In CT the most dangerious place to be is between Blumenthal and a camera.
I agree that the contingent commissions paid to the \”big crooks\” put a damper on the way we are compensated. Let\’s go back to the old days when we were rewarded with a \”profit sharing check\’ for the profitable business we produced. Let\’s also thank our self serving associations that did nothing to help us by not renewing our memberships. Goodbye PIA and big I.
…..to see if any/all the dollars St Paul budgets for contingent payout finds its way to the \”new\” commission schedule. IF in fact a new schedule of commissions is produced.
As a former field man for the old St Paul, I spent more than a little time, personally delivering new commission schedules in December for use in the coming year. Never saw one with an increase in compensation.
Having spoken with current St Paul agents who were involved with a Jay-teleconference call related to StP\’s plans…I think ol\’ Jay is sitting in his suite at 385 Washington with a big \’ol smile on his face.
I own a large personal lines agency and most with Travelers. If they do not bump up the standard commission to make up for our loss on profit sharing, I don\’t think \”ol\’ Jay\” will have a big \’ol smile on his face after our Travelers business goes elsewhere.
My profit in personal lines came from contingent commission\’s. Without it, I can no longer market this product. Way to go Eliot! Your ignorance of our business will reduce competition and provide less choices for the consumer.
i have been an independant agent for many years. why in the world do we allow this to happen to us? i wish a group of agents would rise up and figure out how to beat these companies at their own game……..
Better yet, why doesn\’t our association do it? That is precisely what I AM PAYING THEM FOR, not the issues they usually choose to take on.
Want to impact a company\’s bottom line – just PULL YOUR BUSINESS! Don\’t think about, worry about it, etc. By contract, we own the renewals!
JUST DO IT!
I am aware that the agents associations have attempted to do something, but I believe they have failed miserably. My business is commercial and will not go to travelers/st. paul.
but can you guys remember when they were good companies.
the fraud and abuse done by the companies and the large brokers are causing us great difficulty.
We smaller agencies are truly powerless and at the mercy of the large carriers and the marketplace. The 65% \”tipping\” point includes direct writers and heavy advertisers like Geico and Prog. Direct – I guess they can continue to \”waste\” their consumer\’s premium dollars on TV ads while the agency carriers get to screw their professional sales agents who have built up relationships with customers for many years, and who look out for those consumers unlike the direct writers!
Certainly NOT Eliot Spitzer. I cannot imagine a worse choice for a horrible job. It is amazing to think that people are talking about his potential candidacy down the pike as if he is some golden haired prince.
Guiliani can at least say that he fought organized crime in NY. Agents and brokers aren\’t organized enough to even protect reputable incomes against the likes of Spitzie and Bloomingthal.
Shame on us for not being lean and mean enough to survive on standard commissions.
I\’m 85% commercial. The national carriers are the problem……..dump ’em.
Our association\’s efforts are mis-directed. The national (and large regional) companies are more our enemy than
the politicians. Both in the way they treat us as their supposed ‘preferred distribution channel\’ and in the way they compensate us for OUR business. At the same time they call us PARTNERS. Hilarious isn\’t it? They\’ve pushed most of the menial work down to our staffs (as they lay off their own), cut our pay, management LINES their pockets and they get in bed with the large brokers who couldn\’t spell integrity much less live up to the spirit of the word.
Yes, insurance companies used to be much different animals, run by insurance people who made decisions based on long term thinking – not the bean counters and ‘next quarter\’ thinkers of today.
KICK \’EM OUT OF YOUR OFFICE! Do business with any honorable regional carrier that you can find – for YOUR and YOUR CUSTOMERS\’ sake.
Only then, and only MAYBE then, will they ‘get it\’!
I don\’t understand how removing contingent commissions will remove the temptation to write policies with a certain company. If bad for the insured, more expensive company is offering 25% commission and good for the insured, but not the agent, company is offering 5% commission, isn\’t there incentive for the agent to steer the business towards that 25% commission? No contingency needed.
Not all agents will direct all of their customers to that 25% commission product, but there is definitely incentive to do so.
That is NOT a dumb question!! You are exactly right that compensation steers business no matter its name. My question for companies like the big T is this: are you going to have a single, fixed commission for all agents: regardless of size/growth/retention/profitability/ETC?? If the answer is yes…then you can count on me to send my business to companies that will reward me for results that are better than my competitors. Does anyone out there agree with me?
And they still have it wrong. The companies and brokers were guilty of bid rigging and stealing from their clients, not abuse of contingent commissions. Contingent commissions are paid after the fact, after an entire book of business has proven profitable to the insurer.
Bid rigging in this case involved loading quoted premiums to induce a broker to place a piece of business with the insurer. And was done on a rotating basis with various insurers. It had nothing to do with contingent commissions.
But it sounds good, doesn\’t it? And Spitzer and the others look like heros, on the backs of the honest independent agents.
