Smart agents have been doing that already.
One of my policyowners is a plaintiff attorney. About 10 years ago he “cleaned the clock” of a Farmers agent who wrote a motor home with $100/$300 BI limits for liability and the lowest limits on the UM BI limit.
After the accident the guy with the motor home claimed he didn’t know he could have got more UM coverage and if he did he surely would have snatched it up.
That issue could also come up with liability limits or passenger coverage limits or anything else.
The whole lesson is to always offer higher limits and get a decline for limits higher than what they want to buy.
The use of the legal system to validate the failure to learn English in written form is more the abuse by the legal system than the individual’s failure. The United State’s language is English and in order to reside here it is understood that you have to both speak and read. There is no specific discrimination to any race or country of origin. Maybe the legal system as a whole should have to create a defense to that so they can stay in this country or go somewhere that they have to work in the squalor that does not allow such a freedom.
A decade or so ago a life insurance agent in some northeastern state wrote a life policy on a guy who did not speak English. They had an interpreter.
The guy died during the contestability period and the company did their duty to investigate.
Turned out that the guy had a long history of some sort of malady and the company declined the claim.
The court on the agent E&O case filed against him by the insurance company said that since he could not read the language of the app he could not know what he was signing. The interpreter was not part of the contract.
Unless you the agent speak the language of your client do not have that client. If you do speak the language make certain the policy is written in that language. Different nationalities interpret contracts differently as well. I wish the United States would allow English only as the written and spoken language. Just think of how fast everone would learn our language and the money saved on education. Yes there would be a lag but it would end soon.
Bluemax — one of the problems of the decision is that ANY rejection form that is used that has not been filed BY THE INSURANCE COMPANY is not valid. If you, as the agent, use the form filed by the company to have a customer decline UM/UIM and then use a second form in the language that they speak, the second form is not valid because it was not a filed form by the insurance company. An agency can not come up with their own forms. That is why this decision is so very bad. For plaintiff attorneys it is great, for insurance agents there is no way to win. You can refuse to sell coverage to someone unless they have the same UM/UIM limits as the BI, but if later they want to take down the limits, my agency got slapped up by ADOI for refusing to take UM/UIM off when customer requested.
Wellduh – did you read the article? Are you aware of the situation which has been widely reviewed by Big I? It is not that the insured chose lower limits and signed the form, but rather that the form is in English and the client didn’t speak English.
You are right — if you have a customer come into your office that does not speak English, if the Insurance Company did not file a Spanish form / German Form / etc. etc. etc. — then you can’t use that company to sell auto insurance –if the customer wishes to reject coverage. An agent can’t come up with their own fom for rejection of UM/UIM, each company has to file any forms used. THEN what about people that are just plain illiterate?
The lawsuit is that Ballesteros bought a policy without UM and later his mother in law was driving his car and she got into a wreck with an uninsured motorist and was killed. Now they are saying they would have pruchased the UM if they could read English or if the form was in Spanish.
It would be interesting to know what his BI limits were. Did he buy the state minimum or maybe 10/20? That is an indication of wanting to keep the premium low, so he probably would not have purchased the additional coverage. Plus, isn’t it payout enough to get rid of your mother in law!
Our language is English. Learn it! Certainly we shouldn’t allow lawsuits like this based on a failure to learn the language or investigate the insurance options. If there wasn’t an accident, this guy never would have taken the time to learn about UM coverage. It happened in 2001. It would also be interesting to know if he has the coverage today.
This is a huge case, and will set a precedence for future cases. How are we as agents going to be able to have every form for every language within our offices, for those who claim they do not speak English fluently? The Department of Transportation grants licenses with the expectation that the people carry insurance. In Arizona we have mandatory liability limits, and a requirement that the insured sign a form stating whether or not they want UM/UIM and the limits they are selecting. When potential customers come in the office with an interpreter (I have heard stories of children being the interpreter)red flags should be going up. The forms are not going to be in several languges, so should we not sell the policy? Arizona as everyone knows is a border state, and there are several people (400,000) who are here illegally, and several who are legal, but not fluent in English. If a person has a legal driver’s license should we not sell to someone who is not fluent in English or sell to the person and risk being sued? Besides Hispanics there are several other nationalities and languages that are spoken. Whose responsibility is it that the insured understand the forms? If you think the insurance companies and insurance agents owe it to everyone to put the form in their first language, how many languages should they print, and should the agent have to speak the potential insured’s language to sell the policy?
