There is a fallacy here. Yes, rates are based on how much you drive – but it is based on distance to work or school; not on how much you drive after you leave work or on the weekends.
Unless you use mass transit as your sole means of trnasportation and can prove it, you won’t see a change in rates.
To qualify as pleasure use, no driving to work.
Calling your agent will most likely result in disappointment, so don’t expect much.
Wow…I think that Mr. Hunter really touched a nerve; and not with the consumer. It’s curious to note that that most of you assume that the consumer is out to rip off the insurers. What I really wanted to hear more of was why this idea was flawed in the first place. Thanks to Media Mogul and Compman, I feel more inclined to believe that congress should be looking over our shoulder a little more.
Hunter is the biggest knob around. First he wants everybody to call their agent or company to demand lower rates. That’s all fine and dandy IF you actually lower your annual mileage. I’d say about 75% of the people I insure lie about their total annual miles to begin with. Probably now, they are actually paying for the right amount of miles.
Doesn’t this idiot realize that the insurance companies already have built in lower rates for less mileage driven? But now he wants the governors and ins dept’s to hold hearings. What a complete moron. More Gov’t intervention, yeah, just what we need. Did he also take into account all the people who are torching or dumping their cars for the insurance money? How come he doesn’t want hearings on this. He is such a knob. Just talking about him makes me want to throw up.
This is the same guy who is leading the witch hunt in Florida with our Governor.
I think the morale of this story is going to be like the frog in hot water as the temp went up one degree per day he became comfortable – wasn’t bad a little at the time. One day he ‘was cooked’.
The Gulf waters are heating up on these boys. Be patient and let Nature take its course. Their theories will become reality and we will see how well their
expertise works in real life vrs. political drama.
Your absence of curiosity is perplexing, Peril. Why do you think some might recall consumer malfeasance? The answer is simple – because it occurs. Not surprisingly insurance company SIU’s have been developed to handle those types of problems. Heres another mindbender Peril – in flat economic times, like now, property claims go up. Boats catch fire, motorcycles and other toys get stolen, car thefts. What do most of those stolen toys have in common? Owners with loans that get satisfied with an insurance claim. You help congress watch us. Meanwhile we’ll work on stopping fraud like we have been all along. That way you’ll pay a lower premium prickly Peter Peril.
Our rates in the State of California are already based on total annual miles driven & vehicle usuage such as “Please” or “Commuter” miles 1 way to work. So that won’t help..
The comment from “Rate Bating” is right — if you’re reducing your driving for errands and leisure, your car insurance rate won’t be affected. For a story with actual insurance company response on this subject, I’d recommend “How gas prices can lead to lower car insurance rates” on Insure.com at http://www.insure.com/articles/carinsurance/gas-prices.html
I agree with the guy earlier who said most car insurance clients are already lying about how much driving they do. I called my agent. He’s still laughing.
I can’t believe this guy’s statement that “as Americans drive less, fewer claims will be filed”. That will not doubt be true, but what about the fact that when people have less money in their pocket, they are more likely to commit fraud eg. get the car stolen for the payout, make up a fake burglary claim, add extra items onto a genuine burglary claim, etc etc etc.
Obviously insurance companies will have to cover these spiralling costs (and increased investigation costs) out of our “windfall profits”…aaaaaarrrgh!!!
how’s this?… You call in to report your actual mileage now that you’re driving less…but your premium goes up because you were previously under-reporting your mileage.
Wow, are all you insurance guys brainwashed or what? Yes, everyone is out to get the insurance companies. They all lie awake at night trying to come up with a new plan to cheat their insurance company.
I’ll bet insurance was the first job you got out of college and have been drinking nothing but the insurance propaganda Kool-Aid ever since.
We, in insurance, may seem a bit jaded. True. Unfortunately it is not without merrit. When you are in an industry that the “Public”, in most cases, only uses because they are required by loans and laws. And the “Public”, ie. media, politicians, consumer advocate groups spend a great many hours making our industry seem like the bad guy out to steal premium $$ and not pay claims. On top of that, most agents that have been doing this for more than a year, learn first hand how much fraud there is in this industry from some clients & some agents. (But we all know that the bad minority makes the good majority look bad, in ALL cases.) Its hard to keep smiling when another consumer advocate trys to tell everyone that price is all tha matters.
Most agents spend their entire career trying to explain to clients that you get what you pay for. If you shop only for the cheepest price, then you will not get the protection that you need, when you needed it. If you shop for coverage, sure you may pay a little more, but wouldn’t rather have you home, car, business, etc protected when there is the disaster that wipes you out.
