Down and out, I am sorry to hear of your situation. That is unfortunate, especially since you have put your in your time.
Something needs to be done to help you out, but this bill was not the answer. The root of the problem (cost of health care) was not addressed. Costs will continue to rise, but I guess you won’t have to be the one that pays for it. So that’s a plus.
Now the ones that are actually working, have to pay for those who aren’t (even more so then before; by a lot!). Re-distribution of wealth is good and all (if your a socialist or communist), but this is not right.
There were other steps that could be taken (and which were offered by both democrats and republicans btw: capping mal practice settlements, kicking out illegal aliens, etc.), but weren’t. It is a sad day for America.
My view will be expressed during the upcoming elections, along w/ many others. Please don’t forget to vote people!
Bill,
People will participate more than they ever have before, as evidenced by the town hall meetings and tea parties. Yes there will be more participation as they vote out those who forgot about the people they represent and voted along the Democrat party line for a bill that is laced with special favors, does nothing to bring down the cost of insurance, and raises taxes. Yes Bill you are going see participation like you have never seen it before just wait until November. Politics often change,but I don’t this fervor will be gone before November.
Willing to pay for health insurance if it’s affordable on our reduced incomes; spouse is working for a small income; just cannot afford private health insurance at this time. Hopefully, I will be back on my feet with a new job soon.
We all saw this coming but its interesting how many Dems do not hesitate to stand in front of the camera with a straight face and say things like-
“This bill will lower the cost of heathcare for all americans”
“This bill will help reduce our national deficit”
“This bill will lower the cost of healthcare for individuals currently paying into the system on their own”
Seriously, I know dumbsh** Pelosi sends out their talking points and I also know that a lot of these jokers know absolutely nothing about Insurance or Business for that matter. But how DUMB can you be?
Mandating that carriers take on anyone and everyone will increase the costs for those currently in the underwritten system. Its not profitable to insure a blind driver for auto insurance and its not profitable to insure someone with heart disease or cancer. Those people should have a subsidized pool, but the private insurance marketplace is not the place for it.
If your goal is to insure “all americans” than that is your stance. Just don’t feed me a bunch of BS saying that in the process of doing so your going to lower the costs of us in the system along with bring down the national deficit. F*ing Idiot Liberals.
I agree with a lot of what you said….mainly the fiscal part. But the Republicans (conservatives) had a chance to do something back when they had the majority but were more concerned with war, oil and tax cuts for the rich. So, I wouldn’t be so fast to hate on the Democrats so hard. The Republicans could have done something and they didn’t. Except pass an unfunded prescription drug program.
The Republicans, when in control, were not fiscally conservative. They did nothing and paid the price for it by getting fired in 2006. They were part of the problem, not the solution.
People need to get out and put people in office who will act responsibly and with common sense. If they continue to elect career politicians we will get the same BS that we currently have. Term limits is the answer.
What the Republicans did when they had power was wrong. What the Dems are doing now is much worse. We need some responsible adults in Congress and the children need to be put to bed.
Your comments about stating one’s purpose and caling it what it is are noble, but misplaced.
If the goal is health care for everyone, then it would be great to come out and say that, sure.
But that’s not how politics works in this country.
To be indignant about it is a double standard unless you were equally indignant about going to war in Iraq for the sake of big oil. If you can’t get equally (or more) upset about the youth of America dying for a similarly mistated purpose, then you are just another greedy ******* who doesn’t want his piece of the pie to shrink.
When Americans begin “otherizing” each other, as you do with your “f*@king liberal” comment, it is obvious that intelligent people such as yourself have lost the ability to think for themselves and have instead been brainwashed by too much spin and too much insulation from the wider world around them.
These aren’t liberals, they are Democrats. And yes, this bill will probably end up being a horrible expense. And it probably won’t fix the real problem. But let’s remember that the people they are tying to help are a part of this nation’s fabric – every bit as important as you or I – regardless of what they earn. And maybe you think the eventual catastrophic conflict between haves and have nots will happen after your dead, so why worry about it….
But I’ll tell you this, unless YOU are doing something to make our country better for future generations, you have no right to wrap yourself in the flag our founding fathers fought for.
It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many.
David, thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately you were able to take no stance at all while telling me I’m too harsh against Liberals. All Democrats are not Liberals by the way. I fully understand how politics works in our country. 95% of black people, All Liberals, many young un-informed voters elected President Obama. His agenda is far left of the majority of the country and the independents who put him in power are now begining to see this. Our country is not left or right leaning. But when push comes to shove, our country will push back and go towards common sense and fiscal responsibility.
Take a side David and once you understand that everyone is not entitled to a medal after a ballgame or anything else in this country you will understand what makes this country great.
Ok so now 50% of my friends in the business are laid off. Ages range from 52 to 64! Guess how many interviews we are getting! I got a quote for health insurance for my spouse and me and it was $650 a month. So we are uninsured and cutting our prescription meds. in half to stretch them out.
So we don’t deserve affordable health care after working diligently and honestly, and paying taxes for the past 75 years, both of us combined?
I think everyone who reads your post feels for your situation. Almost any one of us could have a time in our life when we go through a rough financial time through situations beyond our control. Many states before this so called health plan already had a safety net in place for situations like you are going through. We didn’t need a plan to control 18% of our economy, raise our taxes, and burden our children and their children with a runaway deficit. Hard working people like you need a temporary hand as do several other people out of work, because of the economy. I understand that and I am sure all of the other bloggers understand that, but that being said the plan that was passed yesterday, and will be signed into law tomorrow with all the special deals is not good for America. Most Americans know something has to be done in the way of reform, but not a reckless plan that will not bring down costs and be a hindrance to getting Americans back to work. The very best to you.
