s decision.
Bush lovers and ignorant conservatives, did you know the oil companies get subsidies from our government? They probably don’t tell you that on Fox news.
Remove the subsidies on the oil companies and the extra profit to the government would be used to reduce taxes on gas and thus the price of gas would go down.
There you go a hole, what can I help you with next?
Wow Dick, that was really good. You actualy were able to put a thought together.
Have you ever watched Fox News or have you been to busy blogging on the Daily Kos? If you ever get the chance you may see that differing opinions are presented. Of course that is not really what you “open minded” people want.
You need to pull your head out of your rear if you think the government is going to lower the gas tax as a result of the removal of oil subsidies.
All right! Got everybody upset and jawbonin’ and talkin’ some real issues. Fox Propaganda takin’ it in the shorts as they deserve! Beaten down centrists and lefties finally speakin’ their peace. You are the majority. Don’t be bullied by right wing chickenhawk, phony patriots any longer.
Let’s go out in November and git our gummint back from the corporate fat cats and their mouthpieces. Let’s git our money back from the big corporations–they stole it, alright, but not fair and square.
And don’t forget the war in Iraq (or the one we didn’t choose in Afghanistan). Stopping trading corporate profits for American lives! Become Americans.
I never did try to make a point in this little discussion. I simply asked the resident Dick if he would feel the same about Bush and his ties to the oil industry if Bush were from Iowa and tied to the corn industry instead. It’s easy to get upset with big oil and their subsidies, but what about big agriculture? In the left’s mad dash to become environmentally friendly they overlook the impact of using our food supply to create alternative fuels and the resultant rise in the cost of food that is created as a result. Let’s have clean air and starve the poor at the same time!
Dick – You can’t even look away from your script long enough to see that I made several points in my previous posts. You actually validated and reinforced my last point with your painfully predictable and pointless response. Maybe my expectations are a bit too high, but you really need to get some new material.
Republicans have had control of the House and Senate since 1994 right on through …what…November of 2007? Since Bush took the Presidency, what have they done to solve this country’s problems. I’ll give you Afghanistan.
Let me just inject this little tidbit: what did Bush swear to do to the constitution when he was elected? He does not respect any law, any statute, any ordinance or court ruling that he disagrees with….that’s why he issues signing statements. Remember the ruling that Gitmo detainees can challenge their detentions in court via Habeus Corpus? And what was his response…”well we don’t agree with that and we are looking into it to see how to respond, maybe with more legislation”. How’s that for protecting, enforcing and defending the law of the land? I cannot imagine how his approach to being chief executive, or how he politicized the Justice Department does not rise to the level of impeachable offense. These are the facts, he does as he pleases. Now one of you conservatives please tell me how he did not break the law in firing US Attorneys, or by not letting the Gitmo people get into federal court….tell me how the military commissions are not meant to be show trials but are founded on democratic, lawful principals and how his own Supreme Court doesn’t know better than the bushies. Tell me how, ala Reagan, we are better off now than we were 8 years ago. I am willing to listen and want to be convinced that I am not able to think clearly or for myself….
I’m no lawyer but it would seem to me that if Bush is such the blatant criminal that the left has made him out to be then he should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Why has this not happened? Why is it that despite the supposed overwhelming ewvidence pointing to numerous violations of the law and the constitution there has not been any concerted effort by the left to prosecute?
I believe Nancy Pelosi said impeachment would be off the table. Also, the whole Attorney firings investigation is ongoing and should prove quite interesting of an outcome.
First, about 4 months ago, it was reported on MSN AND FOX that the Exxon case couldn’t go to the Supreme Court because too many of them held stock. Not enough judges without conflicting interests. So now, 4 months later, several of them have ‘sold’ their stock, and the case can be heard. So, how much do you want to bet that the justices that cut the award will have their stock ready and waiting for them when the dust settles?
Let’s face it- based on income vs payment, the woman who dumped hot coffee in her lap got a bigger settlement then people who’s entire lives were ruined.
Second- Why do you think Bush only gave Scooter a ‘partial pardon’? He got the fine (which Cheney probably paid) and no jail time. BUT he still can’t testify against the bunch of them. 5th Amendment. In the event of a full pardon, he would have been hauled to the stand with full immunity and forced to testify.
Wait until the hearings with Scott McClellan are over. I was jumping for joy that FINALLY one of the Bush Buddies was going to be honest. Hopefully Rove will be dragged in and we’ll finally see some justice. I know, I do have too much hope, but a jail cell just sounds like such a fitting ending to Bush’s reign of terror.
It was also reported on MSN that Exxon, Shell, and a couple of foreign companies were going to sit down to discuss Iraq oil contracts. Still believe in the WMDs? How about the tooth fairy? It’s about the oil, guys. Since day 1, that’s ALL it was ever about. And no one can stop them. Our boys are dead, our country is on the verge of economic depression, and the ones behind it are going to get richer.
34 Articles of Impeachment, to be exact, and Pelosi had NO right to decide to stop it. Hopefully she sealed her on fate in the next election. As well as that idiot Hoyer.
Well the truth is the truth but it is difficult to access that truth when it is covered up by 100 million dollars worth of propaganda on a yearly basis. The propaganda machines of the Third Reich and Stalin’s Soviet Union pale in comparision to the propaganda machine currently maintained by the Chamber of Commerce and the Insurance Industry.
Since President Bush came to office, gas prices have more than doubled, the Big Oil companies have made more than half a trillion dollars in profits, and the United States is even more dependent on oil.
Stand up for the Consumer-First Energy Act, and help force oil companies to change their ways »
Senate Democrats have introduced a solution, the Consumer-First Energy Act of 2008, which includes rolling back tax breaks for oil companies and investing in renewable energy, forcing Big Oil to pay their fair share through a windfall profits tax, protecting consumers from price gouging, and standing up to OPEC – to make it clear that actions designed to fix oil prices are illegal under U.S. law.
But Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who has taken over $580,000 from the oil and gas industry, seems to have forgotten that he doesn’t work for Big Oil, as he and his Republican colleagues continue to block the Consumer-First Energy Act.
Apparently, Republicans need reminding that they should care about more than just Big Oil and their corporate lobbyists. Let Mitch McConnell and his Republican colleagues know you want them to hold Big Oil accountable for unconscionable price gouging »
Agree with what you say but please don’t further the propaganda of the McDonalds coffee burn case. McDonalds is no better than Exxon. 700 complaints that the coffee was excessively hot and exceeded industry standards that McDonalds intentionally ignored to make more profits even though they acknowledged some people would be maimed (which is why the jury hit them for only one day’s of coffee profits of 1 million in punitives). All she wanted was her med bills of 50k paid. They offered zero. 74 yr old with skin grafts and horrible pain after being scalded by 180 degree liquid. If you want even more horrendous details of that case (which you will never get from the Chamber of Commerce propoganda machine) pls got to thesmokinggun.com or snopes.com.
