The New York Times reported that over 80% of all marijuana in California is grown illegally.
Do you really think people care where they buy this crap when the image is one of healthful goodness? THAT is why people buy it from anyone; they have been told that CBD is all goodness and roses. (Despite the fact there is almost no science to back up the medical claims for CBD. It is almost all anecdotal, but hey, that;s modern journalism for you . . .)
Provide evidence for your claim on the NYT reporting that 80% of marijuana in CA is grown illegally. That sounds like nonsense to me, and since you have a history of making big claims without the actual evidence to back them (see your arguments on 26/27 of the last mass murderers being fatherless, proven wrong, your claims that THC causes psychosis, proven wrong etc.) I think you’re lying here once again, Craig.
Here, let you help you:
Craig Cornell says:
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I see you think you speak for all ALL CBD USERS. Newsflash: you don’t.
You can gripe about CBD benefits being anecdotal. Technically, benefits from taking vitamins are pretty similar. Things may help you, they may not, but if people believe they’re helping them they are allowed to try them. The issue is with a group of people passing off one product as another, not the product itself.
Google it yourself. I have posted the NY Times article more than once and you are a clown who STILL thinks THC can’t cause psychosis, someone so wrapped up in your politics that you make a routine fool out of your intelligence and integrity.
And what logic! Vitamins and CBD! Because when people don’t know the risk of something, Big Boy, they consume it. And people think CBD is magic fairy dust.
LOL I don’t think it can’t cause psychosis, I think it doesn’t cause psychosis. You once again like to play with words to your benefit while ignoring what was/is actually said. Thanks for trying to put words in my mouth, but I’ll speak for myself.
You’ve linked to an article that says that THC MAY cause Psychosis. This is not the sae as your claim that it’s “80%” grown illegally. You have posted a broken link to a NYT article, and my google search doesn’t find anything about the NYT confirming that 80% of marijuana is grown illegally. Hence, me calling you a liar and asking you to cite your source. Since you refuse, and I cannot find it on google, it is likely you are continuing to lie about the facts, Craig.
Really? Pointing out your hypocrisy, lies and misinformation make me a fool? I’d rather be a fool than you any day of the week, pal!
No one thinks CBD is magic fairy dust. Once again, let me allow you to help you:
Craig Cornell says:
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I see you think you speak for all ALL PEOPLE WHO USE CBD. Newsflash: you don’t.
LOL You big hypocrite you can’t stop generalizing and speaking for large groups of people at lal can you? You’ve done it like four times today. Happy to keep pointing out what you yourself deem incorrect behavior though :) you keep trying those straw-man arguments LOL
September 19, 2019 at 5:39 pm
bob says:
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You both miss major points. Jon, your weakness is partisan behavior. Craig’s is he really hates pot.
I already put an obvious solution below. You have not ever given Craig any reason to think that marijuana sales would be done properly, so of course he is worried about side affects of legalization. Instead of lolling at his comments and basically saying he’s spreading misinformation, you could, you know, deal with his concerns, which as much as you don’t think have merit, they do, and are valuable.
September 20, 2019 at 11:19 am
confused says:
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“I love how you basically had to say you would win in a fight with Craig, and had to double down on it several times. Why did you say that I wonder? If it wasn’t about your ego.”
funny hypocritical argument coming from a guy who used to post all the time about how big and strong he is and how much he can bench and that he would obviously win in a fight with anyone on this board.
remember those days bob? the “I can bench press over 300 pounds and will beat you up” days?
it was not that long ago
September 20, 2019 at 2:27 pm
bob says:
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You mean after UW literally threatened me with violence? Twice?
Yes, I talked about my weight lifting.
September 18, 2019 at 7:05 pm
MIghtyQuinn says:
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But then, of course, we all know how accurate the NY Times is, don’t we Justice Kavanagh? Any argument based on anything the NYT publishes is pure heresay unless they are caught in their lie in which case they might own up.
Provide a more reputable source than the NYT to support the claim being made…
September 19, 2019 at 5:44 pm
bob says:
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I don’t see what you are trying to say here.
How does this deal with the issue at hand? Do you realize your post seems to suggest silencing people? There will always be people who say a drug doesn’t have bad affects. If you’re saying this will naturally happen if people are told drugs don’t have bad affects, the only possible solution is to silence them.
I do not at all think you thought this comment through. I get that you’re passionate on the topic at hand, but you’ve got to sound more reasonable on these comments.
Trey Gowdy, I’ve seen him talk about this and has talked about expediting the process to investigate marijuana so it is classified and codified correctly by the government. Right now, it is classified as higher of a problem than cocaine and meth.
I have to note to people like Jon that republicans who argue on the pot issue clearly are behind on it. However, most are worried about real issues with legalization.
When you call them idiots, lol at them, degrade them, etc, it is not just cruel, it is immoral and is no accurate either to what most republicans think on the matter in office.
In particular, Jon, you clearly misrepresent republicans all the time.
A recent example, you said that the democrats won’t pass more beds because it is tied to Trump’s wall. That simply isn’t true. Republicans are trying to pass beds, and without beds, when we have an overrun people will have to be put in cages to follow the law. This was just passed in a funding appropriations bill, passed annually, not an immigration bill, a funding bill, with less beds. You constantly talk about why republicans do things, and you are not at all correct. So you state the republicans want to cage children. This is not accurate. If Craig talked about his position there, and you said he wanted to cage children, it would not only be inaccurate, it would be immoral. You should expect blow back. These are examples of what is causing conflict here. Dial it down.