I took a stance when I joined the military during Viet-Nam.
In my world, only the winners get medals. As I said before, you must be brainwashed.
You say “our country will push back” – and I tell you that the only push back that will work is a lot bigger than health care reform.
Most people giving lip service to push back are pudgy outraged white men who don’t want their apple cart upset. People like Glen Beck followers. Give me break. He’s an idiot.
You want to push back? Demand election/campaign reform. Whoops, sorry, the Supreme Court has said it’s okay to have Plutocracy.
Believe it or not pal, the kind of push back that we’ll eventually face in our great country is likely to get people like you stabbed with a pitchfork. And as a patriot, I am actually on the side of protecting you because I don’t want to see that happen in America.
Congress should read what the vote on, but that will never happen. The tax on the wealthy making over 250k per year is not what the bill states. The bill states only a 3.5% surcharge on investments for people making over 250k a year, and not salaries. We all are going to pay for higher taxes forever.
You do deserve the opportunity to purchase reasonably priced insurance for yourself and your wife. Too bad the current reform bill did little to make this happen. The underlying costs have not been impacted, but you may get a subsidy from the government – Your welcome!
David,
Let me end on a positive note. First of all thank you for your service. Your generation is much better than mine for the sacrafices you all made. I have great respect for those that serve our country. Secondly, I agree with you and am not a fan of Glen Beck. He is an entertainer and his job is to entertain his viewers. If he didn’t go overboard we would not even know his name.
I’m 29 and healthy. I’m not concerned with people with pitchforks. If those with pitchforks were in congress than I would be as concerned as I am with Pelosi guiding our countries legislation.
I’m for people maximizing the opportunities in front of them. I’m for people bettering themselves for their own good and for our countries good.
“It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many.”
This is a foolish statement. Healthcare does not create wealth. PEOPLE create wealth, of their own volition. The current healthcare system does not benefit any one person over another. Rather, it simply, like every other commodity, is earned by those who work and pay for services.
At the same time, every person in the US, right now, before obama’s healthcare scam even is enacted, gets healthcare, whether they pay for it or not. However, lazy leftists (and, at least here in California, illegals the leftists refuse to remove from our country in hopes of more illegal/ACORN votes) have been looting the system for years.
The statement referenced at the top of this message is the perfect example of why those of us that pay taxes, earn our money, don’t have kids out of wedlock, and pay for our own healthcare must begin the revolution.
We have seen how the leftists do not care a lick about the US populace. If this was being done to fix healthcare, the lawyers would have been stopped first. In not stopping the graft rampant through the system, known beter as trial lawyers, the leftists have revealed their true goal…control. The reason control is important is, now the leftists have essentially created a gigantic slush fund to dole out to bribe voting blocks…all on the backs of the American taxpayer.
Please, everyone stop with the talk of healthcare. This bill was/is a scam, designed to do nothing but enrich lefitst coffers for more bribes to stay in power.
We have watched as the leftists have destroyed social security and medicare, by stealing the money from those programs to funnel to special interest groups – Hey,how much had ACORN made off leftists the past 10 years? These people are dispicable, and almost inhuman, in their desire to steal money for their own power.
It is now time to clean the guns, get out the ammo, and begin the revolution. Leftist have proven themselves a cancer on the American people. We must eradicate the cancer.
A sincere “thank you” for serving our country in Vietnam!
I agree with you that the lack of fiscal responsibility is attributable to both major parties, and for too long a time. We need a fresh start in Congress and we need campaign finance reform along with term limits. And Glenn Beck would agree with us.
I disagree with you on the point that we went to war in Iraq because of big oil. The existing facts prove that we were fooled into believing there were WMD’s and that Iraq represented a global security risk. Saddam Hussein was complicit in the foolishness and was certainly a heinous dictator, along the lines of Hitler. Although we were globally embarassed by starting this war, we at least stuck around long enough to help the country achieve success and get back on its feet. I alone may not be able to convince you of this. However, you turn people off from listening to you when you make this type of a blanket statement that lacks real evidence. Because if real evidence existed, it would have surfaced by now – Bush was hated that much, don’t you think? If it was about big oil, then why don’t we have lower prices or higher prices or something to prove that the supply of oil was expanded or retracted? Not much has changed about the oil story.
The only evidence you have are statements of what people want to believe and blame so that Bush’s reputation can be tarnished. Really now, you don’t have to try that hard to find evidence to get the desired end result. Stick to the facts and you get there.
What I want to know is who is going to regulate how often these uninsureds go to the dr/hospital? It’ll be like the teachers in our area with no deductible, no co-pay; they went to the dr for every little sniffle! I took OTC drugs, they got prescriptions. It will be like food stamps – can’t buy cat food with my card, but I sure can buy tuna!!
I know know the people in Congress who voted for this bill think the American people are an uninformed electorate, who they can tell bold face lies to and we will not know the difference. Even though voices were heard they were ignored. Some in Congress believe they don’t need to the will of the people. They are out of touch with their constituents. America elected a President they thought would govern from the center they now know they have a far left President and Congress who will stop at nothing to promote a Socialistic type government. As President Obabama rightly stated this is not a cure all for health care it is only a step in the right direction(he has a lot bigger plans than insurance being the distribution system. He wants a government run health care system, and in his opinion “Katie bar the door” if anyone stands in the way of the Reed, Pelosi, Obama locomotive). What these three have done and a far left leaning Congress is “awaken a sleeping giant”, the Amereican people. November is only eight months away, and I have hope and belief that the face of Congress will change drastically. All of us need to exercise our rights (before they are completely taken from us) and get out and vote, work on a campaign, and contribute money. America needs us to get involved.