Another example of the Insurance Companies decreasing agents commission income!!!!!! Somehow they arranged to have these settlements made –a few thousand dollars–to the pre-arranged Attorneys Generals of a few states who could be bought off–in order to cut out commision to the agency force. Another rip off by the Companies !!!!!!!!!!!
The thousands of agents across the country should get together and start their own truly national insurance company. It is time for the control of the insurance machinery in this country to be in the hands of the servants closest to the consumer.
i could not agree more! at one time i was a member of both agents associations and then i realized that we are funding a business with the ROI that is hard to determine. in many instances the business funded by us becomes more powerful than us, but forgets how they got to be in the first place…..
is there a need for two agents associations, i think not!
They are all weak the carriers and the associations folding like this.WEAK remember who put them in the money the salesman and business owners…us.How about cutting attorneys fees to 1/4 instead of 1/3. How come that is not up for discussion?I am very disapointed in the Carriers…they are either weak or see a chance top profit.
Again – there is only one thing will have an impact – ONE THING!
It\’s nice to say ‘agents band together, etc.\’ It isn\’t going to happen! It\’s evident that the agent associations will/can do nothing.
MOVE YOUR BUSINESS. You own it, you have a right to move it. Don\’t think about it. Just DO IT! If you don\’t, expect this to continue. That alone will open the eyes of the thieving, self absorbed management of these carriers. MONEY TALKS!
When they come out with their new ‘compensation agreements remember the old saying, figures lie and liers figure\’.
NOW MOVE YOUR BUSINESS TO A CARRIER THAT APPRECIATES ITS\’ SALES FORCES\’ EFFORTS – not with talk, but with $.
You guys are all squeeling like you caught your wife cheating on you for the fifth time! Remember, Travelers was the first to cut commissions after they realized they controlled the billing and automation, when the converted from agency bill and shifted the transactional expense and responsibility to you and your staff.
I remember the big whigs came in to make the announcement to their so-called \”partners\”; it was made from the podium and one of the comments from the presenter was \”you want a friend, buy a dog\”.
Personally, I don\’t mind not getting a contingent. that way I won\’t have to play the \”dart throwing\” exercise every December by meeting with the field rep about what I guesstimate I\’ll be writing for them this next year.
The cessation of payment of contingency commissions will disincentivize at least to a lesser extent which company I choose to place my business. I\’ll have the excuse for lack of growth to be that you (the carrier) is less competitive for whatever the reason.
Finally, the cessation of contingency commissions should work to level the playing field between the larger agents who are sitting on volume but not growing, and smaller agents.
In CT the most dangerious place to be is between Blumenthal and a camera.
I agree that the contingent commissions paid to the \”big crooks\” put a damper on the way we are compensated. Let\’s go back to the old days when we were rewarded with a \”profit sharing check\’ for the profitable business we produced. Let\’s also thank our self serving associations that did nothing to help us by not renewing our memberships. Goodbye PIA and big I.
…..to see if any/all the dollars St Paul budgets for contingent payout finds its way to the \”new\” commission schedule. IF in fact a new schedule of commissions is produced.
As a former field man for the old St Paul, I spent more than a little time, personally delivering new commission schedules in December for use in the coming year. Never saw one with an increase in compensation.
Having spoken with current St Paul agents who were involved with a Jay-teleconference call related to StP\’s plans…I think ol\’ Jay is sitting in his suite at 385 Washington with a big \’ol smile on his face.
I own a large personal lines agency and most with Travelers. If they do not bump up the standard commission to make up for our loss on profit sharing, I don\’t think \”ol\’ Jay\” will have a big \’ol smile on his face after our Travelers business goes elsewhere.
My profit in personal lines came from contingent commission\’s. Without it, I can no longer market this product. Way to go Eliot! Your ignorance of our business will reduce competition and provide less choices for the consumer.
Would anyone be willing to share how much of an increase in fixed commissions you are seeing from carriers to offset the loss of contingencies?
i have been an independant agent for many years. why in the world do we allow this to happen to us? i wish a group of agents would rise up and figure out how to beat these companies at their own game……..
Better yet, why doesn\’t our association do it? That is precisely what I AM PAYING THEM FOR, not the issues they usually choose to take on.
Want to impact a company\’s bottom line – just PULL YOUR BUSINESS! Don\’t think about, worry about it, etc. By contract, we own the renewals!
JUST DO IT!
I am aware that the agents associations have attempted to do something, but I believe they have failed miserably. My business is commercial and will not go to travelers/st. paul.
but can you guys remember when they were good companies.
the fraud and abuse done by the companies and the large brokers are causing us great difficulty.
We smaller agencies are truly powerless and at the mercy of the large carriers and the marketplace. The 65% \”tipping\” point includes direct writers and heavy advertisers like Geico and Prog. Direct – I guess they can continue to \”waste\” their consumer\’s premium dollars on TV ads while the agency carriers get to screw their professional sales agents who have built up relationships with customers for many years, and who look out for those consumers unlike the direct writers!
Certainly NOT Eliot Spitzer. I cannot imagine a worse choice for a horrible job. It is amazing to think that people are talking about his potential candidacy down the pike as if he is some golden haired prince.