Wrinkled skin is one thing, having skin that used to be on your outer thigh grafted on to your inner thigh is a completely different thing. I hope Doug you or anyone that you are concerned about never have that experience.
I didn’t mean she didn’t deserve a settlement. I do know she suffered.
What I meant was that 1 day of profit to 1 person equals a HUGE settlement. A few days of profit for entire towns is another example of just how skewed the SC is to big business. They won’t get anything. I think the figure was mentioned to be around $2500 per FAMILY that lost everything because of Exxon.
It wasn’t that I disagreed with the Mcdonald’s case. It was that I felt the Exxon case was a joke to the SC. It was a way to save their friend’s profit margin.
With the logic being presented on this board, I hope all of your agencies are carrying, ummmm, $100 million in E & O limits. And just when does a business become BIG, deserving of the skewering y’all are proposing for BIG business in general? Eliot Spitzer is alive and well in all of you. I’m sure your mothers are all very proud. Now don’t make any mistakes or do something stupid–they could be coming after you next. And I don’t want to hear about how I’ve never been damaged by BIG business ’cause it just ain’t true. But I don’t give them a second chance and, amazingly, most them end up OUT of business. That’s revenge enough for me.
A judgement against McDonalds for $20K won’t make McDonald’s change any policies. McDonald’s has changed the temp that their coffee is served as a result of this settlement.
Same with Exxon. A few days profit isn’t worth any kind of procedural change to them. $500B would make them take a long look at what changes they could make to avoid any further damage.
If it’s cheaper to pay a few lawsuits then to change the procedure, NOTHING CHANGES. If it costs more to pay for damages then it does to fix the problem, THE PROBLEM GETS FIXED.
Thanks, Dawn, for answering a question I didn’t ask. Typical. And condescendingly so. Again, typical. I guess that makes you feel intelligent and isn’t “feeling” what it’s all about? Who cares if your ideas dry up our supply of oil, inhibit research and exploration as long as you “stick it” to BIG OIL because that’s just “Accounting 101”. Brilliant! Tell me, exactly how many Valdez type oil spills have we had since Exxon DESTROYED so many peoples’ lives?
WTF?
How would a few weeks of profit bring Exxon down?????? Dry up oil supply???? What are you drinking this Fri afternoon?
So the executives might not make their extra $10M bonuses this year. Oh well. Don’t think I’ll cry for that one. Why would it be a matter of sticking it to Big Oil to make them take responsibility for their actions?
It SHOULD be proportional to the amount of money they make when they sacrifice people for it. That is the ONLY way they’ll ever change how they do things.
Keep thinking what you’re thinking and watch the decline. Why do you think the stock market is going down? Keep punishing businesses and watch your 401k evaporate. Have fun!
It appears some very relevant issues are being overlooked due to an obvious and intense desire by some to really punish Exxon. Based on many of the posts, one could easily infer that Exxon was simply permitted to haul the Valdez away from the accident site and walk away with no responsibility.
I’m sure that many would cry foul or “liar, liar pants on fire” to the estimated $3.5B Exxon has expended as a result of the accident. We also cannot overlook the $507.5M deemed by the court to be the appropriate compensatory damages. These damages would include direct damages as well as short and long-term losses of those fisherman and other businesses adversely impacted by the accident. I cannot imagine a scenario in which the compensatory damages did not include every last penny of damage and lost business that could be legitimately tied to the accident. That is the way it should be and we really have no reason to believe otherwise.
We have to get past this apparent blind hatred of big business or capitalism, in general, and industries such as the oil industry, in particular. Lest we forget that there is always someone with less money than us who will always try to find a way to take it from us simply because we have more of it. We have to be careful about trying to dole out justice based solely on the size of someone’s wallet.
Your point is well made. I won’t deny I’m feeling a ‘wee bit angry’ at the oil industry these days. ;-)
On the other hand, there is the point that people with more money then us will take it away from us because they can.
But my feeling that the punishment has to be painful enough to promote change isn’t just for big business.
The only way to achieve change anywhere is to create a situation where it is easier or more profitable to abide by laws, correct safety issues, then it is to continue a current practice.
Take NY, for example. It was easier/cheaper to pay off the inspectors then it was to actually correct any issues with the cranes. As a result, people are dead. NOW, after lawsuits and criminal charges, companies will actually inspect and fix cranes.
Even in day to day life. Speeding tickets are an annoyance, but not enough of a deterrent to stop more and more people from joining the “100MPH club”. Raise the penalty by even $1500 and at least a few people will actually think twice before pushing that speedometer needle over that mark.
The law requiring auto insurance is one of the best examples around. The fine (at least in Fla) is less then the cost of the premium. So, what do you think most people do? Make the fine $5000 or forfeiture of the car and the numbers of uninsured motorists will go down. Oklahoma already takes the car and if the motorist didn’t have coverage at the time of the stop, the car belongs to the state. Good law. In the first few months the numbers of uninsured motorists dropped.
A possible fine of, say, $50,000 would stop us in our tracks on anything we might consider doing. A fine of $50,000 to someone that makes $10M a year would not stop them.
So there are definitely times when basing a penalty on the size of the wallet is in order.
I think it applies to anyone- NOT just big business. I really do believe, however, big business is guilty of putting profit above health/safety/welfare/environment because of the gains vs the possible cost if they are caught or if an accident occurs. They just talk in billions instead of hundreds. Same principle.
The amount of damages awarded in the initial judgement were equal to 1 year of profits at Exxon at the time of the verdict. Not one day as has been tossed about.
And EXXON has been sitting on that money for the last 19 years buying back stock, giving departing CEOS 400 million severance etc., etc. Only Big Business can buy 19 yrs of delays in paying on a debt. In the meantime the families that lost their livlihoods have been living on bunkas. It always amazes me the apologists for Corporate America NEVER take into account those who are harmed. Empathy is a feeling that is absent in their personna. Kind of sad actually.
Chris, I tend to think we would see an endless stream of truly sad stories of homeless fisherman if the Valdez incident resulted in such. If the fishing business was adversely impacted by the spill, then the fisherman would have received appropriate and just restitution in the form of compensatory damages.
There are laws and corporate oversight mechanisms in place to prevent Exxon from acting in an inappropriate manner as you suggest. The corporation is also held accountable by its stockholders and I would suspect that many of us are invested in Exxon via our mutual funds and retirement programs.
Exxon is a big, powerful company that serves the needs of the general public by providing for our energy needs and other very necessary goods and services. If they generate $400B in revenue and $40B in profit in the process, then bravo to them. I just don’t understand this vilification of profit when we all benefit from living in a free society and have ample opportunity to thrive in a capitalistic economy.