The whole phenomenon of employers provding medical benefits was a trend that started in the early 50s to attract a young work force. Without regular government participation in providing access to healh care to the general public, the system has not had a chance to develop efficiency and worthwhile prevention programs. Essentially, there is very little “maturity” in the system. Our dreaded fear of becoming “socialist” has left the government the job of “putting out fires” (medicare, medicaide, etc.). Such programs, while worthwhile to people they aim to protect, have provided both parties the opportunity to score polical points (medicare part D.) against each other while not making the system any better. Private Insurers, on the other hand, have not helped themselves one bit. They have chosen not to defend the concept of pre-existing coverage exclusions even though there are sound acturial reasons to enact such exclusions. To defend that practice would be admitting that the system is flawed. It does not take a genius to realize that many of the so-called grass roots organizations fighting reforem have been financed by the private health insurance industry. Sorry folks, but the government needs to be involved more…as a provider of prevention, treatment, education for all ages. The current bill, while a big victory for some, does nothing to reduce costs. It will get people off medicaid (i.e no more pre-existing coverage exclusions) and will give many people access who never had it before but the costs will continue to rise. Economic circumstances will continue to chip away at the benefit programs provided by corporate America until we are all footing the bill.
Most of us who work are already footing the bill through taxes and the premiums we pay for health insurance, but we will now compund the amount we pay for undocumented workers and many US citizens who do not work, or have low paying jobs. This bill did lttle compared to the price it is going to cost the average American citiizen both now and for generations to come. There were a lot better ways to solve this issue through incremental steps, rather than a kidnapping of 18% of our economy. Please find out for yourselves who voted yes on this bill and vote no for them in the next election.
My friend, you have hit on the biggest blunder of all…the fact that we did go to war for big oil (and oil related industry) then failed to get any national advantage for our plunder. It’s completely insane.
Like all things conspiratorial or suspect, just ask yourself, “who profits?”
Plenty of people profited from Iraq. But not the average American. Certainly not the servicemen and servicewomen.
But that wasn’t the point – it only came up because Bleeding Hearts wrote to say how outraged he was that the health care bill is being misrepresented as something other than what it is – so I asked if he had the same outrage over the iraq war being misrepresented.
Shrub Bush doesn’t need help tarnishing his image…the fact that he has a Yale degree and can’t speak, read or write is all you need to know about the powers that run this country.
Massachusetts has had “healthcare reform” similar to what is coming to all of you…Let me say,you are going to love it! Yes, we have huge spiraling Medicare costs, the highest health insurance premiums in the country and we’re really excited about those new Cadillac taxes that will be thrown onto all of our backs…(except those union plans…ha ha). The good thing is that a Republican caused this nighmare…but not to worry…you will soon have what we have only worse….I mean better…one last thing…you know how we legislators know what we just passed is really, really a huge DOG???…BECAUSE WE DIDN’T PUT OURSELVES IN IT…WE ARE EXEMPT FROM IT!!
David II, you are right on.
Eventually we have to stop protecting the plutocracy and embrace the painful (for big business) realities of democratic reform. The current system is simply unsustainable; a fact that always makes me wonder how so-called fiscal conservatives (of which I am one) can claim to be against the need for healthcare reform…
I hear you bro, but there has been too much finger pointing. I understand that alien issue was addressed in this bill. It really remains to be seen what the additional cost of this specific bill will be to the average person. Forbiding the Pre-existing condition clause actually saves the government money as it gets people off medicaid. I am tired of hearing the chicken little guys like John Boener bich, moan, and cry over this when he and his buddies had a big hand in medicare part d. I’d love to vote those hypocrits out! They have added nothing constructive to the debate. The goal was to provide access to those who normally do not have it. For this, people behind the bill should be comended if it actually does that. Maybe Boener is steamed at the new tax on tanning booths:). Sorry, I can’t help making fun of him. He is such a cry baby.
Without meaningful tort reform, emphasis on prevention, knowlege on what waste will be cut out of medicare (to name a few) it appears doubtful that costs of the overall system have been or will be reduced. Time for round 2.
Frankly I’m a little mystified…if you are a “fiscal conservative”, there is nothing but a sea of red ink on the horizon under this plan. We have taken the current “unsustainable” system and are replacing it with a “really, really unsustainable” one, filled with fake accounting, tons of pork, multi-billion dollar special interst pay-backs and on and on…there is nothing in this mess that actually controls costs…..nothing!
You are right on when you said Congress exempted themselves. Many of us heard what a great plan this is going to to be, and Congress will gladly sign up for it. SURPRISE!!! Congress exempted themselves. Not even those who work for them are exempt. Only Congress and their families are exempt. AMAZING!!! This Democratic Congress did not tell the truth, or maybe they will tell us they didn’t know that fact, because over 90% didn’t take the time to read it before they voted on it. Can you imagine voting on 18% of our economy, and not even reading the bill. We should all ask our congress person if they voted on the bill before they signed it last night. I am not saying we will get a straight answer, but it is worth asking.
It’s not that simple to say the leftists are entrenching their pathways to corruption.
Corruption is from both sides, deep within our national political system.
