Businesses Hurt First by Coronavirus Then by Looting Have New Insurance Questions By Katherine Chiglinsk, Michael Sasso and Steven Church | June 5, 2020 Email This Subscribe to Newsletter Email to a friend Facebook Tweet LinkedIn Print Article Article 73 Comments June 5, 2020 at 11:04 am Captain Planet says: Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 17 7It’s awful what has happened to this country and the business world. We had a botched response to the virus which has created economic turmoil. We then had a botched response to the murder of one of our American brothers. This has led to social upheaval. I pray that we can find a sense of normalcy soon. It’s going to take leadership from every individual. We can’t be thinking about haircuts and Baskin Robbins. We have to put humanity first. Black lives matter! Ice cream? Not so much. I love me some scoops though, so don’t get me wrong. Not sure if I need to bring my AK next time I go there, however. Seems a little aggressive. I am pretty sure I don’t have to put a gun to someone’s head just to get a waffle cone. And, maybe we shouldn’t spit on the nurses. Let’s not spit on anyone. As Pat Robertson would say, “That ain’t cool.” I also don’t think this is the time to get a photo op. It’s time for action. And, no matter which set of clubs you have, I believe everyone is motivated to hit a tee shot in the upcoming election. So, let’s not suppress the vote. We need to get these businesses going again. We need to get America back in order. Unfortunately, those in charge right now aren’t the ones who know how to do it. But we do. We can. We will. Be an individual leader every day. Your peers will notice. Do the right thing. Your peers will notice. Have a great weekend, everyone. June 5, 2020 at 11:57 am Jon says: Hot debate. What do you think? 12 11Everyone from the right keeps trying to whine that you can’t trust the media, but all the real news is coming out of people on twitter and facebook sharing live video of what’s been happening. The video from Buffalo, NY just last night that went viral of two police officers knocking over an elderly man who hit his head with a loud CRACK and started bleeding profusely from his ears. A dozen police officers walked past the man without helping him while one police officer yelled to clear the area, the whole time being recorded. Then the Buffalo police department had the nerve to issue a statement saying the man “tripped and fell”. If we don’t have the police recorded, they lie, plain and simple. Just like the republicans. June 5, 2020 at 1:20 pm craig cornell says: Like or Dislike: 11 7Planet: “We need to get these businesses going again. We need to get America back in order. Unfortunately, those in charge right now aren’t the ones who know how to do it.” You might want to check the unemployment numbers today . . . June 5, 2020 at 1:06 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 13 5Remember David Dorn. June 5, 2020 at 1:40 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 8 4Now who would Down vote the request to honor the innocent death of a black man? June 5, 2020 at 2:52 pm Perplexed says: Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 15 4David Dorn was a black COP, so it’s not cool to mourn him or any of the other policemen killed or the business owners that tried to protect their buildings from burning or being looted. Values are warped. It’s either wrong to steal from others or destroy property that doesn’t belong to you or it’s right. This desire to accept heinous crimes against others as being okay because of wrongs committed 5 decades ago is sad. June 5, 2020 at 3:42 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 11 5George Floyd’s death was tragic and wrong and criminal. So was David Dorn’s. Tragic and wrong and criminal. I thought all black lives mattered. But apparently not to the 4 people who down voted my comment about Dorn. June 5, 2020 at 4:36 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 11You’re just trying to take the spotlight off of black lives taken by the police. David Dorn is a tragedy, sure, but he’s not the countless lives taken by the police and you know it. You trying to do so is really lame, even for you. Eric Garner had just broken up a fight, according to witness testimony. Ezell Ford was walking in his neighborhood. Michelle Cusseaux was changing the lock on her home’s door when police arrived to take her to a mental health facility. Tanisha Anderson was having a bad mental health episode, and her brother called 911. Tamir Rice was playing in a park. Natasha McKenna was having a schizophrenic episode when she was tazed in Fairfax, Va. Walter Scott was going to an auto-parts store. Bettie Jones answered the door to let Chicago police officers in to help her upstairs neighbor, who had called 911 to resolve a domestic dispute. Philando Castile was driving home from dinner with his girlfriend. Botham Jean was eating ice cream in his living room in Dallas. Atatiana Jefferson was babysitting her nephew at home in Fort Worth, Texas. Eric Reason was pulling into a parking spot at a local chicken and fish shop. Dominique Clayton was sleeping in her bed. Breonna Taylor was also asleep in her bed. And George Floyd was at the grocery store. It’s sad that a cop died, but all you’re showing is your ignorance to the problem. June 5, 2020 at 5:11 pm Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 3 7Once again, I’m getting the substance from you, Jon. I still