Bucky, you have been hoodwinked and you believe hook line and sinker what you have been told by the big corporations. Your view is juvenile and sheep like…
POLITICAL PEDDLING
The return ExxonMobil gets for the millions it spends on lobbyists and campaign contributions comes back in the billions. The industry as a whole receives up to $113 billion per year in direct federal subsidies, according to experts. (3)
Records filed with the Senate Public Records Office show that Exxon lobbyists focus most of their time on bills that address energy, global warming, environmental rules, and foreign policy. Targets of Exxon lobbyists are not just members of Congress, but nearly every agency as well. In 2005 alone, Exxon reported lobbying the State Department, White House, Environmental Protection Agency, Energy Department, Office of Management and Budget, Department of the Interior, and the Transportation Department.
The 2005 Energy Bill is a prime example of how political dollars translate into legislation. The Energy Bill, in effect until 2010, authorized $4 billion in federal subsidies to the oil and gas industry. Below are a few examples of handouts to Exxon.(4)
PERKS FOR EXXON FROM THE 2005 ENERGY BILL
Deepwater Drilling. ExxonMobil is the self-declared leader in deepwater oil and gas, which it claims will account for 20 percent or more of its production by 2010. The Energy Bill dolled out $1.5 billion in oil subsidies for ultra-deepwater activities.
Tax Royalty Relief. Oil companies supposedly pay a royalty to the government for the privilege of extracting resources off public land owned by all Americans. The Energy Bill dolled out billions worth of unnecessary “royalty relief” for ExxonMobil and other oil and gas companies. Ironically, Exxon has already settled several lawsuits for $52 million for not paying or underpaying royalties. In Alabama Exxon was found guilty of royalty fraud and fined $3.6 billion, which the company has appealed since 2000.
LNG: Liquefied Natural Gas permits. ExxonMobil plans to build at least two new liquefied natural gas (LNG) facilities in Texas. Yet, when ExxonMobil wanted to build a LNG facility in Alabama in 2003 it faced vociferous opposition from the locals who were concerned about potential health hazards and by Republican Governor Bob Riley. The Governor demanded that an independent safety assessment be done before the project went forward. A year later ExxonMobil canceled its plans. The 2005 Energy Bill changed the rules so that the state no longer has the right to determine the location of LNG facilities. Instead, location assessments will be done by federal agencies, which are typically more industry-friendly.
Public health laws. Laws under the Clean Water Act and the Clean Air Act used in the permitting of LNG facilities and natural gas pipelines were also weakened by the Bill. It is now vastly easier for ExxonMobil to get approval for its LNG facilities – despite legitimate objections from the state or local community.
WHY IT MATTERS
There is no denying that America needs a separation of oil and state. ExxonMobil’s backward policies on global warming and oil dependence make that separation even more urgent. The company’s policies are like an anchor holding America down from achieving a safer, cleaner energy future. ExxonMobil is the largest and most profitable private oil company in the world. Coupled with its spending on politicians and lobbying, it is also among the most influential.
Exxon’s policies on energy and environment make it a rogue company among its peers. ExxonMobil is the only major oil giant arguing that renewable energy is a bad investment, that global warming isn’t a real threat, and that U.S. energy independence is undesirable and impossible. These policies are among the greatest threats to the future of America’s national security and energy policy.
exxon’s profits
October 29, 2005
well, to put the high gas prices in perspective…exxon’s profits for the 3rd quarter of 2005(aka-last summer) were over $10 billion dollars, on total earnings of $100 billion dollars.
it was the first time in corporate history that a publicly held corporation had quarterly sales of over $100 billion dollars.
kind of disgusting, huh?
well, let’s look at another salient fact:
exxon were the 2nd largest campaign contributor to bush’s first presidential campaign(2nd only to enron…).
exxon in the last election gave 80% of their campaign contributions to republican candidates.
another salient fact:
exxon executives have participated in a few bush sponsored energy think-tanks, including the one that was involved, with dick cheney, in establishing u.s energy policy.
oh, did i mention that exxon received $2.6 billion in subsidies from the bush administration?
in other words: we as taxpayers gave exxon $2.6 billion so that they could go on to have record earnings and record profits.
these subsidies were a part of the energy bill that the oil industry helped write, along with dick cheney(who, surprise surprise, is the former ceo of halliburton, an energy company).
the bush ideology is so ****ing transparent: take money away from people and give it to corporations. tax the poor and subsidize rich corporations.
all of this other right-wing nonsense is just a smokescreen. the bush administration has one goal: funnel taxpayers money to the energy and defense industries.
i hope that the democrats are paying attention.
note to democrats: voters probably won’t be too happy when they find out that their tax money has subsidized oil companies who have been making record profits from grossly inflated gas prices.
Is it just me or does anyone else find it curious that when oil company haters talk about record profits it’s never expressed as a profit margin? How much have their margins increased over the years? Of course, their profit dollars have reached record levels. Many formerly third world countries are reporting record consumption of petroleum products. And to you, Moby, who would you propose as a knowledgable source to craft our national energy policy? Sean Penn? Alec Baldwin? Ed Begley Jr.? Hezbollah? I’d rather have a knowledgable energy professional than some boneheaded partisan but that’s just me. When we end up with “Univeral Health Care” should we exclude medical professionals’ advice from the mix, too?
Buckeye, it is not a vilification of profit but a vilification of profit over people. The news media does a terrible job in relaying the story of those impacted by the harm commited. We all read the paper of how so and so was paralyzed in an awful accident etc. The person injured and the family are impacted for the rest of their lives on a daily basis but as reader of the story we go on to the next story and forget about the misery that individual contines to suffer. That ongoing suffering never hits the papers because it won’t sell newspapers. In addition the media also likes all stories to have a happy, tidy ending. Businesses shd make profits but not at the expense of damaging others. And when they do damage others they need to step up and be responsible instead of doing everything in their power–like dragging out a case for 19 yrs–to make it right.
Moby, Chris & Killer – Thanks for the re-education offer, but I think I’m going to pass. I’m quite comfortable with my position based on reality and the facts.
Once again the customer gets the short end. The fine is what 2-3 days of Exxon’s sales.
They won’t even miss it
$2.3 billion for destroying an entire ecosystem wasn’t nearly enough. Wonder if the justices that overturned this one were the same ones appointed by our Oilman in Chief?
In Alaska, Riki Ott, a fisherman and scientist and longtime environmental activist in the Prince William Sound town of Cordova, where most of the area’s fishing fleet is concentrated, was disappointed by the ruling.
“We were really counting on punitive damages paying for our long-term losses in the fishery. That’s obviously not going to happen,” Ott said. “Well, that’s an affront to everyone’s sense of justice.”
-ummmm sounds to me like future losses should have been taken into account in the compensatory damages, not as a component of the punative damages.
Does that matter? The fact that the amount is a drop in the bucket to Exxon does not take away from the fact that the SCOTUS has the responsibility to apply the law equally across the board. Excessive punitive damages are excessive regardless of the defendants ability to pay.