Hats off to the Independent Insurance Agents of Arizona, as you notice they are spending money on an Amicus even though American Family is not an independent agent. Insurance professionals this is a huge case, and one you may want to get involved with letting your voice be heard.
Insurance people shouldn’t blaim our customers for not reading English when don’t bother to read it oursevles.
I love this predictible “learn English” mantra (a.k.a. a cop out) when we don’t keep ourselves informed on issues in a State with such a heavy non-English speaking population. Why should courts side with lazy or disorganized insurance agents (professionals?) any more than they should with uninformed, illiterate, or ignorant people who don’t understand what anything about the coverage they are buying?
Hey NonDebator — you should read the bulletin yourself — it says that the insurance company must file the form first. The 2003-03 allows a company to file in different languages – but the point is, they must still file the form. If a customer comes into your office and you quote them coverage and they say “no” they don’t want UM/UIM — if the company did not file in the language that they read, then, if case in question sticks, non-English speaking people must ONLY go with a company that has filed the UM/UIM form in English, or must be shown the door. Agents are not being lazy you #$&%@, they are trying to do their job and getting hammered.
A non-debator are you an agent? How do you handle non-english speaking people who come in your office and want to buy insurance, or are you fluent in every language this world offers? Do you interpret all the forms in their first language before they get to your office. You must either be the most intelligent person in the world or have one huge staff to be proficient in every language. I would also suggest you go back and read the form you are so quick to cite, and I would love to hear how your agency applies it to non-speaking customers.
There are 2500 languages on the African continent alone.
150 languages spoken by various kids in our local public schools.
Anyone who cannot read English cannot buy insurance here. Here’s the phone book. Oh, sorry. Hit the street.
Maybe I have just over simplified this whole mess, but the issue seems to be letting the insured dictate the coverage whether they understand it or not. Don’t reduce the UM/UIM on any policy that you sell. English, French or Arabic speaking clients can and will with the right situation blame us for anything. Good luck.
Word to the wise, folks. If you are an insurance producer in Arizona, the phrase that pays is “Matching Limits”. 100-300-100 BI/PD limits AUTOMATICALLY get 100-300 UM/UIM. Live by price alone, DIE by price alone. If you are covering every other motorist on the road for high limits, protect yourself against those same motorists that could damage you. Here is an interesting thought: Revise the ARS statute to only allow plaintiffs to sue for the BI/PD limits that they themselves carry. If you have 15-30 limits and collide with an uninsured motorist, then you get 15-30.
Good point transparency, and no one is arguing the point you are making. The question still remains how do you know the person totally understands the limits and coverages if you do not speak their first language, and the policies and forms are not in their first language?
Arizona Agent, I don’t know exactly how we agents know if they do in fact know or understand the limits. It seems that they somehow know how to ask for 15-30-10 vs 100-300-100. I guess that the safest place to hang your hat is to not back down to price vs. coverage and take the high ground.
Going back to the article the highest court in Arizona is going to decide a case where an insurance agent is being sued, because the insured claims he didn’t understand the form,coverage and limits of the policy. The reason he states he did not understand is because the uninsured and underinsured form was in English, and he wasn’t able to comprehend English. The policy was also in English, and not in the insured’s first language. The uninsured and underinsured motorist form was signed by the insured. Notice the case does not state the insured did not speak any English. Was this the agent’s fault?
Probably not, Agent in AZ. And, the insured probably does in fact have some grasp of the lingo (otherwise, how in hell does he get around?). However, I stand by my position to all agents in Arizona and elsewhere: Matching limit.
Smart agents have been doing that already.
One of my policyowners is a plaintiff attorney. About 10 years ago he “cleaned the clock” of a Farmers agent who wrote a motor home with $100/$300 BI limits for liability and the lowest limits on the UM BI limit.
