This appears to me to be a half baked idea providing slight coverage enhancement but still leaving homeowner vulnerable to significant loss when renting out their home.
Eric, half baked is a very good description. What if the Homeowner rented out one of their cars to the tenants while they were away? That opens up a whole new can of worms.
Do you really think the average Allstate insured knows that they shouldn’t rent their auto to someone else living in their home? They don’t even read their policies and fall back on the “they told me I had full coverage” excuse.
So now it is half baked because they might rent their car too, and then not know about their auto coverage? Why does every story with you immediately veer off into a contrived scenario where everybody is somehow dumber than you? You don’t even know about these products. They are very rarely people renting their primary home while they are away, they are people renting second homes, condos, mother in law apartments, duplexes, etc they own but don’t live in. Few, if any are renting their cars, and if they do it’s in no way tied to their home renting business.
Most of these people are running small side businesses. They can purchase insurance for that if they want more than this, but offering cheap options for a little extra coverage for your belongings is not half baked.
May 26, 2016 at 12:18 am
Mark says:
Like or Dislike:
7
2
Here we go again with your goofy remarks, Agent. You’re obviously and clearly not familiar with how AirBNB works. UW is spot on here.
May 26, 2016 at 8:14 am
confused says:
Like or Dislike:
6
1
so you move the goalpost and now say the can of worms is, what, insured’s not knowing all the exclusions in their policy? that happens all the time on homeowner claims. there is no ‘can of worms’ there, it’s just the insured filing a claim for an excluded loss and the insurer denying it. happens all the time. people file auto hail claims without comprehensive coverage and those get denied, as do flood claims on a standard home policy. same thing with renting the car – it’s just a claim denial, not a ‘can of worms’ you’re incorrectly making it out to be.
May 25, 2016 at 4:59 pm
Einstein says:
Like or Dislike:
3
2
If I was an Allstate insured I wouldn’t about it since I would be in good hands.
ERIC, I happen to insure several investors that buy houses for rental. You know what, a lot of the renters trash houses because it isn’t their property. The owner has to come in and renovate, replace flooring, repair walls, re-paint to make them good enough to rent out again. I wonder if Allstate will pay these owners for renovation costs if damage is done. NOT!
They should have taken pictures before the renter moved in and had the renter sign a form agreeing to the condition of the unit at that time. Then if the renter moves out and the damage exceeds normal wear and tear, the owner can sue the renter for said damages within 30 days of the renter moving out.
This is owner/renter 101 stuff right here. Just tell your investor friends “Take pictures before the renters move in! Have the renters sign a form agreeing there’s no damage before they move in! Take pictures after the renter moves out!” Do that, and they’ll never have to foot the bill for excessive damage due to a prior renter’s negligence ever again! Easy-peasy owner-easy!
In a perfect world Rosenblatt! It isn’t and property owners often cannot collect anything from renters who were renting because they can’t afford to buy a house. The only answer might be to collect a big deposit and first and last which might defray expenses of repair after the house is damaged. Try getting that up front with people that don’t have money to start with.
1) run the risk of renters trashing their homes and not being able to seek damages, or
2) only rent to those who can afford first, last & security and are willing to sign an attestation on the condition of the home.
It’s really not that hard.
Either they do their due diligence on the renter(s) to protect their investments or they take the risk of someone trashing the place and trying to get blood from a stone.
May 27, 2016 at 11:09 am
UW says:
Like or Dislike:
3
2
That’s still not what home sharing is in the context of this story. They are owners of an investment property and should have insurance for that type of business. It’s astounding a person like you who knows nothing about anything advises anybody on anything.
No need to read an article on this, just keep making comments instead. Try again, take 3!
Devastating rebuttal, from the guy making post after post showing he doesn’t know what home sharing is in the context of the story, doesn’t believe in science, statistics, probability, or even seem to understand what insurance is at the most basic level.
The astonishing thing with you is how in almost every story you make comments showing your ignorance about basic topics crucial to insurance, along with everything else. You cannot rail against probability and using actuarial methods and then claim to be knowledgeable about insurance.
May 25, 2016 at 2:13 pm
TX Agent says:
Like or Dislike:
6
0
1) Better than nothing
2) Best way to exclude something is to include and put a small sub-limit to cover (ie: Mold).
I agree with half baked too. I am one of those people that rents a second home in VT through VRBO/HomeAway. I had to obtain a very robust and expensive E&S policy to protect me. Allstate’s coverage seems a bit superficial at best.
It wasn’t designed for a second home more than 50% of the time. It’s for people who rent their PRIMARY home every once in a while. There are a lot of people on AirBNB who went a room out for extra money, not entire houses.
I agree with half baked. Since a policy that covers a homeowner renting out their home on an occasional basis is pretty pricey, Allstate offering this coverage is probably pretty minimal at best. Of course, it’s gonna sound good to some, but I have my doubts about what is actually covered. I see it’s not offered in CA, where I don’t think Allstate even writes their own policies anymore. So, if they’re not willing to take the risk of insuring a “normal” homeowner, why do this? The logic of all this escapes me.
Allstate is seeing the current situation and the future of the business, 20 people living in the same space sharing everything from toothpaste to car and so forth.