Huge punitive awards are the primary reason we have seen such a exponential increase in litigation. Everyone wants to sue now over even the most trivial things (I’m not saying the Valdez spill was trivial) and lawyers are more than willing to oblige. Why? Because of the huge awards and the potential to hit the litigation lottery.
Our civil law system is like a runaway train and until there are major changes such as a “Loser pays all” type of system it is only going to get worse.
Too many people sue thinking they are hurting nobody but the big, bad corporations and insurance companies, and they can afford it right? Only a drop in the bucket after all. We all know the reality is that everyone, regardless of economic status, ends up paying more in the price of goods and services as well as higher premiums due to out of control litigation.
Go McCain!
Pollution pays!
More offshore drilling! Open ANWAR!
$5 gas! We love it! $6 gas! We love it!
It would be nice if we could all work together to return our government to the people it is supposed to represent, following its seizure in the Cheney coup of 2000, assisted by Shell, BP, the Saudis, the Supreme Court (remember that part?) and the Bush family. Now I know what it is like to be treated like a citizen of a third world country by the big corporations, often allied with dictatorial governments. It would be nice to live in America again, instead of Big Oil’s Amerika.
Imagine…
Well said DB.
You folks are really going to suffer withdrawals when Bush leaves office aren’t you? Think of it: 8 years of your life devoted to the hate and derision of one man and all that will end soon. Who will you turn your sights on then when we are still in Iraq, oil is still high priced and big business stays big and most likely gets bigger? You can only blame Bush for your unhappiness for so long before hopefully you realize that happiness comes from within and not out of a political party.
nah, we’ll still blame everything on Bush, kind of like the way the Clintons are still blamed for everything that happened during Bush’s term. “Sure, Bush did this, but CLINTON DID THAT!!!”
We (the) People (not “you people”) congratulate you on having drunk so deeply of the recent right wing kool aid. Now, drink just one more glass and we won’t have to disturb you in that cave int which you are already retreating.
Turn off your Fox News. Put the Bible (dusty as it really is in your case) in the other room. Stop listening to your politicized preacher now looking to trade in his Hummer. Get some real books and some real friends. Develop critical thinking skills!
Oh, heck, why bother. Just close your cave door. It smells bad anyway and we could all use some fresh air.
Or, better yet, go serve in Iraq or Afghanistan. As the sturdy Midwestern National Guardsmen recently said on a PBS report–“Our orders are to drive around until we get blown up.” Take one of their places, big guy. I’m sure they’d appreciate it.
I meant to add:
“Exxon Mobil, BP, Shell and Total will apreciate it too. It’s all the same to them.”
These oil companies are proving to be the principal beneficiaries of the so-called war on terorism. More like a state-sponsored war on consumers for the ultra-rich. And the beauty part–guess what the beauty part is?–their kids don’t serve in the military…just ask Paris Hilton and her crowd.
What I like best about this blog is the almost unanamous opinion that money grows on trees and there really is such a thing as a Free Lunch and that THEY are out to get us! WE are THEY and WE will pay for it.
There is a free lunch when you control the most powerful (for now) government on earth. Free breaklast and dinner too! Wake up and smell the crude oil, man! It stinks to high heaven!
You really need to get your news from more sources than the left-wing nut cases.
George Soros would be proud of you.
So, if someone has a Bible, reads it, loves the Lord, goes to church, that makes him/her a right winger that’s ruining the country and empowering Exxon? Is that the thrust of your pitiful connect the dots post?
Didn’t get the memo? Behind on your TPS forms again? Tsk, tsk.
Your Fox News-like attempt to polarize the debate (along the lines of the false choices offered over the years by Rove–with us or agin’ us; cut and run or hard on) is an old and discredited tactic. World opinion changed vs. the US years ago and now it is changing in the US. This is hardly news to non-right-wingers. The days of this simple-minded “paint the other side as extremists” approach are over.
Aint that what I’m doing here? Nah, I’m in the middle. You’ve just lost sight of where that is because you have gone too far to the right with the Cheney, Rove, Fox crowd.
Anyway, our boys for the oil companies’ record profits! Gung ho!
Let’s bring all these debates back to the killing reality for our families and neighbors in Iraq. Let’s remember that right wing extremism got us into there and we have to respond to right wing extremism in the correct way. Disempower it as soon as constitutionally possible!
In spite of all the distractions, including $4.50 oil: “It’s the war, stupid!”
LOL!!! I you accuse ME of drinking the kool aid??
BTW, with the Donks in the majority now for how long? I lost count after Nancy Pelosi’s “first 100 days” of change where not one single major Democrat sponsored piece of legislation was enacted. Where are the impeachment charges against Bush? you would think with all the “OVERWHELMING evidence” of his criminal conduct he’d have been long gone by now. And why are we still in Iraq? Weren’t the donks swept into power because they were going to get us out of Iraq quickly?
Amazing how Bush is supposed to be a stupid, inarticulate, alcoholic cocaine addict and yet he has managed to win the Presidency twice over the best the left had to offer and even with the Donks in control of both sides of the aisle they can’t seem to figure out how to defeat him. What does that say about the left?
Isn’t it interesting that the Bush blamers answer to their manufactured “oil crisis” is to punish the producers of the product? No other viable idea exists for them. Right wingers are just waiting to hear YOUR solution because until now your solution is “NO” to the solutions of the right. C’mon. Give it a shot and stop being so negative.
No oil man
This is an insurance forum not a political one. Take your politics to where they belong.
You cant separete this discussion from politics – Its imposible.
And Brook, there are many solutions, you would know what they are already if youd get your head out of Fox news and read a newspaper honey.
Hey Dick,
Why don’t you educate us on a couple? Surely MSNBC has supplied you with some.. You and the other two viewers should put your heads together and come up with something.
Good point, Dick, but learn how to spell.
There are even solutions to the problem in Forbes magazine which is completely right wing. But like I say, you have to get your news from different sources, and you have to read the paper. It shouldn’t be my job to educate you.
I have an honest question. If Exxon makes a profit of 10 cents a gallon, even if the price sky rockets, their profit should still be 10 cents a gallon right?
The only way they should make more profit is by selling more gas, which they aren’t really doing.
Yet their profits have sky rocketed. So why cant they just take less profit in order to be good corporate citizens to the American people?
When the media talks about the price going up, they never say its because Exxon is taking more profit than they ever have in any companies history.
If Bush had been from Iowa, would the left be up in arms over the price of corn due to the alternative fuels initiatives where one of our basic staple crops is being used to make ethanol as opposed to corn meal? Bush would probably then be accused of lining the pockets of his corn cronies and of starving the poor people in Mexico since they can’t afford to buy their tortillas anymore.