Guiliani can at least say that he fought organized crime in NY. Agents and brokers aren\’t organized enough to even protect reputable incomes against the likes of Spitzie and Bloomingthal.
Shame on us for not being lean and mean enough to survive on standard commissions.
I\’m 85% commercial. The national carriers are the problem……..dump ’em.
Our association\’s efforts are mis-directed. The national (and large regional) companies are more our enemy than
the politicians. Both in the way they treat us as their supposed ‘preferred distribution channel\’ and in the way they compensate us for OUR business. At the same time they call us PARTNERS. Hilarious isn\’t it? They\’ve pushed most of the menial work down to our staffs (as they lay off their own), cut our pay, management LINES their pockets and they get in bed with the large brokers who couldn\’t spell integrity much less live up to the spirit of the word.
Yes, insurance companies used to be much different animals, run by insurance people who made decisions based on long term thinking – not the bean counters and ‘next quarter\’ thinkers of today.
KICK \’EM OUT OF YOUR OFFICE! Do business with any honorable regional carrier that you can find – for YOUR and YOUR CUSTOMERS\’ sake.
Only then, and only MAYBE then, will they ‘get it\’!
I don\’t understand how removing contingent commissions will remove the temptation to write policies with a certain company. If bad for the insured, more expensive company is offering 25% commission and good for the insured, but not the agent, company is offering 5% commission, isn\’t there incentive for the agent to steer the business towards that 25% commission? No contingency needed.
Not all agents will direct all of their customers to that 25% commission product, but there is definitely incentive to do so.
That is NOT a dumb question!! You are exactly right that compensation steers business no matter its name. My question for companies like the big T is this: are you going to have a single, fixed commission for all agents: regardless of size/growth/retention/profitability/ETC?? If the answer is yes…then you can count on me to send my business to companies that will reward me for results that are better than my competitors. Does anyone out there agree with me?
And they still have it wrong. The companies and brokers were guilty of bid rigging and stealing from their clients, not abuse of contingent commissions. Contingent commissions are paid after the fact, after an entire book of business has proven profitable to the insurer.
Bid rigging in this case involved loading quoted premiums to induce a broker to place a piece of business with the insurer. And was done on a rotating basis with various insurers. It had nothing to do with contingent commissions.
But it sounds good, doesn\’t it? And Spitzer and the others look like heros, on the backs of the honest independent agents.
Another example of the Insurance Companies decreasing agents commission income!!!!!! Somehow they arranged to have these settlements made –a few thousand dollars–to the pre-arranged Attorneys Generals of a few states who could be bought off–in order to cut out commision to the agency force. Another rip off by the Companies !!!!!!!!!!!
The thousands of agents across the country should get together and start their own truly national insurance company. It is time for the control of the insurance machinery in this country to be in the hands of the servants closest to the consumer.
i could not agree more! at one time i was a member of both agents associations and then i realized that we are funding a business with the ROI that is hard to determine. in many instances the business funded by us becomes more powerful than us, but forgets how they got to be in the first place…..
is there a need for two agents associations, i think not!
They are all weak the carriers and the associations folding like this.WEAK remember who put them in the money the salesman and business owners…us.How about cutting attorneys fees to 1/4 instead of 1/3. How come that is not up for discussion?I am very disapointed in the Carriers…they are either weak or see a chance top profit.
Again – there is only one thing will have an impact – ONE THING!
It\’s nice to say ‘agents band together, etc.\’ It isn\’t going to happen! It\’s evident that the agent associations will/can do nothing.
MOVE YOUR BUSINESS. You own it, you have a right to move it. Don\’t think about it. Just DO IT! If you don\’t, expect this to continue. That alone will open the eyes of the thieving, self absorbed management of these carriers. MONEY TALKS!
When they come out with their new ‘compensation agreements remember the old saying, figures lie and liers figure\’.
NOW MOVE YOUR BUSINESS TO A CARRIER THAT APPRECIATES ITS\’ SALES FORCES\’ EFFORTS – not with talk, but with $.
You guys are all squeeling like you caught your wife cheating on you for the fifth time! Remember, Travelers was the first to cut commissions after they realized they controlled the billing and automation, when the converted from agency bill and shifted the transactional expense and responsibility to you and your staff.
I remember the big whigs came in to make the announcement to their so-called \”partners\”; it was made from the podium and one of the comments from the presenter was \”you want a friend, buy a dog\”.
Personally, I don\’t mind not getting a contingent. that way I won\’t have to play the \”dart throwing\” exercise every December by meeting with the field rep about what I guesstimate I\’ll be writing for them this next year.
The cessation of payment of contingency commissions will disincentivize at least to a lesser extent which company I choose to place my business. I\’ll have the excuse for lack of growth to be that you (the carrier) is less competitive for whatever the reason.
Finally, the cessation of contingency commissions should work to level the playing field between the larger agents who are sitting on volume but not growing, and smaller agents.