The current THC is approximately 6 times more potent than in the 60’s. Assuming that CBD was also part of the 60’s pot, then it is reasonable to presume that the potency of CBD is somewhat equal to that. My son is always being tested in his job for pot [which he does not use] so we’ve boned up on this. Blood testing shows that the current THC component remains in the body far far longer than it did in the 60’s and that the strength does have the capacity to cause psychosis in frequent abusive users. Drug psychosis is not an uncommon diagnosis of those in their teens & 20s who out of the blue manifest symptons of bi-polarity, schizophrenia or borderline personality disorder. Would one then be wrong to think that prolonged use of CBD oil will eventually surprise many of those using it as a topical for muscular aches & pains by masking their pains even when they do not apply it. That is called addiction and it could be a huge negative for seniors who use it regularly for their routine aches & pains which are a normal part of againg.
CBD doesn’t bother me, but the truth is that there is no scientific evidence it is good for anything. It is all anecdotal. If people use it for relief from symptoms of chemotherapy for example, I am all for it, even if eventually we find the effect was just as a placebo.
But as you point out, science doesn’t know anything about CBD, relatively speaking. The fools who pretend it is some kind of magic fairy dust for all kinds of ailments are ignoring the point you make. It could turn out to be not-so-safe after all.
LOL Your idea of a damn reasonable post is more misinformation. He offered no evidence to support any claims, made up statements about drug psychosis and schizophrenia and wasgenerally confusing. He makes you look… actually, no, you still look pretty bad.
Nice try, Jon, but I do know something. Our oldest son went away to college and got deep into pot all day, everyday. She came home after 2 years and was diagnosed by the good folk at St Joseph’s Hospital in Orange as having developed a drug psychosis that manifested itself in bi-polar 2 with psychotic episodes. Within 3 years of that diagnocis and after stabilization of meds he killed himself.
Jon, I take it that you are a stoner who just wants to knock down any negative comments about pot and its chems. Sorry, but that is your problem, don’t criticize those of us who have experienced the dark side to justify your inability to cope with your ultimate fate.
I disagree Quinn. We have discussed this on the board numerous times, and in the case of your son (I am sorry you had to go through this) he has a predisposition to those characteristics, and he could have had them already, and by smoking pot, it exacerbated those. Again similar to alcohol where it can exacerbate mental diseases.
There was a lot going through there, but there are also many other factors that played into it, and it is easy to blame the physical plant instead of the harder part, the brain that needed to be looked at first.
September 20, 2019 at 1:48 pm
FFA says:
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Craig, I use a topical CBD cream on pulled muscles / shoulder injury pain. It does work. Maybe it is a placebo effect. Dont care to find out. When my knee wont bend, it works great. Important to note – I dont ingest it.
My wife was smoking the oil for anxiety / Fibromilaga relief and it also worked. My wife has since stopped the oil due to the uncertainty of the safety of this stuff.
I think anything that is abused can cause psychosis. I had too much chocolate one Halloween and started seeing visions of Reeces Peanut Butter Cups dancing in my front yard. I’m not fully prepared to say these were just visions as one of the peanut butter cups told me it was really happening. It had a voice similar to Morgan Freeman and was narrating the dance. My conclusion; Ban everything. No more Halloween, no more chocolate. Apparently it’s a bad thing and makes candy talk. If it happened to me, it must happen to absolutely everyone.
Clearly halloween candy is an addictive substance that absolutely causes psychosis. I know, I’ve counseled numerous neighbhorhood children on the dangers of halloween candy. I’m kind of an expert. (s)
Ha. I see Jon and I both received a thumbs down at the same time. I hate to say this, but it proves the point of what many on the board have been saying. Jon is a Democrat. I voted Republican in the last election. Yet we all know it was a Republican (guess who) that gave us the thumbs down for making a joke. Why? Well, probably because the party I voted for sees things one way and one way only. I can make jokes all day at my expense and find them amazingly funny. Yet I make a joke about talking candy and someone doesn’t like it because it may mean I’m a Democrat or Liberal. Had I posted MAGA, then written my post, the person giving the thumbs down wouldn’t have done so.
Look, it’s ok to make jokes. I’m quite certain you aren’t going to be at night and losing sleep over CBD. If you are, there is medication for that. It’s called CBD. Ahahahahahahahaha.
God Bob you are just such a bummer. Smooth’s comments are like the best thing happening here.
September 19, 2019 at 9:45 pm
Jon says:
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So you’re just the conversation police and you dictate who gets to say what to who? God that sounds obnoxious.
September 20, 2019 at 9:37 am
I'm Convinced... says:
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Bob is Craig. Craig is Bob.
September 20, 2019 at 11:25 am
confused says:
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he also gets to say when someone is insulting someone correctly and when someone is insulting in the wrong way, because his insults are okay and god forbid we insult him back. #boy
September 20, 2019 at 2:28 pm
bob says:
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Confused, I don’t know what got you so mad, but you’re not at all representing what I’m saying accurately, and I called him boy no more than a couple times after being called a geezer. I insult occasionally, I do not say insults are ok, they are reactive not proactive insults, ergo no insult in this post retort. Boy was a reply to geezer.
September 20, 2019 at 4:25 pm
Rosenblatt says:
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I don’t know about confused, Bob, but you have called me boy numerous times in our discussions as the first “attack.”
I told you many times that it’s disrespectful and it’s insulting, and your responses were basically “it’s a valid insult because you’re not arguing correctly.”
To claim you only called someone boy when you’re insulted first is categorically false solely based on our interactions.
You have also called me things WAY WORSE than boy and — except for saying you’re a hypocrite and a liar and providing verbatim quotes from you to prove those adjectives are based in reality — I have not personally attacked you.
But hey. That’s just my two cents. I’m sure you have a completely different account of what went on. And honestly, as you can tell by my lack of responses to your posts recently, I don’t care what you say. Have a great weekend.
September 19, 2019 at 5:07 pm
Craig Cornell says:
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What a dipstick. Have you ever known anyone who was a schizophrenic, moron? You wouldn’t wish it on your worst enemy, let alone someone in your family. It is a horrific existence.