don’t have it in me to read Craigisms anymore. So, he’s talking about dead cops? Yes, that is wrong as well. What he’s playing here is whataboutism. Things can happen simultaneously. It’s bad for cops to die and innocent African Americans. On the rear window of my car is a sticker of a badge number of a local police officer who was killed. My neighbor across the street was his sergeant. I absolutely love our police force and thank them all the time for keeping my neighborhood and daughters safe. Guess what? Even she says black lives matter. Good men and women in blue are getting it and they are starting to display it. Change is happening and it’s a beautiful phenomenon to witness. Obama’s legacy in that regard continues. No one can stop it! June 5, 2020 at 5:24 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 6 5It is just too funny that Planet says he won’t respond to my comments . . . and then he responds!!! (As if it doesn’t count if his response is aimed at someone else . . .) Hilarious. It isn’t “what aboutism” to point out the absurdity of people claiming all black lives matter . . . who then ignore the murder of innocent black people because it doesn’t fit a political narrative. That ain’t compassion. That is the opposite. June 5, 2020 at 5:29 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 6 8What’s actually funny is that you think anyone still takes you seriously after you’ve made such a fool of yourself lying on these forums over and over, Craig. Tell us about the recreation only marijuana dispensaries again LOL you’re a joke, and you understand whataboutism and that you’re using it. Whataboutism, also known as whataboutery, is a variant of the tu quoque logical fallacy that attempts to discredit an opponent’s position by charging them with hypocrisy without directly refuting or disproving their argument. You literally just did exactly that.So now you’re a liar on something else for claiming that what you did wasn’t whataboutism LOL you stay dishonest I’ll be right here June 6, 2020 at 11:35 am PolarBeaRepeal says: Like or Dislike: 8 7Clearly, no one on the Left will list the police killed in the line of duty, or Blacks or others killed every day in drug deals gone wrong, gang killings, intentional and accidental deaths due to drive-by shootings, etc. in Chicago, NY, LA, St. Louis, Detroit, Philly, … In reality, only Black Lives taken by police actions Matter to them. There are also thousands of soldiers who died 76 years ago today. Will anyone honor them today for preserving our rights to free speech and peaceful demonstration? June 6, 2020 at 4:43 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 6The police take a job with risks. That does not give them the right to kill innocent black people as they see fit, Polar, which is shocking for you to suggest. We all know you don’t actually care about black lives, but your argument does nothing but make your inherent racism clear. Dishonest AND racist? You’re just a peach. Glad you’ve started showing your face again since getting caught lying about that Yougov poll (remember saying it said 90% of Americans were more afraid of terrorism than climate change? But then the easily findable poll says no such thing? Still refusing to acknowledge your lies huh? That’s okay, I’ll keep bringing it up) its always a pleasure to point out what a despicable person you actually are. June 7, 2020 at 11:04 am okt0ber says: Like or Dislike: 6 5Jon – It’s actually very rare to be killed by the police, as a percentage of deaths in America. And also as a percentage of total police/civilian interaction. This idea that the police are wholesale out to kill people of color is not supported by the numbers. You’re more likely to be killed by lightning strike than by a police officer while unarmed. As far as the looting, we might be getting up to a billion or so in damage overall? There are very few people on the earth whose lives are worth that amount of money. Maybe just a hand full on the entire earth. George Floyd was not one of them. I’m not one of them. The guy was murdered. The police officers are being charged and prosecuted. The system, so far, is working as designed when someone is murdered. The fact is that every race/culture in America, and the world, have things they need to work on. The white community needs to work on the racism. The black community is one of the most homophobic in the nation. That isn’t equality, is it? Don’t throw stones when you live in a glass house. Looting doesn’t make me feel sympathy for anyone. It just makes me have a poor view of those committing those crimes. Until we can have a non-knee jerk discussion about our societal problems without tearing each other down and placing nasty labels on each other, all I see is a whole lot of hypocrisy going on. It isn’t deflection, it’s about a universal acknowledgement of many of our problems regardless of race, creed, sexuality, etc. That’s equality. June 7, 2020 at 5:05 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 4Jesus, are you just bob with a different screen name? The thing you’re missing is that if a black man is killed by a police officer, what happens? Nothing, that’s what happens. Rarely is anyone even fired if the event wasn’t captured on video. This has happened over, and over, and over again. Three officers killed Breonna Taylor while she was sleeping in bed and they haven’t even been fired for her murder. Do your research, because you just come off as another foolish, privileged