BDS, thats pointless, are you suggesting Bush hasnt given the oil companies favorable treatment? Are you blind?? Read the darn news, or zip it.
Oh come on Dick. You brilliant people should educate us mislead and misguided individuals. Can’t you give us at least one of your great solutions? Other than putting a windmill on my car I haven’t heard of any from your side. Oh I forgot, I can also drive less.. that will fix the problem.
Bush appointed former oil executives to write our energy policy when he got in office 8 years ago – was that a smart idea?
Did you actually read the article? Did you not pick up on the fact that the 2.5 billion was more than all of the other punitive damage awards affirmed on appeal? The reality is that our “justice” system is rigged for the those who can pay—the corporations. It took 19 yrs to get this decision–that is 19 yrs!. Exxon is laughing all of the way to the bank and then they plant this writer who blames it on the attorneys when only 1% of verdicts involve punitive damages. The Chamber of Commerce is on record this year indicating it will spend 100 million dollars to try and change the laws to favor Big Business. The public are willing saps as they vote their rights away and then get upset when something happens to them but they find the doors to the courthouse closed because of a change in the law they supported since “they never thought it could happen to me”. 100 million dollars can buy you a lot of propaganda. Big Business is smart and they are winning the battle as Exxon won this one. This Exxon result is the norm not the exception and until the American people wake up and start voting for politicians who will protect their interests instead of the interests of Corporate America, we will all wake up one day and realize the only ones that can afford to go to court and have laws on the books that allow them to go to court will be those businesses responsible for passing the laws that only protect their interests—this Exxon decision is just the tip of the iceberg if nayone cares to find out the truth behind the realities of our “justice system”.
Nice way to not answer a question, Dick. Is that your typical MO? Answer questions with Donk talking points spoon fed to you by Harry Reid and George Soros rather than approach the question with an intelligent answer?
BDS.
So you dont think that was part of the problem? What about destroying Iraqs infrastructure and ability to pump oil? Did that help?
“This Exxon result is the norm not the exception and until the American people wake up and start voting for politicians who will protect their interests instead of the interests of Corporate America”
Would be nice to have one who meets that criteria and has a snowballs chance in hell of winning to actualy vote for wouldn’t it? Of course then that person would have to be able to actually accomplish something once elected.
Dick – I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but libs such as yourself are hopeless. Exxon made ten cents on the dollar in 2007. I would venture to guess their profit margin in 2008 will be in the same neighborhood. This should not be considered excessive by any stretch of the imagination. The true windfall profit (defined as unexpected profit arising from causes not controlled by the recipient) is confiscated by the government in the form of a tax on gasoline sales on top of the corporate income tax confiscated from oil companies.
I have a suggestion for you, Dick. Stop whining about Bush and just vote for a fellow lib so we can all pay higher taxes, watch the government ruin our health care, reduce our military to patsy-like status, watch illegals pour across our border while footing the bill for them and further expand failed social programs. You can then look proudly upon and get a good laugh out of the shared misery we will all have to experience.
I’m sure you will have a counter to this post. Keep in mind, though, that I can easily script the old and tired lib response to matters such as these, so you don’t really have to bother. Maybe your time would be better spent picketing a gas station, building a windmill or paying homage to your Al Gore shrine.
Another non-answer. This time you managed to not answer a question by asking three questions in response.
You just can’t bring yourself to answer the question can you? :-D
It is really a simple question, Dick.
I will not argue that Bush put together a good energy policy. No one has over the past 30 years. I want to know what your solutions are. What do you have to offer that will help out the lower income people that cannot afford to buy a Prius or a Smart Car? Maybe raising the gas tax will help them to realize that they should not be using gasoline. They should be putting solar panels on their roofs and installing windmills in their backyards… now that will help them get to work.
Whoa, that was pretty original! I just heard Sean HanniCoulBaugh say the same thing!
I can’t wait until the Dicks of the world drive dirty rotten “big business” into the ground. Then they’ll whine about lost jobs and CEOs’ golden parachutes. Drill offshore? NO! Drill in ANWR? NO! Build more refineries? NO! Peddle a bicycle for 30 minutes to toast a single slice of bread a la Ed Begley Jr.? Sounds like a great use for Nancy Pelosi’s time, doesn’t it? Just give us one idea that you would approve of, Dick–just one.
Ease up Larry, that really hurt. Why don’t you chime in with your brilliant solutions. Oh, I know what the answer is… it’s time for change…
I got your change right here, baby! A quarter, a dime, a nickel and three pennies. There’s your change!!
there, there, Waiting. I’m actually a McCain supporter. I’m no fan of Obama at all. Shocking, ain’t it???
We need to discuss the verdict and not polictics BUT- We thought of running for president in my office. Ivan Boski would be sec’t of treasury, We had George Carlin as our drug Czar & homeland security, Don Imus as Press Sec’y,ADT as homeland security (got to love TYCO).
This makes about as much scense as everything that is going on.
This country needs some real leadership and whcih ever party has it regardless of them being blue or red we should for the most and best qualified candidate.
As insurance professionals we should try and keep on the topic at hand which is the court’s decision.
Bush lovers and ignorant conservatives, did you know the oil companies get subsidies from our government? They probably don’t tell you that on Fox news.
Remove the subsidies on the oil companies and the extra profit to the government would be used to reduce taxes on gas and thus the price of gas would go down.
There you go a hole, what can I help you with next?
Wow Dick, that was really good. You actualy were able to put a thought together.
Have you ever watched Fox News or have you been to busy blogging on the Daily Kos? If you ever get the chance you may see that differing opinions are presented. Of course that is not really what you “open minded” people want.
You need to pull your head out of your rear if you think the government is going to lower the gas tax as a result of the removal of oil subsidies.
Atta boy, Dick — right on cue and according to the script.
Yea, nice response, adding nothing, saying nothing, and refuting nothing.
“Yea, nice response, adding nothing, saying nothing, and refuting nothing.”
What’s the matter, Dick? You mad because someone is stealing your style of responding to a question?
Dick,
Were you aware that a lot of organizations get subsidies and funding from the government,some with which I’m sure you side.
I agree we should cut subsidies to all those feeding off the government. If you don’t agree, you’re a hypocrite.
Cutting subsidies and funding would save a lot of tax dollars. Unless, of course, you’re against fee market economies and are a conspiracy theorist.
From Publishers Weekly
Johnston, a New York Times investigative reporter, has spent his 40-year career exposing collusion between government officials and private sector entities as they enrich the rich and ignore consequences for middle-class laborers and the poor. In Perfectly Legal, he focused on hidden inequities in the tax system. This volume is a broader examination of collusion and unfairness, ranging from subsidies for professional sports stadiums to secret payouts to multinational corporate chief executives. At the base of Johnston’s journalistic indictment are the highly paid lobbyists working Congress, state legislatures, county commissions, city councils and government regulatory agencies. Johnston also cites the culpability of George W. Bush in his roles as professional baseball team owner, Texas governor and U.S. president, and targets well-known tycoons such as Donald Trump, Warren Buffett and George Steinbrenner as well as lesser-recognized beneficiaries who own golf courses and insurance companies and energy consortiums. Heroes appear occasionally, such as Remy Welling, an Internal Revenue Service investigator who blew the whistle on improper tax breaks for the wealthy and lost her job. Johnston writes compellingly to show how government-private sector collusion affects the middle class and the poor. (Jan.)