When it is said, “It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many”…it means that we have an underlying problem whereby the status quo is ultimately maintained at tax payer’s expesne who receive a disproportionately small benefit for their dollar. Just read the post “Still a long way to go.”
WC, wake up dude, Both sides are equally corrupt when it comes to selling their votes for pork. When you aim your anger at leftists (just go ahead and call them commies or use the “N” word or whatever your true prejudice is!) you’re simply being used as a pawn by the true power brokers of this country. Do yourself a favor and read multiple points of view from multiple sources…maybe try helping some hard working blue collar folks who couldn’t afford insurance then had a medical emergency wipe out their world. Spend a month doing for others, then see how you feel.
You cannot be Fiscally Conservative and support this healthcare bill.
If you think that you are, then you need to read up on this thing and quit listening to the talking points about what the “CBO” stated.
Osama-care is a debacle that we will all be paying for, for many many years to come.
They need to institue a rule for congressman. If they lie to their constituents and are proven to have done so, they must face them in a cage-match. Violence is not the answer…But neither is lying to people. Bet you wouldn’t have a bunch of dipsh**s sitting in front of the camera saying they just passed the largest tax break for the middle class. If they do, you must enter the cage.
Do we have an uninformed electorate? You better believe we do! People get their information from sound bites, Glenn Beck and Keith Olberman; that is how they decide where they fall on this issue. Personally I am glad this bill passed. I do wish the Republicans would have participated (I am one), but their goal was to see this President fail.
Is this bill perfect? Not even close, I also submit that in many respects it did nto go far enough. Call me a liberal, but to those who are in this industry (healthcare) I have witnessed firsthand how people have been forced to either do without healthcare and lose their home or even die because they had no access to treatment.
Will this bill be tweaked over time? Yep, it sure will, and should be, but someone show me any sweeping legislation that was not adjusted or modified over time. The GOP had many opportunities to get this process started, as did the DEMS. Call it Obamacare, but I say congrats Chief and to my GOP friends I say, stop being obstructionists and participate!!
Bill your a liberal. Stand up and be accountable for it. If you think that this bill is great, then you are either:
A) Dumb/not well read
B) A Liberal
C) All of the above
Republicans should have been out in front of this issue, but at the end of the day this is the most partisan bill you could have. Bill, what is the problem with healthcare. If you think the problem is the X amount of people uninsured than this is your bill. If you think that the problem is the rising costs than this bill is a piece of Sh**. The purpose of this bill was to gain universal coverage and they packaged up that idea and sold it to dumb-asses like yourself as a “Health Insurance Reform” and lowering costs. You bought it hook line and sinker. Congrats Billy the Lib, now get ready to see costs go up along with your taxes.
Sorry to be angry, I just don’t have much tolerence for ignorance.
Chuck, how do you really feel? Call me a liberal. I believe people all have conservative and liberal leanings; depends on the issue.
I make no apologies for my stance. And as you agreed the GOP also had many opportunities to craft meaningful legislation including helping to craft the present bill, they/we failed to do so.
Calm down, you may pop a gasket…hope you’re adequately insured…
I’ve been on all-lines agent for 31 years. I’ve seen all too many customers decide they wanted to buy a boat, motorcycle, travel trailer, etc.etc.; rather than buy health and/or life insurance. They couldn’t afford both and the toy won over the health insurance. The years go by and they develop health problems and then they want to trick the system and buy health insurance at the same prices as healthy people. For the most people, going without health insurance has been a choice they made.
The bill does require health insurance carriers to accept applicants with pre-existing conditions. However, it is my understanding that it does not require carriers to charge the same premium for those with pre-existing conditions. As such, underwriters will probably issue policies with extremelly high premiums due to the pre-existing conditions. This will result in either the person not accepting delivery of the policy and/or it not effecting the premium base of those with standard and/or preferred premiums. In the long run most people with pre-existing conditions will probably end up in one of the exchange programs. This should result in the exchange programs having high premiums and reduced coverages. I could be wrong but, I don’t see any other outcome.
If anyone wants to read the health care reform bill all you do is google HR 3200.
The file is a pdf file, and when you do read this bill please be out of earshot of anyone. I have read the first 500 pages, and I was furious. Nobody in Congress has read this bill. Good luck with your reading.
The bill could have simply stated that all people have to participate in paying for health care…just like car insurance. Even the reckless have a place to buy, its called assigned risk for auto and/or WC
I’m all for it. People of all stripes should get involved. My only hope, even if they don’t agree with me, is that they are informed and stop parroting sound bites from talking heads…
Informed discourse is what will truly revive this country…..
Down and out, I am sorry to hear of your situation. That is unfortunate, especially since you have put your in your time.
Something needs to be done to help you out, but this bill was not the answer. The root of the problem (cost of health care) was not addressed. Costs will continue to rise, but I guess you won’t have to be the one that pays for it. So that’s a plus.
Now the ones that are actually working, have to pay for those who aren’t (even more so then before; by a lot!). Re-distribution of wealth is good and all (if your a socialist or communist), but this is not right.
There were other steps that could be taken (and which were offered by both democrats and republicans btw: capping mal practice settlements, kicking out illegal aliens, etc.), but weren’t. It is a sad day for America.
My view will be expressed during the upcoming elections, along w/ many others. Please don’t forget to vote people!
The good news is… Congress and Obama have awakened a sleeping giant… the same one that awakened after the pearl harbor attacks and 9/11.
Mr. President are you ready to see change that the people really believe in?
Vote em out!