white person taking their color for granted. You can’t commodify every aspect of life and not expect people to loot as a form of protest. Did you actually complain this much when innocent black lives were murdered? No. Are you fine letting your family be shot and then arguing that their lives aren’t worth it? I didn’t think so. Again, check your privilege. Have a family member murdered by police who aren’t even losing their job and see if you care about looting. Correction. George Floyd was murdered. The officers in question were not even fired until people began to protest. It was days after the protests that all four men were arrested and the main officer charged with second degree murder. This was I believe 5 days after protests started. Nothing was going to happen if not for the protests, those four men would still be walking around. The three men who murdered Breonna Taylor are STILL walking around. The system is NOT working. Black lives are not the same as homophobia, sorry. You can try to equate the two but one while hateful doesn’t take the person’s life. Now I’m really thinking you are just bob, because this is the same type of ignorant, dishonest trolling as he tries. One thing I know for sure, you don’t understand the word “equality” in the slightest. June 5, 2020 at 1:36 pm Ms. J says: Like or Dislike: 8 6Remember: Sean Monterrosa Willie McCoy, a 20-year-old who had been sleeping in his car in February 2019 when six officers fired 55 bullets in 3.5 seconds George Floyd Trayvon Martin Matthew Ajibade Paterson Brown Eric Harris William Chapman Walter Scott Philander Castile Tamir Rice Alton Sterling Eric Garner Justine Damond Akai Gurley Terrence Crutcher I could go on but I don’t see the need. June 5, 2020 at 3:24 pm Mr. Integrity says: Well-loved. Like or Dislike: 13 2I can appreciate your comment. The circumstances of each individual case is unique and the outcome very unfortunate. I don’t believe anyone wishes their deaths happened. There were ~10.5 million total arrests in 2019. According to FBI data, 89 police officers also died in the line of duty in 2019. These are isolated cases that do not reflect the vast majority of “peaceful” arrests that occur throughout the country on a daily basis. When we lose context, or are provided with questionable information or a basis to understand the scope of a problem, rash decisions and reactions ensue. People are left to their own devices when it comes to being informed, and we can certainly use more objectivity and fact based insights to better inform ourselves and mitigate future crisis from occurring. June 5, 2020 at 3:39 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 5 4Now. Now. Don’t let facts get in the way of emotions. You might actually cause people to look for real solutions that way. June 5, 2020 at 3:58 pm Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 6 6I agree with you, Mr. Integrity. Problem is, in today’s America, facts do not seem to matter. A man can face a camera and lie to us over 20,000 times and people will still wrap themselves in Chinese manufactured red hats. June 5, 2020 at 4:30 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 5 5And here comes Trump hater to bore us again . . . tell us, Planet, what solutions do you have? I won’t wait up. June 5, 2020 at 4:37 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 6 7Just because you don’t like what he’s saying doesn’t mean it’s not true, unlike things you say. Keep trying to distract from the issues, troll. June 5, 2020 at 5:19 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 8 6Excellent commentary from the resident hater. As usual. Deep, man, real deep . . . FYI, many immigrants and minorities have had their businesses destroyed. THAT is what the article is about, and Trump had nothing to do with it. (But DiBlasio did. In fact, nearly all the destruction is in cities run by . . . wait for it . . . Democrats.) June 5, 2020 at 5:30 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 7Poor response from the resident liar! FYI you’re trying whataboutism again. Pathetic. Too bad the president has been calling for violence. Keep trying to shift the goalpost, your tactics are as boring as you are ugly. That’s very, I’m saying you’re very ugly because you are, you goalpost shifting uglyass sad old man. June 7, 2020 at 11:08 am okt0ber says: Like or Dislike: 6 4Jon – It is actually true that most of the civil unrest and looting has occurred in cities that are primarily run by Democrats. Including Minneapolis. There’s no getting around that. June 7, 2020 at 4:59 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 5Yeah, and democratic cities tend to have a larger black population. A larger black population that is being routinely murdered by the police. If you’d been paying attention, you’d know multiple innocent black men have been shot and killed by the Minneapolis PD, who then decided to do nothing against the murderous police officers. But then you wouldn’t have been paying attention because you simply don’t care if black people are murdered, right? Try to dance around your racism, we all see you by your priorities. June 6, 2020 at 11:39 am PolarBeaRepeal says: Like or Dislike: 5 6Trollsenblattism: “Can you list those 20,000 lies? Can you prove they were lies? You made the claim, so you must prove it. Otherwise, I deem it to be invalid.” June 6, 2020 at 11:51 am Rosenblatt says: Like or Dislike: 6 6this would be a valid request to prove an argument