Copyright © Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.
Dear BDS,
You seem like a charming guy. Makes whatever your agenda is totally ineffective.
All right! Got everybody upset and jawbonin’ and talkin’ some real issues. Fox Propaganda takin’ it in the shorts as they deserve! Beaten down centrists and lefties finally speakin’ their peace. You are the majority. Don’t be bullied by right wing chickenhawk, phony patriots any longer.
Let’s go out in November and git our gummint back from the corporate fat cats and their mouthpieces. Let’s git our money back from the big corporations–they stole it, alright, but not fair and square.
And don’t forget the war in Iraq (or the one we didn’t choose in Afghanistan). Stopping trading corporate profits for American lives! Become Americans.
I never did try to make a point in this little discussion. I simply asked the resident Dick if he would feel the same about Bush and his ties to the oil industry if Bush were from Iowa and tied to the corn industry instead. It’s easy to get upset with big oil and their subsidies, but what about big agriculture? In the left’s mad dash to become environmentally friendly they overlook the impact of using our food supply to create alternative fuels and the resultant rise in the cost of food that is created as a result. Let’s have clean air and starve the poor at the same time!
Here is a good story for you all… Let’s go green and show the world how environmentally conscious the Donks are! http://online.wsj.com/public/article/SB121434145793701111.html?mod=blog
Dick – You can’t even look away from your script long enough to see that I made several points in my previous posts. You actually validated and reinforced my last point with your painfully predictable and pointless response. Maybe my expectations are a bit too high, but you really need to get some new material.
Hey Dick,
Republicans have had control of the House and Senate since 1994 right on through …what…November of 2007? Since Bush took the Presidency, what have they done to solve this country’s problems. I’ll give you Afghanistan.
Sorry Dick, that last post was meant to be directed at Waiting.
Let me just inject this little tidbit: what did Bush swear to do to the constitution when he was elected? He does not respect any law, any statute, any ordinance or court ruling that he disagrees with….that’s why he issues signing statements. Remember the ruling that Gitmo detainees can challenge their detentions in court via Habeus Corpus? And what was his response…”well we don’t agree with that and we are looking into it to see how to respond, maybe with more legislation”. How’s that for protecting, enforcing and defending the law of the land? I cannot imagine how his approach to being chief executive, or how he politicized the Justice Department does not rise to the level of impeachable offense. These are the facts, he does as he pleases. Now one of you conservatives please tell me how he did not break the law in firing US Attorneys, or by not letting the Gitmo people get into federal court….tell me how the military commissions are not meant to be show trials but are founded on democratic, lawful principals and how his own Supreme Court doesn’t know better than the bushies. Tell me how, ala Reagan, we are better off now than we were 8 years ago. I am willing to listen and want to be convinced that I am not able to think clearly or for myself….
Great post, Chris! You nailed it!
I’m no lawyer but it would seem to me that if Bush is such the blatant criminal that the left has made him out to be then he should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Why has this not happened? Why is it that despite the supposed overwhelming ewvidence pointing to numerous violations of the law and the constitution there has not been any concerted effort by the left to prosecute?
I believe Nancy Pelosi said impeachment would be off the table. Also, the whole Attorney firings investigation is ongoing and should prove quite interesting of an outcome.
First, about 4 months ago, it was reported on MSN AND FOX that the Exxon case couldn’t go to the Supreme Court because too many of them held stock. Not enough judges without conflicting interests. So now, 4 months later, several of them have ‘sold’ their stock, and the case can be heard. So, how much do you want to bet that the justices that cut the award will have their stock ready and waiting for them when the dust settles?
Let’s face it- based on income vs payment, the woman who dumped hot coffee in her lap got a bigger settlement then people who’s entire lives were ruined.
Second- Why do you think Bush only gave Scooter a ‘partial pardon’? He got the fine (which Cheney probably paid) and no jail time. BUT he still can’t testify against the bunch of them. 5th Amendment. In the event of a full pardon, he would have been hauled to the stand with full immunity and forced to testify.
Wait until the hearings with Scott McClellan are over. I was jumping for joy that FINALLY one of the Bush Buddies was going to be honest. Hopefully Rove will be dragged in and we’ll finally see some justice. I know, I do have too much hope, but a jail cell just sounds like such a fitting ending to Bush’s reign of terror.
It was also reported on MSN that Exxon, Shell, and a couple of foreign companies were going to sit down to discuss Iraq oil contracts. Still believe in the WMDs? How about the tooth fairy? It’s about the oil, guys. Since day 1, that’s ALL it was ever about. And no one can stop them. Our boys are dead, our country is on the verge of economic depression, and the ones behind it are going to get richer.
34 Articles of Impeachment, to be exact, and Pelosi had NO right to decide to stop it. Hopefully she sealed her on fate in the next election. As well as that idiot Hoyer.
Well the truth is the truth but it is difficult to access that truth when it is covered up by 100 million dollars worth of propaganda on a yearly basis. The propaganda machines of the Third Reich and Stalin’s Soviet Union pale in comparision to the propaganda machine currently maintained by the Chamber of Commerce and the Insurance Industry.
Since President Bush came to office, gas prices have more than doubled, the Big Oil companies have made more than half a trillion dollars in profits, and the United States is even more dependent on oil.
Stand up for the Consumer-First Energy Act, and help force oil companies to change their ways »
Senate Democrats have introduced a solution, the Consumer-First Energy Act of 2008, which includes rolling back tax breaks for oil companies and investing in renewable energy, forcing Big Oil to pay their fair share through a windfall profits tax, protecting consumers from price gouging, and standing up to OPEC – to make it clear that actions designed to fix oil prices are illegal under U.S. law.
But Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who has taken over $580,000 from the oil and gas industry, seems to have forgotten that he doesn’t work for Big Oil, as he and his Republican colleagues continue to block the Consumer-First Energy Act.
Apparently, Republicans need reminding that they should care about more than just Big Oil and their corporate lobbyists. Let Mitch McConnell and his Republican colleagues know you want them to hold Big Oil accountable for unconscionable price gouging »
Agree with what you say but please don’t further the propaganda of the McDonalds coffee burn case. McDonalds is no better than Exxon. 700 complaints that the coffee was excessively hot and exceeded industry standards that McDonalds intentionally ignored to make more profits even though they acknowledged some people would be maimed (which is why the jury hit them for only one day’s of coffee profits of 1 million in punitives). All she wanted was her med bills of 50k paid. They offered zero. 74 yr old with skin grafts and horrible pain after being scalded by 180 degree liquid. If you want even more horrendous details of that case (which you will never get from the Chamber of Commerce propoganda machine) pls got to thesmokinggun.com or snopes.com.