Stop pretending to be a republican that opposes his own party Bill. You sound even more democrat then a democrat.
Imposter!
Bill,
People will participate more than they ever have before, as evidenced by the town hall meetings and tea parties. Yes there will be more participation as they vote out those who forgot about the people they represent and voted along the Democrat party line for a bill that is laced with special favors, does nothing to bring down the cost of insurance, and raises taxes. Yes Bill you are going see participation like you have never seen it before just wait until November. Politics often change,but I don’t this fervor will be gone before November.
…”you won’t have to be the one that pays for it.”
Willing to pay for health insurance if it’s affordable on our reduced incomes; spouse is working for a small income; just cannot afford private health insurance at this time. Hopefully, I will be back on my feet with a new job soon.
We all saw this coming but its interesting how many Dems do not hesitate to stand in front of the camera with a straight face and say things like-
“This bill will lower the cost of heathcare for all americans”
“This bill will help reduce our national deficit”
“This bill will lower the cost of healthcare for individuals currently paying into the system on their own”
Seriously, I know dumbsh** Pelosi sends out their talking points and I also know that a lot of these jokers know absolutely nothing about Insurance or Business for that matter. But how DUMB can you be?
Mandating that carriers take on anyone and everyone will increase the costs for those currently in the underwritten system. Its not profitable to insure a blind driver for auto insurance and its not profitable to insure someone with heart disease or cancer. Those people should have a subsidized pool, but the private insurance marketplace is not the place for it.
If your goal is to insure “all americans” than that is your stance. Just don’t feed me a bunch of BS saying that in the process of doing so your going to lower the costs of us in the system along with bring down the national deficit. F*ing Idiot Liberals.
I agree with a lot of what you said….mainly the fiscal part. But the Republicans (conservatives) had a chance to do something back when they had the majority but were more concerned with war, oil and tax cuts for the rich. So, I wouldn’t be so fast to hate on the Democrats so hard. The Republicans could have done something and they didn’t. Except pass an unfunded prescription drug program.
I agree with you Allan.
The Republicans, when in control, were not fiscally conservative. They did nothing and paid the price for it by getting fired in 2006. They were part of the problem, not the solution.
People need to get out and put people in office who will act responsibly and with common sense. If they continue to elect career politicians we will get the same BS that we currently have. Term limits is the answer.
What the Republicans did when they had power was wrong. What the Dems are doing now is much worse. We need some responsible adults in Congress and the children need to be put to bed.
Your comments about stating one’s purpose and caling it what it is are noble, but misplaced.
If the goal is health care for everyone, then it would be great to come out and say that, sure.
But that’s not how politics works in this country.
To be indignant about it is a double standard unless you were equally indignant about going to war in Iraq for the sake of big oil. If you can’t get equally (or more) upset about the youth of America dying for a similarly mistated purpose, then you are just another greedy ******* who doesn’t want his piece of the pie to shrink.
When Americans begin “otherizing” each other, as you do with your “f*@king liberal” comment, it is obvious that intelligent people such as yourself have lost the ability to think for themselves and have instead been brainwashed by too much spin and too much insulation from the wider world around them.
These aren’t liberals, they are Democrats. And yes, this bill will probably end up being a horrible expense. And it probably won’t fix the real problem. But let’s remember that the people they are tying to help are a part of this nation’s fabric – every bit as important as you or I – regardless of what they earn. And maybe you think the eventual catastrophic conflict between haves and have nots will happen after your dead, so why worry about it….
But I’ll tell you this, unless YOU are doing something to make our country better for future generations, you have no right to wrap yourself in the flag our founding fathers fought for.
It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many.
David, thank you for your thoughts. Unfortunately you were able to take no stance at all while telling me I’m too harsh against Liberals. All Democrats are not Liberals by the way. I fully understand how politics works in our country. 95% of black people, All Liberals, many young un-informed voters elected President Obama. His agenda is far left of the majority of the country and the independents who put him in power are now begining to see this. Our country is not left or right leaning. But when push comes to shove, our country will push back and go towards common sense and fiscal responsibility.
Take a side David and once you understand that everyone is not entitled to a medal after a ballgame or anything else in this country you will understand what makes this country great.
Equal opportunity does not mean Equal Outcome.
Ok so now 50% of my friends in the business are laid off. Ages range from 52 to 64! Guess how many interviews we are getting! I got a quote for health insurance for my spouse and me and it was $650 a month. So we are uninsured and cutting our prescription meds. in half to stretch them out.
So we don’t deserve affordable health care after working diligently and honestly, and paying taxes for the past 75 years, both of us combined?
I think everyone who reads your post feels for your situation. Almost any one of us could have a time in our life when we go through a rough financial time through situations beyond our control. Many states before this so called health plan already had a safety net in place for situations like you are going through. We didn’t need a plan to control 18% of our economy, raise our taxes, and burden our children and their children with a runaway deficit. Hard working people like you need a temporary hand as do several other people out of work, because of the economy. I understand that and I am sure all of the other bloggers understand that, but that being said the plan that was passed yesterday, and will be signed into law tomorrow with all the special deals is not good for America. Most Americans know something has to be done in the way of reform, but not a reckless plan that will not bring down costs and be a hindrance to getting Americans back to work. The very best to you.
Maybe if you are really sick you can get some self righteous dude in nice clothes to condescendingly throw a $1 bill at your face
My mission was not to take a stance.
I took a stance when I joined the military during Viet-Nam.
In my world, only the winners get medals. As I said before, you must be brainwashed.