Good one jay. Yes, we have seen a lot of the Hispanic crowd in Texas sharing homes. They have up to 20 people living in these little shacks, have one legal to buy the place and then he brings in all his illegal relatives to live there. They share their clunkers as well and most of them don’t have insurance on the vehicles. Pity the poor innocent driver who gets hit by them. I have had some of my customers suffer that fate. U/M all the way and nothing to subrogate for.
Sounds like intentional material misrepresentation to me. I’m surprised those policies were ever enacted, and even more surprised carrier’s aren’t cancelling those policies after doing a very basic SIU investigation.
FYI – Medical Payments and Uninsured Motorist coverage can always be subrogated in TX and PIP can only be subrogated if the other vehicle is uninsured.
You say “nothing to subrogate for” and I say “every kind of medical payment a carrier makes for their insured resulting from an uninsured/underinsured motorist can be subrogated.”
Rosenblatt, ever heard of Excess/Surplus lines policies writing pier and beam 60 year old houses bought by someone with the purpose of hiding illegal aliens? It goes on all the time and very little inspection goes on with these markets. FYI- Subrogation can be tried, but when the perps scatter to the winds, they can’t even find them, let alone subrogate against them. If they were lucky enough to find one, what could they possibly get from them. No bank accounts, no money and no luck. You seriously need to wake up and smell the coffee.
Well, if “it goes on all the time” as you claim, there’s EVEN MORE reason for the carrier to do their due diligence prior to writing the policy!
Ever heard of a carrier sending a home inspector to inspect the requested insured property to ensure it’s (a) the right piece of land, (b) insured to value and (c) no material misrepresentation took place?
May 27, 2016 at 2:00 pm
Captain Planet says:
Like or Dislike:
0
2
Yes, Agent, those pesky brown people. If you and Trump get your way, we can go back to the good ol’ days when discrimination ran rampant.
Say, a gay Mexican Muslim couple (US citizens) walks into your shop and wants to buy a homeowner’s policy. What do you do, Agent? What do you do?
May 28, 2016 at 12:29 am
Captain Planet says:
Like or Dislike:
1
2
Hey, there is no way anyone is going to say Agent is an advocate for violence. But, Trump is. And, Agent supports Trump. Trump’s America will kill the country, and that’s violence. So…
“Traditional homeowners policies do not cover the risks of owners renting out their properties on a temporary basis. The new endorsement is named HostAdvantage”
Does anyone at Insurance Journal actually read a policy before they write this stuff? Both ISO and Allstate do not exclude coverage when the dwelling is occasionally rented to others.
This appears to me to be a half baked idea providing slight coverage enhancement but still leaving homeowner vulnerable to significant loss when renting out their home.
Eric, half baked is a very good description. What if the Homeowner rented out one of their cars to the tenants while they were away? That opens up a whole new can of worms.
since renting out a car is specifically excluded in the generic iso auto policy, there is no “can of worms” to concern yourself with.
Do you really think the average Allstate insured knows that they shouldn’t rent their auto to someone else living in their home? They don’t even read their policies and fall back on the “they told me I had full coverage” excuse.
So now it is half baked because they might rent their car too, and then not know about their auto coverage? Why does every story with you immediately veer off into a contrived scenario where everybody is somehow dumber than you? You don’t even know about these products. They are very rarely people renting their primary home while they are away, they are people renting second homes, condos, mother in law apartments, duplexes, etc they own but don’t live in. Few, if any are renting their cars, and if they do it’s in no way tied to their home renting business.
Most of these people are running small side businesses. They can purchase insurance for that if they want more than this, but offering cheap options for a little extra coverage for your belongings is not half baked.
Here we go again with your goofy remarks, Agent. You’re obviously and clearly not familiar with how AirBNB works. UW is spot on here.
so you move the goalpost and now say the can of worms is, what, insured’s not knowing all the exclusions in their policy? that happens all the time on homeowner claims. there is no ‘can of worms’ there, it’s just the insured filing a claim for an excluded loss and the insurer denying it. happens all the time. people file auto hail claims without comprehensive coverage and those get denied, as do flood claims on a standard home policy. same thing with renting the car – it’s just a claim denial, not a ‘can of worms’ you’re incorrectly making it out to be.
If I was an Allstate insured I wouldn’t about it since I would be in good hands.
ERIC, I happen to insure several investors that buy houses for rental. You know what, a lot of the renters trash houses because it isn’t their property. The owner has to come in and renovate, replace flooring, repair walls, re-paint to make them good enough to rent out again. I wonder if Allstate will pay these owners for renovation costs if damage is done. NOT!
In that case, blame rests with the investors.
They should have taken pictures before the renter moved in and had the renter sign a form agreeing to the condition of the unit at that time. Then if the renter moves out and the damage exceeds normal wear and tear, the owner can sue the renter for said damages within 30 days of the renter moving out.
This is owner/renter 101 stuff right here. Just tell your investor friends “Take pictures before the renters move in! Have the renters sign a form agreeing there’s no damage before they move in! Take pictures after the renter moves out!” Do that, and they’ll never have to foot the bill for excessive damage due to a prior renter’s negligence ever again! Easy-peasy owner-easy!