Yea but the fact that shes 74 should lead to a lower payment cause her skin is already wrinkled.
Wrinkled skin is one thing, having skin that used to be on your outer thigh grafted on to your inner thigh is a completely different thing. I hope Doug you or anyone that you are concerned about never have that experience.
I didn’t mean she didn’t deserve a settlement. I do know she suffered.
What I meant was that 1 day of profit to 1 person equals a HUGE settlement. A few days of profit for entire towns is another example of just how skewed the SC is to big business. They won’t get anything. I think the figure was mentioned to be around $2500 per FAMILY that lost everything because of Exxon.
It wasn’t that I disagreed with the Mcdonald’s case. It was that I felt the Exxon case was a joke to the SC. It was a way to save their friend’s profit margin.
With the logic being presented on this board, I hope all of your agencies are carrying, ummmm, $100 million in E & O limits. And just when does a business become BIG, deserving of the skewering y’all are proposing for BIG business in general? Eliot Spitzer is alive and well in all of you. I’m sure your mothers are all very proud. Now don’t make any mistakes or do something stupid–they could be coming after you next. And I don’t want to hear about how I’ve never been damaged by BIG business ’cause it just ain’t true. But I don’t give them a second chance and, amazingly, most them end up OUT of business. That’s revenge enough for me.
A judgement against McDonalds for $20K won’t make McDonald’s change any policies. McDonald’s has changed the temp that their coffee is served as a result of this settlement.
Same with Exxon. A few days profit isn’t worth any kind of procedural change to them. $500B would make them take a long look at what changes they could make to avoid any further damage.
If it’s cheaper to pay a few lawsuits then to change the procedure, NOTHING CHANGES. If it costs more to pay for damages then it does to fix the problem, THE PROBLEM GETS FIXED.
Accounting 101.
Thanks, Dawn, for answering a question I didn’t ask. Typical. And condescendingly so. Again, typical. I guess that makes you feel intelligent and isn’t “feeling” what it’s all about? Who cares if your ideas dry up our supply of oil, inhibit research and exploration as long as you “stick it” to BIG OIL because that’s just “Accounting 101”. Brilliant! Tell me, exactly how many Valdez type oil spills have we had since Exxon DESTROYED so many peoples’ lives?
Good job Dawn, you just blew Brook out of the water! Bam, its over Brook…go home for the weekend.
WTF?
How would a few weeks of profit bring Exxon down?????? Dry up oil supply???? What are you drinking this Fri afternoon?
So the executives might not make their extra $10M bonuses this year. Oh well. Don’t think I’ll cry for that one. Why would it be a matter of sticking it to Big Oil to make them take responsibility for their actions?
It SHOULD be proportional to the amount of money they make when they sacrifice people for it. That is the ONLY way they’ll ever change how they do things.
He’s either heavily invested in Exxon or sniffing the gas.
Keep thinking what you’re thinking and watch the decline. Why do you think the stock market is going down? Keep punishing businesses and watch your 401k evaporate. Have fun!
It appears some very relevant issues are being overlooked due to an obvious and intense desire by some to really punish Exxon. Based on many of the posts, one could easily infer that Exxon was simply permitted to haul the Valdez away from the accident site and walk away with no responsibility.
I’m sure that many would cry foul or “liar, liar pants on fire” to the estimated $3.5B Exxon has expended as a result of the accident. We also cannot overlook the $507.5M deemed by the court to be the appropriate compensatory damages. These damages would include direct damages as well as short and long-term losses of those fisherman and other businesses adversely impacted by the accident. I cannot imagine a scenario in which the compensatory damages did not include every last penny of damage and lost business that could be legitimately tied to the accident. That is the way it should be and we really have no reason to believe otherwise.
We have to get past this apparent blind hatred of big business or capitalism, in general, and industries such as the oil industry, in particular. Lest we forget that there is always someone with less money than us who will always try to find a way to take it from us simply because we have more of it. We have to be careful about trying to dole out justice based solely on the size of someone’s wallet.
How does it feel to be a corporate shill? You do their bidding while they sit back and reap the profits. You must feel really small right about now.
Your point is well made. I won’t deny I’m feeling a ‘wee bit angry’ at the oil industry these days. ;-)
On the other hand, there is the point that people with more money then us will take it away from us because they can.
But my feeling that the punishment has to be painful enough to promote change isn’t just for big business.
The only way to achieve change anywhere is to create a situation where it is easier or more profitable to abide by laws, correct safety issues, then it is to continue a current practice.
Take NY, for example. It was easier/cheaper to pay off the inspectors then it was to actually correct any issues with the cranes. As a result, people are dead. NOW, after lawsuits and criminal charges, companies will actually inspect and fix cranes.
Even in day to day life. Speeding tickets are an annoyance, but not enough of a deterrent to stop more and more people from joining the “100MPH club”. Raise the penalty by even $1500 and at least a few people will actually think twice before pushing that speedometer needle over that mark.
The law requiring auto insurance is one of the best examples around. The fine (at least in Fla) is less then the cost of the premium. So, what do you think most people do? Make the fine $5000 or forfeiture of the car and the numbers of uninsured motorists will go down. Oklahoma already takes the car and if the motorist didn’t have coverage at the time of the stop, the car belongs to the state. Good law. In the first few months the numbers of uninsured motorists dropped.
A possible fine of, say, $50,000 would stop us in our tracks on anything we might consider doing. A fine of $50,000 to someone that makes $10M a year would not stop them.
So there are definitely times when basing a penalty on the size of the wallet is in order.
I think it applies to anyone- NOT just big business. I really do believe, however, big business is guilty of putting profit above health/safety/welfare/environment because of the gains vs the possible cost if they are caught or if an accident occurs. They just talk in billions instead of hundreds. Same principle.
The amount of damages awarded in the initial judgement were equal to 1 year of profits at Exxon at the time of the verdict. Not one day as has been tossed about.
Yea now its one hour though.
And they spent more then they made in 2 years 25 years ago to fight it.
And EXXON has been sitting on that money for the last 19 years buying back stock, giving departing CEOS 400 million severance etc., etc. Only Big Business can buy 19 yrs of delays in paying on a debt. In the meantime the families that lost their livlihoods have been living on bunkas. It always amazes me the apologists for Corporate America NEVER take into account those who are harmed. Empathy is a feeling that is absent in their personna. Kind of sad actually.