And the best we have in the country, the American Psychiatry Association, link THC consumption with psychosis and yes, schizophrenia which is permanent and irreversible from THC alone. Meaning people who otherwise would NEVER have become schizophrenic do so by consuming THC.
Yes, my neighbor for three years was. We played chess, he would regularly demolish me, and I still see him when I’m downtown from time to time. I gave him one of my jackets because he lost his one winter. How many schizophrenic people have you known, Craig? It is truly a tragedy, we can agree on that.
What we don’t agree on, and what I find so disgusting from you, is your attempts to use schizophrenia as a weapon in your crusade against marijuana. Correlation between THC and schizophrenia is not causation. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants, but you don’t look at that possibility, you claim it absolutely is causation. It is not. Your claim is false. The American Psychiatry Association has NEVER stated that THC causes schizophrenia. You see how you twist words to make it look like they did? The fact is, they didn’t. You are a liar.
I will make jokes, because they’re funny, you old fuddy-duddy. My jokes are not the problem. A liar and a coward who denies ANY accountability? You’re the problem, bud.
This is the most reasonable comment I have seen in a long time from you.
I have to comment on this though:
“. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants,”
Yes. This is true. This is why Craig has issues with legal marijuana. Legalize it and those people with issues are bound to have more issues.
I already made a post on this. As I said:
“Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. Most people who are prone to the disorder have addiction issues, addiction issues leads to pot. See the problem in the chain there?”
How does your stance in any way direct this concern? You haven’t told Craig you would be ok with a law to require an ID to purchase it, have state licensed sales areas kind of like liquor stores in WA, disallow private sales through regulation, and methods to make sure people with predispositions are less likely to be over using it.
Everything you have said to Craig focuses on legalizing, and this is why his first comment said he is mad at people who ignore the side affects. This is the side affect being ignored. So then, why not address the concern?
“Yes. This is true. This is why Craig has issues with legal marijuana. Legalize it and those people with issues are bound to have more issues.”
So what? I’m allowed to go to the store and buy myself a fifth and drink the entire thing. Why do you get to determine who can and can’t do something? That’s life, stop trying to take away my rights.
As you said, “Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder” You’re missing an essential part. Psychosis will happen if you are prone to the disorder. There is ZERO Evidence that says marijuana can cause it to come on or to come on faster. There is evidence that the two MAY be linked. That’s as far as it’s gotten.
All of thosse things are already in place. There is a recreational dispensary a half mile from me and you have to fill out a form, give over your ID showing you’re above 21 and wait in a line to purchase any marijuana product. That’s what the regulation actually is.
The side effects Craig believes in are fairy tales. Namely, the psychosis and addiction. The real side effects are lethargy, lack of ambition, hunger. You shouldn’t drive under it, things like that. Craig is yelling about the moon falling from the sky instead of dealing with the hail.
September 19, 2019 at 5:37 pm
bob says:
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Comparing Chocolate to a recreational drug is not the best way of making a comparison.
Marijuana has known affects, many much more negative than chocolate, and it even feels absurd that I have to say that.
Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. Most people who are prone to the disorder have addiction issues, addiction issues leads to pot. See the problem in the chain there?
We regulate cold sales. If you want to make a max someone can buy like cold medicine, and require ID to purchase, as well as stop all private sales without a license, that’s one thing and is fine and could be used to address the issues with over use of marijuana and psychosis. This would be an excellent rebuttal to Craig. Instead, you took the non related condescending one…That was why your post was disliked by the conservative who did so.
It was a joke, making fun of Craig. I’m not surprised it went over your head.
Your statements are not based in reality. You have ZERO evidence to back the statement “psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder” the science does not back this up. As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here?
I don’t need your help with my rebuttals, because I just use the actual facts.
I don’t care if it was a joke, and the joke was clearly relating the fact that Marijuana isn’t that bad. It doesn’t way the real world affects. Comparing marijuana to a children’s candy high is not the way to talk to people talking seriously.
Uhm, yes I do. It’s contained in a multitude of posts, some I’ve posted before, and you admit to this fact yourself above.
“Correlation between THC and schizophrenia is not causation. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants, ”
This is true, and it comes from the study I quoted before, so I assumed you were referencing it. If you want the link again, I’ll go get it, but you know this, you’ve said it many times before confirming you know it. The study itself says that people with problems are more likely to seek stimulants. Which means those prone to psychosis are going to be those likely to seek pot.
“As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here?”
You don’t see what I said, apparently, do you see YOUR problem after my explanation?
”
I don’t need your help with my rebuttals, because I just use the actual facts.”
No you don’t. And you make your insults take lead. Several times when we debated you said you didn’t have to debate the facts because I was a proven liar. I use the facts myself. I don’t need it implied I don’t by a guy taking constant swings calling me names all the time. That post I just made didn’t merit your further swings. Calm down, read, rebuttal properly next time.
Quiz question, in these posts did I say psychosis was CAUSED by marijuana?
I very particularly did not.
Yet you said this:
““As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here”
You are in such a blind fury you conflate me with Craig. I said that if there is a relationship, it is likely that those who are prone to psychosis are more likely to get into pot. This still means we need to stop that, through regulation, and I proposed a solution. I told Craig he was wrong about the image of pot, I told him he was not helpful on the debate of pot, and I told him he was wrong about the current topic on pot. I told you what his concerns were, and to address them, and instead, you basically tell me that I’m an idiot, and just like Craig. Stop this nonsense. Debate properly, or not at all. You’re not adding to this conversation doing this again and again.
“Quiz question, in these posts did I say psychosis was CAUSED by marijuana?
I very particularly did not.”
Previous quote from you: “Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. ”
You are saying with that statement that if you are prone to psychosis and you smoke marijuana you will develop psychosis. That is not the truth, but that is what you literally said.