You say “our country will push back” – and I tell you that the only push back that will work is a lot bigger than health care reform.
Most people giving lip service to push back are pudgy outraged white men who don’t want their apple cart upset. People like Glen Beck followers. Give me break. He’s an idiot.
You want to push back? Demand election/campaign reform. Whoops, sorry, the Supreme Court has said it’s okay to have Plutocracy.
Believe it or not pal, the kind of push back that we’ll eventually face in our great country is likely to get people like you stabbed with a pitchfork. And as a patriot, I am actually on the side of protecting you because I don’t want to see that happen in America.
God Help Us now.
I don’t oppose the bill because I oppose affordable health care. I just don’t happen to believe that Obamacare is the means to achieve that goal.
Congress should read what the vote on, but that will never happen. The tax on the wealthy making over 250k per year is not what the bill states. The bill states only a 3.5% surcharge on investments for people making over 250k a year, and not salaries. We all are going to pay for higher taxes forever.
You do deserve the opportunity to purchase reasonably priced insurance for yourself and your wife. Too bad the current reform bill did little to make this happen. The underlying costs have not been impacted, but you may get a subsidy from the government – Your welcome!
Wow, Matt – a little insensitve now aren’t you? Hope you don’t find yourself in the same situation…
David,
Let me end on a positive note. First of all thank you for your service. Your generation is much better than mine for the sacrafices you all made. I have great respect for those that serve our country. Secondly, I agree with you and am not a fan of Glen Beck. He is an entertainer and his job is to entertain his viewers. If he didn’t go overboard we would not even know his name.
I’m 29 and healthy. I’m not concerned with people with pitchforks. If those with pitchforks were in congress than I would be as concerned as I am with Pelosi guiding our countries legislation.
I’m for people maximizing the opportunities in front of them. I’m for people bettering themselves for their own good and for our countries good.
If I offended you, I am sorry. Have a great week.
I think Matt’s actually on your side. He was referencing an earlier comment with bitter irony
“It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many.”
This is a foolish statement. Healthcare does not create wealth. PEOPLE create wealth, of their own volition. The current healthcare system does not benefit any one person over another. Rather, it simply, like every other commodity, is earned by those who work and pay for services.
At the same time, every person in the US, right now, before obama’s healthcare scam even is enacted, gets healthcare, whether they pay for it or not. However, lazy leftists (and, at least here in California, illegals the leftists refuse to remove from our country in hopes of more illegal/ACORN votes) have been looting the system for years.
The statement referenced at the top of this message is the perfect example of why those of us that pay taxes, earn our money, don’t have kids out of wedlock, and pay for our own healthcare must begin the revolution.
We have seen how the leftists do not care a lick about the US populace. If this was being done to fix healthcare, the lawyers would have been stopped first. In not stopping the graft rampant through the system, known beter as trial lawyers, the leftists have revealed their true goal…control. The reason control is important is, now the leftists have essentially created a gigantic slush fund to dole out to bribe voting blocks…all on the backs of the American taxpayer.
Please, everyone stop with the talk of healthcare. This bill was/is a scam, designed to do nothing but enrich lefitst coffers for more bribes to stay in power.
We have watched as the leftists have destroyed social security and medicare, by stealing the money from those programs to funnel to special interest groups – Hey,how much had ACORN made off leftists the past 10 years? These people are dispicable, and almost inhuman, in their desire to steal money for their own power.
It is now time to clean the guns, get out the ammo, and begin the revolution. Leftist have proven themselves a cancer on the American people. We must eradicate the cancer.
A sincere “thank you” for serving our country in Vietnam!
I agree with you that the lack of fiscal responsibility is attributable to both major parties, and for too long a time. We need a fresh start in Congress and we need campaign finance reform along with term limits. And Glenn Beck would agree with us.
I disagree with you on the point that we went to war in Iraq because of big oil. The existing facts prove that we were fooled into believing there were WMD’s and that Iraq represented a global security risk. Saddam Hussein was complicit in the foolishness and was certainly a heinous dictator, along the lines of Hitler. Although we were globally embarassed by starting this war, we at least stuck around long enough to help the country achieve success and get back on its feet. I alone may not be able to convince you of this. However, you turn people off from listening to you when you make this type of a blanket statement that lacks real evidence. Because if real evidence existed, it would have surfaced by now – Bush was hated that much, don’t you think? If it was about big oil, then why don’t we have lower prices or higher prices or something to prove that the supply of oil was expanded or retracted? Not much has changed about the oil story.
The only evidence you have are statements of what people want to believe and blame so that Bush’s reputation can be tarnished. Really now, you don’t have to try that hard to find evidence to get the desired end result. Stick to the facts and you get there.
What I want to know is who is going to regulate how often these uninsureds go to the dr/hospital? It’ll be like the teachers in our area with no deductible, no co-pay; they went to the dr for every little sniffle! I took OTC drugs, they got prescriptions. It will be like food stamps – can’t buy cat food with my card, but I sure can buy tuna!!
Bankruptcy of the US Government is now not an IF but a WHEN thanks to the socialist monarchy that has control of Washington.