In a perfect world Rosenblatt! It isn’t and property owners often cannot collect anything from renters who were renting because they can’t afford to buy a house. The only answer might be to collect a big deposit and first and last which might defray expenses of repair after the house is damaged. Try getting that up front with people that don’t have money to start with.
Well Agent, your investors then have two options:
1) run the risk of renters trashing their homes and not being able to seek damages, or
2) only rent to those who can afford first, last & security and are willing to sign an attestation on the condition of the home.
It’s really not that hard.
Either they do their due diligence on the renter(s) to protect their investments or they take the risk of someone trashing the place and trying to get blood from a stone.
That’s still not what home sharing is in the context of this story. They are owners of an investment property and should have insurance for that type of business. It’s astounding a person like you who knows nothing about anything advises anybody on anything.
No need to read an article on this, just keep making comments instead. Try again, take 3!
It’s much more astonishing that you have a job in the insurance industry. Just sayin…
Devastating rebuttal, from the guy making post after post showing he doesn’t know what home sharing is in the context of the story, doesn’t believe in science, statistics, probability, or even seem to understand what insurance is at the most basic level.
The astonishing thing with you is how in almost every story you make comments showing your ignorance about basic topics crucial to insurance, along with everything else. You cannot rail against probability and using actuarial methods and then claim to be knowledgeable about insurance.
1) Better than nothing
2) Best way to exclude something is to include and put a small sub-limit to cover (ie: Mold).
I agree with half baked too. I am one of those people that rents a second home in VT through VRBO/HomeAway. I had to obtain a very robust and expensive E&S policy to protect me. Allstate’s coverage seems a bit superficial at best.
It wasn’t designed for a second home more than 50% of the time. It’s for people who rent their PRIMARY home every once in a while. There are a lot of people on AirBNB who went a room out for extra money, not entire houses.
I agree with half baked. Since a policy that covers a homeowner renting out their home on an occasional basis is pretty pricey, Allstate offering this coverage is probably pretty minimal at best. Of course, it’s gonna sound good to some, but I have my doubts about what is actually covered. I see it’s not offered in CA, where I don’t think Allstate even writes their own policies anymore. So, if they’re not willing to take the risk of insuring a “normal” homeowner, why do this? The logic of all this escapes me.
Allstate writes homes through North Light Specialty in California and already offers policies for both short term and long term rentals there.
Allstate is seeing the current situation and the future of the business, 20 people living in the same space sharing everything from toothpaste to car and so forth.
Good one jay. Yes, we have seen a lot of the Hispanic crowd in Texas sharing homes. They have up to 20 people living in these little shacks, have one legal to buy the place and then he brings in all his illegal relatives to live there. They share their clunkers as well and most of them don’t have insurance on the vehicles. Pity the poor innocent driver who gets hit by them. I have had some of my customers suffer that fate. U/M all the way and nothing to subrogate for.
Sounds like intentional material misrepresentation to me. I’m surprised those policies were ever enacted, and even more surprised carrier’s aren’t cancelling those policies after doing a very basic SIU investigation.
FYI – Medical Payments and Uninsured Motorist coverage can always be subrogated in TX and PIP can only be subrogated if the other vehicle is uninsured.
You say “nothing to subrogate for” and I say “every kind of medical payment a carrier makes for their insured resulting from an uninsured/underinsured motorist can be subrogated.”
Rosenblatt, ever heard of Excess/Surplus lines policies writing pier and beam 60 year old houses bought by someone with the purpose of hiding illegal aliens? It goes on all the time and very little inspection goes on with these markets. FYI- Subrogation can be tried, but when the perps scatter to the winds, they can’t even find them, let alone subrogate against them. If they were lucky enough to find one, what could they possibly get from them. No bank accounts, no money and no luck. You seriously need to wake up and smell the coffee.
Well, if “it goes on all the time” as you claim, there’s EVEN MORE reason for the carrier to do their due diligence prior to writing the policy!
Ever heard of a carrier sending a home inspector to inspect the requested insured property to ensure it’s (a) the right piece of land, (b) insured to value and (c) no material misrepresentation took place?
Yes, Agent, those pesky brown people. If you and Trump get your way, we can go back to the good ol’ days when discrimination ran rampant.
Say, a gay Mexican Muslim couple (US citizens) walks into your shop and wants to buy a homeowner’s policy. What do you do, Agent? What do you do?
Hey, there is no way anyone is going to say Agent is an advocate for violence. But, Trump is. And, Agent supports Trump. Trump’s America will kill the country, and that’s violence. So…
http://www.nytimes.com/video/us/politics/100000004268217/trump-reacts-to-security-scare-at-rally.html
“Traditional homeowners policies do not cover the risks of owners renting out their properties on a temporary basis. The new endorsement is named HostAdvantage”
Does anyone at Insurance Journal actually read a policy before they write this stuff? Both ISO and Allstate do not exclude coverage when the dwelling is occasionally rented to others.
Shouldn’t this be called “all hands” coverage? Get it?
Good one knowall. Perhaps a new ad campaign should be started on the “All Hands” concept.