So if you look at insurance in that light, we may seem out of joint, but it is not without merrit.
Peril and Disbelief, You are the type of clients we avoid and send to our enemies. You would be the first to pad your statement of loss to cover your deductible because you think it is ok. That is fraud. Who do you think pays for fraud? That’s right, you do with higher premiums. They have done surveys and over 50% of people with property claims see no problem with padding their loss list to cover the deductible. That is what our society has come to. Too much entitlement and not enough people who want to work for a living. Time to ship all the deadbeats to an island somewhere and let them fend for themselves.
Your right SP. Being made the bad guy on the front line of insurance, can be very demanding. Consumer ignorance breeds anger towards us. I have spent my career educating the client. (as much as they can handle) But, when you see FRAUD…the insured who didn’t want to slow down and then T-bones a truck because she needed the week off from work(her words not mine). Or, the guy who tells the company he didnt delete that car (the agent must had done it)until he hears HIS recorded voice asking for it! All you have to do is go out and drive and you can see fraud. An accident is an accident, an auto crash(on purpose) is FRAUD!!
Huh? How does working out of his home disqualify Hunter? Half of this industry’s claims adjusters, agents and managers work from home and the other half wish they could. He has credentials; he’s an actuary. You may disagree with him but he raises points worthy of discussion. Too many in this industry prefer to attack the critic rather than address the criticism or recommendation. Every industry needs watchdogs.
Yes. Every industry needs a watchdog. However, this particular watchdog thinks the industry is rotten to the core and never misses an opportunity to toss out a jab and grab a headline. Key words in the last sentence: grab a headline.
The best watchdog is a neutral party able to see both sides.
This industry suffers from the perception of all of us being greedy, self-absorbed types whose only purpose is to milk consumers out of hard-earned cash. The reality is that most insurance agents are good people who care deeply about their clients and that go to bat for them in their darkest hour.
WHAT ABOUT THE GUY WHO BUYS A HOUSE AND PAYS DOUBLE ITS VALUE, TAKES A MORTGAGE FOR 110% OF SALES PRICE,PAYS INTEREST-ONLY FOR 3 YEARS. THEN, AFTER HIS PAYMENT DOUBLES, HIRES A RETIRED FIREMAN TO TAKE CARE OF HIS PROBLEM. WHEN THE REPLACEMENT COST IS HALF OF HIS COVERAGE A, HE COMPLAINS THAT THE INSURANCE GUY OVERSOLD HIM?
Dwelling coverage limit has little to do with the market value of a home. Also many insurance companies will not use the market value at all. I have not run into a problem with coverage A being 2 times the replacement cost at the time of a claim.
He should complain. His agent did oversell him. Get a clue. Market sales price has nothing to do with replacement cost. In CA here, in 2005, replacement cost sometimes was only 50% of the market price. Now, in 2008, we are seeing replacement cost 150-200% of market price.
PETER—-SORRY FOR THE ANGER AND SARCASM. FOR ME, I AM NOT REALLY THAT ANGRY AND STRESSED. THIS IS JUST A WAY TO BLOW OFF STEAM, SINCE SOME THINGS YOU CANNOT REALLY CHANGE MUCH!
Before this thread gets locked up. I wanted to thank all of you for commenting. In support of my earlier post…yes my statements were a little naive. I’m an Independent P&C agent in the midwest. I’m green, but not stupid, I know a number of my clients are looking to hurt my P&L. Thats primarily why I wanted to hear the opinion of my peers on this matter. I wasn’t prepared for the sarcasm or the angry comments– especially those in response to my suggestion that the government look over our collective shoulders. Sure fraud is real on BOTH sides of the desk; thats why I;m here–to learn what other ethical agents and brokers do in times like these. For me conservative underwriting and a sharp, experienced senior broker has paid off but what happens when even these fail. Our industry is in transition and I’m looking for the path that leads to continued success for my clients, carriers and my agency. Here’s hoping that we’ll find it. To all of you angry guys lighten up.
Fraud is real on both sides of the desk? Here is something for you to learn – if there is fraud on your side of the desk then get the hell away from your desk.
If you cannot do YOUR part of the job without fraud, then get out of my industry. The job is hard enough without that.
There is a fallacy here. Yes, rates are based on how much you drive – but it is based on distance to work or school; not on how much you drive after you leave work or on the weekends.
Unless you use mass transit as your sole means of trnasportation and can prove it, you won’t see a change in rates.
To qualify as pleasure use, no driving to work.
Calling your agent will most likely result in disappointment, so don’t expect much.