I know know the people in Congress who voted for this bill think the American people are an uninformed electorate, who they can tell bold face lies to and we will not know the difference. Even though voices were heard they were ignored. Some in Congress believe they don’t need to the will of the people. They are out of touch with their constituents. America elected a President they thought would govern from the center they now know they have a far left President and Congress who will stop at nothing to promote a Socialistic type government. As President Obabama rightly stated this is not a cure all for health care it is only a step in the right direction(he has a lot bigger plans than insurance being the distribution system. He wants a government run health care system, and in his opinion “Katie bar the door” if anyone stands in the way of the Reed, Pelosi, Obama locomotive). What these three have done and a far left leaning Congress is “awaken a sleeping giant”, the Amereican people. November is only eight months away, and I have hope and belief that the face of Congress will change drastically. All of us need to exercise our rights (before they are completely taken from us) and get out and vote, work on a campaign, and contribute money. America needs us to get involved.
VOTE EM OUT
VOTE EM OUT
VOTE EM OUT
VOTE EM OUT
VOTE EM OUT
VOTE EM OUT
Congressmen don’t know how to have fun.
The whole phenomenon of employers provding medical benefits was a trend that started in the early 50s to attract a young work force. Without regular government participation in providing access to healh care to the general public, the system has not had a chance to develop efficiency and worthwhile prevention programs. Essentially, there is very little “maturity” in the system. Our dreaded fear of becoming “socialist” has left the government the job of “putting out fires” (medicare, medicaide, etc.). Such programs, while worthwhile to people they aim to protect, have provided both parties the opportunity to score polical points (medicare part D.) against each other while not making the system any better. Private Insurers, on the other hand, have not helped themselves one bit. They have chosen not to defend the concept of pre-existing coverage exclusions even though there are sound acturial reasons to enact such exclusions. To defend that practice would be admitting that the system is flawed. It does not take a genius to realize that many of the so-called grass roots organizations fighting reforem have been financed by the private health insurance industry. Sorry folks, but the government needs to be involved more…as a provider of prevention, treatment, education for all ages. The current bill, while a big victory for some, does nothing to reduce costs. It will get people off medicaid (i.e no more pre-existing coverage exclusions) and will give many people access who never had it before but the costs will continue to rise. Economic circumstances will continue to chip away at the benefit programs provided by corporate America until we are all footing the bill.
Most of us who work are already footing the bill through taxes and the premiums we pay for health insurance, but we will now compund the amount we pay for undocumented workers and many US citizens who do not work, or have low paying jobs. This bill did lttle compared to the price it is going to cost the average American citiizen both now and for generations to come. There were a lot better ways to solve this issue through incremental steps, rather than a kidnapping of 18% of our economy. Please find out for yourselves who voted yes on this bill and vote no for them in the next election.
My friend, you have hit on the biggest blunder of all…the fact that we did go to war for big oil (and oil related industry) then failed to get any national advantage for our plunder. It’s completely insane.
Like all things conspiratorial or suspect, just ask yourself, “who profits?”
Plenty of people profited from Iraq. But not the average American. Certainly not the servicemen and servicewomen.
But that wasn’t the point – it only came up because Bleeding Hearts wrote to say how outraged he was that the health care bill is being misrepresented as something other than what it is – so I asked if he had the same outrage over the iraq war being misrepresented.
Shrub Bush doesn’t need help tarnishing his image…the fact that he has a Yale degree and can’t speak, read or write is all you need to know about the powers that run this country.
Massachusetts has had “healthcare reform” similar to what is coming to all of you…Let me say,you are going to love it! Yes, we have huge spiraling Medicare costs, the highest health insurance premiums in the country and we’re really excited about those new Cadillac taxes that will be thrown onto all of our backs…(except those union plans…ha ha). The good thing is that a Republican caused this nighmare…but not to worry…you will soon have what we have only worse….I mean better…one last thing…you know how we legislators know what we just passed is really, really a huge DOG???…BECAUSE WE DIDN’T PUT OURSELVES IN IT…WE ARE EXEMPT FROM IT!!
David II, you are right on.
Eventually we have to stop protecting the plutocracy and embrace the painful (for big business) realities of democratic reform. The current system is simply unsustainable; a fact that always makes me wonder how so-called fiscal conservatives (of which I am one) can claim to be against the need for healthcare reform…
I hear you bro, but there has been too much finger pointing. I understand that alien issue was addressed in this bill. It really remains to be seen what the additional cost of this specific bill will be to the average person. Forbiding the Pre-existing condition clause actually saves the government money as it gets people off medicaid. I am tired of hearing the chicken little guys like John Boener bich, moan, and cry over this when he and his buddies had a big hand in medicare part d. I’d love to vote those hypocrits out! They have added nothing constructive to the debate. The goal was to provide access to those who normally do not have it. For this, people behind the bill should be comended if it actually does that. Maybe Boener is steamed at the new tax on tanning booths:). Sorry, I can’t help making fun of him. He is such a cry baby.
Without meaningful tort reform, emphasis on prevention, knowlege on what waste will be cut out of medicare (to name a few) it appears doubtful that costs of the overall system have been or will be reduced. Time for round 2.
Frankly I’m a little mystified…if you are a “fiscal conservative”, there is nothing but a sea of red ink on the horizon under this plan. We have taken the current “unsustainable” system and are replacing it with a “really, really unsustainable” one, filled with fake accounting, tons of pork, multi-billion dollar special interst pay-backs and on and on…there is nothing in this mess that actually controls costs…..nothing!
You are right on when you said Congress exempted themselves. Many of us heard what a great plan this is going to to be, and Congress will gladly sign up for it. SURPRISE!!! Congress exempted themselves. Not even those who work for them are exempt. Only Congress and their families are exempt. AMAZING!!! This Democratic Congress did not tell the truth, or maybe they will tell us they didn’t know that fact, because over 90% didn’t take the time to read it before they voted on it. Can you imagine voting on 18% of our economy, and not even reading the bill. We should all ask our congress person if they voted on the bill before they signed it last night. I am not saying we will get a straight answer, but it is worth asking.