After the accident the guy with the motor home claimed he didn’t know he could have got more UM coverage and if he did he surely would have snatched it up.
That issue could also come up with liability limits or passenger coverage limits or anything else.
The whole lesson is to always offer higher limits and get a decline for limits higher than what they want to buy.
The use of the legal system to validate the failure to learn English in written form is more the abuse by the legal system than the individual’s failure. The United State’s language is English and in order to reside here it is understood that you have to both speak and read. There is no specific discrimination to any race or country of origin. Maybe the legal system as a whole should have to create a defense to that so they can stay in this country or go somewhere that they have to work in the squalor that does not allow such a freedom.
” . . . in order to reside here it is understood that you have to both speak and read English. . .”
This is a false statement.
A decade or so ago a life insurance agent in some northeastern state wrote a life policy on a guy who did not speak English. They had an interpreter.
The guy died during the contestability period and the company did their duty to investigate.
Turned out that the guy had a long history of some sort of malady and the company declined the claim.
The court on the agent E&O case filed against him by the insurance company said that since he could not read the language of the app he could not know what he was signing. The interpreter was not part of the contract.
Unless you the agent speak the language of your client do not have that client. If you do speak the language make certain the policy is written in that language. Different nationalities interpret contracts differently as well. I wish the United States would allow English only as the written and spoken language. Just think of how fast everone would learn our language and the money saved on education. Yes there would be a lag but it would end soon.
Bluemax — one of the problems of the decision is that ANY rejection form that is used that has not been filed BY THE INSURANCE COMPANY is not valid. If you, as the agent, use the form filed by the company to have a customer decline UM/UIM and then use a second form in the language that they speak, the second form is not valid because it was not a filed form by the insurance company. An agency can not come up with their own forms. That is why this decision is so very bad. For plaintiff attorneys it is great, for insurance agents there is no way to win. You can refuse to sell coverage to someone unless they have the same UM/UIM limits as the BI, but if later they want to take down the limits, my agency got slapped up by ADOI for refusing to take UM/UIM off when customer requested.
Wellduh – did you read the article? Are you aware of the situation which has been widely reviewed by Big I? It is not that the insured chose lower limits and signed the form, but rather that the form is in English and the client didn’t speak English.
You are right — if you have a customer come into your office that does not speak English, if the Insurance Company did not file a Spanish form / German Form / etc. etc. etc. — then you can’t use that company to sell auto insurance –if the customer wishes to reject coverage. An agent can’t come up with their own fom for rejection of UM/UIM, each company has to file any forms used. THEN what about people that are just plain illiterate?
The lawsuit is that Ballesteros bought a policy without UM and later his mother in law was driving his car and she got into a wreck with an uninsured motorist and was killed. Now they are saying they would have pruchased the UM if they could read English or if the form was in Spanish.
It would be interesting to know what his BI limits were. Did he buy the state minimum or maybe 10/20? That is an indication of wanting to keep the premium low, so he probably would not have purchased the additional coverage. Plus, isn’t it payout enough to get rid of your mother in law!
Our language is English. Learn it! Certainly we shouldn’t allow lawsuits like this based on a failure to learn the language or investigate the insurance options. If there wasn’t an accident, this guy never would have taken the time to learn about UM coverage. It happened in 2001. It would also be interesting to know if he has the coverage today.
This is a huge case, and will set a precedence for future cases. How are we as agents going to be able to have every form for every language within our offices, for those who claim they do not speak English fluently? The Department of Transportation grants licenses with the expectation that the people carry insurance. In Arizona we have mandatory liability limits, and a requirement that the insured sign a form stating whether or not they want UM/UIM and the limits they are selecting. When potential customers come in the office with an interpreter (I have heard stories of children being the interpreter)red flags should be going up. The forms are not going to be in several languges, so should we not sell the policy? Arizona as everyone knows is a border state, and there are several people (400,000) who are here illegally, and several who are legal, but not fluent in English. If a person has a legal driver’s license should we not sell to someone who is not fluent in English or sell to the person and risk being sued? Besides Hispanics there are several other nationalities and languages that are spoken. Whose responsibility is it that the insured understand the forms? If you think the insurance companies and insurance agents owe it to everyone to put the form in their first language, how many languages should they print, and should the agent have to speak the potential insured’s language to sell the policy?