Now you’re claiming that you said it was likely, but the quotes above are what you actually said.
September 19, 2019 at 5:03 pm
Craig Cornell says:
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Since you seem to have a mental defect when it comes to seeking the truth, here you go again. But maybe you just aren’t very good at math: when only 20% of pot grown in California is consumed in California, you see, the rest (that would be 80%) is going to states where it is illegal, Big Boy.
“Of the roughly 14 million pounds of marijuana grown in California annually, only a fraction — less than 20 percent according to state estimates and a private research firm — is consumed in California.”
LOL you’re an idiot, Craig, once again drawing conclusions where facts differ. You do realize marijuana is legal in what 11 states now medicinally? And a couple of others recreationally? It’s not going to the black market you simpleton, it’s going to those states. Simple math is simple, logic is simple too except for you LOL
Wow. You truly are either the dumbest person on IJ or the most dishonest:
80% of the pot grown in California is grown without testing by the authorities for potency or pesticides. Because the way the system works is that when the legally grown stuff does get tested by California authorities, it is then tracked through the legal distribution system. That means – for the hard of thinking – that 80% of the pot grown in California is NOT tested.
And if you truly think that all of that 80% is going exclusively to the other states that legalized, you are one of the dumbest people in the world.
I know you can’t think well enough to do Google searches on your own, so I will give you a head start. Try: British Medical Journal, marijuana, schizophrenia. Or National Academy of Science, marijuana, schizophrenia. Or maybe you can at least read and comprehend:
Consider a 2002 study in BMJ (formerly the British Medical Journal). It found that people who used cannabis by age 15 were four times more likely to develop schizophrenia or a related syndrome than those who’d never used. Even when the researchers excluded kids who had shown signs of psychosis by age 11, they found that the adolescent users had a threefold higher risk of demonstrating symptoms of schizophrenia later on.
Or consider a 2017 report by the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. It concluded that marijuana use is strongly associated with the development of psychosis and schizophrenia. The researchers also noted that there’s decent evidence linking pot consumption to worsening symptoms of bipolar disorder and to a heightened risk of suicide, depression, and social anxiety disorders: “The higher the use, the greater the risk.”
Last time you quoted articles like that, those quotes were found to be fraudulent and not on any of the links you posted. So why don’t you post the evidence if you’re so sure? You’ve been caught lying once, let’s go for a second round today! You have zero credibility in this regards. I similarly don’t trust your claim that 80% of pot grown is grown without testing, because you have LIED REPEATEDLY. You literally posted links with a quote and the quote WAS NOT IN THE LINKS. That’s called fraud, Craig. Nice try though.
And here is another one from a study in Sweden. It ruled out any connection to genetic pre-disposition to schizophrenia.
Translation for the corruptly dishonest: you can become schizophrenic from THC alone if you have NO genetic pre-dispostion to schizophrenia, no family history, no other factors at all. Just THC. Cheers!
I’m happy to poke holes in this, as I find it unlikely that this swedish study from 1986 is really saying what you’re saying it says, but I have a haircut appointment. Assuming the thread isn’t gone, I’ll prove you wrong in a few hours dear :)
Finally, a mostly ok rebuttal. For God’s sakes was that so hard? Remove the sexist dear at the end though. If you’re going to call misgendering sexist, it has to apply to you as well. Whereas Craig doesn’t, so I don’t apply this rule for him, you have actually said this when I jokingly called that MSNBC girl a guy, (though I didn’t see it happen and said as such at the time, but you insisted it occurred). If misgendering is wrong to you, you don’t get to do it either.
God how do you get it wrong even when you’re trying to be right? You can refer to a male or female as dear. I was absolutely trying to condescend to him, but it was in no way sexist. I also don’t actually remember you calling Rachel Maddow a man, there was someone else I was calling out for that because they did it purposefully twice, maybe Jax? Either way, it’s not misgendering here.
Craig Cornell- there are plenty of studies that confirm it. Once pot is legal and the head games begin, anyone associated with it will be red flagged immediately.
Lighten up. C’mon. Just look a the guy on MSNBC and you tell me what’s going on there. Not exactly a fountain of masculine characteristics or behavior traits, right? And he DOES look like Rachel. (But then again, maybe you Transphobic?) That’s a PC joke. Get it?
I make a joke about chocolate and get beaten up over it by Bob & Craig. Craig makes a very clear homophobic joke and they feel that is ok? Wow. That’s just sad.
My joke wasn’t making fun of anyone. It was making fun of comments, not a person. It was being absurd to show just how absurd a post is claiming marijuana leads to psychosis. I’m sure there is a risk involved of bad things happening, but I haven’t seen you post anything about the dangers of allergy medication, depression medication, heartburn medication…… I could go on. Those are all known to have absolutely horrible side effects, but you choose to pick on marijuana, the one thing that can help a Cancer patient not only keep their medicine down, but also ease pain and help them with end of life struggles. Ok then. Way to pick your battles.
Smooth,
Craig lost his son, which is horrible and I cannot pretend to imagine what that must feel like. But, as a result, he chose to attribute MJ as the cause of death. His crusade is relentless, and there is something to be said of that kind of passion, as misled as it may be. I pray Craig finds peace and joy again someday.
If THC were the cause of all the things Craig pretends they are, we’d have a good sample size to test that in the NBA. Roughly 80% of NBA professionals use THC in one form or another. Where are all the conditions Craig associates with THC in the NBA?
Thank you for the explanation CP. I did not know that. Losing a child would be the most horrible thing imaginable to me. I understand the bitterness now, even on non THC posts. There are times I get the same way, really bitter towards everyone and everything. It’s human emotion and somewhat expected after a tragedy.