Chris, I tend to think we would see an endless stream of truly sad stories of homeless fisherman if the Valdez incident resulted in such. If the fishing business was adversely impacted by the spill, then the fisherman would have received appropriate and just restitution in the form of compensatory damages.
There are laws and corporate oversight mechanisms in place to prevent Exxon from acting in an inappropriate manner as you suggest. The corporation is also held accountable by its stockholders and I would suspect that many of us are invested in Exxon via our mutual funds and retirement programs.
Exxon is a big, powerful company that serves the needs of the general public by providing for our energy needs and other very necessary goods and services. If they generate $400B in revenue and $40B in profit in the process, then bravo to them. I just don’t understand this vilification of profit when we all benefit from living in a free society and have ample opportunity to thrive in a capitalistic economy.
Dawn – I appreciate your thoughtful response, but think this is an area in which we simply need to respectfully agree to disagree.
Bucky, you have been hoodwinked and you believe hook line and sinker what you have been told by the big corporations. Your view is juvenile and sheep like…
POLITICAL PEDDLING
The return ExxonMobil gets for the millions it spends on lobbyists and campaign contributions comes back in the billions. The industry as a whole receives up to $113 billion per year in direct federal subsidies, according to experts. (3)
Records filed with the Senate Public Records Office show that Exxon lobbyists focus most of their time on bills that address energy, global warming, environmental rules, and foreign policy. Targets of Exxon lobbyists are not just members of Congress, but nearly every agency as well. In 2005 alone, Exxon reported lobbying the State Department, White House, Environmental Protection Agency, Energy Department, Office of Management and Budget, Department of the Interior, and the Transportation Department.
The 2005 Energy Bill is a prime example of how political dollars translate into legislation. The Energy Bill, in effect until 2010, authorized $4 billion in federal subsidies to the oil and gas industry. Below are a few examples of handouts to Exxon.(4)
PERKS FOR EXXON FROM THE 2005 ENERGY BILL
Deepwater Drilling. ExxonMobil is the self-declared leader in deepwater oil and gas, which it claims will account for 20 percent or more of its production by 2010. The Energy Bill dolled out $1.5 billion in oil subsidies for ultra-deepwater activities.
Tax Royalty Relief. Oil companies supposedly pay a royalty to the government for the privilege of extracting resources off public land owned by all Americans. The Energy Bill dolled out billions worth of unnecessary “royalty relief” for ExxonMobil and other oil and gas companies. Ironically, Exxon has already settled several lawsuits for $52 million for not paying or underpaying royalties. In Alabama Exxon was found guilty of royalty fraud and fined $3.6 billion, which the company has appealed since 2000.
LNG: Liquefied Natural Gas permits. ExxonMobil plans to build at least two new liquefied natural gas (LNG) facilities in Texas. Yet, when ExxonMobil wanted to build a LNG facility in Alabama in 2003 it faced vociferous opposition from the locals who were concerned about potential health hazards and by Republican Governor Bob Riley. The Governor demanded that an independent safety assessment be done before the project went forward. A year later ExxonMobil canceled its plans. The 2005 Energy Bill changed the rules so that the state no longer has the right to determine the location of LNG facilities. Instead, location assessments will be done by federal agencies, which are typically more industry-friendly.
Public health laws. Laws under the Clean Water Act and the Clean Air Act used in the permitting of LNG facilities and natural gas pipelines were also weakened by the Bill. It is now vastly easier for ExxonMobil to get approval for its LNG facilities – despite legitimate objections from the state or local community.
WHY IT MATTERS
There is no denying that America needs a separation of oil and state. ExxonMobil’s backward policies on global warming and oil dependence make that separation even more urgent. The company’s policies are like an anchor holding America down from achieving a safer, cleaner energy future. ExxonMobil is the largest and most profitable private oil company in the world. Coupled with its spending on politicians and lobbying, it is also among the most influential.
Exxon’s policies on energy and environment make it a rogue company among its peers. ExxonMobil is the only major oil giant arguing that renewable energy is a bad investment, that global warming isn’t a real threat, and that U.S. energy independence is undesirable and impossible. These policies are among the greatest threats to the future of America’s national security and energy policy.
exxon’s profits
October 29, 2005
well, to put the high gas prices in perspective…exxon’s profits for the 3rd quarter of 2005(aka-last summer) were over $10 billion dollars, on total earnings of $100 billion dollars.
it was the first time in corporate history that a publicly held corporation had quarterly sales of over $100 billion dollars.
kind of disgusting, huh?
well, let’s look at another salient fact:
exxon were the 2nd largest campaign contributor to bush’s first presidential campaign(2nd only to enron…).
exxon in the last election gave 80% of their campaign contributions to republican candidates.
another salient fact:
exxon executives have participated in a few bush sponsored energy think-tanks, including the one that was involved, with dick cheney, in establishing u.s energy policy.
oh, did i mention that exxon received $2.6 billion in subsidies from the bush administration?
in other words: we as taxpayers gave exxon $2.6 billion so that they could go on to have record earnings and record profits.
these subsidies were a part of the energy bill that the oil industry helped write, along with dick cheney(who, surprise surprise, is the former ceo of halliburton, an energy company).
the bush ideology is so ****ing transparent: take money away from people and give it to corporations. tax the poor and subsidize rich corporations.
all of this other right-wing nonsense is just a smokescreen. the bush administration has one goal: funnel taxpayers money to the energy and defense industries.
i hope that the democrats are paying attention.
note to democrats: voters probably won’t be too happy when they find out that their tax money has subsidized oil companies who have been making record profits from grossly inflated gas prices.
-moby
Is it just me or does anyone else find it curious that when oil company haters talk about record profits it’s never expressed as a profit margin? How much have their margins increased over the years? Of course, their profit dollars have reached record levels. Many formerly third world countries are reporting record consumption of petroleum products. And to you, Moby, who would you propose as a knowledgable source to craft our national energy policy? Sean Penn? Alec Baldwin? Ed Begley Jr.? Hezbollah? I’d rather have a knowledgable energy professional than some boneheaded partisan but that’s just me. When we end up with “Univeral Health Care” should we exclude medical professionals’ advice from the mix, too?
Buckeye, it is not a vilification of profit but a vilification of profit over people. The news media does a terrible job in relaying the story of those impacted by the harm commited. We all read the paper of how so and so was paralyzed in an awful accident etc. The person injured and the family are impacted for the rest of their lives on a daily basis but as reader of the story we go on to the next story and forget about the misery that individual contines to suffer. That ongoing suffering never hits the papers because it won’t sell newspapers. In addition the media also likes all stories to have a happy, tidy ending. Businesses shd make profits but not at the expense of damaging others. And when they do damage others they need to step up and be responsible instead of doing everything in their power–like dragging out a case for 19 yrs–to make it right.
Moby, Chris & Killer – Thanks for the re-education offer, but I think I’m going to pass. I’m quite comfortable with my position based on reality and the facts.