had he not already posted his evidence in many other comment sections June 5, 2020 at 1:40 pm Jack says: Like or Dislike: 12 5Police departments were told to stand down. I wish the carriers would pay the claims and subrogate the local mayors and police departments, it was negligence by anyone’s definition. June 5, 2020 at 4:37 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 7Police departments have absolutely not stood down, open your eyes. DEFUND THE POLICE. June 5, 2020 at 5:21 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 6 5Defund the police . . . and watch crime sky rocket in poor and minority communities. Just like it does every time law enforcement shrinks. Deep, man, real deep. June 5, 2020 at 5:30 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 7Whataboutism strike three? We don’t need the police, there are alternatives. Keep lying, liar. June 5, 2020 at 5:42 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 5 5Oh, please tell me about alternatives to the police. (This should be hilarious.) June 5, 2020 at 6:08 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 7I’ll tell you about you being a dishonest, racist person who’s not worth talking to except to shut down in his repeated lies and weak goalpost shifting attempts. June 5, 2020 at 7:02 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 4 4And there you have Jon’s “alternatives to the police”. NOTHING. All BS. As usual. June 8, 2020 at 3:00 pm Perplexed says: Like or Dislike: 2 4Jon, show us how sincere you are, noble man. Move to Minneapolis and help all the poor souls left after the police department is defunded. Or maybe New York City when that idiot may defunds the police as he’s mentioned. Crazy old man doesn’t have a clue about anything. He’s almost as bizarre as Joe Biden. By the way, what’s the plan for Joe after he’s elected? Going to nominate someone as VP then knock the old man off or will they just declare him as being incompetent because of dementia? Does it even register with you people that no one is fooled by the dems allowing him to be their presidential candidate? Do you really think everyone else in the country is stupid? June 8, 2020 at 3:07 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 2Why would I do that? The people of Minneapolis are winning in their battle against the police. Just because you’re a scared old lady who thinks black people will harm her if there aren’t police doesn’t mean the rest of us are as deluded as you, Perplexed. Minneapolis has taken a step in the right direction. Keep trying to direct the conversation elsewhere, while your president has to literally hide in a bunker from his people LOL whatever Joe does it will be better than the great orange joke you old racists have allowed to run this country into the ground. Republican president that puts us into another recession SHOCK on top of caging children in staggering numbers (most of which have been sexually abused under Trump lock and key) I really think everyone else in the country is tired of being lied to by people like you. June 5, 2020 at 5:33 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 9Trump’s trying to brag about the unemployment rate while the country burns, he’s set the military on it’s own citizens, and literally the entire world is protesting his police and their brutal policies. The police attempt to gaslight the entire nation while we literally watch them murder and injure citizens without a second thought. See you in November LOL you scared yet? You should be :) June 5, 2020 at 5:35 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 8Oh yeah, and he’s losing his evangelical followers because he sicc’d teargas on protestors to take a publicity photo in a church. Yeah, come back with some snappy line about Biden to make yourself feel better before you start trying to claim the election was fraudulent as soon as Big Daddy Trump loses. June 5, 2020 at 5:41 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 6 7There was no tear gas. Are you man enough to admit when you say something that is not true? No. June 5, 2020 at 5:53 pm Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 5 7Jon, He’s bragging about the unemployment numbers? Why? Of course the number is going to skyrocket once businesses are able to open back up. DDDDDDUUUUUUHHHHHHH! It’s not new jobs, it’s simply re-employment. June 5, 2020 at 6:12 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 8washingtonpost.com/politics/2020/06/05/reverse-fact-check-trump-his-supporters-about-tear-gas-falls-apart/ “On Friday, the Park Police themselves clarified. Yes, they’d used a form of tear gas.” Then they backpedalled because it’s a different BRAND name of pepper ball. Who can keep track, with as often as your side lie? Trick question, no one cares. You’re still dishonest and racist. LOL that’s right CP. Craig’s still trying to argue that the police (who have been lying to us and gaslighting us) are the best option. DEFUND THE POLICE. BIDEN 2020 June 5, 2020 at 7:01 pm Craig Winston Cornell says: Like or Dislike: 5 5HA HA HA HA HA! You didn’t even read the article! Philip Bump (whose routine dishonesty has made his name a joke) tries to claim that Pepper Balls are . . . tear gas! And he is a “reporter”! Too funny. June 6, 2020 at 11:33 am Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 6 7Hey Jon, Did you hear there was a major miscalculation in the unemployment number? It’s actually about 16%. They are looking into why the miscalculation