September 20, 2019 at 12:37 pm
Jon says:
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Don’t need or want your prayers, thanks :) Donations can be directed to the church of Satan, mostly because it’s the kind of silly thing I could see you getting pissed off about. <3
If you buy this crap on the street, you’re just asking for trouble. Wise up people.
The New York Times reported that over 80% of all marijuana in California is grown illegally.
Do you really think people care where they buy this crap when the image is one of healthful goodness? THAT is why people buy it from anyone; they have been told that CBD is all goodness and roses. (Despite the fact there is almost no science to back up the medical claims for CBD. It is almost all anecdotal, but hey, that;s modern journalism for you . . .)
Provide evidence for your claim on the NYT reporting that 80% of marijuana in CA is grown illegally. That sounds like nonsense to me, and since you have a history of making big claims without the actual evidence to back them (see your arguments on 26/27 of the last mass murderers being fatherless, proven wrong, your claims that THC causes psychosis, proven wrong etc.) I think you’re lying here once again, Craig.
Here, let you help you:
Craig Cornell says:
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I see you think you speak for all ALL CBD USERS. Newsflash: you don’t.
You can gripe about CBD benefits being anecdotal. Technically, benefits from taking vitamins are pretty similar. Things may help you, they may not, but if people believe they’re helping them they are allowed to try them. The issue is with a group of people passing off one product as another, not the product itself.
Hidden due to low comment rating. Click here to see.
LOL I don’t think it can’t cause psychosis, I think it doesn’t cause psychosis. You once again like to play with words to your benefit while ignoring what was/is actually said. Thanks for trying to put words in my mouth, but I’ll speak for myself.
You’ve linked to an article that says that THC MAY cause Psychosis. This is not the sae as your claim that it’s “80%” grown illegally. You have posted a broken link to a NYT article, and my google search doesn’t find anything about the NYT confirming that 80% of marijuana is grown illegally. Hence, me calling you a liar and asking you to cite your source. Since you refuse, and I cannot find it on google, it is likely you are continuing to lie about the facts, Craig.
Really? Pointing out your hypocrisy, lies and misinformation make me a fool? I’d rather be a fool than you any day of the week, pal!
No one thinks CBD is magic fairy dust. Once again, let me allow you to help you:
Craig Cornell says:
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I see you think you speak for all ALL PEOPLE WHO USE CBD. Newsflash: you don’t.
LOL You big hypocrite you can’t stop generalizing and speaking for large groups of people at lal can you? You’ve done it like four times today. Happy to keep pointing out what you yourself deem incorrect behavior though :) you keep trying those straw-man arguments LOL
You both miss major points. Jon, your weakness is partisan behavior. Craig’s is he really hates pot.
I already put an obvious solution below. You have not ever given Craig any reason to think that marijuana sales would be done properly, so of course he is worried about side affects of legalization. Instead of lolling at his comments and basically saying he’s spreading misinformation, you could, you know, deal with his concerns, which as much as you don’t think have merit, they do, and are valuable.
“I love how you basically had to say you would win in a fight with Craig, and had to double down on it several times. Why did you say that I wonder? If it wasn’t about your ego.”
funny hypocritical argument coming from a guy who used to post all the time about how big and strong he is and how much he can bench and that he would obviously win in a fight with anyone on this board.
remember those days bob? the “I can bench press over 300 pounds and will beat you up” days?
it was not that long ago
You mean after UW literally threatened me with violence? Twice?
Yes, I talked about my weight lifting.
But then, of course, we all know how accurate the NY Times is, don’t we Justice Kavanagh? Any argument based on anything the NYT publishes is pure heresay unless they are caught in their lie in which case they might own up.
Provide a more reputable source than the NYT to support the claim being made…
I don’t see what you are trying to say here.
How does this deal with the issue at hand? Do you realize your post seems to suggest silencing people? There will always be people who say a drug doesn’t have bad affects. If you’re saying this will naturally happen if people are told drugs don’t have bad affects, the only possible solution is to silence them.
I do not at all think you thought this comment through. I get that you’re passionate on the topic at hand, but you’ve got to sound more reasonable on these comments.
What you are saying is just not true when it comes to the government by the way on pot.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2017/07/31/rep_trey_gowdy_grills_national_drug_policy_director_why_is_marijuana_worse_than_cocaine.html
Trey Gowdy, I’ve seen him talk about this and has talked about expediting the process to investigate marijuana so it is classified and codified correctly by the government. Right now, it is classified as higher of a problem than cocaine and meth.
I have to note to people like Jon that republicans who argue on the pot issue clearly are behind on it. However, most are worried about real issues with legalization.
When you call them idiots, lol at them, degrade them, etc, it is not just cruel, it is immoral and is no accurate either to what most republicans think on the matter in office.
In particular, Jon, you clearly misrepresent republicans all the time.
A recent example, you said that the democrats won’t pass more beds because it is tied to Trump’s wall. That simply isn’t true. Republicans are trying to pass beds, and without beds, when we have an overrun people will have to be put in cages to follow the law. This was just passed in a funding appropriations bill, passed annually, not an immigration bill, a funding bill, with less beds. You constantly talk about why republicans do things, and you are not at all correct. So you state the republicans want to cage children. This is not accurate. If Craig talked about his position there, and you said he wanted to cage children, it would not only be inaccurate, it would be immoral. You should expect blow back. These are examples of what is causing conflict here. Dial it down.
The current THC is approximately 6 times more potent than in the 60’s. Assuming that CBD was also part of the 60’s pot, then it is reasonable to presume that the potency of CBD is somewhat equal to that. My son is always being tested in his job for pot [which he does not use] so we’ve boned up on this. Blood testing shows that the current THC component remains in the body far far longer than it did in the 60’s and that the strength does have the capacity to cause psychosis in frequent abusive users. Drug psychosis is not an uncommon diagnosis of those in their teens & 20s who out of the blue manifest symptons of bi-polarity, schizophrenia or borderline personality disorder. Would one then be wrong to think that prolonged use of CBD oil will eventually surprise many of those using it as a topical for muscular aches & pains by masking their pains even when they do not apply it. That is called addiction and it could be a huge negative for seniors who use it regularly for their routine aches & pains which are a normal part of againg.