Wow…I think that Mr. Hunter really touched a nerve; and not with the consumer. It’s curious to note that that most of you assume that the consumer is out to rip off the insurers. What I really wanted to hear more of was why this idea was flawed in the first place. Thanks to Media Mogul and Compman, I feel more inclined to believe that congress should be looking over our shoulder a little more.
Hunter is the biggest knob around. First he wants everybody to call their agent or company to demand lower rates. That’s all fine and dandy IF you actually lower your annual mileage. I’d say about 75% of the people I insure lie about their total annual miles to begin with. Probably now, they are actually paying for the right amount of miles.
Doesn’t this idiot realize that the insurance companies already have built in lower rates for less mileage driven? But now he wants the governors and ins dept’s to hold hearings. What a complete moron. More Gov’t intervention, yeah, just what we need. Did he also take into account all the people who are torching or dumping their cars for the insurance money? How come he doesn’t want hearings on this. He is such a knob. Just talking about him makes me want to throw up.
This is the same guy who is leading the witch hunt in Florida with our Governor.
I think the morale of this story is going to be like the frog in hot water as the temp went up one degree per day he became comfortable – wasn’t bad a little at the time. One day he ‘was cooked’.
The Gulf waters are heating up on these boys. Be patient and let Nature take its course. Their theories will become reality and we will see how well their
expertise works in real life vrs. political drama.
“Tell the agent or company representative that you want the cheapest rate they have for drivers reflecting your new driving circumstances.”
Really!?!? ‘Cuz the lowest rate out there is ALWAYS the best choice.
Consumer advocates like these make agents jobs that much harder!
IF IT WASN’T FOR CONSUMER GREED AND SIMPLE MINDED PEOPLE, GUYS LIKE THIS WOULD HAVE NOTHING TO SELL!
Your absence of curiosity is perplexing, Peril. Why do you think some might recall consumer malfeasance? The answer is simple – because it occurs. Not surprisingly insurance company SIU’s have been developed to handle those types of problems. Heres another mindbender Peril – in flat economic times, like now, property claims go up. Boats catch fire, motorcycles and other toys get stolen, car thefts. What do most of those stolen toys have in common? Owners with loans that get satisfied with an insurance claim. You help congress watch us. Meanwhile we’ll work on stopping fraud like we have been all along. That way you’ll pay a lower premium prickly Peter Peril.
Our rates in the State of California are already based on total annual miles driven & vehicle usuage such as “Please” or “Commuter” miles 1 way to work. So that won’t help..
The comment from “Rate Bating” is right — if you’re reducing your driving for errands and leisure, your car insurance rate won’t be affected. For a story with actual insurance company response on this subject, I’d recommend “How gas prices can lead to lower car insurance rates” on Insure.com at
http://www.insure.com/articles/carinsurance/gas-prices.html
I agree with the guy earlier who said most car insurance clients are already lying about how much driving they do. I called my agent. He’s still laughing.
I can’t believe this guy’s statement that “as Americans drive less, fewer claims will be filed”. That will not doubt be true, but what about the fact that when people have less money in their pocket, they are more likely to commit fraud eg. get the car stolen for the payout, make up a fake burglary claim, add extra items onto a genuine burglary claim, etc etc etc.
Obviously insurance companies will have to cover these spiralling costs (and increased investigation costs) out of our “windfall profits”…aaaaaarrrgh!!!
I agree. Being a Media Mogul I have money everywhere, but people without wealth like mine would easily resort to fraud in tough times.
how’s this?… You call in to report your actual mileage now that you’re driving less…but your premium goes up because you were previously under-reporting your mileage.
Wow, are all you insurance guys brainwashed or what? Yes, everyone is out to get the insurance companies. They all lie awake at night trying to come up with a new plan to cheat their insurance company.
I’ll bet insurance was the first job you got out of college and have been drinking nothing but the insurance propaganda Kool-Aid ever since.
How does that insurance hater-aide taste? Look at yourself before you point and say things about us.
We, in insurance, may seem a bit jaded. True. Unfortunately it is not without merrit. When you are in an industry that the “Public”, in most cases, only uses because they are required by loans and laws. And the “Public”, ie. media, politicians, consumer advocate groups spend a great many hours making our industry seem like the bad guy out to steal premium $$ and not pay claims. On top of that, most agents that have been doing this for more than a year, learn first hand how much fraud there is in this industry from some clients & some agents. (But we all know that the bad minority makes the good majority look bad, in ALL cases.) Its hard to keep smiling when another consumer advocate trys to tell everyone that price is all tha matters.