happened. I don’t think they need to look any further than The Oval Office. June 7, 2020 at 11:13 am okt0ber says: Like or Dislike: 6 5Jon – It’s mostly the policies of Democrat liberal mayors that has allowed the country to burn. They seem to think committing more crime is justified because a different crime was committed and is actually being prosecuted. It doesn’t follow any kind of logic at all. Meanwhile, red states are enabling their economies to flourish again, which is pushing unemployment down right now. Those are the facts as of right now. June 7, 2020 at 4:56 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 4Have you not been paying attention to what’s happening in your country, or do you think the problem with the “democrats” is not cracking down on these protests? Have you even seen any of the footage of the police brutalizing civilians and then lying about it? The footage out of Buffalo of an old man trying to return a police helmet, shoved over so he hits his head on the concrete? And a dozen police officers walk by as blood pours out of the man’s ears. The Buffalo police then issued a statement saying that the man “tripped and fell”. Pay attention to what’s happening in the world, as literally people around the world are protesting. You know the racists are the ones crying about protesters now even though they were protesting not being allowed to get their hair cut a month ago? Yeah, we all see you for who you are. Defund the police. June 5, 2020 at 5:04 pm Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 6 6Jack, It didn’t look like law enforcement of any kind stood down in DC when they were ordered to flash bang and pepper ball innocent, peaceful protesters just so someone could stand by a church with a book he’s never read. June 7, 2020 at 11:16 am okt0ber says: Like or Dislike: 5 4Guess you missed the part where they had set fire to a historic building in the area. That isn’t peaceful. June 7, 2020 at 4:51 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 5 5Did you complain about the dead lives lost, or just the property damage? Because it looks like you just care about the property damage, not black lives in any way. Rioting is the voice of the unheard. June 8, 2020 at 3:03 pm Perplexed says: Like or Dislike: 3 4Jon, only people devoid of any morals think it’s okay to steal, burn, kill because of one wrong committed against one man. Don’t waste your time with your lists. It means nothing to me and it’s not because I’m a racist. You’re a product of post modernism and that isn’t a compliment. June 8, 2020 at 3:09 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 2LOL you know the “rioting is the voice of the unheard” is a Martin Luthor King Jr. quote right? I don’t expect you to, you seem too stupid to actually study your history LOL.Hey, at least you’re admitting that you’re a racist, that’s a start, however our country doesn’t need or want you. Keep trying to excuse away people smarter than you who disagree with you, no one cares about your opinion anyway. June 7, 2020 at 6:07 pm Captain Planet says: Like or Dislike: 5 4I am sure oct0ber is consistent and am against the Protest on the War on Baskin Robbins when those protesters were spitting on nurses and innocent bystanders. Armed none the less and donning the treasonous Confederate flag. June 7, 2020 at 9:52 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 4https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/06/07/us/george-floyd-protests-sunday/index.html Smarter people than Craig have decided dismantling the police is the best option right now. As I’ve said, we don’t need the police. Kudos to the city of Minneapolis taking a step in the right direction. Another week and the rest of the country will follow suit. There will be plenty of scared racists and the private sector I’m sure will create more jobs in the private security sector, but this is the first step to clearing a host of our country’s problems. If there are no police, the prison system dries up. People get help instead of being locked in a box to profit some rich racist old man. This is when the change actually begins. June 7, 2020 at 10:31 pm knowall says: Like or Dislike: 3 3I’ve seen the cops pick on many different segments of society; a small minority of them like to throw their power around — I mean who hasn’t been pulled over and the officer has basically refused to tell them why they were pulled over. When I was a young driver they always pulled me over because I had a junk car and I was young. I’m not seeing the disbanding of the police departments though, sheesh, they were the heroes on 9/11. Most departments were having trouble recruiting enough to replace the retirees. Someone with almost 20 complaints against them should have been put out to pasture long ago, though — obviously some mental or hate issues there. I also don’t see these protests changing the racial attitudes; it may for a few but I doubt the masses will change. I hope I am wrong in this regard. June 8, 2020 at 12:19 am Jon says: Like or Dislike: 4 6You’re claiming to have a lot of experience, okay. Are you a black man? So you’re claiming that this is “a small minority” that like to throw their power around. Did you see the video of the old man in Buffalo pushed over by two police officers? The Buffalo PD later lied about the cause of the old man’s head injury. When backlash hit (only because it was filmed) the two officers who shoved the old man were suspended. The