Damn reasonable post, MQ.
CBD doesn’t bother me, but the truth is that there is no scientific evidence it is good for anything. It is all anecdotal. If people use it for relief from symptoms of chemotherapy for example, I am all for it, even if eventually we find the effect was just as a placebo.
But as you point out, science doesn’t know anything about CBD, relatively speaking. The fools who pretend it is some kind of magic fairy dust for all kinds of ailments are ignoring the point you make. It could turn out to be not-so-safe after all.
LOL Your idea of a damn reasonable post is more misinformation. He offered no evidence to support any claims, made up statements about drug psychosis and schizophrenia and wasgenerally confusing. He makes you look… actually, no, you still look pretty bad.
Nice try, Jon, but I do know something. Our oldest son went away to college and got deep into pot all day, everyday. She came home after 2 years and was diagnosed by the good folk at St Joseph’s Hospital in Orange as having developed a drug psychosis that manifested itself in bi-polar 2 with psychotic episodes. Within 3 years of that diagnocis and after stabilization of meds he killed himself.
Jon, I take it that you are a stoner who just wants to knock down any negative comments about pot and its chems. Sorry, but that is your problem, don’t criticize those of us who have experienced the dark side to justify your inability to cope with your ultimate fate.
I disagree Quinn. We have discussed this on the board numerous times, and in the case of your son (I am sorry you had to go through this) he has a predisposition to those characteristics, and he could have had them already, and by smoking pot, it exacerbated those. Again similar to alcohol where it can exacerbate mental diseases.
There was a lot going through there, but there are also many other factors that played into it, and it is easy to blame the physical plant instead of the harder part, the brain that needed to be looked at first.
Craig, I use a topical CBD cream on pulled muscles / shoulder injury pain. It does work. Maybe it is a placebo effect. Dont care to find out. When my knee wont bend, it works great. Important to note – I dont ingest it.
My wife was smoking the oil for anxiety / Fibromilaga relief and it also worked. My wife has since stopped the oil due to the uncertainty of the safety of this stuff.
I think anything that is abused can cause psychosis. I had too much chocolate one Halloween and started seeing visions of Reeces Peanut Butter Cups dancing in my front yard. I’m not fully prepared to say these were just visions as one of the peanut butter cups told me it was really happening. It had a voice similar to Morgan Freeman and was narrating the dance. My conclusion; Ban everything. No more Halloween, no more chocolate. Apparently it’s a bad thing and makes candy talk. If it happened to me, it must happen to absolutely everyone.
Clearly halloween candy is an addictive substance that absolutely causes psychosis. I know, I’ve counseled numerous neighbhorhood children on the dangers of halloween candy. I’m kind of an expert. (s)
Ha. I see Jon and I both received a thumbs down at the same time. I hate to say this, but it proves the point of what many on the board have been saying. Jon is a Democrat. I voted Republican in the last election. Yet we all know it was a Republican (guess who) that gave us the thumbs down for making a joke. Why? Well, probably because the party I voted for sees things one way and one way only. I can make jokes all day at my expense and find them amazingly funny. Yet I make a joke about talking candy and someone doesn’t like it because it may mean I’m a Democrat or Liberal. Had I posted MAGA, then written my post, the person giving the thumbs down wouldn’t have done so.
Look, it’s ok to make jokes. I’m quite certain you aren’t going to be at night and losing sleep over CBD. If you are, there is medication for that. It’s called CBD. Ahahahahahahahaha.
From now on, I identify as a Reeces Peanut Butter Cup. I’m no longer a Republican.
This should cause someone’s head to literally blow right off his shoulders.
God Bob you are just such a bummer. Smooth’s comments are like the best thing happening here.
So you’re just the conversation police and you dictate who gets to say what to who? God that sounds obnoxious.
Bob is Craig. Craig is Bob.
he also gets to say when someone is insulting someone correctly and when someone is insulting in the wrong way, because his insults are okay and god forbid we insult him back. #boy
Confused, I don’t know what got you so mad, but you’re not at all representing what I’m saying accurately, and I called him boy no more than a couple times after being called a geezer. I insult occasionally, I do not say insults are ok, they are reactive not proactive insults, ergo no insult in this post retort. Boy was a reply to geezer.
I don’t know about confused, Bob, but you have called me boy numerous times in our discussions as the first “attack.”
I told you many times that it’s disrespectful and it’s insulting, and your responses were basically “it’s a valid insult because you’re not arguing correctly.”
To claim you only called someone boy when you’re insulted first is categorically false solely based on our interactions.
You have also called me things WAY WORSE than boy and — except for saying you’re a hypocrite and a liar and providing verbatim quotes from you to prove those adjectives are based in reality — I have not personally attacked you.
But hey. That’s just my two cents. I’m sure you have a completely different account of what went on. And honestly, as you can tell by my lack of responses to your posts recently, I don’t care what you say. Have a great weekend.
What a dipstick. Have you ever known anyone who was a schizophrenic, moron? You wouldn’t wish it on your worst enemy, let alone someone in your family. It is a horrific existence.
And the best we have in the country, the American Psychiatry Association, link THC consumption with psychosis and yes, schizophrenia which is permanent and irreversible from THC alone. Meaning people who otherwise would NEVER have become schizophrenic do so by consuming THC.
Keep making jokes. You are the problem.
Yes, my neighbor for three years was. We played chess, he would regularly demolish me, and I still see him when I’m downtown from time to time. I gave him one of my jackets because he lost his one winter. How many schizophrenic people have you known, Craig? It is truly a tragedy, we can agree on that.