It’s not that simple to say the leftists are entrenching their pathways to corruption.
Corruption is from both sides, deep within our national political system.
When it is said, “It is a fact that the disparities in wealth created by our medical system favor the benefit of the few at the expense of the many”…it means that we have an underlying problem whereby the status quo is ultimately maintained at tax payer’s expesne who receive a disproportionately small benefit for their dollar. Just read the post “Still a long way to go.”
WC, wake up dude, Both sides are equally corrupt when it comes to selling their votes for pork. When you aim your anger at leftists (just go ahead and call them commies or use the “N” word or whatever your true prejudice is!) you’re simply being used as a pawn by the true power brokers of this country. Do yourself a favor and read multiple points of view from multiple sources…maybe try helping some hard working blue collar folks who couldn’t afford insurance then had a medical emergency wipe out their world. Spend a month doing for others, then see how you feel.
Hello! No kidding.
I never endorsed this plan. I simply said that lot of people are misdirecting their outrage and indignation.
It’s obviously a load of crap – thus the word unsustainable –
Where can I get a copy of the 2,000+ page copy of the bill on-line? Can’t find it on the House’s web page. Thanks!
You cannot be Fiscally Conservative and support this healthcare bill.
If you think that you are, then you need to read up on this thing and quit listening to the talking points about what the “CBO” stated.
Osama-care is a debacle that we will all be paying for, for many many years to come.
They need to institue a rule for congressman. If they lie to their constituents and are proven to have done so, they must face them in a cage-match. Violence is not the answer…But neither is lying to people. Bet you wouldn’t have a bunch of dipsh**s sitting in front of the camera saying they just passed the largest tax break for the middle class. If they do, you must enter the cage.
Do we have an uninformed electorate? You better believe we do! People get their information from sound bites, Glenn Beck and Keith Olberman; that is how they decide where they fall on this issue. Personally I am glad this bill passed. I do wish the Republicans would have participated (I am one), but their goal was to see this President fail.
Is this bill perfect? Not even close, I also submit that in many respects it did nto go far enough. Call me a liberal, but to those who are in this industry (healthcare) I have witnessed firsthand how people have been forced to either do without healthcare and lose their home or even die because they had no access to treatment.
Will this bill be tweaked over time? Yep, it sure will, and should be, but someone show me any sweeping legislation that was not adjusted or modified over time. The GOP had many opportunities to get this process started, as did the DEMS. Call it Obamacare, but I say congrats Chief and to my GOP friends I say, stop being obstructionists and participate!!
just look at Mass our rates have gone up more and more since we mandated health care
Bill your a liberal. Stand up and be accountable for it. If you think that this bill is great, then you are either:
A) Dumb/not well read
B) A Liberal
C) All of the above
Republicans should have been out in front of this issue, but at the end of the day this is the most partisan bill you could have. Bill, what is the problem with healthcare. If you think the problem is the X amount of people uninsured than this is your bill. If you think that the problem is the rising costs than this bill is a piece of Sh**. The purpose of this bill was to gain universal coverage and they packaged up that idea and sold it to dumb-asses like yourself as a “Health Insurance Reform” and lowering costs. You bought it hook line and sinker. Congrats Billy the Lib, now get ready to see costs go up along with your taxes.
Sorry to be angry, I just don’t have much tolerence for ignorance.
Chuck, how do you really feel? Call me a liberal. I believe people all have conservative and liberal leanings; depends on the issue.
I make no apologies for my stance. And as you agreed the GOP also had many opportunities to craft meaningful legislation including helping to craft the present bill, they/we failed to do so.
Calm down, you may pop a gasket…hope you’re adequately insured…
I’ve been on all-lines agent for 31 years. I’ve seen all too many customers decide they wanted to buy a boat, motorcycle, travel trailer, etc.etc.; rather than buy health and/or life insurance. They couldn’t afford both and the toy won over the health insurance. The years go by and they develop health problems and then they want to trick the system and buy health insurance at the same prices as healthy people. For the most people, going without health insurance has been a choice they made.
The bill does require health insurance carriers to accept applicants with pre-existing conditions. However, it is my understanding that it does not require carriers to charge the same premium for those with pre-existing conditions. As such, underwriters will probably issue policies with extremelly high premiums due to the pre-existing conditions. This will result in either the person not accepting delivery of the policy and/or it not effecting the premium base of those with standard and/or preferred premiums. In the long run most people with pre-existing conditions will probably end up in one of the exchange programs. This should result in the exchange programs having high premiums and reduced coverages. I could be wrong but, I don’t see any other outcome.
If anyone wants to read the health care reform bill all you do is google HR 3200.
The file is a pdf file, and when you do read this bill please be out of earshot of anyone. I have read the first 500 pages, and I was furious. Nobody in Congress has read this bill. Good luck with your reading.
The bill could have simply stated that all people have to participate in paying for health care…just like car insurance. Even the reckless have a place to buy, its called assigned risk for auto and/or WC
eliminate social security benefits as a start.
I’m all for it. People of all stripes should get involved. My only hope, even if they don’t agree with me, is that they are informed and stop parroting sound bites from talking heads…
Informed discourse is what will truly revive this country…..
Wake me up when society has collapsed, as per reports from the Conservatives suggest this health insurance reform bill will do.
I think someone should wake you up David. You seem to be sleeping through all of your economics, accounting, government and logic classes.