Most agents spend their entire career trying to explain to clients that you get what you pay for. If you shop only for the cheepest price, then you will not get the protection that you need, when you needed it. If you shop for coverage, sure you may pay a little more, but wouldn’t rather have you home, car, business, etc protected when there is the disaster that wipes you out.
So if you look at insurance in that light, we may seem out of joint, but it is not without merrit.
Peril and Disbelief, You are the type of clients we avoid and send to our enemies. You would be the first to pad your statement of loss to cover your deductible because you think it is ok. That is fraud. Who do you think pays for fraud? That’s right, you do with higher premiums. They have done surveys and over 50% of people with property claims see no problem with padding their loss list to cover the deductible. That is what our society has come to. Too much entitlement and not enough people who want to work for a living. Time to ship all the deadbeats to an island somewhere and let them fend for themselves.
Your right SP. Being made the bad guy on the front line of insurance, can be very demanding. Consumer ignorance breeds anger towards us. I have spent my career educating the client. (as much as they can handle) But, when you see FRAUD…the insured who didn’t want to slow down and then T-bones a truck because she needed the week off from work(her words not mine). Or, the guy who tells the company he didnt delete that car (the agent must had done it)until he hears HIS recorded voice asking for it! All you have to do is go out and drive and you can see fraud. An accident is an accident, an auto crash(on purpose) is FRAUD!!
Why does this guy get publicity? He’s a one man show who works out of his home and uses a Ralph Nader group for his mailing address.
Huh? How does working out of his home disqualify Hunter? Half of this industry’s claims adjusters, agents and managers work from home and the other half wish they could. He has credentials; he’s an actuary. You may disagree with him but he raises points worthy of discussion. Too many in this industry prefer to attack the critic rather than address the criticism or recommendation. Every industry needs watchdogs.
Yes. Every industry needs a watchdog. However, this particular watchdog thinks the industry is rotten to the core and never misses an opportunity to toss out a jab and grab a headline. Key words in the last sentence: grab a headline.
The best watchdog is a neutral party able to see both sides.
This industry suffers from the perception of all of us being greedy, self-absorbed types whose only purpose is to milk consumers out of hard-earned cash. The reality is that most insurance agents are good people who care deeply about their clients and that go to bat for them in their darkest hour.
don’t forget that due to this economy more and more WC claims will be filed along with the false stolen car claims…
WHAT ABOUT THE GUY WHO BUYS A HOUSE AND PAYS DOUBLE ITS VALUE, TAKES A MORTGAGE FOR 110% OF SALES PRICE,PAYS INTEREST-ONLY FOR 3 YEARS. THEN, AFTER HIS PAYMENT DOUBLES, HIRES A RETIRED FIREMAN TO TAKE CARE OF HIS PROBLEM. WHEN THE REPLACEMENT COST IS HALF OF HIS COVERAGE A, HE COMPLAINS THAT THE INSURANCE GUY OVERSOLD HIM?
Dwelling coverage limit has little to do with the market value of a home. Also many insurance companies will not use the market value at all. I have not run into a problem with coverage A being 2 times the replacement cost at the time of a claim.
He should complain. His agent did oversell him. Get a clue. Market sales price has nothing to do with replacement cost. In CA here, in 2005, replacement cost sometimes was only 50% of the market price. Now, in 2008, we are seeing replacement cost 150-200% of market price.
PETER—-SORRY FOR THE ANGER AND SARCASM. FOR ME, I AM NOT REALLY THAT ANGRY AND STRESSED. THIS IS JUST A WAY TO BLOW OFF STEAM, SINCE SOME THINGS YOU CANNOT REALLY CHANGE MUCH!
Before this thread gets locked up. I wanted to thank all of you for commenting. In support of my earlier post…yes my statements were a little naive. I’m an Independent P&C agent in the midwest. I’m green, but not stupid, I know a number of my clients are looking to hurt my P&L. Thats primarily why I wanted to hear the opinion of my peers on this matter. I wasn’t prepared for the sarcasm or the angry comments– especially those in response to my suggestion that the government look over our collective shoulders. Sure fraud is real on BOTH sides of the desk; thats why I;m here–to learn what other ethical agents and brokers do in times like these. For me conservative underwriting and a sharp, experienced senior broker has paid off but what happens when even these fail. Our industry is in transition and I’m looking for the path that leads to continued success for my clients, carriers and my agency. Here’s hoping that we’ll find it. To all of you angry guys lighten up.
Fraud is real on both sides of the desk? Here is something for you to learn – if there is fraud on your side of the desk then get the hell away from your desk.
If you cannot do YOUR part of the job without fraud, then get out of my industry. The job is hard enough without that.