other 57 officers in that unit resigned. IN SOLIDARITY WITH THE TWO WHO KNOCKED THE OLD MAN OVER. They’re still paid Buffalo PD employees btw, they simply resigned from that task force. Your position is sadly, woefully naive. There are good cops out there, you’re right. Most of them have already resigned because of what’s going on. I know of several who resigned days ago and began marching with protests. I’m sorry to say, if you’re a white person, there’s a good chance this is just a part of reality you haven’t dealt with. We’ve been in this place for a long, long time. The people have just finally, rightfully had enough. There is still racism, we know that. The republican push of a “post racial america” after we had a black president was garbage, we know that. We have to acknowledge systemic racism as a country, and part of that is a complete re-tooling of what we consider law enforcement. There are better options out there, Minneapolis has taken the first step towards them. Now the rest of the country needs to follow suit. June 8, 2020 at 12:21 am Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 6We have to acknowledge systemic and institutional racism* I meant to say. Additionally, we have to put an end to the clear racists out there and stop letting their voices ring loudest. The small minority of evil, dishonest racists currently in power. People like Craig. June 8, 2020 at 9:45 am curious says: Like or Dislike: 1 4Jon, generally I agree with your positions. Regarding the tactical unit members who quit, I was reading yesterday that though there may have been feelings of solidarity, the stronger underlying reason might have been receiving word that their union advised it would not cover their legal fees: https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/exclusive-two-buffalo-police-ert-members-say-resignation-was-not-in-solidarity-with-suspended-officers June 8, 2020 at 9:53 am knowall says: Like or Dislike: 3 2Jon, sometimes you state incorrect things — there’s no place in my comment where I say anything about ‘having a lot of experience.’ the color of my skin is irrelevant – there is racism in all races’ hearts. and yes, there is even discrimination in the workplace against non minorities in the hiring and promotions processes If you want to split hairs, those two officers are a small minority of that force on the street right then. the other 57 did not push him over Who are you going to call if someone is at your home brandishing a rifle and trying to break in? What I’m saying is people don’t usually change. If you can get them to change for the better – great. They may tell you they’ve changed but they actually haven’t – they just feel guilty at that moment. June 8, 2020 at 10:48 am Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 5Knowall, your quote was “I’ve seen the cops pick on many different segments of society; a small minority of them like to throw their power around” that does imply a certain level of experience. And yes, I’m well aware. I’m bi-racial and have been lucky enough to see the best and worst of both whites and blacks. The problem right now isn’t the blacks that are prejudiced, though mostly those were pushed by extreme racism from whites. The issue is the system of black oppression that we call the police. I asked about your race because I think if you consider a “small minority” of cops to be the problem, you’re not really being honest with yourself about the problem, or you’re just not aware. The other 57 didn’t push the man over, you’re right. But they walked by and did nothing. They didn’t turn in the two who did push the man over. If you have 2 cops who break the law and 57 who turn a blind eye you have 59 bad cops. Why do you assume the police are going to help me if someone breaks into my home brandishing a rifle? There are TONS of reports out there of black people calling the police and then being shot or arrested because the cops assume we’re the ones committing the crime. I’ve heard this argument as well “What are you going to do if you’re raped?” Many women who are raped call the cops and receive zero help anyway. I understand that there are situations where the police are needed, but what we think of as the police needs to shift. 95% of the things cops do need to be about community support, rehabilitation and crisis aversion. Not showing up with a gun and making the problem worse. This is a problem that’s been going on for literally decades. After the civil rights movement steps were made to address the inherent racism built into the police system, and then nothing was done. It’s been 50 years of this. The time to put a band-aid on the problem is over. June 8, 2020 at 12:09 pm knowall says: Like or Dislike: 3 2A social worker is not going to protect you if someone is trying to off you. I understand the inner city is a different story, as far as police response etc.. than more rural or affluent areas. My white nephew is married to a black woman and I have heard all the unnecessary racism stories. (unnecessary because as she calls it – she is a quality person) name calling when on the school bus and on lockers and even today going to a healthcare provider and they automatically assume you are on Medicaid because you are black – and how differently you are treated by the same people once it’s determined you have Cadillac health coverage. I’m paying taxes for protection I don’t want a wimp protecting me — I do want a good person protecting me and you though; we