What we don’t agree on, and what I find so disgusting from you, is your attempts to use schizophrenia as a weapon in your crusade against marijuana. Correlation between THC and schizophrenia is not causation. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants, but you don’t look at that possibility, you claim it absolutely is causation. It is not. Your claim is false. The American Psychiatry Association has NEVER stated that THC causes schizophrenia. You see how you twist words to make it look like they did? The fact is, they didn’t. You are a liar.
I will make jokes, because they’re funny, you old fuddy-duddy. My jokes are not the problem. A liar and a coward who denies ANY accountability? You’re the problem, bud.
This is the most reasonable comment I have seen in a long time from you.
I have to comment on this though:
“. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants,”
Yes. This is true. This is why Craig has issues with legal marijuana. Legalize it and those people with issues are bound to have more issues.
I already made a post on this. As I said:
“Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. Most people who are prone to the disorder have addiction issues, addiction issues leads to pot. See the problem in the chain there?”
How does your stance in any way direct this concern? You haven’t told Craig you would be ok with a law to require an ID to purchase it, have state licensed sales areas kind of like liquor stores in WA, disallow private sales through regulation, and methods to make sure people with predispositions are less likely to be over using it.
Everything you have said to Craig focuses on legalizing, and this is why his first comment said he is mad at people who ignore the side affects. This is the side affect being ignored. So then, why not address the concern?
“Yes. This is true. This is why Craig has issues with legal marijuana. Legalize it and those people with issues are bound to have more issues.”
So what? I’m allowed to go to the store and buy myself a fifth and drink the entire thing. Why do you get to determine who can and can’t do something? That’s life, stop trying to take away my rights.
As you said, “Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder” You’re missing an essential part. Psychosis will happen if you are prone to the disorder. There is ZERO Evidence that says marijuana can cause it to come on or to come on faster. There is evidence that the two MAY be linked. That’s as far as it’s gotten.
All of thosse things are already in place. There is a recreational dispensary a half mile from me and you have to fill out a form, give over your ID showing you’re above 21 and wait in a line to purchase any marijuana product. That’s what the regulation actually is.
The side effects Craig believes in are fairy tales. Namely, the psychosis and addiction. The real side effects are lethargy, lack of ambition, hunger. You shouldn’t drive under it, things like that. Craig is yelling about the moon falling from the sky instead of dealing with the hail.
Comparing Chocolate to a recreational drug is not the best way of making a comparison.
Marijuana has known affects, many much more negative than chocolate, and it even feels absurd that I have to say that.
Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. Most people who are prone to the disorder have addiction issues, addiction issues leads to pot. See the problem in the chain there?
We regulate cold sales. If you want to make a max someone can buy like cold medicine, and require ID to purchase, as well as stop all private sales without a license, that’s one thing and is fine and could be used to address the issues with over use of marijuana and psychosis. This would be an excellent rebuttal to Craig. Instead, you took the non related condescending one…That was why your post was disliked by the conservative who did so.
It was a joke, making fun of Craig. I’m not surprised it went over your head.
Your statements are not based in reality. You have ZERO evidence to back the statement “psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder” the science does not back this up. As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here?
I don’t need your help with my rebuttals, because I just use the actual facts.
I don’t care if it was a joke, and the joke was clearly relating the fact that Marijuana isn’t that bad. It doesn’t way the real world affects. Comparing marijuana to a children’s candy high is not the way to talk to people talking seriously.
Uhm, yes I do. It’s contained in a multitude of posts, some I’ve posted before, and you admit to this fact yourself above.
“Correlation between THC and schizophrenia is not causation. It’s likely as simple as people with problems are more likely to seek comfort from stimulants, ”
This is true, and it comes from the study I quoted before, so I assumed you were referencing it. If you want the link again, I’ll go get it, but you know this, you’ve said it many times before confirming you know it. The study itself says that people with problems are more likely to seek stimulants. Which means those prone to psychosis are going to be those likely to seek pot.
“As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here?”
You don’t see what I said, apparently, do you see YOUR problem after my explanation?
”
I don’t need your help with my rebuttals, because I just use the actual facts.”
No you don’t. And you make your insults take lead. Several times when we debated you said you didn’t have to debate the facts because I was a proven liar. I use the facts myself. I don’t need it implied I don’t by a guy taking constant swings calling me names all the time. That post I just made didn’t merit your further swings. Calm down, read, rebuttal properly next time.
Quiz question, in these posts did I say psychosis was CAUSED by marijuana?
I very particularly did not.
Yet you said this:
““As even Craig has been pushed into, the most any scientific study has said is that there MAY be a relationship between marijuana use and psychosis. Correlation is not causation. See your problem here”
You are in such a blind fury you conflate me with Craig. I said that if there is a relationship, it is likely that those who are prone to psychosis are more likely to get into pot. This still means we need to stop that, through regulation, and I proposed a solution. I told Craig he was wrong about the image of pot, I told him he was not helpful on the debate of pot, and I told him he was wrong about the current topic on pot. I told you what his concerns were, and to address them, and instead, you basically tell me that I’m an idiot, and just like Craig. Stop this nonsense. Debate properly, or not at all. You’re not adding to this conversation doing this again and again.
“Quiz question, in these posts did I say psychosis was CAUSED by marijuana?
I very particularly did not.”
Previous quote from you: “Psychosis from long term use will happen if you are prone to the disorder. ”
You are saying with that statement that if you are prone to psychosis and you smoke marijuana you will develop psychosis. That is not the truth, but that is what you literally said.
Now you’re claiming that you said it was likely, but the quotes above are what you actually said.
Since you seem to have a mental defect when it comes to seeking the truth, here you go again. But maybe you just aren’t very good at math: when only 20% of pot grown in California is consumed in California, you see, the rest (that would be 80%) is going to states where it is illegal, Big Boy.