Hats off to the Independent Insurance Agents of Arizona, as you notice they are spending money on an Amicus even though American Family is not an independent agent. Insurance professionals this is a huge case, and one you may want to get involved with letting your voice be heard.
The Arizona Department of Insurance offered guidance on this matter along with an acceptable form in the linked bulletin back in 2003:
http://www.id.state.az.us/bulletin/2003-03.pdf
Insurance people shouldn’t blaim our customers for not reading English when don’t bother to read it oursevles.
I love this predictible “learn English” mantra (a.k.a. a cop out) when we don’t keep ourselves informed on issues in a State with such a heavy non-English speaking population. Why should courts side with lazy or disorganized insurance agents (professionals?) any more than they should with uninformed, illiterate, or ignorant people who don’t understand what anything about the coverage they are buying?
Hey NonDebator — you should read the bulletin yourself — it says that the insurance company must file the form first. The 2003-03 allows a company to file in different languages – but the point is, they must still file the form. If a customer comes into your office and you quote them coverage and they say “no” they don’t want UM/UIM — if the company did not file in the language that they read, then, if case in question sticks, non-English speaking people must ONLY go with a company that has filed the UM/UIM form in English, or must be shown the door. Agents are not being lazy you #$&%@, they are trying to do their job and getting hammered.
A non-debator are you an agent? How do you handle non-english speaking people who come in your office and want to buy insurance, or are you fluent in every language this world offers? Do you interpret all the forms in their first language before they get to your office. You must either be the most intelligent person in the world or have one huge staff to be proficient in every language. I would also suggest you go back and read the form you are so quick to cite, and I would love to hear how your agency applies it to non-speaking customers.
There are 2500 languages on the African continent alone.
150 languages spoken by various kids in our local public schools.
Anyone who cannot read English cannot buy insurance here. Here’s the phone book. Oh, sorry. Hit the street.
NonDebator was just deported.
Maybe I have just over simplified this whole mess, but the issue seems to be letting the insured dictate the coverage whether they understand it or not. Don’t reduce the UM/UIM on any policy that you sell. English, French or Arabic speaking clients can and will with the right situation blame us for anything. Good luck.
Word to the wise, folks. If you are an insurance producer in Arizona, the phrase that pays is “Matching Limits”. 100-300-100 BI/PD limits AUTOMATICALLY get 100-300 UM/UIM. Live by price alone, DIE by price alone. If you are covering every other motorist on the road for high limits, protect yourself against those same motorists that could damage you. Here is an interesting thought: Revise the ARS statute to only allow plaintiffs to sue for the BI/PD limits that they themselves carry. If you have 15-30 limits and collide with an uninsured motorist, then you get 15-30.
Good point transparency, and no one is arguing the point you are making. The question still remains how do you know the person totally understands the limits and coverages if you do not speak their first language, and the policies and forms are not in their first language?
Arizona Agent, I don’t know exactly how we agents know if they do in fact know or understand the limits. It seems that they somehow know how to ask for 15-30-10 vs 100-300-100. I guess that the safest place to hang your hat is to not back down to price vs. coverage and take the high ground.
Going back to the article the highest court in Arizona is going to decide a case where an insurance agent is being sued, because the insured claims he didn’t understand the form,coverage and limits of the policy. The reason he states he did not understand is because the uninsured and underinsured form was in English, and he wasn’t able to comprehend English. The policy was also in English, and not in the insured’s first language. The uninsured and underinsured motorist form was signed by the insured. Notice the case does not state the insured did not speak any English. Was this the agent’s fault?
Probably not, Agent in AZ. And, the insured probably does in fact have some grasp of the lingo (otherwise, how in hell does he get around?). However, I stand by my position to all agents in Arizona and elsewhere: Matching limit.