agree on that point June 8, 2020 at 12:25 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 5Per 2017 crime rates in america there are 382.9 violent crimes per 100,000 population, and 2,362.2 property crimes per 100,000. So right off the bat, things like “Someone trying to off you” are less than 1/5 of the crimes the police tackle. So why are we militarizing them? They do not need the budget they have, nor the tactics. Again, you’re prioritizing your own protection, and you are white. Everyone deserves equal protection and that is not the case right now. So you’re comfortable with black people continuing to be murdered and incarcerated unfairly because you’re worried that you might not get the best protection? Well black people have not been getting the best protection for decades. The system as it is is only meant to protect whites, and that as a system is a failure. What we need is less protection and more support. There will always be a need for potentially armed law enforcement, sure, but that should be a last resort. The entire system needs to be burned to the ground and something new in it’s place, because what we have is not working. June 8, 2020 at 3:13 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3There are about 800,000 police. You just said 382.9 violent crimes per population, and you say it’s 1/5 the total crimes, but you neglect to go over the exposure to those police, the amount of injuries and deaths in the police, and how prevalent that is as opposed to the other way. Whether or not they are a lesser total (which you would expect when comparing all crime, that violent crime would be less than non violent) is not at all relevant data to whether or not police are exposed to unsafe conditions, (which they are). They do need the budget they have. Defunding them will not make them more efficient. Funding goes to training them, numerous programs would help. Removing the police or defunding them is not a good plan at all. “So you’re comfortable with black people continuing to be murdered and incarcerated unfairly because you’re worried that you might not get the best protection?” black folks are incarcerated less than they should be relative to their portion of violent crime participation. https://www.conservativereview.com/news/can-incarceration-rates-racist-reflect-actual-crime-rates/ In other words, you are more likely to go to jail due to violent crime being white than black, it isn’t by much at all to indicate any bias against white, that isn’t the point of me saying that, but what you are stating is not true. “The system as it is is only meant to protect whites, and that as a system is a failure.” Not true, at least in the first point, and I’m sick of your racial arguments which do not hold water. “What we need is less protection and more support. There will always be a need for potentially armed law enforcement, sure, but that should be a last resort. The entire system needs to be burned to the ground and something new in it’s place, because what we have is not working.” Define “support”. June 8, 2020 at 3:18 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 1https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2017-leoka-line-of-duty-death-statistics-released-051018 Per the FBI, roughly 96 officers were killed in the line of duty in 2017. So your concern seems really pointless if it’s less than 1% of police officers. Your numbers of incarceration (show me something not from a conservative site to be taken seriously) do not factor in systematic or institutional racism. You keep trying to deny these things are factors and they are, and they take your “data” and turn it around on it’s ass. There are more white people than black people. You’re ignoring that point. Just because you only read racist conservative articles that refuse to believe in racism doesn’t mean it’s true. I don’t need to define anything to you, the changes are already happening. Minneapolis is dismantling their police force. LAPD and NYPD losing funding. It’s only been 10 days. In another week total police reform is on the table as long as the idiots on the force keep attacking innocent protestors and then pretending they didn’t until the video is shown. Your side has already lost while you’re still trying to justify police budgets. The time for what we know as law enforcement currently is over. June 8, 2020 at 3:19 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3In other words, give me your idea to make the police work, while also defunding them. It’s impossible by the way. I would agree there needs to be a system, and I have suggested this myself, of bargaining a police sentence with education, for lesser crimes when you first start getting into trouble. The conservatives here called me crazy for saying it. I believe you got involved too at the time, but I cannot remember what you said. You definitely went after me though. Some people have suggested mental health programs to indirectly deal with folks who had mental health issues who make up a disproportionate amount of crime offenders, yourself included though you didn’t correlate the two at once. I kept asking how in the world we would make that voluntary, without government overreach? I’m not convinced that can help. You referenced other nations that you perceive succeeded with it, I cannot recall which. I tend to think that people involved in crime can be pulled out of it, I tend to think the police and the U.S. as a whole has been too focused on