“Of the roughly 14 million pounds of marijuana grown in California annually, only a fraction — less than 20 percent according to state estimates and a private research firm — is consumed in California.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/27/us/marijuana-california-legalization.html
LOL you’re an idiot, Craig, once again drawing conclusions where facts differ. You do realize marijuana is legal in what 11 states now medicinally? And a couple of others recreationally? It’s not going to the black market you simpleton, it’s going to those states. Simple math is simple, logic is simple too except for you LOL
Wow. You truly are either the dumbest person on IJ or the most dishonest:
80% of the pot grown in California is grown without testing by the authorities for potency or pesticides. Because the way the system works is that when the legally grown stuff does get tested by California authorities, it is then tracked through the legal distribution system. That means – for the hard of thinking – that 80% of the pot grown in California is NOT tested.
And if you truly think that all of that 80% is going exclusively to the other states that legalized, you are one of the dumbest people in the world.
I know you can’t think well enough to do Google searches on your own, so I will give you a head start. Try: British Medical Journal, marijuana, schizophrenia. Or National Academy of Science, marijuana, schizophrenia. Or maybe you can at least read and comprehend:
Consider a 2002 study in BMJ (formerly the British Medical Journal). It found that people who used cannabis by age 15 were four times more likely to develop schizophrenia or a related syndrome than those who’d never used. Even when the researchers excluded kids who had shown signs of psychosis by age 11, they found that the adolescent users had a threefold higher risk of demonstrating symptoms of schizophrenia later on.
Or consider a 2017 report by the National Academies of Sciences, Engineering, and Medicine. It concluded that marijuana use is strongly associated with the development of psychosis and schizophrenia. The researchers also noted that there’s decent evidence linking pot consumption to worsening symptoms of bipolar disorder and to a heightened risk of suicide, depression, and social anxiety disorders: “The higher the use, the greater the risk.”
Last time you quoted articles like that, those quotes were found to be fraudulent and not on any of the links you posted. So why don’t you post the evidence if you’re so sure? You’ve been caught lying once, let’s go for a second round today! You have zero credibility in this regards. I similarly don’t trust your claim that 80% of pot grown is grown without testing, because you have LIED REPEATEDLY. You literally posted links with a quote and the quote WAS NOT IN THE LINKS. That’s called fraud, Craig. Nice try though.
And here is another one from a study in Sweden. It ruled out any connection to genetic pre-disposition to schizophrenia.
Translation for the corruptly dishonest: you can become schizophrenic from THC alone if you have NO genetic pre-dispostion to schizophrenia, no family history, no other factors at all. Just THC. Cheers!
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2887%2992620-1/fulltext
I’m happy to poke holes in this, as I find it unlikely that this swedish study from 1986 is really saying what you’re saying it says, but I have a haircut appointment. Assuming the thread isn’t gone, I’ll prove you wrong in a few hours dear :)
Finally, a mostly ok rebuttal. For God’s sakes was that so hard? Remove the sexist dear at the end though. If you’re going to call misgendering sexist, it has to apply to you as well. Whereas Craig doesn’t, so I don’t apply this rule for him, you have actually said this when I jokingly called that MSNBC girl a guy, (though I didn’t see it happen and said as such at the time, but you insisted it occurred). If misgendering is wrong to you, you don’t get to do it either.
God how do you get it wrong even when you’re trying to be right? You can refer to a male or female as dear. I was absolutely trying to condescend to him, but it was in no way sexist. I also don’t actually remember you calling Rachel Maddow a man, there was someone else I was calling out for that because they did it purposefully twice, maybe Jax? Either way, it’s not misgendering here.
Craig Cornell- there are plenty of studies that confirm it. Once pot is legal and the head games begin, anyone associated with it will be red flagged immediately.
Molon Labe!!
when Craig, not I, jokingly called that MSNBC girl a guy
Lighten up. C’mon. Just look a the guy on MSNBC and you tell me what’s going on there. Not exactly a fountain of masculine characteristics or behavior traits, right? And he DOES look like Rachel. (But then again, maybe you Transphobic?) That’s a PC joke. Get it?
Now THAT was in poor taste though.
I make a joke about chocolate and get beaten up over it by Bob & Craig. Craig makes a very clear homophobic joke and they feel that is ok? Wow. That’s just sad.
My joke wasn’t making fun of anyone. It was making fun of comments, not a person. It was being absurd to show just how absurd a post is claiming marijuana leads to psychosis. I’m sure there is a risk involved of bad things happening, but I haven’t seen you post anything about the dangers of allergy medication, depression medication, heartburn medication…… I could go on. Those are all known to have absolutely horrible side effects, but you choose to pick on marijuana, the one thing that can help a Cancer patient not only keep their medicine down, but also ease pain and help them with end of life struggles. Ok then. Way to pick your battles.
Smooth,
Craig lost his son, which is horrible and I cannot pretend to imagine what that must feel like. But, as a result, he chose to attribute MJ as the cause of death. His crusade is relentless, and there is something to be said of that kind of passion, as misled as it may be. I pray Craig finds peace and joy again someday.
If THC were the cause of all the things Craig pretends they are, we’d have a good sample size to test that in the NBA. Roughly 80% of NBA professionals use THC in one form or another. Where are all the conditions Craig associates with THC in the NBA?
Thank you for the explanation CP. I did not know that. Losing a child would be the most horrible thing imaginable to me. I understand the bitterness now, even on non THC posts. There are times I get the same way, really bitter towards everyone and everything. It’s human emotion and somewhat expected after a tragedy.
Don’t need or want your prayers, thanks :) Donations can be directed to the church of Satan, mostly because it’s the kind of silly thing I could see you getting pissed off about. <3