throwing people in jail. It is not racial. The numbers do not bear that out, white arrests have exploded since 1980 too. I tend to think it needs to be dialed down. When you have people agreeing on all fronts, and instead insist on programs only which remove one race from the issue, it is incredibly annoying to that race left out (not just white, Asian seems to have been left behind too). June 8, 2020 at 3:28 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 2No. I don’t need to provide you squat. You just want to post your thoughts and opinions and I couldn’t care less what you think, you’re not an expert and your posts have shown you to be a dishonest person. You don’t like that the police are being defunded? Cry more. No one cares. The corruption of the police and by extension the right-wing nutjobs currently in power will no longer fly. Racists are getting what they deserve. June 8, 2020 at 3:30 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3Did you note the violent crime rates based on race? Those are insane numbers. White folks need defending from racial crime more than any ethnicity, other than black folks from other black folks. White people do indeed need protection. You claim the police are only protecting them. They are not. But also, black folks need protection. Not from the police. Black kids are most likely to die from other black kids, there were 9 unarmed police killings in 2019. If we are talking the real homicide tragedy, you folks are getting killed like crazy! Not by police, by other citizens, and usually other black folks. The last time I heard the leading cause of death for younger black men was murder, from, other black men. So you all need protection. This is not to blame black folks for being violent. It is still a minority portion of your population, in much the same way white men contribute more to violent crime than white women, but, it is a small minority of white men causing issues, so it is not a gender issue, and it is not a racial issue when I point this disparity out. I am not shaming black folks. https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2019/12/22/the-need-to-discuss-black-on-black-crime/ This for example shows your murder rate is like 7 times white folks (ergo why your incarceration rate tends to lean higher, the offenders are more likely to be black, but so too are the victims). I have seen numerous passionate black men, truly amazing, talk on this issue. One just talked on Ben Shapiro’s show, and he went rapidly through the numbers, and you could tell this man was just wanting so badly for all the suffering to not happen. I agree with him. You are so polarized and divisive, we could find common ground if you would stop the anger. June 8, 2020 at 3:33 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 2Again, more racist babble and fake conservative website numbers. I don’t care dude, how can I make it any more clear that I do not like you or want to talk to you? You are a dangerously unstable, dishonest narcissist. All you seem to do is post in response to my posts specifically with your lies and weird obsession, get a hobby you weird neo-nazi lunatic. June 8, 2020 at 3:38 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3Do you dispute the deaths? They are not fake numbers just because it came from a conservative website. This is not racist babble. I don’t care, then don’t talk to me. I will continue to point out you are wrong. I am not a neo Nazi. I am dangerously unstable? Yeah…No. June 8, 2020 at 3:40 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3Or even do you dispute the violent crime numbers? June 8, 2020 at 3:28 pm knowall says: Like or Dislike: 1 2Jon, I never told you I was white. Maybe my nephew was adopted. You are your own worst enemy, as far as these arguments; you assume you know the other person’s intents and it makes you look less like the debater and advocate for change you could be. You should use your talents to that end, instead of yelling at people! I pay taxes and property tax or rent; the last I heard the police are supposed to protect all citizens. Do you think they respond to all white people’s calls – nope they don’t. June 8, 2020 at 3:35 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 2Knowall, you didn’t have to tell me, your opinions speak loudly of your white privilege. Showing that you’re more concerned about your taxes you pay for your protection shows that right away. If you were black, the smart money would be that you’d have had negative interactions with the police because that is the reality for most black people. You want to talk about the subject but you’re not willing to listen. Police are supposed to protect all citizens. The delusion on your part is thinking they protect black citizens the same way they protect white citizens. The evidence shows that to be VERY to the contrary. Open your eyes man. June 8, 2020 at 3:38 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 1 3I’m Hispanic, and you already assumed wrongly I was white. You cannot assume based on beliefs what color someone is. Racist. June 8, 2020 at 3:51 pm Jon says: Like or Dislike: 3 1I’m sure you’re whatever you need to be to try and win an argument at all times. Your posts have showed so much white privilege it’s laughable that you would try to argue you’re hispanic LOL your name might as well be Scott or Chad, liar. June 8, 2020 at 3:37 pm bob says: Like or Dislike: 0 3Well said. Comment have been closed for this article.